What if Young Xehanort was the only one?



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Gram

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—Were the 13 Seekers of Darkness, who were meant to be in different times, gathered by transcending time with magic?

Nomura: Just as it says in the story, to transcend time one must ‘first’ discard their form. As a result of the actions of the Brown Robed Figure, they all were in a state where they had gained the power to transcend time. The Brown Robed Figure explains the facts. The thirteen were summoned at the same time, this time thanks to Young Xehanort who borrowed that power. However, apart from Young Xehanort, that does not mean that all the members transcended time.
With E3 over it's time to amuse ourselves again till the next heavenly offering of info so let's talk about what if's here.

In the course of DDD a very annoyingly unique form of time travel was introduced which Young Xehanort was making use of to gather the other Xehanorts.
He explains to Sora that Robed Figure/Ansem [KH1, pre-possession of riku's body] appeared to YX in the past and "sent him on his way".
And taking Nomura's words into account to it basically means Robed Figure, which I'll type as RF here after, is the one responsible for YX's powers and appearance in DDD.

But even though the source of YX's power is RF who in turn gained it from MX losing his body (according to Nomura) Nomura says that doesn't mean the others we seen gathered at the end of DDD were time travelers.

Now logically speaking Ansem and Xemnas should also be time travelers because, as the heartless & nobody, it was their destruction and the following process called 're-completion' that revived Xehanort as we saw him in DDD's end.

But herein lies some confusion. The RF is Ansem before he stole Riku's body, he admits so himself, yet each time you see him in DDD he's accompanied by YX who is responsible for bringing Ansem there. (like he does with Xemnas)

But why would Ansem need assistance? He's already time traveled before so why would he need YX's help now when he's the one that gave the boy that power?

So with that in mind I point again to the quote I posted above. Over the course of DDD interviews Nomura is questioned on several aspects the time travel concept he introduced but he also points out that the only confirmed traveler over the course of DDD was YX. (YX says Ansem visited him first but that was before DDD started)

Now having taken all of this in do you think (or maybe hope?) that Young Xehanort is probably the only time traveler?
Got any ideas/theories of your own perhaps?
Don't be shy let's all throw random things out there and theorize together~

EDIT:

Some food for thought on this matter. If anything can grow a heart it's possible that Ansem and Xemnas both formed one apart from Xehanort who dominated them.

And on two occasions already we've seen a being of just a heart take on a physical form. This happened to not only Sora who Kairi turned human again after he became a heartless but this also happened to Vanitas who just formed a body as he came into existence.

Who's to say this same "sora's method" wasn't used to bring Xemnas and Ansem back separate of MX? Heck who's to say Xehanort didn't use it to revive himself as MX separate from Terra as well after Terranort reformed?
 
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Sdog

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I've always found it weird to why RF needed to go back to YX when he could just do it directly himself, perhaps he needs a host that's easily impressionable to do some dirty work? Clearly at that point YX was still at least a bit naive to everything going on around him and his curiosity on all things darkness could make for an easy persuasion on RF/Ansem's end.

Now this might sound crazy but I've always found RF's character to be a bit more than meets the eye, ever since KH 1. Could it be possible that he's developed his own plan? A "sense of awareness" what have you". It might seem completely farfetched but it could be something overlooked.

As for the whole Xehanort's heartless and nobody's time traveling debacle, I'm still hazy on the whole time-traveling rules but it seems one can bring others forward through time as long as they were meant to be at the destination.

Though everything I've said is a bit of a mess, and this whole time travel concept is a bit too convoluted for my taste, I still think there's going to be quite some twists thrown at us that one couldn't see (hopefully) other than Nomura of course.
 

Gram

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I've always found it weird to why RF needed to go back to YX when he could just do it directly himself
I find that especially odd myself. Ansem as the RF obviously had the power so why go get YX? I can see him recruiting YX for a vessel but why send him on the journey of gathering Xehanorts and stalking Sora? Makes no sense.

