Symbolism in Kingdom Hearts

[Blackdrazon]

If the line does in fact refer to eyes, it may be a matter of Chirithy meaning to say "You have a very intense expression, just look at how you've grown." idek, it's probably best that someone more familiar with Japanese speak up.

 

[FudgemintGuardian]

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Before DDD I considered that line to be talking about Sora (since red is his main color and I think Days he was even referred to him once or twice as "the boy in red") though there's nothing saying it can't refer to more than one character.


After my comments on X I wanted to avoid doing theorizing here but Axel's talk on the light spectrum got me thinking:
Can we figure out final lineup of the Guardians of Light by the characters' colors?

Red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, violet
Seven colors.

Sora is red
Lea wore orange in BBS
Rock for brains' wayfinder is yellow
Ventus' is green
Aqua's is blue
Riku's colors have always been yellow and blue (interestingly he also shares a couple traits with Terra and Aqua.) but I'll list him as indigo.
And if DDD's secret movie is any indication, Kairi is the last GoL. She always had some purple, mostly in KHI. So violet she is.

An expected lineup. However Riku has been losing his blue as the series went on. It's a paler blue in KHII and in DDD his pants are practically grey, so Riku might actually be yellow with indigo being someone else and Terra possibly not on the final list.

 

[LightUpTheSky452]

Could we say that Aqua being "water" is symbolism (as water is life, and she's the only one "alive" by the end of it all with any chance to save/heal her friends)?

(Sorry, I guess I'm a bit confused on what we're referring to as symbolism in this thread, and what we're not. ^_^')

 

[Antifa Lockhart]

Before DDD I considered that line to be talking about Sora (since red is his main color and I think Days he was even referred to him once or twice as "the boy in red") though there's nothing saying it can't refer to more than one character.


After my comments on X I wanted to avoid doing theorizing here but Axel's talk on the light spectrum got me thinking:
Can we figure out final lineup of the Guardians of Light by the characters' colors?

Red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, violet
Seven colors.

Sora is red
Lea wore orange in BBS
Rock for brains' wayfinder is yellow
Ventus' is green
Aqua's is blue
Riku's colors have always been yellow and blue (interestingly he also shares a couple traits with Terra and Aqua.) but I'll list him as indigo.
And if DDD's secret movie is any indication, Kairi is the last GoL. She always had some purple, mostly in KHI. So violet she is.

An expected lineup. However Riku has been losing his blue as the series went on. It's a paler blue in KHII and in DDD his pants are practically grey, so Riku might actually be yellow with indigo being someone else and Terra possibly not on the final list.

Interesting. Though, Terra's color is predominantly orange: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-PadNbiugQKE/UgEVuH2HmII/AAAAAAAAAjk/0QeuReM5Ook/s1600/screen00007.jpg

 

[FudgemintGuardian]

Interesting. Though, Terra's color is predominantly orange: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-PadNbiugQKE/UgEVuH2HmII/AAAAAAAAAjk/0QeuReM5Ook/s1600/screen00007.jpg

Ah, thank you. I was looking through screenshots to make sure on color but it appeared more yellow to me in them. So that lumps Terra in orange with Lea.

Forgot to add this yesterday:

Light is comprised of all colors. Darkness however is absence of color.

Organization XIII

Aside from the obvious black coats, there's Xehanort's plan of inserting pieces of his Heart into others in order to make thirteen Darkness. Thirteen Xehanorts.
Through these seeds, the individuals' Heart is enveloped in Xehanort's own darkness, suppressing and possibly annihilating the individuals' identity, and making a sort of copy of Xehanort.

Xemnas himself has admitted the Heartless experiments were in trying to remove such:

"Our experiments creating Heartless, were attempts to control the mind and convince it to renounce its sense of self."

Where as the Seven Guardians of Light are comprised of individuals (colors of light) Xehanort's Thirteen Seekers of Darkness is comprised of himself spread across 13 people (absence of individuality, color.)

