I don’t think it was simple as him trusting her completely. He “needed” her as means to an end, but slowly got snared by darkness. The first game sets up the theme of the darkness slowly controlling you, as with Clayton and many Disney villains, so I think Riku trusted her results but knew deep down she was dangerous. Also despite his facade, Riku had moments of weakness and felt insecure. In those moments I don’t doubt that he ignored the warnings and jumped aboard. Personally I see desperation in Kingdom Hearts 1 Riku. It’s so subtle, but it becomes plainly obvious when he loses to Sora, because despite being the rational one, Riku is also very emotional.
Riku & Maleficent
- Thread starter maleficentfan123
- Start date
|
REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS |
|
Definitely agree on Riku having moments of weakness and insecurity. I think the entirety of KH1 shows that. I really felt Maleficent also sensed his insecurity and emotional behavior and was trying to use it to her advantage.
Your point on slowly getting snared by the darkness is interesting. Could it be argued that since Maleficent is really the one who got him going down the path of darkness in the first place, that she had a bigger role in his eventual turning to darkness than Ansem? I know he and Ansem briefly met on the islands (which I think was a retcon but whatever), yet I still think his time with Maleficent led him further and further down the path of darkness than anything Ansem did with him. By the time Ansem possessed him, he was so far gone that Riku couldn't have done anything even if he wanted to. If Maleficent hadn't been in the picture at all, would Ansem have been able to get Riku to go down the path of darkness? Perhaps, but it's debatable. (Can Ansem even leave the Destiny Islands at the start of KH1, in his robed figure? Honest question...I'm forgetting how that whole thing works. I don't play through the KH games other than KH1, KH2 and KH3 very often at all.)
Also, I think Riku was suspicious of Maleficent at first, but did eventually come around to trusting her to some extent. Definitely not completely, but I do think he had some level of trust with her. He does choose to stay with her after she finds Kairi, even though he could have just taken her body and tried to find a way to restore her heart on his own without Maleficent's help. I think if he didn't trust Maleficent whatsoever, he wouldn't have stayed with her for as long as he did in KH1. She convinced him to not trust SDG, despite the previous friendship he and Sora had had.
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2012
- Messages
- 3,782
- Awards
- 37
I think Riku came to treat Maleficent not like a friend exactly, but like a colleague, a working relationship they could both benefit from. Part of it was that he was isolated from Sora, so there wasn't exactly anyone or anywhere else to go to. And here was someone willing to give him more and more power that he could show off to Sora, so why not stick around with her? I think the only thing Riku actually did for Maleficent in the end was kidnap Jasmine and fight Beast.
As a side note, I think the moment Riku opens his heart to Ansem, he was no longer in control at all. All of the disdain from Riku / Ansem was entirely Ansem, imo, much the same way Xehanort completely takes over Terranort and left Terra no control whatsoever. So I don't think that was a reflection of Riku's feelings towards Maleficent exactly, merely those of Ansem SOD. I'm really not sure how Riku would interact with Maleficent now. I think he would be uncomfortable around her simply because she would remind him of what he's ashamed of or he would simply be dismissive of her.
As a side note, I think the moment Riku opens his heart to Ansem, he was no longer in control at all. All of the disdain from Riku / Ansem was entirely Ansem, imo, much the same way Xehanort completely takes over Terranort and left Terra no control whatsoever. So I don't think that was a reflection of Riku's feelings towards Maleficent exactly, merely those of Ansem SOD. I'm really not sure how Riku would interact with Maleficent now. I think he would be uncomfortable around her simply because she would remind him of what he's ashamed of or he would simply be dismissive of her.
- Joined
- Jan 16, 2021
- Messages
- 75
- Awards
- 2
Replaying KH1 I took note of how often Maleficent was warning her co-conspirators not to let the darkness overtake them. Even back then, she cared a little, in her own way. She doesn't delight in everyone's misfortune anyway. Her heroic deeds in KH2 were a huge progression for her, so it's too bad Sora seemed to have completely forgotten about them by KH3, because maybe he could have been the bridge to reconciliation between Maleficent and Riku. I'm sure there's more she could teach him about dark magic, and even if she was still in villain mode, it would be cool to have some interactions with a wicked character that isn't them just threatening you or saying ominous things.
Since I'm sure both characters will continue to play their own part in the story, I hope their paths cross again, and hopefully more than just once.
Since I'm sure both characters will continue to play their own part in the story, I hope their paths cross again, and hopefully more than just once.
Kidnapping Jasmine was a pretty big deal though. I mean, she was/is a princess of heart and Maleficent needed her to carry out her plans. Also, he did fight Sora a few times in Monstro and Neverland. Was that for Maleficent, or for himself? An argument could be made either way.
Good points re: Ansem being the one in control showing disdain to Maleficent. Interesting that Ansem would view Maleficent so negatively, but Xehanort would see her as a valuable pawn in his grand plan. I'm rather surprised Maleficent went against Xemnas in KH2 but wasn't seen actively working against Xehanort in KH3. While I prefer the version of Maleficent we got, I do think it was rather inconsistent with the character they had set up in KH2.
