Alright everyone, place your bets

Five bucks on Skuld

okay, Ven maybe. because nomura want to retcon the reason why Vanitas exists. Well hopefully not though, I think if Ven killed because of Vanitas is actually too predictable and boring. The theory of Gula being Ven's brother is actually interesting and more fun but I think it won't happen,will it?

I rewatched the last part and wonder if chirithy is asking Skuld only to come (since he faces towards her at the end ) or calling both of them.

Nah, it's totally Luxu who's the green candy monster. Wait, what were we betting on?

If Brain is asking Ephemera about the replacement Union Leader, I'm guessing it must be someone he knows well enought, right? So yeah, Skuld is probably my first pick. After that would probably be Ven, but there's not as much grounding with him admittedly. At the very least, it seems Darkness definitely isn't one of the new Union Leaders (though Lauriam is unaccounted for in this sequence).

Edit: The phrasing also seems to imply the one was originally meant to get the Book of Prophecies, wasn't necessarily the "replacement" themselves. So I'm curious who the MoM originally intended to give the BoP to.

Looks like we'll have some answers soon, at last!
I don't know who I want to be the murderous replacement. If it was Skuld I wonder if that will have something to do with Subject X losing her memories. If it was Ven I'll feel betrayed but it would be an interesting plot twist. There's the possibility Lauriam was playing dumb all along and killed his own sister, but as cruel as Marluxia was in CoM I don't think he would do that, specially if Nameless Star is Strelitzia.
What if Ephemer is the imposter and that's why Brain called him first? To ask for an explanation and make sure he won't run away before exposing him to the others.
I bet on Skuld too.

I think it’s Ven lmao. I wanna say more about it especially what Ephemer said about Ven in KHUx novel and I had a “that’s-so-Raven” vision moment when Brain asked Ephemer about the fake union leader. But you know how Nomura is. He can change it and it could be a red herring.

Brain’s chirithy is wearing a fedora!!!!!! So cute.

What did Ephemer say about Ven? I haven't read the novel, but you have spurred my curiosity now.

He's also got little booties ?

Wild card bet: Player killed Strelitzia.

To start off, the members were already suspicious of Ventus.

Eph mentioned that he had known all the others before they were chosen except for Ventus. He didn’t understand why Ventus was there because he never seen his face or heard of his name. Despite that, Eph was curious about Ventus. I’m pretty sure I’m forgetting something else but that’s all.

But I think it’s a red herring.



Right! His black pouch. His chirithy is adorable.



Reminder, And if Ventus is the fake union leader, that doesn’t mean he killed Strelitzia lol. He’s 12.....I doubt he’s capable of hurting anyone. He was probably setup.

Ooo I’m starting to feel like my theory on it being Ephemer may be correct... after all why would Brain want to talk to him specifically about the imposter?

Subtitled vids are up!

Wasn't there a scene with Ava choosing Ephermer as union leader? If so, that would pretty much eliminate him as the imposter.

I'm rathet curious who the false leader is. That said i don't think finding out who the false leader is, will tell us who the killer is.

My bet is also on Skuld. To my colorblind eyes her eyes always looked yellow-ish, which made her a bit suspicious. Though I've liked her in the game and kinda hoped she'd not be evil.

He could have been the original leader meant to get the book.

Was mulling it over for a while, and I am starting to think Ven is a red herring.

Been thinking about what will happen in the main series going forward and how things will connect with each other, we figure Lauriam will be searching for his sister's killer, and Lea an' Isa will be searching for Subject X, who we assume to be Skuld. I'm starting to believe the killer and Subject X are one and the same.

While my Most obvious pick would be Ven, Lauriam is technically a suspect because we don't see him in these scenes (even though that doesn't make any sense as we see his inner thoughts here where he has no reason to lie to himself), but it does absolve at least Brain from being the killer of Strelitzia at least as long as this is an actual mystery and not a bad one. So currently my list of suspects in order of most to least likely is:
Ventus
Skuld
Ava
Someone Else (This would most probably be a cop-out.)
Brain, Ephemer, Lauriam
Brain, Ephemer, and Lauriam are all on the most unlikely as all have no obvious motive or we have seen their thoughts that point to them not being the killer. For Brain it is the fact that not only is he the detective of this story here but he also was chosen as one of the five. Ephemer we know was chosen in the beginning while we have no real evidence that Skuld was ever chosen as a leader. I have already stated that Lauriam has inner thoughts that point away from him being the killer which if he were to be the real one wouldn't make sense unless it's some darkness-split-personality mess and the only person that trope really fits is Ventus.

Also while the motive could be something other than replacing Strelitzia, it is obvious that she needed to go in order for the plan to go forwards, so the killer is most likely the one who killed Strelitzia and took her place or Ava who could replace one of the five without that one knowing that they were not originally chosen.

So, are we all just not going to talk about the light speed time machine that rips people's flesh off?
Like, Jesus. Ain't that a bit dark for this series?

The team voted for Ephemer as their leader. It makes sense that Brain would want to get his input, especially for important matters like this.

I love how when all of this started everyone was so sure if would be Lauriam and now no one is even considering him, lol. I will die on the hill that it was Ventus as I predicted so long ago.

However, I don't think he was the killer, just the replacement leader. Something along the lines of Ava wanted to break the cycle and chose a innocent chield but that was the undoing as it ended up with causing a chain reaction in the future as the scarred Ven was picked as Xehanorts apprentice.

It's also interesting to note that Ben's role was a proxy that shouldn't be there kept repeating: he was inserted in Land of Departure, then inserted himself into Sora's heart.

His other half was the main threat of BBS (Xehanort ended up the key villain, yeah, but if it wasn't for the Unversed and Vanitas I don't think he would have gotten so far in his plan), Vanitas being in Sora's heart deeply impacted the creation of his nobody (and I firmly believe it's the reason Roxas didn't have memories of being Sora).

His role in the franchise as a whole so far has always been of a proxy, and we never find out even once what how far did his memory go. Was he also found as an amnesiac by Xehanort like Subject X was? Did he regain all of his memories after being completed again as he seems to remember his charity?

I think it's also a possibility that time travel was involved with the assassin being Luxu (or more precisely, Xigbar) making sure everything would move as intended.

Made a slight tweak: "an intermediary who can...." changed to "an intermediary that serves to".

Since it's unclear if it's a person or an object.

Reaching but

Didn’t the original union leaders (the foretellers) have 3 boys and 2 girls.

The new union leaders (the dandelions) have 1 girl and 4 boys.

Shouldn’t that be a clue, at least?

I think they're talking about some special type of Gummi Ship and if you consider light speed and threshold barriers that makes sense for Kingdom Hearts terms.

Since Maleficent reformed in her robes, I think it's safe to say it's an object.

So is it safe to assume we'll get the next update in a month when Re:Mind drops? Seems we reached the season finale.

Typically the story updates drop on Thursdays, with this month being the exception because of Christmas. Since Re Mind is scheduled for release on January 23rd, I'm pretty confident the last of Nomura's four updates will drop on that day as well.

The reason Roxas didn't have Sora's memories is because Sora was a heartless for a very brief time and his memories didn't have time to migrate into Roxas. It is explained somewhere in the games or interviews, I don't remember. But there could be an additional reason.

Ahahahaha. Player's from a different game. LOL

I'm really starting to think Vaneloppe's one of the Seven Pure lights now, since we don't know who three of them are yet and we all know this KHUX stuff is tying into the next saga. Plus, it may explain why Player's being so protective of her here--despite what Chirithy wants, in wanting them to watch Ralph instead--since they've been so protective of all the other Princesses of Heart. Maybe Player senses the light in her that will make her one of the New Seven Lights someday.

So, I was right about Ava being the traitor (I mean, I think most of us were) and also being partly responsible for the Strelitzia thing. It sounds like she wasn't her killer, though, and they're implying that it was Ventus or Skuld? And it was probably Ventus, because of the whole Vanitas thing. I know people have thought that for a long time--and I get why--but I was hoping it wasn't true, because... if I'm being honest, as much as I love Nomura, I don't know if he has the finesse to pull this off. Because in KHIV, or whatever, where all of this will probably get brought up and dealt with... putting all of the blame on Vanitas and none on Ventus seems a bit unfair to me, since they weren't split here. But at the same time, if Ven does get some rightful blame for it next saga, it's going to ruin a fan-favorite character and kind of make him unsalvageable... so all of this is why I hoped they wouldn't go this route, personally, but it looks like they are. Since I really doubt it's Skuld, and I'd need a ton of hard and concrete evidence to prove to me that it was: something they probably don't have time to do at this point, and thus are going with the easy answer of Ven.

I also really think the theory about Ava being Darkness is true. Yeah...

And at first, I wasn't sure I liked them trying to explain how Maleficent came back in KHII. But I think I'm okay with it now, and that it's working pretty well.

But... I'm confused, did we just get told what the black box is? Or partly? Some sort of ark that was supposed to take people to future worlds? I'm not sure if the ark and black box are the same thing. Probably not? Since Luxu already took the black box away at this point, so it shouldn't be around for Maleficent to use at all? But the fact she called the ark a "box" at one point threw me off. But it's probably just a coincidence and I shouldn't read too much into it. Right?

Edit: Also, Brain's Chirithy is so cute!

Five bucks on Ven.

Him wielding the Missing Ache seems symbolic to me, and I think that symbolism has to do with the ache of Strelizia's death.

....buuuutttt, Skuld's name is derived from the Norse god of the same name who "decides the fate of people", and eliminating Strelitzia is an act of deciding someones fate.

It's really a coin toss between either two. ?

I have a theory: I think that multiple people (Ven? Lauriam? Larxene? Elrena?) will also board the arch and so somehow arrive to Sora's timeline.

Nevertheless, the imagination that Maleficent's flesh gets stripped off is super funny and horrific

Ehh, the whole flesh ripping off thing doesn't seem literal. It reads to me the same way as Terranorth discarding his body on purpose to get closer to the darkness as a Heartless.

Ehh, that doesn't make much sense to me but it's believable enough, I suppose.

I would love for Subject X/Skuld to be a villain/anti hero of sorts working against the Foretellers, also portrayed as villains. Once she regains her memories, she could start building her own faction, likely recruiting Isa, Lea, and possibly even Roxas and Xion. The rest of the Guardians would be caught in the middle or forced to choose a side, culminating in the next Keyblade War/Kingdom Hearts: Civil War. Lol

After looking over the new cut scenes again, I actually do feel like it might be Skuld who was not supposed to be a Union Leader. Brain wanted to talk to Ephemer specifically about the person who replaced Strelitzia and we know that Skuld and Ephemer were friends before all of this so that might be way he wanted to talk to him alone as he may have the most insight on her character and motives.