 

[hemmoheikkinen]

Could we say that Aqua being "water" is symbolism (as water is life, and she's the only one "alive" by the end of it all with any chance to save/heal her friends)?

(Sorry, I guess I'm a bit confused on what we're referring to as symbolism in this thread, and what we're not. ^_^')

There are various possibilities and I am not sure there is a wrong answer. I guess it just boils down to that people can find enough credible evidence and argue good for their view... or something like that.

To add to water Aqua, thing, some see water as a feminine element(Aqua being female) and also representing flexibility.

Organization XIII
Aside from the obvious black coats, there's Xehanort's plan of inserting pieces of his Heart into others in order to make thirteen Darkness. Thirteen Xehanorts.
Through these seeds, the individuals' Heart is enveloped in Xehanort's own darkness, suppressing and possibly annihilating the individuals' identity, and making a sort of copy of Xehanort.

Xemnas himself has admitted the Heartless experiments were in trying to remove such:

"Our experiments creating Heartless, were attempts to control the mind and convince it to renounce its sense of self."

Where as the Seven Guardians of Light are comprised of individuals (colors of light) Xehanort's Thirteen Seekers of Darkness is comprised of himself spread across 13 people (absence of individuality, color.)

This very well connects to the "light is made up from different colors" and possibly to Young Eraqus line "there is more to light than meets the eye." I don`t know if this is just me, but that line somehow sounds different than Eraqu`s older days light zealot mind set, that he shows in BBS. Like, his mind was ore flexible then or something.

Also as you mentioned the back clothes, I read an interesting idea from here a few years back, that as the new Org XIII members are all Old Nort clones, they were they same outfit and that represents their lack of individuality. The heroes in the other hand have personal different looking outfits(I guess this just basically the same thing you raise in your post).

 

[Alpha Baymax]

Master Xehanort's design is very reminiscent of The Mad Doctor from Disney's original Black and White shorts. At least in my interpretation, I see the symbolism as an inspiration from the latter's design.

 

[Koopa Sensei]

Remember that awful Jim Carrey movie where he kept seeing the number "21" everywhere? Kingdom Hearts does the same thing with the number "13." In multiple instances throughout the series, "13" keeps popping up all over the place, and a lot of these examples are downright mind-blowing. Don't believe me?

Well, let's start the most obvious. Kingdom Hearts' main group of bad guys is called "Organization XIII," made up of the 13 members. "Kingdom Hearts" has 13 letters in the title. In the opening sequence of the first Kingdom Hearts, the "M" in the title zooms towards the screen - and M is the 13th letter in the alphabet. Still not convinced? Add up the sum of the number of letters in the names of the main trio - Sora, Kairi, and Riku. It's thirteen. Remember the Ultima Weapon from Kingdom Hearts II? Guess how many Orichalcum+ you need to create it. Thirteen. How many worlds are in Kingdom Hearts, KH2, and Birth By Sleep? THIRTEEN.

Coincidence? I didn't think so.

 

[BlackOsprey]

tbh I just think Square Enix just has an unhealthy obsession with thirteen for whatever reason. They were strangely attached to FF XIII and made a trilogy (that nobody asked for) out of it too.

 

[Koopa Sensei]

tbh I just think Square Enix just has an unhealthy obsession with thirteen for whatever reason. They were strangely attached to FF XIII and made a trilogy (that nobody asked for) out of it too.

Square Enix is illuminati confirmed.​

 

[hemmoheikkinen]

Master Xehanort's design is very reminiscent of The Mad Doctor from Disney's original Black and White shorts. At least in my interpretation, I see the symbolism as an inspiration from the latter's design.

Master Xehanort sure seems to have this mad scientist thing going on. He does in-humane experiments with live test subjects(Ventus, Apprentice Nort`s experiments with the Heartless) Both also wear gloves in their hands and seems to have a thing going one with their hands:

But I guess when it comes to the Oldnort, nobody beats him with hand gestures.

