Cartoon/TV ► Falcon and the Winter Soldier (2021)

[AdrianXXII]

Idk, tackling institutional and systemic racism isn’t that safe haha

True, though I think it'll only flirt with it instead of fully diving into it. Though I'd be happy to be proven otherwise.

The comics do have a history of getting pretty political, it'd be cool to see the MCU delve into that too. But I feel like by the end of the day it'll be racist individuals instead of racist systems once more.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

True, though I think it'll only flirt with it instead of fully diving into it. Though I'd be happy to be proven otherwise.

The comics do have a history of getting pretty political, it'd be cool to see the MCU delve into that too. But I feel like by the end of the day it'll be racist individuals instead of racist systems once more.

Maybe...

I don’t want to spoil anything if nobody saw it during the credits but we are going to be getting an interesting character that isn’t USAgent, and I don’t think there is any way to dance around these themes at an institutional level because of this.

I don’t think Disney will call racism by its name, though. They absolutely are too afraid to do that. They didn’t in Black Panther even though they got close with the subject of imperialism and poverty/crime in black communities...

 

[Deleted member 246005]

Idk, tackling institutional and systemic racism isn’t that safe haha

I meant in terms of tone. Its the traditional action comedy the MCU tends to be known for. Granted I'm curious how they handle that stuff. The MCU has dabbled in politics before in WS/CW and Black Panther but the show might have more room to do it well.

 

[KingdomKurdistan]

I don’t think Disney will call racism by its name, though.

Why should they? It's not because they're afraid it's because telling not showing is something Marvel is moving away from.

I don't think being so blatant is brave. It would be self-conscious and slightly cowardly from an artistic perspective if they did.

I always find films that have most to say about social issues don't actually state things. Things are made overt and on-the-nose when they don't have the artistry to express those words in abstractions. If it was was an ABC drama then they'd be less subtle.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Why should they? It's not because they're afraid it's because telling not showing is something Marvel is moving away from.

I don't think being so blatant is brave. It would be self-conscious and slightly cowardly from an artistic perspective if they did.

I always find films that have most to say about social issues don't actually state things. Things are made overt and on-the-nose when they don't have the artistry to express those words in abstractions. If it was was an ABC drama then they'd be less subtle.

I do agree with the sentiment that they should show, not tell, but all weekend I’ve have seen nothing but confusion on various discussion boards and social mediawhere people have missed the very obvious hints of what the show is addressing.

Before I went online and saw reactions, I thought it was super obvious and way too on-the-nose. After reactions hit, I realized that without it being blatantly stated, people can’t seem to grasp the concept.

More artistry would be nice because it creates a more thoughtful and creative product, but also people are straight up stupid or willfully ignorant. Sometimes they need this stuff put in their face or they will miss it/choose to miss it.

 

[AdrianXXII]

Agreed artistry is nice, but often it muddies the message so much people either miss the point or rationalize it with other explaination.

Sometimes things have to be staited outright or people might walk away thinking your romantic couple are just very good friends, because they are the same gender.

 

[KingdomKurdistan]

If people don't "get it" then tough. Meaning is given to art by the viewer, not the author. Wandavision lends itself to so many interpretations and readings because it choses images over words.

Otherwise we'd have an essay with one single reading and that's not art.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Meaning is given by both the author and the viewer. Otherwise what is the point of the author creating a piece of work with their own meaning to it?

 

[Chaser]

So annoyed I have to wait until next week to

Spoiler Show

see Daniel Brühl in all his glorious hotness

.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

I take everything I said back (partially since they gotta stick the landing in the next 4 episodes)

Wow they are not pulling the punches. I felt visceral anger multiple times this episode so thanks to Malcolm Spellman and Kari Skogland for actually tackling racism. And Bucky gets it but he’s also dealing with his own feelings of being unworthy, so he says the wrong shit and he knows he hurt Sam’s feelings and Isaiah like wtf this is effective storytelling

I will say I didn’t like the flow of this episode like episode 1. It was a bit off in places like I was missing context for the chain of events...

 

[Deleted member 246005]

I liked Bucky as the White Wolf and its a decent replacement for the Winter Soldier. Just shorten it to Wolf and we are golden.

Walker is nicer here than when he first pops up. He started out as jingiostic parody of conservativism so I'm glad they toned it down for his intro.

I'm glad they stuck to their guns. They don't hold back.

This is what they referenced-

Truth: Red, White & Black - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Falcon & The Winter Soldier: Every MCU Easter Egg In Episode 2

Did you catch them all?

screenrant-com.cdn.ampproject.org

 

[AdrianXXII]

This was a decent episode. I'm honestly surprised with how straight forward they're addressing the race issues, I was expecting it to be watered down a lot more than it has been so far.