I feel that Brain wouldn't want to accuse Skuld of treachery so that is why he is trying to get a better picture of the situation first with Ephemer. For some reason he is confident that Ava didn't orchestrate the switch up of leaders, only of the book. That is mainly why I am starting to feel that Skuld is more likely than Ephemer. Although none of her actions (or Vens) show any clear motive as to why they would infiltrate the leaders. As most have stated they haven't had a very active role in decisions made thus far. So if not Ava, then who would stand to gain from replacing Strelitzia with Skuld? or Ventus for that matter?

The impression I'm getting is that perhaps the ark is something similar to the Black Box but isn't the actual thing, like an early-concept prototype that was abandoned after the Black Box was created, or perhaps a second box that was never finished.

Man there’s so many conflicting clues Nomura gives out.

Luxu calls the impostor the virus so when Brain called himself that, everyone assumed that was it. And then that’s wrong. The secret reports were intentionally misleading here.


I feel like the snowman scene was intentionally placed after the Brain and Ephemer scene to show the guilty party. So it’s either Skuld or Ven. Evidence points to Ven, but since it’s a recurring theme that “evidence” from prior events aren’t necessarily facts, wouldn’t be surprised if Skuld was guilty.

As much as I love that theory, darkness saying they haven’t read the entire book kind of ruins that theory. I still think Ava makes the most sense but it’s probably not at this point.

Actually it may be just be proof that she is darkness. Remember how there was the lost page? To me the fact that darkness has read portions of book but not the “entire” thing makes me believe that darkness must be one of the Foretellers excluding Gula.

I’m starting to think that the Black Box doesn’t have the Book of Prophecies, nor Space Colony Ark (lol).

- It can’t have the Book because Brain already has it and, at this point in time, Luxu hid it.

- It can’t be the Ark because Maleficent has already used the Ark to travel to the future.

Sooo... what’s in the Box? Why do the Norts say that it contains hope? Is it the prototype of the BoP? A second volume? Does the BoP in the Box contain the future of another Worldline?

Iunno. Something tells me that Nomura will pull an Occam’s Razor and give us a simple explanation for the Box: the MoM, Sora and Yozora all get out of the Box in a room with Luxigbar and the Foretellers and congratulates them for being chosen as the MoM’s ensamble or Worldline Rangers to save the Worldlines from an impending doom.

Also, Darkness talks too much and his name is too basic to be one of the MoM’s creations. I’m starting to think it’s Ava disguised, creating a force of her own to try and fight the MoM’s pre-selected destiny shenanigans.

What if the killer is Gula, who used the same illusion powers Ava used to make himself look like Ventus? Strelitzia was killed in Gula's building after all. He took the book, and choose the likeness of a relatively lesser known wielder to fit in.

Out of curiosity, what's the basis for this?

Hm that’s the sort of technicality that Nomura goes for so I’ll stand corrected here lol. Still plausible then

I feel like if we're excluding Gula since he has the Lost Page, then we might as well exclude Ava since Luxu told her what was written on it.

I initially liked this idea, but the more i think about it, it has a few major issues.

Where is the real ventus? How/when does he get swapped for the Gula version of Ventus and why did Gula get summoned back to the future with the other foretellers if they are gone, but Gula isn't?

To me this set of scenes all be convinced me that Ava is darkness. They have admitted to reading the book of prophecies. To me, only 7 characters have real knowledge of the book at this point. The Mom, 5 foretellers, and Brain. Stealing Strelitzia's spot/rule book didn't get this person the Book of Prophecies.

In any good criminal case, you need to prove three things to convict a person, Motive, Means and Opportunity.

Let's tackle Opportunity first
1. For 4 of the new leaders, we don't know anything about their whereabouts at the time. The only one we have any idea of is Skuld. She was with Player until right before. We know that Skuld was nearby the house Strelitzia was murdered in at the time of her death.

Means
1. All the characters have the ability to kill her. We are dealing with powerful key blade wielders after all.
2. However, even though everyone has the power to kill her, who knows that killing her would provide them an opportunity to infiltrate the leaders ranks?


Motive
What motives exist for killing/replacing Strelitzia or any leader for that matter? Below I have listed out the ones I can think of, no matter how unlikely.

1. Becoming a union leader will guarantee them access to something/someone that they otherwise would not have. This could be the BoP, this could be the Ark, this could be the foretellers room / clock tower to search for secrets (but one would need to know these things exist, and how would anyone know about these unless told be a foreteller? Perhaps one discovered something upon exploring the tower previously? We know Skuld and Ephemer have been inside...)

2. Strelitzia was threatening someone/something and needed to be stopped. This feels incredibly unlikely, and we have no basis for any indication that this is the case. Perhaps this person read the BoP and determined the actions Strelitzia would take would undoubtedly ruin the chances for future success. The only possible person here would be Brain, if he had killed her and replaced her with another leader, then he wouldn't even open his mouth, let alone show Ephemer, so I think this is out.

3. Along the same lines, her killing could have been 100% random and had nothing to do with anything. Then upon taking her belongings, the killer stumbles across the rule book and decides to take her place. This is obviously incredibly unlikely and ultimately would have no real positive reason (story wise) to happen.

4. To plant another person in her place. Long thought by many (myself included) to have been Ava quickly replacing Strelitzia with another potentially more capable leader. Well what if another fore-teller had done so? Eliminated a leader to identify a replacement? The problem here is, how would they know of Ava's role, and who was chosen? How would they know who to replace them with? If they did do this, how then would they communicate to the replacement leader? If the replacement leader is unaware of Strelitzia's murder, then why would they hide that they were given their role by another foreteller? Why not speak up and say "Gula gave me the role and book?"

5. To change the fate that had been designed. This has been speculated for a long time as well. It's the only motive for the swap, that involves the new leader having no idea it happened. This person then doesn't need to have been given loads of information no one else had (about the ark, the book, how to interact and change the future etc. and a reason for existing as a leader, since it doesn't appear anyone is trying to undermine things and prevent an escape back to reality.

In the end, the motive that makes the most sense to me, is still #5, the intent to change fate without knowing how, which means it would have to be Ava. Yes this cutscene suggests that it wasn't her. But Nomura loves his red herrings, and all this was to pull suspicion off Ava was a statement by brain that says "I don't think the change in Union Leaders was Lady Ava's doing" this could easily end up that Brain was simply wrong.

Looking at the evidence,

Who knew Stelitzia was a union leader? the MoM, Brain (potentially if he already had the BoP at this time, but again as described above, why show the list ever if he had killed her? No one would ever find out), and Ava. She has already shown a desire to change fate by giving the book to Brain. If she wanted to really change fate, then changing the leaders was her best chance. I believe she was questioning things before the conversation with Luxu, as seen in the conversation when Brain was made a leader. After that conversation with Luxu, I believe her whole mind snapped, (with Luxu claiming she was the traitor for making Brain the man with the Book of Prophecies, which would then explain why Luxu called him the virus, even though he isn't the traitor/unexpected leader), and she lost it. She then determined to unravel the MoM's plans, took out the first leader she found, desperate to instill someone other than Strelitzia. My guess is Ven makes the most sense as he was just a random she grabbed off the street, and it would explain why a Meh wielder who isn't nearly as powerful or as successful at gathering Lux is appointed leader. It also explains why Ava would then go on to become Darkness and be so desperate to help Maleficent and the Dandelions escape back to the real world. She was desperate to undo everything she had set in motion and stop the MoM's plan.

the TLDR version of my ideas is this:

Ava is still the bad guy, she did it all to change fate without knowing what would happen, possibly explaining Darkness' statement about having read most of the BoP (reasoning being, I changed things, so I know most of what's coming, but not all)

I also agree with whomever stating that Ven being the killer will irrevocably damage the character in ways that make him unredeemable, and I just can't see Disney allowing that to take place.

Our boy HMK posted a good video not too long ago:



He doesn't go into everything, like how Darkness speaking to Malificent about her dealings with MX spotlights Vanitus as the only other entity who would have been present at MX's side to witness said exchange (and hence be able to speak of it later), but hey, a video's ten times better than mere words on a page to get a point across.

I was going to wait on this, but screw it *pours celebatory scotch* *raises glass*

To those of us who knew Ventus was the one NOT chosen to be a Union leader, and that Vanitus was in fact Darkness all along, TO US!!!

*Downs drink in one gulp*

Aaaaahhhhh, the taste of victory! :cool:

My guess is that no one has the real BoP. MoM just wrote copies with stuff he wanted to include for the rest, and the original BoP that foreshadows everything correctly (including Ava’s attempts to change events) is hidden. Maybe locked somewhere xD

Forget about the traitor thing for a while
Skuld is not fond of cold
Ventus does not hate cold. Is it that why in KH3 Vanitas keep casting ice magic?

I’m hoping Darkness is the cloaked character from the Union Cross key art and thus none of the five Union Leaders. It’s about time we find out who that is.

Another moment that creates more questions is the fact that when the new five very first enter the Foreteller chamber, the BoP is sitting in the desk. Brain immediately goes to pick it up.. but does this mean he had already gone there without the others? We know that Ava directly handed him the book before the Keyblade war so how else would the book have ended up in that room? Why would Brain be going off to the Foreteller chamber alone before meeting the other five? Am I asking way too many questions at this point?? Will Union Cross actually ever reveal an answer to anything???

this makes perfect sense to me. He gave them just enough info to get them to act in such a way. But he censored things for them. He's already done it once with the lost page...

Always an excellent thing to point out. How/why was the BoP there?

It feels like next month we will get some answers. I'm just curious which comes first, the UX update or Re:Mind. Which direction will things be spoiled for us? UX spoiling remind stuff? Or Remind spoiling the UX stuff?

What lead me to bring it up is that it may be possible that while the book was sitting there unattended literally anyone could have gone up to it and read a couple portions without anyone else knowing basically making darknesses new claim even less helpful.. but I still think it’s either a Foreteller or Strelitzias heartless/nobody.

I’m very much on the Ava train. But I get your point if the book was just out, maybe anyone read it. But why the heck was a copy of the book just “out” lying around?

that’s a good point and at this point if Ava is indeed darkness then the lost page is irrelevant since she already knows she’s the traitor. Which means she knows everything about the Book which contradicts Darkness saying that they don’t.

except for the fact Ava doesnt know that’s the only thing on the lost page (actually do we even know it’s the only thing on the page?)

