UEM and the White Heartless aka Dusks.

[Genocide]

For any oldfag that's been here long enough to recognize these archaic-ass dinosaur terms, Im referring to Master Xehanort and Nobodies.

MX seemed like he had this plan in BBS. Which he did.
Keep his heart body hopping to remain immortal and respark the Keyblade War to obtain the true Kingdom Hearts in which he can truly be immortal instead of forever body changing. [There's some other things in his plan but irrelevant to the topic]

Ever since KH1, Ansem has kinda been the go to guy about in game material. ie; Heartless, Nobodies, series lore, etc. Despite original intent, the Heartless have "always existed" and this leaves us, as well as Ansem, up shit's creek without a life preserver.

Arriving at the point shortly, Nobodies appear [even to this day] to be the untintentional result of a strong heartes person losing the afforementioned heart. With that in mind, my question is this:

With all of his "seeds" and "plans", do you think Master Xehanort was aware of the possibility of Nobodies appearing? Nobody [no pun intended] could have seen it coming.

 

[Crazy Mario]

It takes someone Heartless to toy with such a matter. However, he has shown interest in studying the archness and has even learned about the Heartless and could summon them. Not to mention that there are those "seeds" he likely scattered to Braig, Isa, and Vanitas due to their similar features in eyes and ears to Master Xehanort. It's not entirely out of the blue to suggest that he might have tested them out on a few people to see the product of a heart consumed by darkness. However, since Nobodies can actually think and plan, but don't act on instinct, he probably ordered all of them to remain low, or at least eliminated them to make sure no one would know of their existence.

 

[Genocide]

To which would allow them to return possibly.

 

[gelandporn]

Unknown Elderly Mage~ ah man.

MX could have possibly worked it out, I imagine. Not sure how they could really fit into his plans though, other than, well, there's "another you" so that just increases your likelihood of succeeding.

 

[Genocide]

I don't know. His plan seems pretty straight forward. Body hop forever, to be blunt.
I'm pretty sure he knows now, but I was referring to during BBS.

 

[Cosmic+Amarna]

other than, well, there's "another you" so that just increases your likelihood of succeeding.

He planned it.

instead of forever body changing.

That's an interesting thought to think maybe what if this dude has been around since way back when with the KBWars, and has just been possessing people/bodies. It would change him to more of Evil Spirit of Xehanort that continuously has been body swapping thru history, all to forge the Xblade and get at his precious kingdom hearts. It's probably unlikely, but what if.

 

[Crazy Mario]

He planned it.

That's an interesting thought to think maybe what if this dude has been around since way back when with the KBWars, and has just been possessing people/bodies. It would change him to more of Evil Spirit of Xehanort that continuously has been body swapping thru history, all to forge the Xblade and get at his precious kingdom hearts. It's probably unlikely, but what if.

No, it's not possible. Eraqus and Xehanort have been friends since they were kids and some Destiny Island residents can still somewhat recall him. Also, he doesn't even know what happened there, which is exactly why he's doing this in the first place. For the sake of curiosity of how it was and how i could change the fabric of the worlds like it did last time.

 

[Cosmic+Amarna]

It's probably unlikely,

but if that were possible/or was the case/or what was happening, then within that context, the true form of Xehanort being this centuries old spirit hellbent ona powerbinge, would make sense having him know Eraqus. Within the notion of what was pretend theorized, the Xehanort that Eraqus knew wouldn't be the real Xehanort, just another body it has possessed thru out time/history. And as for him not knowing about the KBWars when we see him as MX in BBS, this would be ok too since when he fused with Terra's body he had amnesia, so if that's what happens when you body switch than it'd be possible that everytime/body he swapped that may happen(the amnesia). Allowing for his uninformed- ness on the KBwars. It's was just a what if thought, wasn't sayin it was right.

 

[Crazy Mario]

but if that were possible/or was the case/or what was happening, then within that context, the true form of Xehanort being this centuries old spirit hellbent ona powerbinge, would make sense having him know Eraqus. Within the notion of what was pretend theorized, the Xehanort that Eraqus knew wouldn't be the real Xehanort, just another body it has possessed thru out time/history. And as for him not knowing about the KBWars when we see him as MX in BBS, this would be ok too since when he fused with Terra's body he had amnesia, so if that's what happens when you body switch than it'd be possible that everytime/body he swapped that may happen(the amnesia). Allowing for his uninformed- ness on the KBwars. It's was just a what if thought, wasn't sayin it was right.

Most of this really unnecessary since we could just have him be normal and just not know what the Keyblade War was.

 

[Genocide]

Which, moreover seems to be the case.

I get the feeling that he did not understand the concept of Nobodies.
With all of this implication of Xehanort retaining his memories after becoming AX, it's not a strech to say he didn't now. He wrote the Ansem Reports and was surprised in them about Nobodies.

 

[Memory Master]

I think MX may have thought about what becomes of the body and soul when a heartless is made (He's a curious guy, so of course he probably wondered about this at some point), but I don't think he knew that nobodies was what becomes of the body and soul when a heartless is made.

 

[Genocide]

Does anyone think that nobodies existing [in a manner of speaking] make these plan of his easier?