Spoiler Show

I am surprised by how much work they did in the first half to humanize Walker. At first he doesn't come off as that bad of a guy, a bit cocky but overall not too bad of a dude, though his more questionable qualities show up as the episode progresses and he doesn't get what he wants.
I found his fixation and desperation for approval from Steve's friends rather interesting, especially with how poorly he handled being rejected by them. Walker seems to have admired Steve and was hopping to get to fight along side his friends.
Him referring to the big 3 makes me wonder, if it is supposed to confirm it's a thing in the MCU or if it's a hint that he's contently spying on Sam.

It's interesting that the government created new Cap has another black guy as his partner, kind of as if they were trying to mimic Caps and Falcons relationship. I saw that Battlestar is also from the comics, but asides from maybe having scene him in a background once I'm not really familiar with his character, or how he fits in with USAgent, so I'm looking forward to learning more about him.

I can't help, but feel like USAgent is either another Super Soldier or the flag smashers were just pretending with him, seeing he should not have been able to perform as well against them as he did.

Bucky and Sam have a really fun dynamic. Their rivalry is on full display and while they act like they don't like each other, it's kind of obvious that they do enjoy being around one another. I do hope the relationship evolves a bit beyond them acting like they don't care or like each other.

From the fact that they're going to see Zemo, I feel like the next episode will return to Bucky's arc, that seems to seems to have gone under a bit. I have the feeling his past is tied to the Flag Smashers or Power Broker somehow. I'm happy to see they brought back his White Wolf moniker, though I doubt it'll become his established alias.

 

[MATGSY]

Spoiler Show

Finally we see Battlestar or I know him better as "that one alt costume from MUA".

So far CapV2 & the BS don't seem to actually have powers, just elite soldiers closer to Widow & Hawkeye. Wonder if that'll change.

 

[KingdomKurdistan]

Woah they're not holding back. This is so good.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

'The Falcon and the Winter Soldier' writer addresses bisexual Bucky fan theory

'The Falcon and the Winter Soldier' Malcolm Spellman has addressed a theory saying Bucky Barnes is bisexual, telling fans to keep watching

www.nme.com

This is the oddest headline I've seen today, but the idea came about because Bucky has been seeing a lot of tiger photos on whatever dating apps he's been using, and the photo with tigers thing is done mostly by men. People have now assumed this means Bucky is seeing profiles from men and women.

I mean, since the show has the balls to address racism, it should have the balls to make Bucky bi. I'm not holding my breath, though haha

Anyways, back on theories:

I don't think Walker is enhanced...yet. I think the government is probably trying to get their hands on the serum and it will be used on Walker and make him hella aggro and probably beat the shit out of the wrong person. Everybody will find out and that'll lead to the title of Cap being stripped from him.

Since the Flash Smashers probably aren't the real bad guys, it makes me wonder who Power Broker will end up being played by and how they are going to handle him in the MCU overall.

 

[Willow A113]

'The Falcon and the Winter Soldier' writer addresses bisexual Bucky fan theory

'The Falcon and the Winter Soldier' Malcolm Spellman has addressed a theory saying Bucky Barnes is bisexual, telling fans to keep watching

www.nme.com

This is the oddest headline I've seen today, but the idea came about because Bucky has been seeing a lot of tiger photos on whatever dating apps he's been using, and the photo with tigers thing is done mostly by men. People have now assumed this means Bucky is seeing profiles from men and women.

I mean, since the show has the balls to address racism, it should have the balls to make Bucky bi. I'm not holding my breath, though haha

Anyways, back on theories:

I don't think Walker is enhanced...yet. I think the government is probably trying to get their hands on the serum and it will be used on Walker and make him hella aggro and probably beat the shit out of the wrong person. Everybody will find out and that'll lead to the title of Cap being stripped from him.

Since the Flash Smashers probably aren't the real bad guys, it makes me wonder who Power Broker will end up being played by and how they are going to handle him in the MCU overall.

What did the writer say? I'm afraid of clicking on the article because of spoilers.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

What did the writer say? I'm afraid of clicking on the article because of spoilers.

He just said he isn’t going to dive into any rabbit holes but that we should all keep watching the show wink wink. Who knows what that means, though lol

Again, I won’t believe anything until I actually see it done.

 

[Willow A113]

He just said he isn’t going to dive into any rabbit holes but that we should all keep watching the show wink wink. Who knows what that means, though lol

Again, I won’t believe anything until I actually see it done.

Has Sabastion Stan come out with his sexuality? If he's straight they might not have done it but if he's bisexual irl, they might've made the character bi.

 

[AegisXIII]

Has Sabastion Stan come out with his sexuality? If he's straight they might not have done it but if he's bisexual irl, they might've made the character bi.

It's Disney we are talking about. They are always taking about how some characters are secretely gays in the interviews, but nothing happens on screen. They are afraid to take narrative risks and that's why in my opinion everything they do feel so empty these days.
Then if i am wrong and Bucky turns out bi, I will gladely swallow my words.
Note that I still have to watch episode 1. XD

 

[Absent]

Its their go to quote when referring to sexuality. Same shit happened with Rise of Skywalker.