I went back to the scene where the leaders enter the Foretellers' Room for the first time. After giving it some thought, I wonder if the book lying on the desk wasn't intended to be the Book of Prophecies but just used the same asset due to some oversight? Because the fact that Brain shows this book's contents to the other leaders, tears a page out and gives it to them is a huge red flag.

I think the book Brain is shown reading after this scene is probably the actual Book of Prophecies, but the one here in this moment may be just an ordinary research book or something.

The MoM told that to Ava but I don’t believe she passed that message on to Brain meaning he would have no reason to withhold information from the others from within the book. She was after all giving the book to wrong person anyways so I don’t see why she’d give two Xions if anything else the MoM ordered actually happened as planned.

I can’t seem them “accidentally” using the book of prophecies like that. It’s definitely done on purpose. Maybe brain did it to make it appear that Ava didn’t personally give him the book.

The others don't even know he has the Book at this point so that argument is kinda moot?

well if Brain showed up at KG with book already in his possession vs just picking it up in the foretellers chamber it would definitely have looked suspicious to the others. They would have wondered how and why he had it. This way they just accept that he got it from the room when they all first arrive there.

How do you suppose it got there then? He snuck in and planted it?

Ephemer is the only other person who knows Brain has the Book of Prophecies.

That’s exactly what I’m thinking yep. I just don’t know why he would do it. Ux has so many mysteries I feel like I’m in Wonderland.

Okay then lol. I can agree to disagree, it's all part of having fun and solving the mystery :D

He could've had Ava take him there.

Was this when they needed ingredients for new spirits? If so, I could see that book as just being some kind of recipe book for the spirits. Why would the BoP have those recipes in it? And it isn’t impossible that it just happened to have the Master’s symbol on it since it belonged to him. I don’t think anyone would be foolish enough to just leave the BoP out on a table like that.

I honestly don't expect much from KH characters when it comes to intelligence. ?

But if that book isn't meant to be the BoP, then yeah, that's a huge oversight.

Up to this point, we've been lead to believe certain people are guilty until it turns out that they aren't (or at least have a strong case for why they wouldn't be). First it was Lauriam, then it was Brain. Just like what others have mentioned already, not being chosen may not necessarily mean they're also Strelitzia's killer. Ven definitely seems to have a lot of darkness within him if Vanitas is anything to go by, but we don't know if he's always had that from the beginning OR if that darkness developed after what happened in the Age of Fairy Tales/Meeting Master Xehanort. So far, he's acted along the same lines as how we know Ven acts currently.

Plus, something to keep in mind... If the Master of Masters knows what the future holds, he absolutely would know about Ven, considering just how big his role is. Taught by Master Xehanort personally, ends up with Master Eraqus, Terra and Aqua, and then becomes one of the Guardians of Light in KH3. If anyone should have the Book of Prophecies, it's actually him. He's the most important piece in all of this next to Sora and Xehanort.

When it comes to Ava being Darkness? I think there's a good case for it, but I don't think I want to make that accusation just yet. Luxu says that "Ava had her own mission, and she carried it out." Now, we thought that it was her selecting enough capable Keyblade wielders and forming the Dandelions. But now that we know that she acted under her own agency when giving Brain the Book of Prophecies, what IS her mission? Given what she's said to Brain, she wants to change destiny, even if it means going against her own Master. But at what cost? Luxu didn't seem all that surprised that she wasn't summoned back, so I wonder if he knows what her plans were. Maybe he has an idea but nothing concrete, a hunch of some sort.

---

"Observations, Excerpt 1— I have seen it through; the Keyblade War unfolded exactly as written on the Lost Page. Now, the Keyblade the Master entrusted to me must be bequeathed to another. Five Union leaders have been chosen from the surviving Dandelions. I will pass the Keyblade to one of them, and then continue watching the future unfold. Yet it seems that someone has pulled the old switcheroo. One of the Five is an imposter, someone the Master did not choose. They represent a virus in the program he so carefully wrote. The virus has begun a strange undertaking: a reckless plot to allow the Five to escape into another worldline. Surely such a thing can't be possible? We're talking about the same trick that allowed the Dandelions to transfer to other worldlines after the Keyblade War. But these children are no Masters. They haven't the means...unless, of course, a certain lady of magic summoned here from the future knows more than I do. The whole Union leader thing was supposed to be by the books. Are these new events just another phase in the Master's grand plan? —Unknown"

And... "Even on a worldline with no Keyblade War, peace is but a dream. In the absence of us and our Master, a "darkness" arrived—one that shall surely lead the World to yet another demise."

It makes you wonder. Darkness is the one that informed Maleficent of how to jump back to her original timeline, especially noting that going to the Daybreak Town tower will allow her to return to the real world, and the method for returning to her time is deep in the tower's real-world counterpart. The tower (if memory serves) is forbidden for everyone except for the Foretellers/Union Leaders and the Master of Masters, so how would Darkness know about this? This is secret information only a handful of people should be privy to.

Also... Ava is the one who chose Brain to have the Book of Prophecies, but with the latest update... He lets Ephemer see the list of the Chosen Five. Meaning, Brain and Ephemer were definitely chosen by the Master of Masters (unless Brain is luring a trap and made a fake list, but then, why?). Brain was looking over the BoP and then gets his Chirithy to summon Ven and Skuld. Right after that, he's talking with Ephemer. Everything currently going on is a direct result of Ava interfering. Plus... None of the Five would know who'd be chosen before everything happened, so Strelitzia's killer would have to be someone who knows she'd receive a rulebook.

Strelitzia was chosen and then was killed the next day after she realized Player isn't in the Dandelions and wanted to tell them the truth of the fate of the world. The Master of Masters told Ava that the Dandelions won't need to remember the tragedy that is the Keyblade War, so it's implied that a Union Leader talking to ANYONE about anything before the appointed time is a huge no-no. So what happened? My guess is, she was silenced. And if this is the case, then there's only one person who could've done it.

Now, switching gears and going back to this event:



Ephemer was surprised that Skuld was also chosen, but Skuld assumed Ephemer would be chosen. It might be me looking into this too much, but it's an interesting detail to note. Now Ephemer is asked about the person "who isn't meant to be a leader originally". Food for thought.

Another EXTREMELY important detail is the exchange between Ava and MoM: "Yeah, it'll be dangerous if anyone but little red circle there sees it. So make sure you only give it to them, and in secret." Right after that, Ven is revealed. However, we know that Ava gave Brain the BoP and now we ALSO know that he wasn't supposed to have it. So who was? I think it was Ven. Like I said above, it just makes sense if it turned out to be him, when you think about the role he's played in the series up to now.

All of this is a guess, but one thing is for sure -- next month's update is going to be crazy.

Ok I’m sorry that I’m rambling on in this thread but I just have a lot of thoughts about this whole plot lol so it’s looking like whoever replaced Strelitzia is not the killer. Brain talks to Ephemer about the situation while also getting his chirithy to go find Ven and Skuld. Who’s being left out here? Lauriam. He still was the character we saw introduced directly after Strelitzia death and rn Brain seems to be gathering the other four together to discuss the imposter. It would definitely be the plot twist of the plot twist if Lauriam was the replacement especially seeing as how he has the same lineage as Strelitzia which may be significant as to why he was chosen to replace her. Just a thought but hey ya never know.

You know, something I didn't realize until now... Remember when Ephemer disappeared suddenly, and we never saw him again until after the Keyblade War ended? His disappearance if I remember correctly happened around the same time he and Player explored the tower.




We're on the same page. If she's willing to switch up who gets the Book, who's to say she wouldn't go any further? Let's say Ava didn't have a role in it. Then who could've possibly known who would've been chosen by the Master of Masters as a Union Leader? Unless the assailant was someone who was just knocking off random Keyblade wielders and happened to strike gold with Strelitzia, it would've had to be someone who knew she was in possession of a rulebook. And since Ava is in charge of forming the Dandelions, (her role that only she knew) and the Master of Masters was long gone by the time this was all happening...



Yeah, the more I'm thinking about it, the more I'm thinking it's likely that Ava killed Strelitzia. I've never subscribed to the theory that Vanitas is Darkness, because that's a little too on the nose, and generally isn't how Nomura does things. It also doesn't make sense because Vanitas was created from forcing a split between Ven's light and darkness... at the hands of Master Xehanort. If Vanitas was in existence before, how would Xehanort know about it? Unless the guy just got lucky. But then you'd have to explain how Darkness has knowledge about things they logically shouldn't, if Darkness is Vanitas. Plus yeah, who else but the Foretellers would have access to the BoP? This cutscene ALONE narrows it down to who Darkness could be, it'd have to be someone in the know, and it wouldn't even be possible for Vanitas to be in possession of the Book.

If Ven is the killer, you have to wonder what "possessed" him to go do it. What's his MO? Ven shouldn't have any sort of knowledge about the World or the fate that lies beyond the Keyblade War. So unless he's just a Jekyll-Hyde character who's a serial killer on the low... It doesn't make much sense. Because for this to be true, Ven would have to be privy to Foreteller secrets, and not just "there's a war coming and there's five Unions" secrets, because the Dandelions knew this was coming anyway. It'd have to be something MUCH bigger than that.

If Ava is Darkness, or at least the one that killed Strelizia, then that solves some problems but there are some questions that need to be asked.

Why? If Strelitzia is the successor to the BoP she wouldn't have known because Ava didn't tell her, she gave it to Brain after all so if that's the case why was she killed? If Ava wanted someone else to take up the mantle, the bell started to ring right before Strelitzia's death so Ava would have had to make a new choice immediately after killing her and the newest captain would have been assigned at most a day or so before the Keyblade War started. Also Ava didn't lose faith in the plan until after Luxu told her on the last day.
Unless Strelitzia is impossibly important to the plan, why kill her out of everybody? And if her replacement isn't the killer why haven't they put it together that they are not the original choice?

You're saying Lauriam isn't the killer, but he's the replacement for Strelitzia? If that's the case, that's depressing as hell lmao. Poor guy, and he doesn't even know the truth.



Strelitzia was never confirmed to be the original successor of the BoP if memory serves. She had a rulebook that was stolen after she was killed, but Brain always had the BoP because Ava gave it to him instead of whoever else was supposed to have it. But think about it. Who were the only ones that could've known that Strelitzia was a Union Leader at this current point in time? After the war, when she reunites with Ephemer, Skuld says herself that the identity of the Union Leaders is supposed to be a secret until the appointed time arrived that they meet at the Keyblade Graveyard. This is backed up with Ephemer's noticeable surprise seeing Skuld, and also meeting Ven for the first time there.

