Recusant`s Sigil in 358/2 Days?



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hemmoheikkinen

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So after the events of Dream Drop Distance, it comes to our attention that Xehanort uses a tracking system called the Recusant`s Sigil. It appears as an X and the symbol has manifested itself in various places. For example The Heartless emblem has an X right in the middle of it. So my question is this: In 358/2 Days Roxas and Xion are set on various missions to collect hearts, and Marluxia also explains that only the Emblem Heartless release hearts. Did the higher ups in the Organization know where to send Xion and Roxas, because they were able to follow the movements of the Emblem Heartless trough Recusant`s Sigil(although it is`t confirmed that the X in the emblem is Recusant`s Sigil)? Also if I remember correctly the Emblem Heartless were artificial, created by Xehanort? Or is it pure relaying to the fact that the Heartless are drawn to the Keyblade?
 

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They sent Roxas and Xion to destroy Emblem Heartless because they are the only Keyblade wielders in the Organization. Captive hearts can only be released and returned to Kingdom Hearts with the Keyblade. When defeated without a Keyblade, the heart will just linger around and be consumed by another Heartless (or something similar; pardon me that my memory is fuzzy since I haven't played the games in I don't know how many months now. Heck, I'm not even sure if what I'm saying is entirely correct).

The only X's that have been confirmed as the Sigil are the silver one on Sora's DDD outfit as well as the ones in the Organization members' names. The diagonal cross on the Heartless emblem is not a sigil, at least until it's confirmed to be one (though it's unlikely).
 

ChibiHearts249

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Knowing this for sure would require knowledge of the actual use of the sigil itself that we don't possess. We know that Xemnas used it since he was the one to spill the beans during his fight in 3D, but how often any of them use it is unclear.
I believe it's entirely possible that Xemnas could track Heartless with the sigil, but it's just as likely that he knew their whereabouts through some link to the power of darkness or the fact that Heartless aren't exactly the stealthiest of adversaries. Their trademark is destruction of WORLDS, after all. But tracking small groups COULD be chalked up to use of the sigil, I suppose.
 

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Crap, I didn't even answer the question posed. You were asking about how they know where to send Roxas and Xion, weren't you?

I believe that's what reconaissance missions were for. They sent members to new worlds to monitor Heartless activity and strategised action plan before finally sending the Keyblade wielders. If I'm not mistaken, every time we moved on to new worlds, the first mission was always of investigative nature.
 

hemmoheikkinen

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Crap, I didn't even answer the question posed. You were asking about how they know where to send Roxas and Xion, weren't you?
Yes, this is correct. No worries :)

I just thought it was a little suspicious that they always knew where to send Roxas and Xion to a world where the Emblem Heartless appear. It would be easy to track their movements trough the Sigil, but after the reckon mission and maybe trough a link between darkness as ChibiHeart mentions, it might not be needed. I guess if there would only a little amount of Emblem Heartless compared to the purebloods, they would have used the Sigil to only track Emblem ones, since the purebloods devour the hearts. Does this make any sense? :D

EDIT: Wait, is the X in Org XIII members names confirmed to be an Sigil? When did this happen? I only thought it was a theory.
 

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EDIT: Wait, is the X in Org XIII members names confirmed to be an Sigil? When did this happen? I only thought it was a theory.
Yeah, the DDD glossary mentioned it.

DDD Glossary on Recusant's Sigil said:
Xemnas, leader of Organization XIII, gave new names to all who entered its ranks. Each name was an anagram created from the member's original name plus the letter X.

This X is known as the Recusant's Sigil, and has manifested itself in both obvious and insidious ways throughout Sora's adventures.
 

hemmoheikkinen

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It was in the DDD Glossary! Dang it. How did I forget it.

Just to get back to the Emblem Heartless, were they created artificially? Xehaort is curious man and I bet he would like to know where his newly found creation is at all times. So it kind of makes sense that the X in the emblem could be a Sigil. All though it might be because of the fact that Nomura likes to put little X`s everywhere, ranging from clothes to monsters. :D
 

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It was in the DDD Glossary! Dang it. How did I forget it.

Just to get back to the Emblem Heartless, were they created artificially?
Yes. Xehanort created and marked them.