I have also seen Master Xehanort as some sort of parallel to the devil. His pointy and sharp ears remind me of horns, and the goatee beard reminds me to some ways of how the devil/lucifer has been drawn in popular culture. Then there is of course his Goat Keyblade. (kinda superficial thoughts, but that is the best I can do right now... )

 

[Vanitas666]

KH is God, the fake KH created by Xehanort is any world system out there, any religion etc, it's like the Matrix.
Our hearts belong to our mind control which we will fight for and protect with everything we have because it is the only thing that will hide us from ourselves and the darkness within us, it is what make us seam like "good people" when we are fucked up and all twisted.

Also the 7 Princesses are obviously the chakras but did you know that the mind is often represented by the number 12 because it's at the edge of the mind like the zodiac and it have 12 different types of wiring + one extra kind that doesn't always count but it basically connect everything, cosmological that would be the sun aka the 13th vessel (or first depending on how you look at it and it's always either Satan or Christ)

When I say Christ I talk about the True Self when all the mind control is gone and the Ego is never in charge,
when I say Satan I talk about the false ego that think it's in charge of everything and is so fucking important and prideful.

 

[Squood!]

KH is God, the fake KH created by Xehanort is any world system out there, any religion etc, it's like the Matrix.
Our hearts belong to our mind control which we will fight for and protect with everything we have because it is the only thing that will hide us from ourselves and the darkness within us, it is what make us seam like "good people" when we are diddlyed up and all twisted.

Also the 7 Princesses are obviously the chakras but did you know that the mind is often represented by the number 12 because it's at the edge of the mind like the zodiac and it have 12 different types of wiring + one extra kind that doesn't always count but it basically connect everything, cosmological that would be the sun aka the 13th vessel (or first depending on how you look at it and it's always either Satan or Christ)

When I say Christ I talk about the True Self when all the mind control is gone and the Ego is never in charge,
when I say Satan I talk about the false ego that think it's in charge of everything and is so diddlying important and prideful.

...that's a bit too symbolic.

 

[Vanitas666]

...that's a bit too symbolic.

What? You're a bit too simple and want to hide under your dear moonshaped black sun?

The moon does not shine on it's own. The moon's light is a reflection from the sun's.
No sun. No light. And this is why the nortification accelerated.
During Days, Axel and Saix's relationship was already deteriorating, along with Axel gravitating towards Roxas and Xion and Saix' jealousy of that creating a greater rift between the two, eventually breaking what little friendship the two had left.
Because of the bond now broken, without Lea's light to shine on Isa's heart, this allowed the Xehanort seed to encroach further and envelop Isa's heart.

Man, this is brilliant. In the end the moon was swallowed by the darkness since it did not have the light of the sun to help it.
This is probably me stretching and idea, but moon`s surface is full of craters, most caused by the impact of meteors. Saix`s face has the X shaped scar, and when he unleashes his berserk side, the scar gets even worse. Maybe the scars can be viewed as craters in the moon caused by meteor. The meteor`s came outside of the moon, symbolizing outside forces are at play, and that outside force in Saix`s case would be Xehanort. As Terranort, Xheanort uses a few Meteor based attacks.

These are great discoveries when you discover that the very idea of a nobody is being a Moon without a sun on the inside so you have to follow the false sun on the outside.
All the meteorites are attacks on your face (ego) and they leave a lot of scars just like the one Saix have:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYzT36DA0Rk

Ooh this is interesting. So if I understood correctly, that line could be taken as metaphor for Axel/Lea`s journey and character growth?

I haven't even thought about it before (which still for some reason always surprise me because of how obvious it is lol, like I really can't believe how stupid I am ha ha) but the red color (and other colors but especially blue vs red) have a lot of symbolism in them.
The red color is very arrogant and prideful, in the bible it's the story of "The Prodigal Son" who leave the safety of his fathers home and though he go through much hardship, or rather because of it he learn so much and when he finally get back home he get to have a huge welcome party and he'll always reach much farther than his brother who just stay home and safe without ever venturing out of his comfort zone and always judge one man against another.