The Master of Masters himself decided on who would be the next five, and put Ava in charge of recruiting them, along with the Dandelions. Given those two facts, the only person that would know of the identities would be... Ava.



Well (this is just a possibility, but...), what if Ava already had someone in mind? Remember, she's choosing the Dandelions other than the Original Five. So if one gets knocked off, she can choose anyone and say, "Hey, you were chosen to be a Union Leader, so... congrats." There's no authority to challenge her on this. Notice how Strelitzia was killed in the dark, in the back of a house? Almost like she was assassinated? I think there's a reason for this. Sure, nobody wants to have their identity revealed when knocking someone off, but the whole situation is sketchy.

Also remember in all of this that's going on, she's looking for Player, because she wanted to save them from the impending doom that is the Keyblade War. I like to think that's a possible factor in all of this too. The person killed her and took her rulebook, which implies that was their goal. But going back to the original question, who would know the identities of the Union Leaders chosen by the Master of Masters? The only one I can think of would be... Ava.



Continuing off what I was saying above, she was going to find Player to convince them to join the Dandelions. Player at that point didn't want to join, so Strelitzia wanted to tell them everything in order to warn them. Remember, the identities of the Union Leaders are supposed to be a secret until AFTER the Keyblade War occurs. What do you think would happen if someone didn't follow the rules? Mayhem would occur, and possibly cause events that are irreversible. My guess is? The girl was killed because she was going to cause too much problems, and say something she shouldn't have.



Well, this is the whole mystery they have to figure out right now. Naturally, how it's most likely gonna play out is that four of the five Union Leaders suspect the replacement is the killer because they weren't originally chosen and Strelitzia was. That's the logical conclusion. But, again, how would the replacement know about who were selected to be Union Leaders? It was supposed to be a secret. If the killer is the replacement, they would have to know information about who was chosen, where to meet, and know that they needed a rulebook. But if Ava is the killer, she can easily pass on the rulebook to another person just like she did for everyone else. It'd just be that one of the chosen is "illegitimate" due to not being chosen by the Master of Masters.

I have a very tentative thought about the 'intermediary' that the Darkness says can reconstruct Maleficent's flesh in the future.

It reminds me a little bit of the Chirithy in the Final World in KH3. It does guide Sora to reconstruct his body, in a manner of speaking, by gathering the phantoms. I don't recall the reason why it is there in the first place being properly explained.

If you run with that, and it does come with a lot of problems, also remember the credits suggest that the Chirithy belongs to Ventus.

This ark ultimately leads them back to Sora's universe/timeline.

Someone is waiting there to restore their body, so long as memories and someone who remembers you exists... Is Namine or Vexen this intermediary? Which would mean "Darkness" is either one of the org, or just Xehanort. Their involvement would help explain why Marluxia and the others would end up becoming organization members after, theoretically, getting on this ark to get to the Kh2-ish timeline...

I'm confused how exactly you came to this conclusion. The people who remember her are the 3 Fairies at the beginning of KH2, and she spawns from her cloak, which is likely the "intermediary" itself (considering it was left behind after her disappearance in KH1). That said, one does have to wonder how her bird friend knew to bring the cloak their. Maybe they were informed by darkness(?), but that'd open a whole different can of worms.

I assumed you needed an intermediary to prepare your body for you, almost like a replica, and that you needed people to remember you in order to finish the job and connect the two.

But I was taking the intermediary term more literal in the sense of a individual, as oppossed to just meaning an object of your own.

So I see what you mean - as long as you have someone there to remember you and some kind of catalyst, then your body returns? Seems weird. Feel like you still need someone to restore your body... Unless Maleficent just restored her own form and not her actual body?

Reading this caused another idea to enter my head. During back cover, we saw that Ava and Gula had a pretty close relationship. The Ava we have seen thus far is very against violence, wishing the war never even had to occur and doesn’t seem like a ruthless murderer that would take out Strelitzia. Gula however is a lot less emotional, and seems like He would do anything he deemed necessary to reach his goals.

Gula‘s role was to identify the traitor and stop them from doing whatever it is that is considered treacherous. One trait we know the traitor has is that they are “the one who bears the sigil” the sigil most likely being the recusant sigil aka an X, a symbol shown on Strelitzia‘s outfit.

And the house where Strelitzia is struck down is the exact same house player and Skuld talk to Gula moments before her demise.

So my theory here is that Gula strikes down Strelitzia believing that she is the traitor. At some point Ava may or may not have shared the list of new union leaders with Gula given their close relationship which could explain why he even knew who she was. Then after striking her down he returns the rulebook to Ava explaining why he did it and she is forced to pick someone else to replace her in the new five. Who should she pick? Perhaps someone closely related to Strelitzia, like her brother Lauriam.

So Lauriam believes he is supposed to be one of the five and has no idea that he actually replaced his sister. (This explains why Brain wants to talk to the other three new union leaders right after discovering who the imposter is)

This also would explain why Ava seems so shaken up during the Keyblade War having just dealt with the matter of one of her Dandelions death.

I just imagined:
Maleficent will be the final boss of the game: she will attack everyone in the tower in order to find this Ark and return to the future.
The final battle will happen right next to the Ark, and it will culminate sending Skuld to Future Radient garden without memories somehow, Lauriam finds out about Strilitzia's death and dies too, becoming Marluxia. Ven will stay alive but will be sent to whenever Xehanort is his master, and Brain and Ephemer will be the only ones who will stay behind in the data world.

Skuld is the only other character that has the same eye colour as Xehanort (when Xehanort was tempted into Darkness). I don't think that's a stylistic coincidence...

Or maybe the killer is a red-herring nobody guessed like Demyx's somebody because Nomura lol.

Demyx and Luxord still haven't appeared despite allegedly being from the Chi-era, and I swear if one of them is the killer then I'll swear!

Luxord and Demyx killed Streritzia in order to put Ventus in there. That makes Ven part of a trio with Demyx and Luxord: a trio of blondies.

As happy as I maybe am about this "intermediary" stuff, that might explain how Maleficent came back, how Kairi magicked Sora a body, Final World stuff, and whatever else (I've seen some think this might show how Naminé came out of almost nothing, and that would be cool)... I wish it wasn't called that (though I know this is a fan translation--and an awesome one, at that:)--thank you for said translation, guys), because I remember when we were talking about intermediaries for Keyblades: like when Roxas had to use a stick to summon Kingdom Key. Oh well.

Skuld's eyes are brown though, right? Or at least that's how they were depicted in the novel color. I guess you could argue they might be kind of amber-ish in the game, but the graphics make it hard to tell.

It's a possibility, but then that would be a huge mistake on Ava's part because just like the Master predicted, it would cause trouble. If Ava and Gula are both responsible, then both of them are directly the cause of what's happening right now.

Strelitzia having the "recusant's sigil" plus also wanting to expose secrets that only a Union Leader should know... I could see why he's thinking "Traitor". But then again, this is under the assumption that Ava would've told him, and I can't help but think why? I would think that the Master forbade her from telling anyone besides the selected Union Leaders for this exact reason. If she did, that was the worst thing she could've done.

Her eyes have red or yellow tints depending on the artwork, but yes, they are consistently brown. Her in-game depiction (top left) is probably the most accurate.

[ATTACH type="full" alt="1577241990015.png"]12112[/ATTACH]

I thought it was strange that Ephemera was like "you have the Book?" as if Brain wasn't already shown reading it in front of everyone
So you might be right, it might've just been an oversight for that scene. Maybe it was there as a placeholder while they prepared a new book asset, and someone forgot to swap them. Something like that.

The reason I thought they didn't think anything of it is because they probably have no idea what the book of prophecies is supposed to look like. So Ephemer wouldn't know any better until when Brain reveals it to be the book, plus Brain is the only one who ever really reads the book so the others wouldn't know what was inside the book either. The only scene we see them slightly read it is the one about creating spirits but even then Brain rips that page out for their use so no one else ever physically holds the entire tome. We as the audience obviously recognize the book, but the majority of wielders in DT have never seen it before.

Even though her name litterly means Guilt or Blame in Swedish, haven't it been confirmed that Ava made Skuld one of the leaders?
I thought so at least, so I figured this episode just confirmed that Ava slaughtered Strelitzia and gave the book to Brain (who btw might get possessed by Luxu) to change the future and thus she's the traitor.
Part of me suspected Invi just because she was the serpent and caused conflict where her mission was to keep the peace.

Yes it did. I went back to Everglow's videos at 42:00 is when Ephemer calls off the search of the tower, and says they will come back tomorrow. Afterwards, he goes exploring the tower, and we never hear of him again (outside of a dream) until after the war.






The biggest support of "Ava did it" in my opinion is that, no one else knew. How could anyone have killed Strelitzia that didn't know what to gain from it. It eliminates any motives.





We thought it before, but now it feels like it can only be one of 7 possible people (Ava, MoM, Ira, Invi, Gula, Aced or Brain) as they are the only ones that we know have read the book. Remember not even Luxu has read it. Clearly he knows of it, and knows certain pieces, but he hasn't read it. So unless the MoM has just been handing out books like candy, or someone stole a foreteller's book (and transported it to the digital world?) then it can only be one of the 7. Given that it appears MoM, Ira, Invi, Gula, and Aced all died in the war (as they are returned to the KG after KH3 by Luxu) that suggests Ava, MoM or Brain. Brain it appears, hasn't read the book until recently, and even if he had Luxu suggests in the reports he doesn't have the powers to become Darkness and make all of that happen. That means we are left with the disappeared Master, or Ava.



I've said it before, and I'll say it again now. If someone else killed Strelitzia, what was their motive in becoming a union leader? What was their goal? Since the leaders were revealed, no one has acted out of place and done anything to suggest they are innately evil / a traitor. I don't buy the Jekyll-Hyde situation being Nomura's style of story-telling. Add in the question, what triggers the personality switch? Why haven't we seen it again in all this time?

Occam's Razor... The easiest/most logical solution is usually the right answer. It's a lot easier to have 1 bad guy in this than several.

Add in the Disney element to all of this, and I can't see them accepting Sora teaming up with a former murderer if it were to be Ven (completely destroys any positivity to his character, I don't care if it really was "Vanitas" who did the deed). There is no redemption arc available for whichever character did kill Strelitzia that leads to them working with Sora to take down the bad guys in the future. Absolutely None, not with Disney's interference in the series. That's why I have always been adamant, it can't be Ven.