Xehaort is curious man and I bet he would like to know where his newly found creation is at all times. So it kind of makes sense that the X in the emblem could be a Sigil. All though it might be because of the fact that Nomura likes to put little X`s everywhere, ranging from clothes to monsters. :D
Nomura already confirmed that he likes slipping it in everywhere. TAV's outfits, for example, was totally intentional.
 

Cosmic+Amarna

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I always took it as Sora is the only one who is marked with the recusant's sigil. They all obviously something with the X going on, but a recusant is someone who refuses to submit or comply, etc. That's Sora, he's the recusant because the 'seeding' is happening against his will.

"As your flesh bears the sigil, you shall be known of that as a recusant"
Because Sora doesn't wanna join the 13 SoD. Amongst them, he will be known as the recusant.
 

FudgemintGuardian

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Yes. Xehanort created and marked them.


Nomura already confirmed that he likes slipping it in everywhere. TAV's outfits, for example, was totally intentional.
This reminded me that Wakka also has X's on his pants. His probably don't mean anything though. But now I want it too.

I always took it as Sora is the only one who is marked with the recusant's sigil. They all obviously something with the X going on, but a recusant is someone who refuses to submit or comply, etc. That's Sora, he's the recusant because the 'seeding' is happening against his will.

"As your flesh bears the sigil, you shall be known of that as a recusant"
Because Sora doesn't wanna join the 13 SoD. Amongst them, he will be known as the recusant.
Isa and the unknown Seekers might count too, as we don't know if they were willing or not.
Xehanort himself might be considered a recusant, as he wouldn't accept his dull unchanging life on Destiny Islands and left. He's sure as hell not accepting death either (otherwise he wouldn't bother body hopping.)
 
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ChibiHearts249

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Just to get back to the Emblem Heartless, were they created artificially? Xehaort is curious man and I bet he would like to know where his newly found creation is at all times. So it kind of makes sense that the X in the emblem could be a Sigil.
Yes, the thought also crossed my mind. Ansem the Wise himself ALSO created machines in a secret laboratory to conduct experiments at the prompting of Ienzo. (As per Secret Ansem Report 2 in KH2) These could have become the machines that created Heartless by some form of simply tampering with them. So Xehanort would've potentially had a MASSIVE influence on those machines, making the Emblem a potential trademark.
Actually now that I think about it: this is VERY coincidental...
 

FudgemintGuardian

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Wait...the Recusant's Sigil... Recusant means someone who refuses to obey/submit/comply blahblahblah blah. Xemnas put this sigil on all Org members and (given that nice big X at the start of his name) himself as well.
Why did Xemnas label all of Org. XIII (himself included) as disobeyers?
But I thought something; Marluxia, Larxene, Roxas, Xion, Axel.
Marluxia and Larxene were traitors, Roxas left the Org. because of what happened to Xion (and probably some other stuff,) Xion sure as hell didn't want to be Xemnas' puppet so she had Roxas kill her, Axel went against the Organization because of Roxas.
Those 5 people are all recusants. Those 5 people all had the Recusant's Sigil, the Disobeyer's Sigil. Could this mean that all who are labeled with the Recusant's Sigil always turn at some point?
 

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I believe Xemnas gave the Organization members the Sigil as a sign that they have cast aside their humanity by becoming Nobodies. Thus, they are the recusants seen from our point of view; they refused to be bound by and subjected to emotions and all other workings of the heart.
 

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I believe Xemnas gave the Organization members the Sigil as a sign that they have cast aside their humanity by becoming Nobodies. Thus, they are the recusants seen from our point of view; they refused to be bound by and subjected to emotions and all other workings of the heart.
It's also said to tie into Xehanort's obsession with the Xblade:
Q9: Where did the Organization’s coat and mark come from?
A: Xemnas remembering his human years.

One year after BbS, Xehanort as well as five other apprentices toss aside their hearts. Then the Nobody Xemnas was born, and the Organization which he creates take a lot of things from his memories as a human. But as Xemnas had two people who he was, Terra and Master Xehanort, he takes from both of their memories.

[picture: Master Xehanort in dark coat]

The coat used by the Organization was something that Master Xehanort originally wore.