Now this might sound crazy but I've always found RF's character to be a bit more than meets the eye, ever since KH 1. Could it be possible that he's developed his own plan?
RF/Ansem's importance certainly has skyrocketed since DDD. Not only was he responsible for KH1 but by sending YX on his way he's more or less responsible for DDD as well.
That'd be ironic in a way, Ansem is Xehanort's Heartless, heartless are the darkness of one's heart manifest, so if he did turn on the others and take top spot it'd be quite symbolic cause it'd show that even Master Xehanort isn't able to truly handle darkness since that being that symbolizes his darkness would be turning on him.

Though everything I've said is a bit of a mess, and this whole time travel concept is a bit too convoluted for my taste
Likewise and I imagine it's the same for most if not nearly every fan. I do give Nomura credit for at least going of his way to have Xehanort explain it in detail as well as limiting it but even still it's an unnecessary confusion, he could've got the same result of DDD without it's inclusion.
 

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That'd be ironic in a way, Ansem is Xehanort's Heartless, heartless are the darkness of one's heart manifest, so if he did turn on the others and take top spot it'd be quite symbolic cause it'd show that even Master Xehanort isn't able to truly handle darkness since that being that symbolizes his darkness would be turning on him.
Exactly what I was thinkin, just didn't know how to word it,thank you. =p

Plus something like that would allow for MX to not necessarily have a 'redemption' moment, but allow him to recollect on his mistakes and perhaps in his final moments regret his choices. Cause he's gotta go one way or another, I think a back stab from what he tried to control and understand would be the most appropriate.
 

Gram

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I don't see MX as the man to ever regret his choices. He's seems willing to admit a mistake to some extents (like his opinion of his attempts in BBS) but I don't see him as one to regret a mistake.

Plus even when admitting a mistake it's only as far as undeniable facts. Things like what he's done to TAV for example he shrugs off as him just "guiding them to their proper places".
 

The_Echo

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Ansem, Seeker of Darkness, post-possession had earned himself a new bodily form.

In order to move through time one must leave their body behind, barring Young Xehanort basically getting cheat codes. Thus, Ansem could not time travel unless he was the Robed Figure.

I think Nomura's just trying to throw a curveball by implying that Young Xehanort is the only one to be confirmed time traveling. YX did, after all, say that he was meant to collect the future versions of himself "across time" and gather them in The World That Never Was.

However, Nomura does say something in the DDD Ultimania that is... interesting:
Nomura said:
Also, ever since Organisation XIII was defeated in KH2, the The World That Never Was’
existence as a world has become uncertain. In the first place, the worlds in the rift between darkness and light have different rules than other worlds.
We saw that TWTNW was very different in DDD compared to its appearance in KHII. Xigbar greets Sora in front of Memory's Scyscraper and claims that "there is no real versus dream anymore," which might imply that TWTNW might co-exist as both a world in the Realm Between and a Sleeping World.

And as we see in Prankster's Paradise, Country of the Musketeers and Symphony of Sorcery, Sleeping Worlds are not tied to the same temporal laws as worlds in the more natural Realms.

Hopefully this makes sense, but the point is that, if Nomura isn't just rusing us with that line... Ansem and Xemnas may actually be experiencing the events of DDD in their natural timeline, by way of visiting this temporally-estranged version of The World That Never Was. It could be that, if someone has been in TWTNW (pre-Xemnas defeat, I suppose), they may be able to appear there regardless of their current circumstance. Because the them that appear in TWTNW are the same them that had been there before.
 

Gram

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Ansem, Seeker of Darkness, post-possession had earned himself a new bodily form.

In order to move through time one must leave their body behind, barring Young Xehanort basically getting cheat codes. Thus, Ansem could not time travel unless he was the Robed Figure.
That's the tricky part though as nothing is stated for this to be cause.

— What about Xemnas and Ansem, essentially they weren’t inside anyone, was it due to circumstances of the worlds of sleep?

Nomura: First off, when Young Xehanort made contact with the Brown Robed Figure, that is to say, the Xehanort who called himself Ansem, his abilities were transferred to him. As a result of Master Xehanort tossing his physical body, he was able to exceed time, and this power was carried into the Brown Robed Figure. Thus when Young Xehanort made contact with him, he gained this power. Possessing this power. Young Xehanort functioned as a “portal”, summoning Xemnas and Ansem each time they appeared. That’s why Young Xehanort was there whenever they appeared. Additionally, when Sora and Riku dropped into the worlds of sleep, simultaneously Young Xehanort himself goes into the world of sleep.
I say this because the reasoning behind the RF's power to travel is said to be because of Master Xehanort discarding his body rather than RF/Ansem discarding Terra's.
This power seems to have basically jumped from MX to RF to YX. More or less the source of this power is Xehanort's heart which all vessels share.