Ava being the killer makes no sense. Why kill Strelitzia, if she can just simply NOT give her the rulebook?
I really liked the Darkness = Vanitas theory, but one thing struck me. Darkness said to Maleficient "According to the BoP, you exist in the future.", which implies that he is not from the future, otherwise he would simply know Maleficient exists there, without referencing the book. I also doubt Ava is Darkness, simply because I see no motivation for her to help Maleficient. If she wanted to change the future, which she wants, keeping her in the past should be a prime opportunity to her, since Maleficient being there is an anomaly.

Ephemer, Skuld, Ven, Brain all talked about Ava as the one choosing them, (except for Lauriam, but I doubt he is the replacement, since Brain wanted to talk about Ephemer about the replacement, which means it's either Ephemer, Skuld or Ven). Since I doubt that the replacement is the the killer (none of them evil), that means the one who gave them the rulebook took on the form of Ava with illusions, which so far is shown as Foreteller magic (exhibited by Ava multipe times). I still belive Gula is the killer, simply because he seems the most shady of the Foretellers. Aced and Ira are way too straightforward, Ava doesn't seem evil, Invi is the second most suspicious, but the fact Strelitzia was killed in Gula's room and that in Back Cover Gula looked like he was ready to summon KH just to get back MoM makes him the prime suspect in my eyes. His goal would be to change the future, so the Master is forced to come back. He was the closest to Ava, so he could have some knowledge about the note. He simply killed the one he can the easiest way, and gave the book to someone he thought would change up the future the most.

But most of this is just speculation with shaky at best basis.

Now this update is leading us to believe Ava is NOT guilty. Another perfect presentation/red herring by Nomura. Unfortunately, he has stacked up so much evidence against Ava, I'm not buying it.



A popular theory is that Ven some how absorbs/gets possessed by Darkness before getting sent to the future, and Xehanort separates them leading to Vanitas as if it is some form of a nobody. I've even seen the idea that upon Vanitas' demise in KH3 that leads to the re-creation of the original darkness (who was Ava), which explains (in Nomura convoluted style) how she gets to the future.


Or like Luxu, he is SO involved in the future, knowing it would drastically color the future and change what actions would be taken. So it actually might be for the reason you stated, that Ven is absolutely NOT supposed to see the BoP as it would shatter the future the MoM put in place.



Luxu clearly knows of her mission. I expected to see Luxu pop up again and communicate with her / darkness, but I guess it is possible that one of the few things the MoM told Luxu lead him to know that she was the traitor (which we can assume he told her during their conversation) and that after the war she would attempt to alter the course of history, which would of course just bring about the history the MoM expects. That would lead Luxu to assuming she has an additional mission, and is why she is unable to be reunited with the other Foretellers in the KG after KH3.

---

SuperSaiyanSora
One of the Five is an imposter, someone the Master did not choose. They represent a virus in the program he so carefully wrote.

SuperSaiyanSora

I like this idea, Strelitzia is killed for a reason. Why her and not another leader? Perhaps she was about to blab to Player. If that happens (since our player just does weird crap that makes no sense he/she could easily upset the apple cart here) who knows how the future could be changed. I would love to see the MoM's version of the BoP, does player show up? Is player supposed to die in the war? It appears that we were the only member of the battle who was saved by Ephemer / Skuld. So why the heck are we saved? I don't believe that has ever been answered either. I realize the "story must go on" and we need the player character to do that. But I really wonder if we should have died.




Brain's Chirithy does look right at Skuld right at the end and says "I'd like you to come with me for a moment" Perhaps Skuld is the unexpected leader. I don't like this theory, but I saw it kicked around that Skuld is the murderer, stole Strelitzia's spot in an effort to reconnect with Ephemer and then when everyone gets future bound and memory-less, that explains why Luxu eventually takes her (because all the EVIL characters need to be together).



My reasoning is that the conversation with Luxu (which happens after Strelitzia is given the book) changes something in Ava. She is compelled to change the future. Or rolling with SuperSaiyan's theory, Strelitzia is about to blab and needs to be silenced. Either theory works well.

As you pointed out, Darkness being from the future and traveling back is highly unlikely given the phrasing of things. Ava wants to get everyone out of the Data world which would change the future. Luxu states in the secret reports that a "certain lady of magic" can help them do that. That is why Ava needs Maleficent and would want to help her.

This is the video that turned me on to the idea. If you want some more reasoning to why Ava could be darkness, I'd check it out. All credit to the Secret Reports for creating it.

So I like the idea that Ventus was actually supposed to be the one the BoP was entrusted to, it would explain why Ventus feels like he's just "there" because his role and purpose was taken by Ava and given to Brain instead. Ven also as a person makes a lot of sense. Someone who wouldn't abuse the knowledge or power, who wouldn't get taken in by it, the young kind hearted and a little "go with the flow" Ventus would actually make a lot of sense.

Which means Skuld is probably not meant to be the leader because that's the biggest twist and it make sense Brain called Ephemer in to talk about her. However I don't think that means Skuld killed her just that she was put in place of Strelitzia.

I do not think Darkness is Ava anymore if only because of that line Darkness said, how they only know about some of the contents of the BoP. That sounds more like Luxu than Ava, but at the very least that seems to confirm darkness is tied to the MoM, because that's the only way they would have seen only some of the BoP.

I was thinking that the line was negated by the idea that Ava didn’t have the lost page, and since she thinks she has changed fate (by giving Brain the BoP so in her mind some of the book isn’t true any more, or possibly the future has “changed” and as such not everything is as it was written so she has only knowledge of some of the future.

I think there is a lot of logic in Ava being the killer but this latest chapter would make her motivations strange, to say the least. As another put it:

I agree with this but if Ava were the killer and made the imposter a union leader, and also gave Brain (an original union leader) the book of prophecies with the list of union leaders...

Then she actually made it so her imposter would eventually be discovered by Brain. Why would she do this? I can only think of two explanations:

1) Ava chose to give Brain the book and note to show that he wasn't the intended recipient before deciding to replace Strelitzia (perhaps because she was going to blab to other wielders). So the imposter was an improvisation and accidentally would be uncovered by her previous attempt to change fate. I find this a tad unsatisfactory but it's feasible, I suppose

2) Ava wanted her imposter to be discovered, perhaps to use them as a scapegoat to hide Strelitzia's murder and perhaps other actions by Ava. One would wonder what Ava's plans were in this case, though if she were the Darkness this level of deception would sort of fit.

I am not an expert on the UX stuff so may have made an error.

We saw Skuld get recruited into the Dandelions, but we did not see her get appointed as a Union leader.

[written in post] I was working off old chi unofficially-translated videos and have no idea what's been included in Ux at this point. So I went and spoiler-tagged that stuff just in case @-@

@-@ My problem with Ava being the killer is I can't see her outright killing someone like that. Naivete maybe, but if she did up and decide she needed a different leader instead of Strelitzia... why act like she needs a "loop hole" or technicality to do that if she's okay just giving the BoP to someone other than who it's supposed to go to? Even if she's already handed the rulebook off to her... why not just ask for it back? Does lil' sis really seem like someone who would make that difficult and complicated? As far as the "talking to Player" aspect, I guess the idea there is Strelitzia acting of her own accord is the big no-no here, but as far as Player is concerned Ava knows they already know, right? 'Cause she invited them to be a Dandelion along with Skuld? And Player wanted to think on it? So if that's the case, why would Ava really care about that here?

I admit, the slow drip feed of this story for so many years has got my memory faulty, so I went through some cutscenes on YT and ran into the Luxu/Ava scene. I literally have no idea anymore if it's been included in Ux and therefore has an official translation or if it hasn't shown up since its appearance in chi and should be brought into question whether it can be considered relevant... point is, there was a line that stood out to me. As Luxu's talking about his role and mission and whatnot, a line of his is translated as "That is why I must keep this world moving forward according to the lost page." and another "I will act in order to carry out my mission, and watch." ...Couldn't that possibly mean that Luxu has the autonomy to act if it means his action will "course correct" a deviation from the MoM's intended future? How killing Strelitzia would course correct is up for debate, but perhaps Brain having the book tips the odds in the Dandelions' favor for escaping b/c big brain. So having a murder mystery will distract or cause distrust enough to ruin that chance. ?‍♀️ And as far as "needing to know the names of the new union leaders", Luxu's been watching. Not much need in a name if you know your target's face/appearance.

tl;dr: Luxu killed Strelitzia in response to Ava switching who got the BoP and therefore the imposter leader (AND Ava) isn't a murderer.

...Proooobably a stretch, I know. But it's gotten wedged in my mind now and likely won't want to leave until more truth starts coming out.

I'm loving Maleficent/Darkness plotline. Darkness is keeping me on the edge of my seat as I wait for the moment where it shows its true intentions.

Ventus/Skuld are giving me Roxas/Xion vibes.

As for Strelitzia's killer maybe in 2030 we find out who is, but let me just say Ephemer is the only white haired KH character in this franchise who still didn't do anything evil...

I think Darkness is his own character, seeing as how I am getting the impression that Luxu was faithful to the MoM's desire of not interfering in his plans. You could make an argument that Luxu was not to interfere in contrast to Ava's interference, which is something I presume the Master expected to happen. Remember that Luxu says that Ava fulfilled her role.

Honestly you're making a better argument for why Ven definitely shouldn't have gotten the BoP then why he should. If the Master of Masters wanted Ventus to play his part in the future Keyblade War he'd need to know as little about his future as possible.

Also I'm kind of curious, wouldn't the other Foretellers know about the Union Leaders? Luxu certainly did, after all he knew that one of them didn't belong. If the book detailed the events of the future most likely leading up all the way to the clash in KH3, wouldn't there need to be at least a mention on who would lead the unions after them?

According to the secret reports from KH3, Luxu cannot be darkness because he speaks about how darkness arrived after he and MoM left DT for good.

Plus in BC MoM says that it’s critical that Luxu never sees the book to avoid temporal paradoxes so yeah definitely not him, but it most likely is a Foreteller.

I was stating a Hypothetical. If Strelitzia was killed because she was the destined possessor of the BoP then Ava have no reason to kill her as Ava had already given it to Brain; and Stre would have no idea unless told by someone who did know. Unless there is even more to that situation that we don't know about. That was my basic argument

On the point of Ava being the only one to know who the 5 Dandyleaders are, it has been shown constantly that the Foretellers don't have everything as they would have planned. They are constantly found with their pants down about everything going on (especially about the whole "Guilt is the power of Darkness" thing), so I wouldn't be surprised if the information somehow leaked beforehand.