 

[Audo]

What? You're a bit too simple and want to hide under your dear moonshaped black sun?

How about you post your thoughts without personal attacks on other members?

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

A more basic observation when it comes to song symbolism (and one I've brought up before lol): "Dearly Beloved" has the same rhythm of a heartbeat, which fits in with the fact that the song is the very "heartbeat" of the series as the main theme and is also used in many songs as a leitmotif (not always, but most of the time).

 

[Audo]

A more basic observation when it comes to song symbolism (and one I've brought up before lol): "Dearly Beloved" has the same rhythm of a heartbeat, which fits in with the fact that the song is the very "heartbeat" of the series as the main theme and is also used in many songs as a leitmotif (not always, but most of the time).

I also love how its first real inclusion in the games is the song that Sora and Riku duet in KH3D.

(so lovingly gay)

 

[Vanitas666]

How about you post your thoughts without personal attacks on other members?

I just want to blow a meteorite so hard in to that moon the scar break it all apart and the sun shine through, it's not very easy and it takes time but I do what I can even when I risk getting banned (and honestly I'm amazed that haven't happened yet, even if they don't want to admit it part of the admins most see the grains of truth in what I say or just have an extremely high tolerance, idk)

Anyway if you can learn to open your eyes a bit and see the symbolism everywhere this is some of the best shit ever :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_81MEE6nfVs&list=PL7qE1RS-m0jZ7JRnkjus875MwjAoDcE8X
Good ol Lizzy probably don't have a clue about how diddlying brilliant her lyrics is but it doesn't matter because the spirit work through her 100% on this one

Edit-

KH is God, the fake KH created by Xehanort is any world system out there, any religion etc, it's like the Matrix.
Our hearts belong to our mind control which we will fight for and protect with everything we have because it is the only thing that will hide us from ourselves and the darkness within us, it is what make us seam like "good people" when we are diddlyed up and all twisted.

Btw, this is one symbolism for the All seeing eye but it's also just your perception and how it see's the world from the experience becoming understood by the ego and the pure light being divided to create the physical world

 

[LightUpTheSky452]

I don't know if this counts as symbolism, per se, but some clever person on Tumblr recently made a post detailing how the first worlds the characters visited in BbS hinted at their fates.

For Terra, he becomes possessed--and that's something that happens to Aurora, when Maleficent is controlling her to get her to prick her finger.

For Ventus, his first world is Snow White (who, in her movie, goes into a temporary coma), and we all know what happens to Ven...

For Aqua, she goes to Castle of Dreams first: where Cinderella leaves behind her glass slipper. At the end of the game, Aqua leaves behind her Stormfall Keyblade and her Keyblade armor

Here's the original post about all of this:http://bluerosesburnblue.tumblr.com/post/142100113846/bbs-foreshadowing

 

[BlackOsprey]

I don't know if this counts as symbolism, per se, but some clever person on Tumblr recently made a post detailing how the first worlds the characters visited in BbS hinted at their fates.

For Terra, he becomes possessed--and that's something that happens to Aurora, when Maleficent is controlling her to get her to prick her finger.

For Ventus, his first world is Snow White (who, in her movie, goes into a temporary coma), and we all know what happens to Ven...

For Aqua, she goes to Castle of Dreams first: where Cinderella leaves behind her glass slipper. At the end of the game, Aqua leaves behind her Stormfall Keyblade and her Keyblade armor

Here's the original post about all of this:http://bluerosesburnblue.tumblr.com/post/142100113846/bbs-foreshadowing

As a matter of fact, TAV's very first appearance (before we even knew what they looked like under that armor) had a degree of foreshadowing. It's that one scene where the three walk up in the Keyblade Graveyard and each one picks up a blade... Terra gets the Kingdom Key (his story ends with him possessed but in the Realm of Light), Aqua gets the KKD (she ends up trapped in the RoD), and Ventus picks to The Way to Dawn (and he's left comatose in the Realm of In-between).