the new Heart emblem and its related enemy

[SeaSalt]

More like the mind or just thoughts, as it was said that some of Terra's thoughts (those pertaining to his deep hatred of Xehanort) entered and animated the armor.
Like a robot outfitted with some basic orders.

The soul can't be separated from the body, because then the being in question would die!

thats right, i guess i dont qute understand what composes a body in KH. lol

 

[EternalDreamer]

So we basically don't KNOW what a possible 3rd part would be?

The soul is impossible, as it always travels along with the (no)body.
Heart is covered (Heartless)
Body is covered (Nobodies)

All that's left i can think of is the mind. But, the mind supposedly also travels along with the (no)body. The only thing is, as proven by the 2 currently existing Lingering Sentiments, is that the mind CAN take over or create other objects/bodies, and then somehow split itself away from the 'main' mind. Terra's mind somehow got rid of his hatred towards xehanort by "dumping" it in his armor, while Vanitas's mind created an entirely new being that was supposed to be himself with ultimate power. I guess. That made no sense, did it?

Maybe the mind can 'envision' stuff that, if strong enough, really happens. Terra wanted to defeat Xehanort, and his Mind made his armor do it for him. Vanitas wanted to be all powerful. His Mind then created an all-powerful version of himself.

Probably not. Cuz then all Sora would have to do is think really really hard that xehanort will be defeated and his Mind would do something to make it happen.

Meh, this is starting to sound like a fan-fic, right? I'm just going to say the 3rd part is Willpower.

Edit: Now that i think about it. Is VLS even canon?

 

[Sephiroth0812]

We have essentially all three "main" parts of a true existence covered, as you said, because soul and body stay together.

There are still lesser parts of an existence though, like memories, the mind/will, emotions and maybe also "dreams".
We already had an enemy based off emotions => Unversed.

The mind doesn't really "travels" with the nobody, as nobodies have their own mind independent from the somebody. Beside their own memories, that's what makes a nobody different from their somebody.
Sora and Roxas coexisted, so that's the most obvious example with Sora still having his mind while Roxas has his own.

It goes for all nobodies though as as of now no one knows what happens to the mind/will of the somebody if they aren't coexisting.

 

[EternalDreamer]

Hm, right. I remember how Roxas was completely...lifeless in the first few days of Days.

Well then, how's this. The mind of the somebody either becomes it's own entity or travels along with the heartless if it's will is strong enough. (Ansem SoD, Sora)

The mind seems to be rather omnipotent in KH. Let's sum it up:
-Stays with the Heartless. Nobody has it's own independent mind.
-Influences lifeless objects. (TLS)
-Creates abnormal entities who look considerably like the somebody. (VLS)
-Becomes it's own independent entity? (KH3D 'new' enemies)

Dangit, i want 3D to come out so we know what the new enemy is made up off. 10 bucks say i'm completely fantasizing here to try and get the mind more involved.

 

[SeaSalt]

We have essentially all three "main" parts of a true existence covered, as you said, because soul and body stay together.

There are still lesser parts of an existence though, like memories, the mind/will, emotions and maybe also "dreams".
We already had an enemy based off emotions => Unversed.

The mind doesn't really "travels" with the nobody, as nobodies have their own mind independent from the somebody. Beside their own memories, that's what makes a nobody different from their somebody.
Sora and Roxas coexisted, so that's the most obvious example with Sora still having his mind while Roxas has his own.

It goes for all nobodies though as as of now no one knows what happens to the mind/will of the somebody if they aren't coexisting.

i think you have a point with the emotions thing. maybe one of the new enemies is based off another one of these cahracteristics.

-Becomes it's own independent entity? (KH3D 'new' enemies)

this is what i was trying to say back when i stated what i originally thought.

 

[Memory Master]

Okay let's look at the enemies so far as well as the parts that comprise a person:

1. Heartless: Hearts Consumed by Darkness
2. Nobody: The Body and Soul left behind
3. Unversed: Negative Thoughts and Emotions (So far Unversed have only come from Vanitas)
4. Bug Blocks: Corrupted Data I think?