...Ava knew that Player knew. Strelitzia going to tell him wouldn't have made any difference which ultimately is the sadly ironic thing about her death. This doesn't make sense as a motive for the murder because Ava had been the one to invite Player, Ephemer and Skuld into the Dandelions. The only way that would make sense is if Ava didn't know who Stre wanted to invite, but even then, as a Dandeleader part of her job was to recruit more Dandelions, so unless she had to tell that she was a leader (which I don't think she was going to as there would be no reason to mention that), I don't see a reason to kill her for that.



The replacement would know because presumably they were told after Stre died. Stre died right after the bell rung signifying the Keyblade War, and that means that they would have been given their book right before it as well, because we see her assassin take her book.

To be fair though, I thought about it a bit and realized that it was just that I've projected my knowledge of Stre being a Dandeleader onto the cast, as only Brain and Ephemer know now that she was supposed to be one of them. So only after one they gather everyone up can they spread that info. Darn it, it starting to look like Laurium is his sister's replacement. Its just a feeling but a bad one to be sure.

Also Crackpot theory time:

MoM said that in his time, Darkness took the shape of people, and it was a mess telling friend from foe, so what if one of our current cast is actually not just an unwilling vessel for darkness, but darkness is their true nature?

Killing Strelitzia to silence her is still a bit too much. Ava is a Foreteller, the easiest to talk to, even from other Unions, she is respected and loved. All she had to do was to ask Strelitzia to stay silent, or at worst just knock her out until the war starts. If she wanted to change the future by replacing Strelitzia, she could simply ask back the rulebook. Killing when you have easier methods at your disposal just doesn't add up, especially for kindhearted Ava.

The video brings up some intresting points, but I'm still not entirely sold. The "venture forth in secrecy" can simply mean her changing who gets the BoP. And still, Ava's goal would be to rewrite the future and help the Dandelions. Why kill one of them, why help Maleficient? Also I don't belive the book they found in the room from which they made the spirits is the BoP, just a random book.

As for the "certain lady of magic" I belive Luxu actually doesn't know about Darkness, and the information he refers to doesn't come from Maleficient, but Darkness (info on the ark, the thing that possibly takes Lauriam, Ven, Elrena and some to the future).

What I belive:
- Ava is innocent, other than giving Brain the BoP
- Darkness is not from the future
- Luxu isn't Darkness and/or the killer
- the killer is not the replacement
- the replacement is either Lauriam, or Ven/Skuld/Ephemer
- if it's Ven/Skuld/Ephemer, the killer was posing as Ava (I exclude Lauriam because I don't remember him ever mentioning Ava choosing them, like the others, and he might simply got the book from someone else, not knowing it's weird)

Guesses:
- Darkness is a Foreteller (due to calling MoM simply Master; taken from the video)
- Darkness is the killer
- since the replacement is innocent, the killer belives this change is enough to cause a big enough change in the future, even though the replacement doesn't know they are special

Wild guesses:
- Gula is Darkness/killer
- his goal is bringing MoM back by simply messing with the future, not caring about the kids
- Ven is the replacement

Why Ava would converse with Maleficent and indirectly lead the Union Leaders to the outside world seems pretty obvious.

MoM was the one who told Ava to send the Dandelions to another world and avoid the war, but we know now that the world they fled to was actually a data world, acting as a "cage." Ephemer equates this to being a trap, and doesn't think Ava herself would have any reason to set up such a thing. Thus naturally, it points back to the machinations of the MoM.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we see MoM and Luxu in that same control room the Union Leaders discovered, during a flashback? In that scene, I recall the two were discussing a plan about "delaying" something, and the framing makes it pretty clear that it was probably the MoM himself that made the data worlds the Dandelions would later jump into. In other words, the one who set the trap could only have been the MoM, and Ava (trying to defy the Master's plan) would naturally be inclined to pull the Union Leaders out of the situation. Idk, that's just my deduction I guess.

There are so many deliberate hints and possible red herrings, it's frustrating.

Whoever Darkness is, there is some unknown motivation for why sending Maleficent to the future with the Ark. Unless it's just to open the way for the Union leaders to ride that Ark, and Darkness wants them all to escape... I don't understand what use Maleficent has to Darkness to return in Kh2. Luxu playing the role of Darkness would be fitting, but also confusing... It's clear that Luxu has been using Maleficent in Kh3, and Xehanort used her before that - but it's so confusing and not-optimal at this point that it's confusing.

Another thing to think about, is how Darkness seems to be following the word of the Book of Prophecies. Or at least believes that it is accurate and regardless of changes... unless its just to convince Maleficent to do it, but it seems more on the side of being genuine than blatantly deceptive.

Things that are seem to be for sure:

1) The ark might be the method all of the dandelions use to escape the data realm... and end up in Sora's timeline. What's weird about the timing of this, is that Maleficent would've had to wait a pretty long time to become whole again, considering Marluxia and co. have time to become part of the Organization and are already long gone for the first time, a good deal of time before Maleficent even got returned to her form. Not an impossible scenario...just a bit odd. Though, I guess if the whole point was just to get Maleficent to grab all of the dandelions, they wouldn't care about restoring her to her former shape, and just wouldn't bother helping to remember her or anything (or, they probably wouldn't have been able to anyway).

I'm curious how this is going to play out.

2) Gula's goal was to summon Kingdom Hearts, thinking it would bring the MoM back. Any theory connecting Gula will depend on this premise. Gula is, in many ways, a parallel to Xehanort. He believes that he's the only one he cant trust, and that any basically actions are permitted, so long as his "role" or "mission" is carried out. They don't believe they are traitors or evil, even though it's clear that they ended up being as such. They both want to call Kingdom Hearts, albeit for different reasons.

3) Ava may be suspicious, but I don't understand her being evil. She is more self aware of the consequences of any action, and desperate to perserve peace and normality. She is loyal to the task that the MoM assigned her, and while she attacked Luxu and inadvertently started a Keyblade War... I don't see any meaningful connection besides "going in secrecy" that points to her being Darkness.


Normura really created a mess of a mystery: which is far more complicated than the actual mystery the foretellers themselves had to deal with.

Right, but remember that when we meet Ven in BBS, he was catatonic after what happened with Master Xehanort. Plus, I believe Chirithy mentioned that Ven doesn't remember them anymore. Whatever happened to Ven during the time-span of UX and BBS must've messed with his memory to some degree. So it's possible that even in the memory loss, the MoM knew this was going to happen anyway and was going to choose him because the knowledge would've been the safest with an amnesiac Keyblade wielder. This is a Master who we haven't pinned down truly what his goal is yet, so even though I admit it may be a bit of a stretch, it's not impossible when we know that he's directly manipulated so far already.

Plus, Luxu knew his role for the Keyblade War, was a direct influence, and he body-hopped all this time until now. It could've been the same for Ven had he ended up getting the book.



Luxu would know because his role was to observe throughout time and watch No Name get bequeathed over and over until the chosen one (Xehanort) would finally try to recreate the Keyblade War. So Luxu would have to know at some point who everyone is, but as far as we know, everyone else died in the War.

But if the book DID have that kind of information, then it would mean that it could be any of the Foretellers that are currently in the shadows manipulating events.



I agree, and it's quite possible that they did know. Of course, we only know so much so I can't say 100% for sure on anything, but it's clear that the Foretellers all had their own agendas. In the Secret Reports, Luxu said that a Darkness threatened the world after they left, so it's implied that everyone besides Luxu weren't present (as far as he knew). Unless Darkness is ALL of the Foretellers, but they just take turns playing the role. (which would be... huh?) But Darkness does have information that most wielders shouldn't, and that's why I'm thinking that their identity has to be of them. Or had the opportunity to explore the tower and read the BoP enough to know what's going on.



You make a good point. But then, maybe Strelitzia WAS going to mention she's a Leader. She had her rulebook and we know that she wanted to talk to Player, but in her desperation... Who knows what she would've said. Honestly, I typed up the theory of Strelitzia being silenced, but I can admit that I'm taking a lot of leaps on this one. That's why I think we don't have enough information, but the basis for the theory is moreso off the idea that if Ava = Darkness, what if Darkness was responsible for killing Strelitzia? This is ALSO based off me wondering if the False Leader and Strelitzia's Murderer are the same.

Cause let's say Ven isn't a chosen leader after all, it may not be set in stone that he killed her either (although the logic is there). If the False Leader and Killer aren't the same, then how did the F.L. get the Rulebook? It would've had to have been given by someone respectable, someone everyone knows that they were in charge of organizing the Dandelions -- Ava.

Occam's Razor would be, False Leader = Killer, but neither Union member has shown the propensity as of right now to murder someone in cold blood, in the back of a house in pitch black darkness. It doesn't mean it's impossible, but then someone right now would have to be lying about their very nature. Who that would be... I guess Brain is suspecting either Ven or Skuld.



Whoever killed her, knew about the book. That much is for sure. But who it is, I honestly don't have a clue. For all intents and purposes, Strelitzia dying doesn't make sense, because how did anyone know SHE had a rulebook? That's why I'm thinking it would've had to have been someone privy to the knowledge of the next Union Leaders. The Master of Masters knew obviously because he chose them, Ava knew because it was her role... So who else? Unless Luxu was listening in on the whole conversation and decided to kill Strelitzia for whatever reason, but then why? Or, if the Foretellers knew about the next chosen five, what motive would any of them have for killing Strelitzia?

If the False Leader is the killer, it makes things easier, but I just can't help but wonder how they would've known to go after her. As far as anyone else was concerned, she was a regular Dandelion. Nobody was supposed to know who was a leader and who wasn't. Unless she was stalked, but then, why?

Regarding the theory, it's possible, but then that would mean it would either be Ven or Skuld. Ven because of Vanitas and Missing Ache, and Skuld because... We don't don't really know all that much about her. MoM is also very cryptic, so who knows what he's saying when he talks about this.

It's possible but I don't see the advantage in giving Ven, who's the youngest of them and still rather shy and not very confident a book detailing the hardships he'd have to endure in the future.

We still don't know exactly how Ven, Lauriam, Elrena and the others get to the future. KH3 strongly implies what ever helped did wipe their memory. I do find it interesting that out of the 5 union leaders at least 2 maybe 3 ended up displaced in time.
This does support that MoM planned on them to end up in the future. I mean why else put them in a position that'd make them more likely to get involved with the Ark.

