Sephiroth

[Unusual1290]

Not having Sephiroth in ReMind was such a missed opportunity, especially since he acknowledged that fans wanted it. It would have been great promo for FF7R. It wouldn’t even have to be a canon fight. A battle gate for it would’ve worked just fine. *sigh*

But who knows? Maybe he is planning to sneak that in there before FF7R’s release. (More likely not, but you never know)

 

[AegisXIII]

I think final fantasy will have a huge role in the future. Kh3 was more disney oriented, and probably for the last time.

 

[Sarius]

I very much expected the cutscene shown in the trailer to be the only FF related thing in remind used only to get people hyped. I'm hoping Nomura realizes that mistake. Seems like the next big game might be more inclusive for FF characters so hopefully we at least get a cloud and Sephiroth conclusion.

 

[2 quid is good]

I think final fantasy will have a huge role in the future. Kh3 was more disney oriented, and probably for the last time.

I don't know how anyone can still possibly have hope for this

 

[Sarius]

I don't know how anyone can still possibly have hope for this

Nomura knows that fans wanted FF characters after this game. I don't think he expected people to be this concerned over it. I think its almost positive that FF will be more involved in the next big game.

 

[Noivern]

I lost count of how many times I've seen people asking for Sephiroth, meanwhile I'd just like to see Genesis instead.

But really, considering Cloud and Tifa are missing too we can probably expect something about them in future titles.

The remake will bring new abilities/powers, redesigns and stuff so remodeling them for something so minor like what Limit Cut has is a bit too much, and in Sephiroth's case, there's already 14 new superbosses with one of them being a super secret boss.

Yuffie, Aerith and Cid are different as they are stablished characters while the others, while also important, are not part of the Restoration Committee.

 

[SuperSaiyanSora]

I don't know how anyone can still possibly have hope for this

I don't know where that idea started, the one where as of this moment, we'll be travelling to Square Enix worlds instead of Disney ones. Or that Disney won't be in Kingdom Hearts anymore. Neither are true (and are highly unlikely for many reasons), and I hope people aren't actually expecting this for KH4.

Kingdom Hearts without the Disney is literally just a massive self-contained Final Fantasy universe. The only benefit the franchise would get from a thing like that (assuming Square could ever actually accomplish this, which they would never want to do) would be more explicit themes or violence, and the series doesn't even need stuff like that.

Terra shot a guy's eye out with black darkness fire, monsters are ripping people's hearts from their body, and human experimentation is a consistent theme. This series is already really dark lmao.

 

[2 quid is good]

Nomura knows that fans wanted FF characters after this game. I don't think he expected people to be this concerned over it. I think its almost positive that FF will be more involved in the next big game.

After BBS released: "We didn't realise the fan demands for FF characters were so high"
- Nomura and Yasue

After KH3 released: "We didn't realise the fan demands for FF characters were so high"
-Nomura and Yasue

A decade later, the position of FF is more untenable than ever before even with their Re:mind appearance. Nomura and/or Yasue just do not get why they should be included, even though their cameo was as in character as they could be for a 120 second scene. I don't think there's any hope at all that SE characters will be featured in KH moving forward, just Nomura's FF inspired OCs.

 

[Eonstar890]

I think a lot of people forget that video game production (especially from major producers) is not a democracy. Sure they’ll consider what fans may say or ask for, but at the end of the day they are gonna tell the story they want to tell and make the gameplay decisions they want to make. FF has not had a major role in KH for AWHILE now, there is absolutely no reason that’s going to change outside of “the fans keep asking for it”. TWEWY may play a role going forward, but that’s still not a guarantee.

I mean the people making these titles already have quite a list of expectations and requirements for what the focus of any particular game is, they are not going to be overly swayed by public want, especially considering that even if they did do that the majority would still be displeased with the end result.

Remind is a perfect example of how far fan outcry will actually get you, a mini episode featuring said characters for five minutes of screen time. Not really trying to attack anyone here, just wanted to voice this since nowadays there’s this weird misconception that if fans beg and plead and protest enough, these major game producers are actually going to do something about those complaints (i.e. Pokémon Sw/Sh National Dex, Smash DLC fighters, etc.)

 

[Face My Fears]

Nomura knows that fans wanted FF characters after this game. I don't think he expected people to be this concerned over it. I think its almost positive that FF will be more involved in the next big game.

