News ► Nomura comments on developing KH3 for the PS4

[Big Mad Draco]

FFXV is 9 years in development and we haven't seen a playable demo yet, we have no release date etc etc. KH3 is at a much earlier development phase.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't a big part of that the teams being on other projects (everybody getting pulled in to try and salvage XIV, the XIII sequels, etc)?

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

9 years this summer and still going.

Eight. Not nine. 2006-2014 is eight years. And FFXV wasn't in dev all of that time. Between 2006-2008/9, it was only in pre-dev. And once 2011 came around and they learned of nextgen consoles, they switched to PS4 which meant starting over with the models and textures.

Judging from what we've been hearing/reading, I wouldn't be surprised if KH3 skipped this generation as well.

You're being WAY too pessimistic about what he's saying. He's saying there is so much freedom they literally don't know where to draw a line. It's not that they are having problems with the tech, but that they realize they have so much freedom they don't know what they need to keep and what to get rid of.

This is probably something all developers are struggling with in their own way and Nomura is one of the few who is saying it.

Am I reading this right? Is he seriously bitching that the PS4 is 'too capable?' How is the fact that he has more options at his disposal a bad thing? He needs to stop feeling pressured by fans and just focus on making a good game. Add what needs to be added, innovate where you see fit to innovate.

I didn't read it as bitching. I think he's probably just being really honest and I'm sure he said it with a few chuckles. It's bad because Nomura's ridiculously ambitious. Before the PS4 (and XB1) every game he made with the intention to push the limits of the system. Hell, back in the PS1 days when he was just a character designer, he drew fur on Squall in order to challenge the CG animators to make moving, flowing fur in the opening and ending cinematics.

With the PS4, he has no way of pushing it. There IS no limit except the limits he puts on himself and he's never had to do that before. Now he has the new challenge of figuring out where to draw a line and that's not easy when you want to deliver a good game & implement all of your ideas in a timely manner.

 

[kupo1121]

He wants to offer everything the system can handle in the game. I understand he's striving for perfection, wanting to make a PS4 game that is generally distinguished from the PS3. He just needs to focus on the necessary components, that make it, well, fun.

That's really the problem...he's striving for perfection from the fans (and since we'll be buying the game, it's understandable) but "perfection" from the fans is unattainable since everyone wants different things, nobody will get everything they want in KH3, so he just needs to focus on, as others have said, his standard of perfection.

It may sound like he's whining, but his argument has basis, people will expect too much so he doesn't know where to find that balance (that or Famitsu has just been holding this quote for months from us and this was still back from when they last interviewed him).

 

[Valcanic]

Hey, here's a idea Nomura why don't you finish kh 2.5 and put an actual date on it. Then you can worry about kingdom hearts 3, and focus on developing that while we're all busy playing 2.5.

 

[Antifa Lockhart]

You're being WAY too pessimistic about what he's saying. He's saying there is so much freedom they literally don't know where to draw a line. It's not that they are having problems with the tech, but that they realize they have so much freedom they don't know what they need to keep and what to get rid of.

This is probably something all developers are struggling with in their own way and Nomura is one of the few who is saying it.



I didn't read it as bitching. I think he's probably just being really honest and I'm sure he said it with a few chuckles. It's bad because Nomura's ridiculously ambitious. Before the PS4 (and XB1) every game he made with the intention to push the limits of the system. Hell, back in the PS1 days when he was just a character designer, he drew fur on Squall in order to challenge the CG animators to make moving, flowing fur in the opening and ending cinematics.

With the PS4, he has no way of pushing it. There IS no limit except the limits he puts on himself and he's never had to do that before. Now he has the new challenge of figuring out where to draw a line and that's not easy when you want to deliver a good game & implement all of your ideas in a timely manner.

Thank you, that's exactly what I was thinking! For game developers, one of the ways to promote creativity is to work within and around the idea of limits. Especially for someone like Nomura.

Right now, he's like this:

And the possibilities are endless, and that scares me. It must terrify Nomura.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Hey, here's a idea Nomura why don't you finish kh 2.5 and put an actual date on it. Then you can worry about kingdom hearts 3, and focus on developing that while we're all busy playing 2.5.

Uh, you do realize only about 10-15 people are working on 2.5 at any given time? It's a really tiny team comprised of planners and a few programmers. Please keep 2.5 complaints in 2.5 discussions, thank you!