Parts that Comprise a Person:

1. Body
2. Soul
3. Heart

And the Mind. However since the above 3 are the main parts that comprise a whole being then we may assume that the mind is a part of one of the 3 main parts.

So the question is which of the 3 main parts does the mind belong to? My guess is the heart. We already know the heart contains memory, emotions, light and darkness. We already have an enemy created from something that lies within the heart, the unversed created from emotion.


So my guess is the heart also contains the mind.

My reason for believing this is that Larxene said people who become heartless lose their minds. So normal heartless lack a mind, instead they act on instict. So where does the mind go when a heartless is made? I believe the mind goes to the nobody which would explain why nobodies unlike heartless can think and plan. Just as heartless lack positive emotions and memories, so too do they lack minds. The mind I believe goes to the nobody.

Another thing that seems to suggest the mind is located in the heart is that in the secret ending of BBS, it was MX and Terra's hearts that were speaking to each other inside of Terranort. If hearts are capable of communication then it suggest the mind/will is located in the heart.

Going off of this one may ask if heartless lack a mind then why did Sora and Xehanort's Heartless seem to keep their sense of self? Well they both had 2 hearts and so they both had 2 minds. Sora's heartless kept Sora's mind while Roxas kept Ven's mind and Heart. XH kept MX's mind and heart while Xemnas kept Terra's mind or atleast part of it. These two are highly unusual cases.

Then we have the new symbols of KH3D. Two of them are heart like symbols. Unversed had heart like symbols and they were an enemy formed from something that exist inside the heart, emotions. So if these symbols are those of a new enemy then perhaps they are created from something inside the heart as well, the mind. Or they could be made from dreams either one XD

 

[Nutari]

Hm. I know this prolly won't be true, but what about a persons light? It isn't, or can't be snuffed out, as we see with Terra. So what if we have heartless counter measure. With all the new enemies, and a possibilty that Unversed would return, it seems over whelming, so the light manifests, becomes something like a heartless, but it keeps them at bay. Just seems insane to add another thousand of a 4th enemy group

 

[Absolute]

I was thinking that perhaps they could make enemies out of damaged somebodies: basically, these would be the nobodies and hearts that rejoined with each other, but instead of coming back as ther original somebody, they are twisted and imcomplete.

 

[snow_flake40]

Hm. I know this prolly won't be true, but what about a persons light? It isn't, or can't be snuffed out, as we see with Terra. So what if we have heartless counter measure. With all the new enemies, and a possibilty that Unversed would return, it seems over whelming, so the light manifests, becomes something like a heartless, but it keeps them at bay. Just seems insane to add another thousand of a 4th enemy group

I was thinking that perhaps they could make enemies out of damaged somebodies: basically, these would be the nobodies and hearts that rejoined with each other, but instead of coming back as ther original somebody, they are twisted and imcomplete.

Ok, I insanely love both of these theories, and I think they work really well together.

When darkness takes over a person's heart and they become a Heartless, maybe the darkness expels the light within? As Sora said, the heart may be weak, and sometimes it may even give in, but deep down there's a light that never goes out. Darkness can never fully engulf light, but maybe the heart turning into a Heartless releases the light to form a light-based counterpart to try to stop the darkness, a defence mechanism as aldrain said.

Well, we actually haven't seen any of these light counterparts yet in the series when someone becomes a Heartless, meaning they would have to have been sent to another world when formed, like Nobodies, probably to somewhere in the Realm of Light. Not a fantastic defensive measure if it catapults them across the galaxy, is it? Maybe it's just that the darkness shrouding the heart sends the light packing to the RoL, subsequently creating a new light-based creature. Which brings me to Absolute's theory...

When a Heartless and Nobody fuse together, maybe they need the light being as well to become a complete Somebody once more. Without the light balancing them out, this new entity would be far more advanced than just a lone Heartless or Nobody, but still not quite a Somebody. They could have a heart and darkness from the Heartless and a mind, will, memories, body and soul from the Nobody but without this third creature of light, they are not complete. These could very well be a new enemy. Organization XIII went to great lengths to try to possess hearts once more. Maybe these new entities will be the same, except with light.