I don't want to be a Debbie Downer, but everyone was thinking Final Fantasy would be more involved in KH3 after seeing it be ignored and its importance reduced to almost nothing from BbS to 3D. The fact that they didn't even appear in KH3 and only showed up after fan outcry for 2 minutes of cutscenes in a feature that was made for Data Battles says a lot. It says that Nomura cares about the fans and will try to accommodate when possible, but also that Final Fantasy characters (specifically the ones from Radiant Garden) will probably not have major roles going forward.

The only possible chance that they have is if Radiant Garden becomes a world that we actually visit/explore again... which there is a possibility of that given what KHUX has shown recently.

My personal opinion is that Nomura should be looking for uses of other FF characters in the KH series (I always use this example: Balthier & Fran as a secret boss fight in The Caribbean would have been great). We've done Sephiroth twice now. Sure, he is an iconic FF villain, but some people don't even know who he is, but just fought him in KH1 and 2 then became intrigued to look into the game he's from further. Why not spread that love/intrigue with other characters in the FF series?

Everyone who fights for the FF crew from Radiant Garden to be in the KH series all the time always screams that "it's a Disney/Final Fantasy crossover!" But the fact that they only seem to want Leon/Cloud/Yuffie/Tifa/Sephiroth to appear in KH seems to me that they think it's a "Disney/Final Fantasy VII and VIII" crossover. Radiant Garden and Olympus shouldn't be the only worlds to see FF characters and if they're going to use FF characters again, why not pick from the other 13 FF games?

 

[Elysium]

Not really trying to attack anyone here, just wanted to voice this since nowadays there’s this weird misconception that if fans beg and plead and protest enough, these major game producers are actually going to do something about those complaints (i.e. Pokémon Sw/Sh National Dex, Smash DLC fighters, etc.)

Then you probably know that fans won't stop complaining about it, no matter how much times passes. Believe me, because people have been complaining about Kairi getting nothing since CoM and that was, what, 15 years ago?

Everyone who fights for the FF crew from Radiant Garden to be in the KH series all the time always screams that "it's a Disney/Final Fantasy crossover!" But the fact that they only seem to want Leon/Cloud/Yuffie/Tifa/Sephiroth to appear in KH seems to me that they think it's a "Disney/Final Fantasy VII and VIII" crossover.

Nah, it's just we know it's even less likely for FF characters to appear in random Disney worlds now. They're only ever in original worlds or the Coliseum, and not even in the latter in KH3 (and who knows when Olympus' next appearance will be). As for the Radiant Garden crew, VII and VIII aren't even my favorite FFs, it's just that they are the only ones who have any story connection to Sora. There's also the fact that Radiant Garden is liked as a world period; the FF characters + TRON + the Apprentices + Merlin and Scrooge + heavy appearances of Mickey and Maleficent is a pretty amazing combo that you don't seen in any other world in KH, as the Disney characters have become more and more confined and separated. And then there's the chance to finally go back to the castle again on top of that.

Also, if we're going to be completely realistic here--I doubt Treasure Planet will even happen, much less with FF characters there.

A decade later, the position of FF is more untenable than ever before even with their Re:mind appearance. Nomura and/or Yasue just do not get why they should be included, even though their cameo was as in character as they could be for a 120 second scene. I don't think there's any hope at all that SE characters will be featured in KH moving forward, just Nomura's FF inspired OCs.

Yeah, most people are not delusional about this. I have a feeling Nomura did learn after BbS since the TWEWY characters play a similar role to the FF characters in 3D. Unfortunately, Nomura's removal from XV happened between 3D and 3, didn't it? Or was it before 3D? Either way, I think he was determined to keep FF out regardless after that. I mean, they had already made models for the FF characters for KH3, but Nomura decided that, no, they were not going to use them.

 

[2 quid is good]

Not really trying to attack anyone here, just wanted to voice this since nowadays there’s this weird misconception that if fans beg and plead and protest enough, these major game producers are actually going to do something about those complaints (i.e. Pokémon Sw/Sh National Dex, Smash DLC fighters, etc.)

Aside from your last example, those games got those huge backlashes because features were removed with no equivalent replacement or indeed something better. Why shouldn't fans voice their complaints? I 100% don't think my complaints will change anything, but I'm still entitled to have them, especially when the excuses given for the remove features are totally BS.