 

[Nayru's Love]

Does anyone think that nobodies existing [in a manner of speaking] make these plan of his easier?

While MX may or may not have been there in person, his intentions usually rubbed off on his counterparts. You could say it's one way of achieving progress, I suppose.

 

[Genocide]

MX achieved one of his plans 11 years ago. [in the series]
He became younger and was only but so close to obtaining the X-Blade.
It was formed and everything.
The heroes hd a Pyrrhic Victory at the last possible moment.
So his plans of not only obtaining the X-Blade and becoming youger are possible, he's only come a few minutes short of actually realizing Kingdom Hearts. And that was as his old self. [Literally pwning Terra and Ven with one arm behind his back.]

Imagine a spry, more powerful Xehanort with access to a range of attacks not limited to Heartless, Unvered, Nobodies [including all of Org. 13] and quite possibly Terra's, Sora's, Ven's and Riku's.

That's a dangerous motherfucker.
And we're about to stand in his [as well as any of his other incarnations'] way.

 

[Nayru's Love]

To be fair, the X-Blade was never actually "completed."

Also, I like to think that No Heart, despite being non-canon, is a premise of what reborn Xehanort will be like.

 

[KevVentus]

UEM? Ha. BHK says hello

It doesn't seem to me that MX was aware of Nobodies. He made his plan in a time when even Heartless weren't very well known. I don't see him looking far ahead enough to conceptualize Nobodies. He was more focused on the X-Blade, Kingdom Hearts, Vanitas, yadda yadda

All he really got out of Nobodies was Xemnas, and he seemed to be more concerned with his own agenda

I dunno

What conclusion are you trying to reach here exactly?

 

[Cosmic+Amarna]

UEM? Ha. BHK says hello

It doesn't seem to me that MX was aware of Nobodies. He made his plan in a time when even Heartless weren't very well known. I don't see him looking far ahead enough to conceptualize Nobodies. He was more focused on the X-Blade, Kingdom Hearts, Vanitas, yadda yadda

All he really got out of Nobodies was Xemnas, and he seemed to be more concerned with his own agenda

I dunno

What conclusion are you trying to reach here exactly?

First, MX knew about the heartless, as seen when he summons Neoshadows to get Ven to fight and use the darkness within him. Xehanort is a pretty smart dude, I think he knew about it all, just because it hasn't been shown in the games doesn't mean it's not possible that he could have known. This guy has a plan, and many paths/options, we know that. Everything thus far problem-wise stems back to this a hole, kind of suggesting his involvement even if it may be "unintentional".

As for Xemnas, you're right, but still, Xemnas was after KH, which is MX is too...I think maybe the conclusion was something like how the majority of all we've encountered thus far has been apart of Xehanort's plan. At least that's how I kinda interpreted it, and I feel that way too, like he had this all planned out

 

[KevVentus]

I know he knew about them. That's why I said they when they weren't very well known

I like to think of KH1 and 2 as less of a part of Xehanort's overall scheme, and more of dangerous consequences of his lust for power. It makes him a better villain. Otherwise if he had planned for them, that would mean he's failed... three times now. Unless.. he planned to fail?

Xehanort, you sly fox.

 

[Genocide]

He clearly had no clue.
Othewise he would have known about them inthe AR.

 

[Cosmic+Amarna]

I know he knew about them. That's why I said they when they weren't very well known

I like to think of KH1 and 2 as less of a part of Xehanort's overall scheme, and more of dangerous consequences of his lust for power. It makes him a better villain. Otherwise if he had planned for them, that would mean he's failed... three times now. Unless.. he planned to fail?

Xehanort, you sly fox.

Maybe he did intend on failing, maybe not. Think of it as though AnsemSoD+Xemnas were his experiments, or attempts at achieving his goal without knowing if they'd succeed or not. Yes it can be thought of as less of a part of Xehanort's overall scheme, and more of dangerous consequences of his lust for power, but that doesn't mean he couldn't use them still even if they failed. We see them now in the RoS, hinting that Xehanort still may have use for them. Yes they are dreams, memories, subconscious, etc. but that's the point. Xehanort directly affected Sora and Riku's psyche, permanently imprinting himself in some way unto them. Now they are in the RoS affecting Riku/Sora in some way. Iv'e speculated for awhile that Xehanort knows that Ven is inside Sora's heart. This could make sense then, he's using them in some way to aid his overall goal/scheme that he has setup in the RoS. I think we're going to see Sora maybe get trapped there, maybe he falls to Sleep, and somehow this helps Xehanort achieve his goal(get at Ven so he can try to make the Xblade again) idk.

He clearly had no clue.
Othewise he would have known about them inthe AR.

Well, yes he didn't write about them and it doesn't appear as if he's all knowing in the AR, but maybe this is because the apprentice Xehanort had amnesia. While the AX knew little or nothing, as we know from his loss of memory, that does not mean that MX may not have known before he stole Terra's body. MX may have knew all of this ish on the heartless, nobodies, dream eaters/nightmares, and whatever else before he stole Terra's body. If he had all this planned out or had an idea of how he like it to go down, he still wanted Terra for the AnsemSoD/Xemnas part, but that doesn't mean just because they failed the mission that they are useless. Idk