I do find it interesting what ever brought them to the future took them to roughly 15 years before the Keyblade War would occur. Wonder if there's some event that took place at that point in time leading them to be scattered, though I guess everyone besides Ven could have also just randomly appeared within the time range of Sora's birth and Roxas' creation.



Honestly we don't know what happened to the Foretellers, if they died or if they just dimmed and faded like the Master of Masters. For all we know they could have taken arks of their own to the future.

We also don't know how Demyx and Luxord's original selves were involved. They'd somehow have to end up where the time travel shenanigans happen. I guess one of them could be Darkness acting as an agent for one of the Foretellers or even MoM himself.


The Fake Leader being the killer would make things simpler, but at the moment none of them really seem like people who'd do such a thing.

Besides it's not hard to imagine Darkness or the Nightmare Chirithy lurking in the shadows following Ava's every move to know what the MoM was planning. I mean others had noticed that she was talking across unions recruiting Dandelion, so if someone was plotting against them, following her would make sense.

I feel like out of everyone we know, the best person to have the Book of Prophecies would either be Ephemer or Brain (who currently already has it and was chosen by Ava). But then again, we also don't know what the Master's end game is. He says he wants to put an end to the Keyblade War, but what's really going on? He hasn't told anyone what the rhyme or reason behind any of this is, not even Luxu fully knows what's going on and the Master probably confided in him the most (for whatever reason).



Well, we know at the end of KH3, Luxu summoned every Foreteller except for Ava back. Prior to this, we know they fought in the war. So you're right, we really don't know what could've happened during that time. It's implied that they were all dead. But then it's also interesting because if they were dead, how did Luxu gain the power to bring people back from the dead? I don't think we've ever really asked this question, and they all just walk out of a portal like nothing happened?

Luxord and Demyx seem to be the two most mysterious characters in ReMIND so their roles have to be pretty big in all of this. Certainly big enough for them to be in present day, for whatever reason.



Right, so that's why I'm not sure if the Fake Leader and the killer are one in the same. Of course, it's definitely possible for someone to be completely hiding their true nature, but... What's the goal?

But if it IS Ventus (which, hoo boy), it might explain how the Master of Masters mentioned that during the Keyblade War as a kid, he fought against beings that "weren't human"... Because Vanitas wasn't human, and it's strange how one Keyblade wielder who was stripped from the heart of their true self is able to create a completely new type of monster that is not only born from negative emotion, but they also return to said individual once defeated. This is extremely strange, and because of Vanitas, we never see the Unversed again until in KH3, and it's the only world he reappears in (that we can visit). Vanitas is Ven's darkness given sentience, so maybe Nomura may come out and say "Oh yeah, Ven isn't exactly human either."

Maybe we'll also get an explanation for Vanitas's outfit and why it's similar to Riku's in KH1 (and by an extension, Repliku's). In fact, we already know that Vanitas's face is because of the events in BBS. But in terms of his outfit (especially his helmet), it was never explained, I feel like maybe there's a bigger reason for it. It could be just a "dark suit", but I'm not convinced.

Another who may not be exactly human is Subject X (assumedly Skuld). In her secret report she says she does not understand 'Who or what" she is and even asks "Am I alive?"

If the Vanitas theory is true, then how does Ven/Vanitas have access to the BoP?

Someone is either manipulating that side of him, or at least cooperating with the Vanitas side of him.

Yeah, Ephemer is definitely my primary candidate for who actually should have gotten the book. He just seems like the natural leader and would be responsible enough to entrust with it.

The Master's plans are a mystery as are his true goals. His method seems to lead to a lot of strive and conflict though. Well at least leading up to Union X.


Well apparently he called all of them just Ava didn't answer his summon, either because she didn't want to or because she couldn't thanks to the actions she took not placing her where she should have been to be summoned.

Yeah seems like Re:Mind will at least try and shine some more light on those two. Though at them moment I wouldn't be surprised, if it weren't just more foreshadowing with UX being left to actually elaborate on them, though I don't think it'll be this season.



In most mystery stories there'd be cracks and clues for the viewer to pick up on. While I have't been really observant I can't say I personally noticed any. I find Darkness being a 6th player in the whole thing and having killed Strelitzia and tricked someone to take her place could work, with what we have so far. At the moment I'd prefer it even.



I feel the explanation of what and who Vanitas is works with what we have been given so far. I assume that when he was created he also absorbed darkness from around him, leading to him being stronger.

I'd personally prefer for Ven to just be a 12 year old kid over his head in this part of the MoMs plans. Him not being human would also effect Sora, seeing those two are deeply connected, and him being responsible for a death and other evil deeds would make him less likable and require damage control later on.

On top of that, if Ven had that kind of Darkness than Xehanort wouldn't have talked about him the way he did in his reports and could have used him as a vessel no problem.

Well the BBS reports aren't totally consistent on that. On one hand Xehanort does say that Ventus was too 'benign for his own good' but then says that Ventus was 'too frail' to serve as a vessel, suggesting physical weakness, not lack of darkness was the problem.

And then of course the reports go onto explain that Vanitas 'took too much of Ventus's heart', nearly killing the remaining light, which needed to be strengthened to match Vanitas' darkness.

This suggests that actually darkness was dominant in Ventus's heart before the split

but when we see the “circle” of Ven at his SOA we see it’s about 60-40, 60% there and 40% gone, meaning to me he is 60% light, then his heart merges with Sora’s to recomplete the circle.

So basically inconsistencies everywhere

I get where everyone is coming about Vanitas being a lot of darkness, but why is everyone assuming that Vanitas was organically born like that? For all we know, Master Xehanort must have meddled some way in order to properly create an opposing force to Ventus' pure light..

Isn't that at the end of the game though, where it is noted that Ventus has become strong enough to finally stand against Vanitas? It could be that when they say that, he was steadily repairing his heart while it was connected with Sora's and so, when it is broken again, it isn't as bad as it could have been, seeing as he didn't just die. I would posit that Vanitas was more of the heart (or more powerful) than Ventus, because Vanitas, after he was created, got up and walked away. Ventus was catatonic for a very long time, and that was with Sora's heart supporting him. Why is Vanitas so powerful, not just when terrorizing the worlds, but also when first created, to the point where Ventus would have died from his absence, but he wouldn't from Ventus'.

I think it’s because Vanitas said his heart was incomplete when he confronted Sora, right? Assumption but if Xehanort nurtured Vanitas heart, I don’t think he would complain about his heart being incomplete. I think Xehanort just trained Vanitas to become stronger and nothing else. Unless he was talking about the state of his heart being incomplete due to the X-blade shattering his heart.


I’m surprised no one brought up void gear having two of MoM’s eyes lmao.

Yeah, I agree it seem like Xehanort did something to strengthen the darkness inside of Ven, to make it stronger and more likely to stand up to Ven's light. Not considering he might have to do something to reinforce Ven's hurt heart of light.

There was a lot of darkness swirling into the part of the heart that would became Vanitas. Potentially from the Heartless Xehanort had previously summoned?

Also looking at Ven's Station of Awakening I'd say Vanitas made up at most 30% of Ven's heart probably closer to 25% or less seeing Ven did mention what he has left was slowly slipping away as well. Which I took as his heart eroding.

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This amount of darkness in someone's heart would seem normal to me. Besides in UX there are no real signs of Ven having a lot of darkness in him, he's neither angry, greedy or depressed, which would be obvious tells of darkness. Though who know's he might be deceitful.

You know, I just though of something strange. We are under the assumption that only the fake leader that is the one is responsible for Strelitizia's death whether it is intentional or not. But isn't there a possibility that one of the chosen union leader works together with the fake one ? It seems too far-fetched and I know other union leaders aren't supposed to know who are the other leaders before meeting them in person but hmm.. I just imagined something like this
- Someone tells the chosen leader the other supposed-to-be-chosen leaders
- That someone strikes down Strelitizia
- The fake leader replaces Strelitizia.
- The fake leader and one chosen leader secretly works together
Okay, maybe impossible. I just remembered that most of the time Ven is together with Skuld so it feels quite strange since I think Skuld is supposed to have more screen time with Ephemer

Thinking about it, what I don't buy is the idea that Xehanort could have split any keyblade wielder's heart in two and that it being Ventus/Vanitas is just a coincidence. Even in BBS, Xehanort says he felt he was 'destined' to meet Ventus and I think the creation of Vanitas was an important moment in someone's plan, be it the MoM or Darkness.

Watching Ventus's conversation when he meets Ephemer and Skuld in the KG reinforces this in my view. Ventus wonders why he was chosen as a leader because there is nothing special about him, which makes me think he is actually very special and important in some way. I would bet the farm on him either being the imposter or the intended recipient of the BoP.

In this conversation Ventus also states that he is jealous of Ephemer and Skuld's friendship, because he has always been a loner. This reminds me of Toy Box, where Young Xehanort links darkness and loneliness ("If the light of friendship is a form of power, then the darkness of being alone is a power even greater"). YX also talks about doubt allowing the darkness to enter someone's heart too so we see that Ventus is at least susceptible to darkness, even at the start.

My guess is the Darkness killed Strelitzia and disguised itself as Ava to make him a union leader (Ventus makes clear he didn't know Ava well, suggesting he could be fooled by the disguise). The Darkness, whatever it's origin, could eventually enter Ven's heart to go with him to the future where it would be brought out by Xehanort as Vanitas.

Not really. There are some people who believe this but being the murderer and the imposter are not exclusive to one another.


Yeah, it is farfetched lol. It's not impossible of course, but there's no evidence of such a thing happening at this time.

Skuld has never had more screentime than Ephemer. I love the girl but she is poorly developed with little to no agency of her own. Even at her most active, her character revolved around one of three things: Ephemer, Player or her duty as a Dandelion.

I love this idea! Darkness' goal could be to get to the future, maybe even to chase after MoM. It knows that the Union Leaders (and Elrena and Luxord and Demyx's somebodies) will be brought to the future, so kills a Leader, and puts in her place a guy he possesses, who's 'darkness' will be extracted and given shape later.
So, basically the Reverse Vanitas Theory, instead of Vanitas going back to the past and becoming Darkness, it's Darkness going to the future to become Vanitas. My only problem is that Vanitas gives off no signs of being someone else other than Ventus' darkness. He was empty when he was born.
But traveling to the future being Darknesses goal is something I can belive.

I just remembered that in the original Chi when Ephemer goes to the Foreteller's tower alone after parting with Player he meets a figure in a black coat.