 

[ajmrowland]

Hopefully the consoles are powerful enough so they don't have to cut anything out of the game, or sacrifice things like grand scale platforming.
In my opinion, if they are able to throw in the Disney ride attractions, then they should be able to fit in a lot of good things like lots of NPCs, explorable non-linear worlds, mini-games etc.
Hopefully they throw in King as a boss battle as well xD

this. Of course, this isn't just a matter of power, but of work. If they cut anything from the game, limitations should not be among the reasons. Of course, rightfully, nothing good should be cut.

Actually, the vibe I got was that he felt the systems were too powerful.

 

[Blackdrazon]

Both Sony and EA have dropped hints that this generation will be much shorter than the last one (5-6 years).

5-6 years is essentially "normal," it wouldn't surprise me if we did land in this neighbourhood.

 

[Solo]

Both Sony and EA have dropped hints that this generation will be much shorter than the last one (5-6 years).

FFXV is 9 years in development and we haven't seen a playable demo yet, we have no release date etc etc. KH3 is at a much earlier development phase.

Are you willing to bet that they will get their act together and finish it in time? I'm not.

By Sony's estimate, we'll be lucky if we get it near the end of this generation.

So, 5 to 6 years. That means the end of this generation will be in 2019 or 2020, and the PS4 and XB1 will still be going strong by then. Wouldn't it be a wide window of time for KH3 to see its release? If we get it, or its release date is announced to be, near the end of this generation, we won't be lucky. We, or at least a good number of us, would likely be disappointed.

And Nomura might have said what he had said (I myself hoped that he hadn't, but oh well, what's done is done), but we don't need to be all too dismissive and pessimistic. I'm pretty sure that he will deliver the games before this generation ends; otherwise, he would risk a tainted reputation for delaying them for an even later generation. I'm optimistic that he wouldn't want that to happen.

 

[WaveK89]

So, in a sense, he feels he has so much freedom. Hard to know where to start and where to end. What to keep in, what to keep out. Makes sense, really. I mean a lot of content can be made, but it's up to them to piece it all together. Sometimes, things aren't necessary for the game.

In this case, it feels like Nomura wants to make everything work for the fans sake. I mean, for many people, KH3 has been a 7-8 year stretch. (For me, I'm not optimism is next year. Reality tells me the following year) It's not surprising those people would be expecting perfection. However from gameplay to story, people will be disappointed because that's just how life is in general.

Whatever happens, I have faith in Nomura and team(s) working on the game.

 

[Gexus]

Am I reading this right? Is he seriously bitching that the PS4 is 'too capable?' How is the fact that he has more options at his disposal a bad thing? He needs to stop feeling pressured by fans and just focus on making a good game. Add what needs to be added, innovate where you see fit to innovate.

Sometimes, having too much at your disposal can damage the outcome. Knowing your limits and working under limited conditions is usually what gives us the best products out there.

 

[Ruran]

Sometimes, having too much at your disposal can damage the outcome. Knowing your limits and working under limited conditions is usually what gives us the best products out there.

Indeed, as weird as it sounds of Nomura complaining about having too much of a good thing, the problem sometimes is having too much of a good thing. The PS4 offers so much it's overwhelming and perhaps he can't "just focus on making a good game" when he's working with a brand new system in which he's not even sure how to do that.

Not to mention, things are delicate now with the fan base right now. Since Square is still a business and KH3 a product to be put out with hopes of making money, fan satisfaction is key. The more vocal fans haven't been satisfied with the series since KH2 because since then they've just put out "pointless filler games". KH3 is very much a make it or break it deal and on top of FFXV, everyone is breathing down Nomura's neck. Things must be really stressful right now.

 

[Gexus]

...everyone is breathing down Nomura's neck. Things must be really stressful right now.

He's been really under-appreciated for such a long time. People have been mistaking him as the reason behind SE's downfall the past years, bitching and whining over him since forever. By this time, heck, he might even be used to it.

 

[Lnds500]

Eight. Not nine. 2006-2014 is eight years. And FFXV wasn't in dev all of that time. Between 2006-2008/9, it was only in pre-dev. And once 2011 came around and they learned of nextgen consoles, they switched to PS4 which meant starting over with the models and textures.

Kept thinking 2005 when it was 2006. Don't know why.

In development. Every game starts with a concept, a pitch etc. They didn't start with code and the game engine. But's it's all part of the umbrella term "(in) development". I wish people stopped throwing the "they didn't work all the time on it" around. I don't work on weekends, I took time out of my job for a seminar but I'm saying I've been working for one year, not a year minus this and that. The fact that it changed 100 different states in these 8 years is not comforting, nor is it something to cut them some slack about. That's exactly the problem. That in 8 years, for whatever reason, they couldn't produce a game. How much time do developers need on average for a game? 3 years? 4 if it's really ambitious? Well, double that and you have... 0 games apparently.

