So i've look through the forms and maybe i missed it but I didn't see it anywhere. I'm Starting to question the canon of Union X. I've been playing through the game and speeding through it this time around but with the new Union X story being place on top of the the old X story. Now parts of it are interesting but the new Union leaders is where i start having problems. My Problems are Ven and Lauriam aka Marluxia possible somebody. I have a lot of problem with the game and with the stories that happen in Birth by Sleep, and Kingdom Hearts, but they explain that those "worlds" are created by the Book of Prophecy. The inclusion of these 2 characters baffle me but not as much as the fact that everywhere i look Youtube or reddit people are ok with them or trying to explain how it's possible. One Youtuber used an old interview where Nomura said nobodies don't age to explain them even though this makes no sense. People are more upset over Blain be translated as Brain and yeah that is really stupid. Another problem i have is Union Cross seems to change the purpose of the Dandelions to just be the Unions all over again and lather rinse repeat. The biggest problem i have with this is at the end of the Keyblade War the worlds were made separate and survived because of the light inside the heart of children aka the Dandelions. Union X seems to ignore this in favor of fan serves and a mystery that honestly it made me tear up a little when I watched it. The only way i'll accept this story in any form is if this is all taking place in the realm of sleep somehow and this is the dream of Daybreak or your character. I love Kingdom hearts any time someone calls the plot convoluted and stupid i quick to correct them but this game hurts my head so much trying to rationalise it in the whole of Kingdom Hearts. Let me know what you think about all this am i crazy (Yeah probable) or does this game just make absolutely no sense in the greater lore.
My Problem with Union X.
- Thread starter Rc9000000
- Start date
|
REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS |
|
- Status
KH IS convoluted and really stupid sometimes, and I love Kingdom Hearts as well. I don't see what loving it has anything to do with that, anyway.
I don't like Ventus and Lauriam being in KHUX either, though. I just wish they never even thought about making any part of the X-series canon, like it was planned in the beginning. I could kind of tolerate Ven because of his past and stuff, but I think Lauriam is just too much. Other than that, I don't think we should be quick to judge -- we aren't even close to the end of KHUX, so anything is possible still. Let's wait and see.
I'm in the minority in that I like the inclusion of Ventus and Lauriam. It's not healthy of a narrative to be able to expect everything that's going to happen. I don't understand why everybody has to "understand" what's happening when the Union X portion of the plot has just started. Let events unfold and we'll slowly see why things are the way they are.
I certainly get what you mean, but look at it this way:
People make assumptions about how the plot is going to unfold based on the events that happened before, on the goals of the people involved and on stuff that would make sense to do. That said, if you couldn't predict something to happen at all (I'm pretty sure no one expected Marluxia to be in there, even as a somebody) that means there were no preceding hints that this might happen and thus it will feel to people like an utter asspull which unnerves them. It's another thing with surprise, for example if it gets revealed that the main villain had another secret goal after all that he actually pursuied and tricked the hero, then people will reconsider the preceding events and look if there had been any hints to that. If there are, like the main villain saying things that didn't make 100% sense back then or which purpose was unclear, people are more likely to accept the revelation as a natural story outcome and will still be surprised. If there are no clues - unlike Ventus, Marluxia never showed one sign of being from another era and he couldn't because Ux wasn't even a thought back then - people are likely to feel cheated.
I don't think you have to understand every little bit of a game or in general, a story, that would indeed be kinda boring and I also like a little surprise. I can live without having every character's backstory explained in detail because I don't think every character in a story has to have an astonishing, dark, grim past full of twists because this is not how it is. I know enough people who pretty much had a normal life with a few events but overall nothing really worth telling but this is to an extent different in games. People want backstory, people want surprises and twists but people also want to be able to predict it because that's part of the fun. That said, it's too early to say much more about the Ux plot itself, like you said: Let's wait and see.
EDIT: I certainly hope this didn't come off as a lecture, I don't mean it that way.
Last edited:
Kingdom Hearts was never designed as a "predictable" series. Man, this response just sounds like the Kingdom Hearts fandom hates surprises. What fun is that? These left field factors are engaging because it makes us re-evaluate what we already know about Kingdom Hearts. Ass pull or not, continue to surprise me. And even with unexpected things, guesses can be made as to why said thing occurred.
Ventus also never was shown/hinted at to be from a completely different era. The only things being implied were from a few sentences in Xehanort's BBS Report that a) Xehanort found him somewhere and b) Ventus has quite some potential.
The character's backstory was deliberately portrayed as maybe something more out of the ordinary (in-universe) or something that might be addressed later (meta-wise), but certainly not as something so totally over the top and unneccessary as making him part of an entirely different era.
It's one thing crafting an interesting, possibly even grim or sad backstory for a character where there are clues given beforehand in conjunction with the character's role for the present, but another blowing it entirely out of proportions in a totally different setting (such as a totally different time period).
You really don't have to always jump directly into extremes when confronted with differing opinions.
It's not like the KH fandom hates surprises as whole, not to mention "hate" is a really strong word, but more like that quite a sizable part of the fandom is getting annoyed at an overblown amount of surprises and twists which also continue to get less and less believable even in the context of the series' own established rules and boundaries.
Re-evaluating already existing knowledge of things can certainly be engaging with some unexpected twists thrown in, but it becomes grating if there are too many and people not only loose overview of the whole picture, but also have to realize thatmost of these new things don't add up with facts/events that are not ambigious to begin with.
Guessing why a certain unexpected thing occurs doesn't add up to much when one feels that it is unneccessary and harmful to the already existing overaching narrative to begin with.
Like i.e. in 0.2. having Aqua present during the events of the KH 1 finale damages more than it actually helps, both concerning the involved characters (Mickey, Riku, Aqua) and the internal logic of events.
It's not about generally "hating" surprises or some unexpected twists, it's about too many and too grandiose instances of them ruining the overall structure.
Well, I am okay with ventus with this game but it may better to let him be the descendant of the dandelion leader rather than the leader himself and well, it's possible that ventus we know is a replica. But for me, none is worse than bringing someone back from dead or who is supposed to be dead just for fanservice
I haven't read kingdom hearts 3 before I read this so union cross ven is the real ven? so the ven we know is fake or does that mean they are the same person
I think he just meant they are the same person. Or at least, I hope lol. Its just the phrasing of the answer.
Having him not directly participating in past events would certainly smooth out the narrative and forego the need for some yet another convoluted explanations as to why it's possible that he's there to begin with.
That's a rather farfetched idea tbh, from where do you get the possibility that the Ventus from BBS could be a Replica? The Replica program didn't even exist before the times of KH 1.
So far in the KH series we did not have any true character death concerning an original (meaning non-Disney) character to begin with, so that analogy doesn't really work.
Yep, the phrasing of the answer may also somewhat weird because the question is somewhat weird. Is the Ventus in Ux the real Ventus? Well duh, the real question isn't if he's "real" (and that too can have different meanings depending on the nature of Unchained to begin with) but why the fuck he is even present there.
Yeah, I have just read the twitter post and it is asking is ven the same person and he answers yes. I get the idea of replica from other person honestly which I found quite interesting since I don't remember where they learned how to make make replica. No true character death after the series continues imo . When aqua asked terra that if he killed master eraqus he says yes and who would be so sad when they know roxas will come back in KH2 also who would have thought there is 14th member inside a organization called organization XII before days is released , I don't really think that they are less convoluted than having ven in past
Last edited:
- Status