Back then we always theorized it being either MoM or Luxu, but now...could that have been Darkness investigating the tower by themselves?

Actually, I believe the general consensus for who the shrouded figure in that scene was, is Ava. It was presumably the moment she first contacted him about leading the Dandelions, and they relocated to the cliffside we see Ephemer receive the rule book at later on. The KHwiki even supports this idea.

I kind of always took it as a sign that Ava could very well be darkness, since she would've had precedent for appearing that way before. But I guess in the end, we still don't know for sure.

It would be a very nice plot twist if Darkness turns out to be Strelitzia in some way, like her ghost or nobody.

I would agree that's a problem with the Vanitas theory but of course if the Darkness did travel to the future inside someone it would have other candidates too.

A reason Vanitas could seem to just be Ven's darkness and a blank slate is that he too is affected by amnesia so wouldn't know his own nature. Part of the Darkness's plan could have even be to position itself so its memory would eventually be restored somehow and its true nature revealed.

Ven's Chirithy in the Final World does seem uneasy about his master's memories being restored, saying 'he's probably happier with his new friends'. To me, this doesn't necessarily mean Ven was evil but that his memories at least include sadness of some kind.

Thinking about it, this amnesia thing could point to Skuld, looking at the Secret Reports about Subject X. We know that the amnesiac (Terra-)Xehanort wanted to unlock her memory with his experiments but she was hidden from him and he was forced to experiment on himself instead, unlocking his own memory and his darkness.

And Subject X's own report suggests that it was Braig who hid her from Xehanort. If so, this would be the first time we know of when Braig/Luxu acted against Xehanort's wishes. This could be because Luxu has identified Skuld as the virus in the MoM's plan and unlocking her memory would derail the plan further.

One more thing about Vanitas, though. He has been shown to be something a little more than Ventus's darkness. He also formed a connection to another heart, through Ventus who now defines him in the same way that Ventus does, according to final words in the KG. I find it difficult to believe the connection of this being of pure darkness to Sora is insignificant.

Off topic from the discussion but am I the only who ships Ephemer and Brain.

then I will ship skuld and ventus

Let us not forget that Lea & Isa were trying to save a girl in Radiant Garden. A girl with no memories that is locked up. Has to definitely be Skuld. Which brings me to say that the culprit is Skuld. It is too easy to say that it is ventus given his unknown history. I don't have a lot of things to back up that it could be skuld because the khux story is confusing and should be a console game before releasing kh4

So you're saying that Skuld has to be the culprit because she could be Subject X and Subject has no memories of her past?

Well why can't Darkness be Strelitzia? We still have that unknown figure in the title opening holding an actual Strelitzia flower right? I just don't think we're done with her yet.

I often question why anything had to happen to her and not... well anyone else. I'm sure her connection to her brother was the deciding factor and not just her desperation to recruit player.

Nomura actually confirmed that the hooded figure in the artwork wasn't Strelitzia quite a while back (before the art was even officially released). That said, if she turns out to be Nameless Star, I can't imagine her not appearing in the flesh again at some point.

there’s no evidence that Strelitzia knows all the things Darkness does. Darkness is aware of the BoP for instance. Strelitzia shouldn’t know a thing about it.

This is probably going to sound really science fictiony but here goes lol.

I kind of have a feeling the "ark" might actually be a stationary machine and the box we've seen Luxu/Xigbar carrying is the portable smaller version.

I remember reading that translated Luxu conversation where he talked about the box and it not being what we might think it is. What if that's kind of true. What if the box we've seen him carrying is currently in an "idle/sleep" mode form but it has the ability to transform into something else, like a machine. If opened, this machine would have the ability to create a portal. Luxu/Xigbar does kind of have that ability to bend space to his will so technically we don't know how far he can reach between dimensions. What's to say he can't stick that box wherever he wants.

With all that being said, you would now have the ability to travel between two points: Ark and to wherever the box has been placed. Since the box has never been opened, could this be something the MoM wants to utilize in the future?

It's probably all totally wrong but atleast I can get a fun mental imagine of MoM and Xigbar being like Doc Brown and Marty McFly with them going back and forth to the past and future lol.

I wouldn't put it past Nomura to make us think that the Black Box has something inside it, when in reality, the lock system it has is used to camouflage the device into a box.

Maleficent said that perhaps the Box doesn't yet exist in their time. Meaning that, perhaps, Luxigbar hid it in a space/time pocket and the reason he sent everyone in a wild goose chase for it is because he needed everyone to desire it in order to attract it. Maybe he hid it in a split version of the Keyblade Graveyard, and the same way the Toybox world worked, perhaps he hid the Box in another Keyblade Graveyard, and when everyone involved in its desire appeared in the Graveyard, the Box appeared?

Calling it now, Ava became [Darkness] and whatever entity [darkness] is that took over Ava is what took her name and everything about her.

So I think the nameless star is Ava. And most likely skuld is subject X.

Also Sora says he was really glad he met the star and that she cheered him up, as if she's really easy to talk to. You know who else said someone was easy to talk to? Brain and Ephemer, about AVA. Bam, proof.

And the person who would be distressed by her absence would be Gula, who also happens to be Ven who killed Strelitzia and took her spot as a union leader because of Vanitas.

There, thats my theory and no one can convince me otherwise.

This is... that is just a lot of leaps based on what we know right now

I just can’t see any foreteller (or MoM) being any character we know.

Nameless Star has a different voice actor though?

Classic misdirection, voice actors change all the time!



A man's gotta believe in something lol.

Well Gula = Ven is fine but I wonder if someone can just forget about adding vanitas into anything ...

It's probably nothing but this made me think of the final boss battle in Scala Ad Caelum (built on the remains of Daybreak Town, in the tower of which the ark is said by Darkness to be held).

Specifically, the weird circles that appear beneath you and lift you up during the battle do kind of look like a mechanism to me. On the larger circle are the symbols of the 7 lights and 13 darknesses and beneath it you can make out the symbol of the BoP surrounded by the foretellers' symbols (though it's hard to make them all out with Xehanort hitting you). I assumed these were purely symbolic but perhaps there could be something more going on.

If that was the case, they could have just picked up another VA for Young Sora instead of keeping the same guy who went through puberty. Or use different voice actors for Ven and Roxas/Sora and Vanitas.

Voice actors are significant in KH.

Yeah that's definitely a question I hope is answered in Remind. He had the box all these years but lost it now? Like you said, maybe there's a specific influence it needs to reappear. Magic concealed it in a special pocket in the lanes between, but needed enough heart's desire to return it the current location.

Then there's the classic Xiggy stuff where he knew where it was stored and messed around with everyone lol. It is interesting though that he seemed to mention the box more specifically to Marluxia and company. Though you could say Vexen was involved too a bit but we see he's not entirely invested in it's whereabouts. Maybe the search was actually a test or bait of some sort to see if there was someone planning on doublecrossing Xehanort's plan to use it for themselves. Again hopefully we get some answers because really anything could be the answer at this point lol.



I looked back myself too and you raise a good point. It appears those magical runes are unlocking something or at the very least warping reality. The sigil circles are spinning at different speeds and the actual colors change from red to gold. It could be something correlating to Kingdom Hearts, Scala, Xehanort or a just general connection between them. Could be nothing like you said but it's still an interesting observation. Hopefully Remind gives us a bit more insight into Scala.

Just had a thought:

What if the black box actually did disappear until the end of KH3, when the foretellers appear.

Perhaps the world was on a particular course of destiny that cause the box to disappear... why? Who knows. Perhaps Xehanort's actions weren't initially destined, and perhaps even the MoM triggered them - causing the first change in the timeline which made the box dissapear, among other possible events that don't seem to make sense with what we happening in the past.

However, after Sora defeated Xehanort, and prevented the keyblade war from ending in darkness as prophesied, it lead to a sequence of time-based events that would allow all the other foretellers and the box to reappear... Perhaps even creating the events of the Backcover to happen the way we saw them... and not the way the originally went down, as passed down in legend, which we may have not actually seen.

It's so important to find the right question to ask. Let me show you...

The dandelions are trapped in data worlds. For data worlds to exist, there must be some kind of computer to run them.
What, and where, is this device?

I'm seen some very interesting theories as of late regarding the black box with the latest union cross updates, and all so good that I'm not sure which one to follow.

One theory - that the black box itself is the ark. I believe this theory belongs to PodCast Now.
One theory - the black box itself is the intermediary object that is mentioned by darkness. Maybe it holds the souls or hearts of the foretellers? The box itself was buried in the keyblade graveyard. Reason foretellers are back is because Luxu is the one to remember them. So maybe they used the ark? I think this was a theory of GamersJoint on youtube. This is one I really want to believe the most. It would explain why the box looks so dirty in the scene.

I think it could be the the case that Luxu's memories brought them back... Though it's a bit confusing. You can't just bring ANYBODY back by just remembering them, right? We know that with the whole Ark concept, that peoples hearts can be sent to a certain time and location, though their bodies fade away... And if someone is around at this destination to help people remember you, somehow, your body can then be restored.

Were the hearts of the Foretellers just lying around in the Keyblade Graveyard, waiting for someone to remember them? Could be. Seems weird though. Maybe Luxu collected their hearts in the Black Box after the original keyblade war, and the box is essentially just a vessel to store hearts which can then be used restore them when necessary?

Ava must still either exist somehow, or had her heart released somewhere else, and that's why she doesn't return when Luxu remembers her.

Claiming theories is weird to me especially since this one is hardly original. That the black box is the ark was probably the first thought most people had when they saw Maleficent refer to the incomplete ark as nothing but a box.



I think it's within the realm of possibility that the Foretellers returned because Luxu remembered them, but the rest of this theory is kind of all over the place.

I can see the black box being the "intermediary" object, required for the ark to function, but I don't think the box is the ark itself.

I kind of have a feeling that the ark is actually like a precursor or prototype to the gummi ship, as it was mentioned to be originally designed to reach "the ocean between" which is what the gummi ship is also used for. My instincts are telling me that this is going to be used as a set up for the gummi ship becoming a time machine in future games.

I seem to recall there being a mission in Ux where Mickey, Donald, and Goofy crash land the gummi ship in Daybreak town and you have to help them find the pieces to rebuild it. This was probably the first time they experimented with using the gummi ship as a time machine at some point in the future.

I will LAUGH if the reason Ventus, Lauriam and Arlene all forgot about their pasts is because they crash landed into present day KH a la SDG back in Deep Jungle LOL