And giving YX's still using his body perfectly fine with his power it make it seem that the body required for this time travel method was Master Xehanort's.
With that said, if the discarded body requirement was meet by MX, it makes Ansem's dependence on YX make no sense.

At first I figured YX was simply the "portal" allowing the other Xehanorts in the dream realm but:
— The Brown Robed Fgure, a Heartless born from that experiment, says “This world has been connected.” While in KH1 that meant that the island was connected to the darkness, in this title does it signify that Xehanort and co. have connected to the dream world?

Nomura: It means both of those things. In that scene, the Brown Robed Figure becomes a “portal” himself as a result of contact with Sora and co., making it possible for the other Xehanorts to intervene within the dreams.
This is again attributed to RF not YX making exactly why YX was needed at all even more odd.

I think Nomura's just trying to throw a curveball by implying that Young Xehanort is the only one to be confirmed time traveling. YX did, after all, say that he was meant to collect the future versions of himself "across time" and gather them in The World That Never Was.
He did indeed say that but given how Nomura always tries to be surprising as well as confusing how do we know he meant that in the sense of multiple points of time?
YX is Xehanort from the farthest past, any version of himself in the future would technically be "across time".

However, Nomura does say something in the DDD Ultimania that is... interesting: We saw that TWTNW was very different in DDD compared to its appearance in KHII. Xigbar greets Sora in front of Memory's Scyscraper and claims that "there is no real versus dream anymore," which might imply that TWTNW might co-exist as both a world in the Realm Between and a Sleeping World.

And as we see in Prankster's Paradise, Country of the Musketeers and Symphony of Sorcery, Sleeping Worlds are not tied to the same temporal laws as worlds in the more natural Realms.
That was actually explained:

Nomura: Sora and co.’s form is due to Yen Sid’s magic, so the way it works is that they can’t turn back until they return to the Mysterious Tower, and Dream Eaters were appearing because Sora was still asleep. Also, ever since Organisation XIII was defeated in KH2, the The World That Never Was’
existence as a world has become uncertain. In the first place, the worlds in the rift between darkness and light have different rules than other worlds. The Mysterious Tower isn’t always standing in a fixed place. Traverse Town too reforms its shape every time, which is why the version that appears in this title is clearly different than the version in KH1.
It's not so much that TWTNW is special on it's own but that all worlds of the Between Realm are unique. Thus explaining why some worlds exist in multiple places. (like Yen Sid's Tower, TWTNW and TWTN)

Hopefully this makes sense, but the point is that, if Nomura isn't just rusing us with that line... Ansem and Xemnas may actually be experiencing the events of DDD in their natural timeline, by way of visiting this temporally-estranged version of The World That Never Was. It could be that, if someone has been in TWTNW (pre-Xemnas defeat, I suppose), they may be able to appear there regardless of their current circumstance. Because the them that appear in TWTNW are the same them that had been there before.
If that was the case they wouldn't have needed YX to take them there though (if I'm understanding that right) since they all could just gather of their own accord no?
 

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wasnt one of the rules of the super complicated time travel you can only go in one direction? so xehanort sent the robed figure back to his earliest battle ready self, so that he could give off the power to time travel to him and send him all the way forward. it makes sense to me. he needed YX because if he just sent RF forward he would have missed some norts.
 

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The rule in question is that "once you reach your destination you can only move forward from that point". RF wouldn't have been breaking the rule because after visiting YX he goes to destiny islands in KH1 to "connect" the xehanorts to the dream realm through some sort of nomura reasoning.
So he's already shown he wasn't breaking the direction rule and since YX never fought till the 12 norts were gathered so he wouldn't need a battle ready Xehanort. (by the point in DDD MX had 12 bodies to choose from to attack Mickey & Riku)
 

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The rule in question is that "once you reach your destination you can only move forward from that point"
Kinda like a yo-yo i suppose, gotta go back the same path that originally left the hand. Can't go off the beaten path,unless ya know so crazy yo-yo master smack!