[pictures: Terra’s mark, Nobody’s mark]

The Nobody mark used by the Organization is a similar shape to the mark Terra used.

[pictures: Roxas receiving his name, Vanitas and the X-Blade]

Xemnas gives Organization members names with an X in them. This has something to do with Master Xehanort’s interest in the X-Blade.
The X is a prominent symbol in the series but not every instance of it is a sign of Xehanort, but rather the Xblade. MX uses it due to his obession thus Sora's X mark on his shirt in DDD and the Org's Names.
However Eraqus and TAV also have X's in their outfits yet we know that's not because of Xehanort.

I think Nomura adds it in were he can since BBS to show that. It can hint at Xehanort but it doesn't always mean he's behind it.
 

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It's also said to tie into Xehanort's obsession with the Xblade:


The X is a prominent symbol in the series but not every instance of it is a sign of Xehanort, but rather the Xblade. MX uses it due to his obession thus Sora's X mark on his shirt in DDD and the Org's Names.
However Eraqus and TAV also have X's in their outfits yet we know that's not because of Xehanort.

I think Nomura adds it in were he can since BBS to show that. It can hint at Xehanort but it doesn't always mean he's behind it.
The outfits part reminds me of a discussion about the X's might have foreshadowed the eventual fates of the protagonists in BbS. Among TAV, Terra was the only one whose X on his outfit isn't broken by the heart-cross badge, and he was taken over by Xehanort. Aqua and Ventus had their X broken by their badges and they stayed their own selves.

Eraqus' X, too, was free of obstructions and he ended up in Terra's heart, which was held captive by Xehanort as said before. What a mess.

Do remember though that this is just a fun observation and should not be treated as fact. Even though they might have told a story, the X's on these outfits are not Sigils.
 

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The outfits part reminds me of a discussion about the X's might have foreshadowed the eventual fates of the protagonists in BbS. Among TAV, Terra was the only one whose X on his outfit isn't broken by the heart-cross badge, and he was taken over by Xehanort. Aqua and Ventus had their X broken by their badges and they stayed their own selves.

Eraqus' X, too, was free of obstructions and he ended up in Terra's heart, which was held captive by Xehanort as said before. What a mess.

Do remember though that this is just a fun observation and should not be treated as fact.
It is a good analogy and comparison but at the same time we all know how we fans can find details like that. xD
The X over the guardians mouth could also be a nod to Terra/Eraqus and the Xblade.
 

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Conclusion: Wakka's pants are the X-Blade.

Ya know, whether Nomura intended it or not, all X's seem to foreshadow something in someway (such as Isa's scar or what Solo mentioned with the BBS gang's chest straps.)
 

hemmoheikkinen

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I think there is also an X in Riku`s KH1 outfit, and he as well gets possessed by Xehanort(though I think it`s not a Sigil).
I just thought something today. The experiment which turned the apprentice`s into Heartless, was that the outcome Xehanort wanted? Maybe he precisely wanted his Heartless self to be a emblem one. Was the body also, which appears after Ansem has possessed Riku, his form after the experiment, or did he turn to The Brown Robed figure right after the experiment? Maybe Xehanort wanted to be an emblem one, so he could have a way to release his own heart with a Keyblade if needed, since the purebloods devour them.

Conclusion: Wakka's pants are the X-Blade.
I think Genie also has an massive X right the middle of his chest in KH2, so he must be an Recusant. :D
 

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A theory that someone I go to conventions with supports the idea that Xehanort becomes the heart-being/brown robed figure after Ansem SoD is defeated by Sora at the gates of the false Kingdom Hearts in KH. We all know what the animation for the release of a heart looks like from seeing variants of it with Sora, Xehanort, and Ven. It's a sort've 'halo of light.' When Ansem gets blasted by the light when the door opens, you see a sort've effect it has on him kinda swirl around where he floats. But this swirliness is centered on his heart. The theory is that Ansem releases the captive heart of Xehanort (since Heartless hold captive hearts) right then and sends it into the past; thus ensuring how the cycle would sort've begin and end.

It's just a theory, but we held a 2hr panel on them, and we really beat this one to death. Just thought I'd share~
 
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