They didn't start from scratch on models and textures either. If they did, it doesn't show. More effects, more polished models maybe, higher resolution, better physics and lightning. These are the changes we've seen.

You're being WAY too pessimistic about what he's saying. He's saying there is so much freedom they literally don't know where to draw a line. It's not that they are having problems with the tech, but that they realize they have so much freedom they don't know what they need to keep and what to get rid of.

I am not being pessimistic. I'm being cautious.

I don't trust Square, they barely showed any interest (comparatively) for consoles last-gen. So yeah, by normal standards KH should come drop this generation. But it's Square so we can't have that luxury.

Plus, ever since the reveal Nomura has been saying they "revealed the game too early" and now he just added what I can only describe as a "we don't know where to start and/or stop basically".

So last gen was "too complicated to create a game on'', "hard to code" and now they have "given us too much freedom"?

All in all, have we seen something positive about the development of the game?

This is probably something all developers are struggling with in their own way and Nomura is one of the few who is saying it.

Japanese devs. Even Kojima has shared similar statements. Nintendo is another one who is having trouble with HD development and the list goes on (at least for those who haven't lost it completely).

5-6 years is essentially "normal," it wouldn't surprise me if we did land in this neighbourhood.

It is normal, but it's substantially less that the previous generation.

So, 5 to 6 years. That means the end of this generation will be in 2019 or 2020, and the PS4 and XB1 will still be going strong by then. Wouldn't it be a wide window of time for KH3 to see its release? If we get it, or its release date is announced to be, near the end of this generation, we won't be lucky. We, or at least a good number of us, would likely be disappointed.

I'd say late 2018-2019 (cause this gen started in late 2013).

 

[limit]

Everybody's forgetting one crucial fact: Nomura's essentially on a deadline. Square's in a tough spot as we all know, and the new president needed to get its act together; I feel like he's the main reason we even got a trailer at E3. He needed to prove he can pull the company together, and E3 was pretty much a decisive event. Now, this article does make me a little more nervous. Originally because of the whole business thing, I was looking for a 2015/2016 release, but now that he's complaining it might be even LATER.

Another thing I feel nervous about is the Osaka team - for some reason I just keep feeling like they haven't been handling the series great. They honestly don't have any real experience with console development (seeing as how the PS3 remasters were ports or cutscenes), not to mention BBS and KH3D afaik are extremely controversial (I don't really have too much of a strong opinion here, but it bothers me that there's even a split like this). Does anybody else feel this way or am I being biased?

I heard after the original team finished FFXV, they were going to merge w/ Osaka and KH3 would go into full development (assuming they also have a deadline and set a 2015 release, late 2014 at the VERY earliest). Is this true?

(I swear if they remove Sora's train, I will knife someone).

 

[Chaser]

not to mention BBS and KH3D afaik are extremely controversial (I don't really have too much of a strong opinion here, but it bothers me that there's even a split like this). Does anybody else feel this way or am I being biased?

People found BBS and DDD to be controversial? The general consensus I've seen is people rated them the best games in the series, gameplay wise.

 

[Gram]

lol I like that nomura thinks it has to much. xD

 

[Sign]

Another thing I feel nervous about is the Osaka team - for some reason I just keep feeling like they haven't been handling the series great. They honestly don't have any real experience with console development (seeing as how the PS3 remasters were ports or cutscenes), not to mention BBS and KH3D afaik are extremely controversial (I don't really have too much of a strong opinion here, but it bothers me that there's even a split like this). Does anybody else feel this way or am I being biased?

BBS and 3D are constantly hailed as two of, if not the best entries in the series. There is little doubt in the Osaka team's abilities and they are the the vastly preferred development team, so I'm not quite sure where you came up with the conclusion that the community is so divided over their titles and believes they're not capable.

 

[Big Mad Draco]

Really the only gameplay complaint I've heard about 3D is the way you unlock skills being rather annoying (which I agree with).

 

[Gram]

Really the only gameplay complaint I've heard about 3D is the way you unlock skills being rather annoying (which I agree with).

I partially agree on that but not because of how I unlock abilities but on the fact that I just dont like dream eaters. If I wanted to raise and cater to cute creatures I'd play pokemon more often. =[