Cause if I'm not mistaken, one of the time travel rules is no touchy what was supposed to happen.
 

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It is and that's actually the most important rule. It's not so much you shouldn't change things it's that they can't.
Many try to argue otherwise but if a troll like Xehanort says he's not able to change anything that more or less shows the rules valid.
 

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If that was the case they wouldn't have needed YX to take them there though (if I'm understanding that right) since they all could just gather of their own accord no?
Well, I was positing that idea under the pretense that Young Xehanort is the only confirmed time traveler. If it turned out that neither Ansem nor Xemnas actually transcended time to reach the events in DDD, that's how I believe it would have to work.
 

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Well, I was positing that idea under the pretense that Young Xehanort is the only confirmed time traveler. If it turned out that neither Ansem nor Xemnas actually transcended time to reach the events in DDD, that's how I believe it would have to work.
Ahhh now it I get it. TWTNW was said to somehow allow all the Xehanorts to gather in one place so you may not be far off the mark.
 

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Well, RF is always wrapped in a robe and you can never see his face, that's not exactly someone you can recognize right off the bat. Maybe YX was needed to be RF's spokesperson as someone the norts would recognize and give proof to the time travel claims. Not to mention RF doesn't look like he can wield a keyblade; I didn't see any hands coming out of the robe, so he needed someone with him who could fight in case something went wrong.
 

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Every Xehanort should know who RF/Ansem is though shouldn't they? I mean YX obviously didn't know at first but he's the one from the furthest past.
Though given we only know a few Xehanorts there could be others from time periods before Ansem/RF came into being.
 

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Every Xehanort should know who RF/Ansem is though shouldn't they? I mean YX obviously didn't know at first but he's the one from the furthest past.
Though given we only know a few Xehanorts there could be others from time periods before Ansem/RF came into being.
If we ever saw RF without the robe looking exactly like Ansem, I would agree, but RF doesn't look like Ansem with the robe on and we've never seen him without it. The height/posture don't match up between them. Even hunched over, Ansem is taller than RF.
If Isa and Braig were turned into Nobodies before AX cast away his heart, they wouldn't recognize RF. RF doesn't necessarily equal Xehanort's Heartless, since XH shows up as one of the norts. I'm having trouble putting this into words... xD
 

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Though given we only know a few Xehanorts there could be others from time periods before Ansem/RF came into being.
This is going be one funky battle if there's more Xehanorts. Gonna be like a rumble at the local senior center if there are any more after RF...
 

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If we ever saw RF without the robe looking exactly like Ansem, I would agree, but RF doesn't look like Ansem with the robe on and we've never seen him without it. The height/posture don't match up between them. Even hunched over, Ansem is taller than RF.
If Isa and Braig were turned into Nobodies before AX cast away his heart, they wouldn't recognize RF. RF doesn't necessarily equal Xehanort's Heartless, since XH shows up as one of the norts. I'm having trouble putting this into words... xD
Your missing the point though, it's not about look, it's about that little part of a creepy old man that's in all of their heart's controlling them.
Wouldn't you think people being host to the same man would notice their fellow hosts when they come across them? xD
Braig at the very least should've known of him since there's no way Xemnas didn't know of his own, very much sentient, heartless.

This is going be one funky battle if there's more Xehanorts. Gonna be like a rumble at the local senior center if there are any more after RF...
Sadly each seeker is a xehanort of some king. u_u
 

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Sadly each seeker is a xehanort of some king. u_u
But they all aren't going to look like him right? Since at the end of DDD we saw Isa and Braig among them, guessing just having their hearts controlled or submitted to MX.
 

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Not to mention RF doesn't look like he can wield a keyblade; I didn't see any hands coming out of the robe, so he needed someone with him who could fight in case something went wrong.
Young Xehanort can't wield a Keyblade either. That's Xehanort before ever leaving Destiny Islands and training with Eraqus.

The Keyblade he "wields" in DDD is actually Master Xehanort's, and it was actually Master Xehanort in control of the body at that time.
 
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