As for FF Characters being included, they literally only make things better. Even if you don't care about them, they provide more variety and more entertaining set pieces than the standard. Nomura removing them without even giving any sense of closure is definitely something that will haunt KH3, Remind or no, for a pretty long time. And more to the point, it seems like Nomura wasn't totally hands on with KH3, I don't remember the exact interview but it implied he only had a more of an overseeing role with the nitty gritty being overseen by Yasue.

I like the guy but I don't think he gets the first thing about KH if he's gonna make it more Disney Clubhouse special rather than balance it out between the original worlds and the Disney. If it carries on like this there is gonna be a pretty large amount of the fanbase who'll be more and more frustrated, or maybe they'll just give up and accept it, who knows. At any rate, I suppose I'm so whipped I still have a tiny bit of hope for KH4, we'll see I guess.

 

[Eonstar890]

Aside from your last example, those games got those huge backlashes because features were removed with no equivalent replacement or indeed something better. Why shouldn't fans voice their complaints? I 100% don't think my complaints will change anything, but I'm still entitled to have them, especially when the excuses given for the remove features are totally BS.

This is fine. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and what they did or didn't want, but some people think that their complaints actually WILL change things which is what I was trying to disprove. While your point of FF characters being a plus for the series is totally fair as well as many others shared belief, I don't expect that to mean jack to Square in the long run.

Basically people shouldn't feel so entitled or owed by a series. Yes be disappointed, yes voice your grievances, no do not sit there and expect the next installation to be everything you complained was missing form the previous. But hey, maybe one day...

 

[DarknessInZero]

Not having a bigger role for the FF7 characters to hype up the remake is one of the biggest missed opportunities you can have in marketing and promo.

A PR intern could have came up with this idea, mind boggling idea to not include them. I think it's purely out of spite.

 

[Elysium]

but some people think that their complaints actually WILL change things which is what I was trying to disprove.

Well... The truth is criticism has had a positive effect on this series. Compare the world designs for 3D and KH3 to those of KH2 and BbS. No comparison. And that's because of a huge amount of b*tchin' on behalf of the fanbase the decade before KH3. I don't think it's entitled to expect they should do better.

As far as FF characters, after the way 3 shafted RG so randomly, I personally don't expect any of Nomura's decisions to make sense anymore. I used to think the absurdity was something restricted to the story, but I guess not. Still, hope springs eternal.

 

[2 quid is good]

I don't expect that to mean jack to Square in the long run.

I totally agree with this.

Basically people shouldn't feel so entitled or owed by a series. Yes be disappointed, yes voice your grievances, no do not sit there and expect the next installation to be everything you complained was missing form the previous. But hey, maybe one day...

Don't entirely agree with this. I don't think that the major criticisms of KH3 come from a place of entitlement. People would only expect certain things of KH3 because the pattern of previous entries lead them to believe that KH3 would also follow that pattern. I agree that we shouldn't expect the next entries to fulfil our desires, but at the same time, I'd say collectively that fans of a series do have somewhat of a clue on what constitutes "goodness" in a game. So while I'm not at all keen on people who claim to know better than the devs in general, I don't think it's at all invalid for fans to have ideas that can improve a series.

 

[Ballad of Caius]

Nomura's excuse with the lack of FF characters was over the issue about constantly shifting spotlight from main characters to FF characters. That's the reason as to why we didn't see young Squall and the gang in Radiant Garden in BBS. The Foretellers' Saga is gonna have, perhaps, the same amount of characters the last saga had, meaning that this is gonna be a recurring argument made by Nomura as a writer. The most we can hope for is more interactions like the ones we got in Limit Cut.

But with the fact that RG is playing a more instrumental role in his rescue, I think it's safe to assume that we'll get a more expanded RG. And it would be a travesty to not have the Restoration Committee appear.

 

[2 quid is good]

Nomura's excuse with the lack of FF characters was over the issue about constantly shifting spotlight from main characters to FF characters.

God forbid a JRPG have subplots and filler, that would be a real mold breaker.

 

[Ballad of Caius]

God forbid a JRPG have subplots and filler, that would be a real mold breaker.

KINGDOM HEARTS needs sidequests that further expand some non-main plot lore and world building.

 

[2 quid is good]

KINGDOM HEARTS needs sidequests that further expand some non-main plot lore and world building.

I was definitely being sarcastic in my post, I'm all on board the world building train, I did write a huge essay on it specifically after all xD