I know that, going by this theory, Sora should be the same kind of creature after merging with his Nobody Roxas. However, Kairi used her own light to save Sora from his Heartless-ness, meaning he did have light. Also, Roxas, having Ven's heart, wielded the element of light in the Organization. Sora's Nobody and heart both having light when they reformed would have saved him from becoming this other entity lacking light.

Only thing is, this theory of light creatures and junk only works if the light is removed from the heart upon becoming a Heartless. Isn't it a common theme in KH that in every darkness there is a light? Is it confirmed, then, that the light stays at the core of the heart even after it gives in to darkness and becomes a Heartless? Hmm...

 

[Tails_Night]

I could only imagine some of the bad guys of the realm of light, provided sora and friends aren't currently in the realm of light. But anyway I can't wait to see more keyblades of the realm of darkness or even someone who weilds keyblades of heart, and you could play as them.

 

[SeaSalt]

the problem i see is why would they be enemies of light? if light is good, why are they bad and whose side are they on?

 

[Absolute]

the problem i see is why would they be enemies of light? if light is good, why are they bad and whose side are they on?

They could be like Eraqua and act like well-intention extremists. Bascially try to destroy ALL darkness, leaving light and hurting the balance.

 

[kupo1121]

the problem i see is why would they be enemies of light? if light is good, why are they bad and whose side are they on?

It is generally people's assumptions that light means that the person is undeniably good and dark is undeniably bad. However, as seen with characters like Terra or Riku, darkness can also be good, and light can also likewise be bad (Eraqus).

 

[Sephiroth0812]

That's even the point. Light is NOT good. It's only mostly associated with good by many lifeforms, while in reality it is neutral, just like darkness.
It's only that most people who count as "evil" use mostly darkness, but as Absolute said, Eraqus is a good example for light being not all good.
He condemned Terra despite him having done nothing wrong...in fact his bias even drove Terra further down the wrong path which Xehanort used mercilessly to his own advantage.
Not to forget he tried to kill Ventus.
Light can blind a person and over yielding to the bright radiance of it that person may forget what really counts and becomes biased and narrow minded in differing degrees.

 

[Tails_Night]

Kinda the same with darkness the shadows can darken the right path, but their are some who use it and can stay on the right path, indeed power can corrupt but it works both ways. In the end ind can be debated if it's the being who corrupts the power or the power that corrupts the being. Either way don't forget the principals of yin and yang, theirs always some good and there's always some bad, but many overlook it because of what it's shrouded in. As you said Eraqus was a defender and being surrounded by light but he even was ready to do evil things in his blindness and created worse things as a result.

 

[SeaSalt]

It is generally people's assumptions that light means that the person is undeniably good and dark is undeniably bad. However, as seen with characters like Terra or Riku, darkness can also be good, and light can also likewise be bad (Eraqus).

maybe what absolute says makes some sense. they both want to cancel out eachother but they cant exists without the other, so if a creation of light enemies in the future games with the already-existing dark enemies would occur, that would lead to all out war. which im sure sora doesnt need to be bothered with during his attempts to take down xehanort.

 

[Virus]

maybe what absolute says makes some sense. they both want to cancel out eachother but they cant exists without the other, so if a creation of light enemies in the future games with the already-existing dark enemies would occur, that would lead to all out war. which im sure sora doesnt need to be bothered with during his attempts to take down xehanort.

I'm nearly positive that before the handhelds were released Nomura had said he wanted to make games with a darker tone.

Plus, Sora and Riku already said they would be exploring the Realm of Darkness and keeping it safe. So if creatures of darkness threatened the Realm of Light, the creatures of light must threaten the Realm of Darkness.

 

[Love Machine]

So if creatures of darkness threatened the Realm of Light, the creatures of light must threaten the Realm of Darkness.

I doubt anyone even gives a shit about the RoD.

 

[SeaSalt]

I doubt anyone even gives a shit about the RoD.

it doesnt matter they still have to cancel eachother out, no matter who cares about it

 

[Virus]

I doubt anyone even gives a shit about the RoD.

Nomura does, and I guarantee the characters do too. It's gotta be kept in perfect balance right?