Jafar, Hades, Ursula, Oogie and Hook were a means to an end for Maleficent. I don't think she truly cared about them, she just wanted to make sure her plans came to fruition. This is rather inconsistent; Hook questions Riku on what Maleficent's planning and Riku claims he doesn't know, but earlier in the game, she's seen conversing/plotting with Jafar pretty heavily. But I don't think she really cared about any of her allies, nor do I think she really cared about Riku. I'm more interested in how Riku feels about Maleficent.
I don't see Maleficent ever reconciling with Sora. Sora ruined her plan in KH1--easily her plan thus far that had the most potential for success. Her search for the BoP doesn't seem to be going well, and I'm doubtful she'll be able to take on the foretellers group that was shown having the black box at the end of KH3. Likely, she'll be relegated to side villain status once again moving forward.
Perhaps she could try to get her group together again or persuade Riku to join her, but I don't see either of those things happening. Hades was very dismissive of her and Pete in KH3. And I don't see Yen Sid or Mickey letting Riku join Maleficent. If she tried to "speak to the darkness sleeping in his heart" like she did Terra, I definitely don't think it would be as successful for her. Perhaps she could get Terra to join her though? But I'm doubtful they'll go down that road with him again. Aqua? I mean, she was in the realm of darkness for so long that maybe her heart is full of darkness?
It's going to be interesting to see what happens with Maleficent going forward either way. I do hope we get some discussion on the Riku x Maleficent dynamic. Like I said, I'm much more interested in how the real Riku would interact with the real Maleficent now than the other way around, or how they'd interact with data versions of each other.
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2012
- Messages
- 3,782
- Awards
- 37
Jasmine was done for regardless, since Maleficent knew she was for sure a PoH. If it hadn't been Riku, it would've been Hook or Hades. I like to think it was sort of an initation rite and that's why they sent Riku.
I think the allies had levels with Maleficent. Jafar seemed to be the closest to her, and unfortunately he was the first out. Oogie seems like the lowest on the totem pole, since he wanted the doctor's heart to be able to control the Heartless (a power Maleficent could've given him since we see her do so for Riku, but apparently she had not done so yet?). It would explain how he acts towards her in 2, too, that he simply wasn't in the group long enough to be committed to her plans.
I think the allies had levels with Maleficent. Jafar seemed to be the closest to her, and unfortunately he was the first out. Oogie seems like the lowest on the totem pole, since he wanted the doctor's heart to be able to control the Heartless (a power Maleficent could've given him since we see her do so for Riku, but apparently she had not done so yet?). It would explain how he acts towards her in 2, too, that he simply wasn't in the group long enough to be committed to her plans.
Wasn't it implied that Riku was also the one to get Alice? Or maybe that's just a theory I'm mistaking for something that was implied. Though it would explain why he'd go through Wonderland in CoM.
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2015
- Messages
- 1,013
- Awards
- 6
It was assumed/theorized but never confirmed. I always assumed the second set of cards he got in CoM were worlds he never actually went to in KH1, since he definitely was shown in the first set of worlds but not the others and it would have been long enough until DiZ got ahold of Sora's world data.
That actually would make sense. I always assumed for many of those worlds the ties were the bosses more than the worlds themselves.
I've never heard the theory that Riku was the one to pick up Alice. Where exactly does this theory stem from? I'm just curious where it even came from. I'm not really seeing a connection tbh.
Agreed on all counts really. I always wondered why exactly Agrabah was, not early exactly, but so mid-game? Jafar probably should've been saved for later in the game. Oogie not being able to control the Heartless was definitely interesting.
Agreed on all counts really. I always wondered why exactly Agrabah was, not early exactly, but so mid-game? Jafar probably should've been saved for later in the game. Oogie not being able to control the Heartless was definitely interesting.
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2012
- Messages
- 3,782
- Awards
- 37
The Cheshire Cat said she was kidnapped by the shadows (Heartless). Or it could be that a dark portal simply opened below her while she was in the Queen's cage. She (or Snow White, depending on which worlds you play in what order) are brought into the Castle Chapel by unseen figures, assumedly Heartless, since the full villain council is already present at the time.
I've said it before (but since when do I mind repeating myself, lol), but Riku's memory worlds were a missed opportunity. Ursula, Hook, Jafar, Oogie, and Hades should've at least made some generic one liners about the darkness to him before their boss battles, and he should've been confronted by Geppetto & Pinocchio in Monstro as well as Jasmine in Agrabah--maybe the Beast, too. (Perhaps he could've met Alice in Wonderland as well, since he technically had to have seen her at Hollow Bastion even if they never spoke.) It would've been interesting if he fought an Antiriku at Neverland to mirror how he created Antisora for Sora. Riku and Mickey totally should've got world-specific designs for Halloween Town and Atlantica (SDG should've changed in Atlantica, too, bw). I know they wanted Riku's side to be abbreviated, but adding one extra room to Monstro and Agrabah wouldn't have been that big of a deal.
I blame fan complaints about swimming in KH1 for why they don't transform in CoM. Which is bizarre because they could still have operated the same way as walking while being transformed since it was a GBA game with sprites. Now the 3D remake would've been more complicated, but I'm sure they had no plans to remake CoM back at the time they were first making it.
I've said it before (but since when do I mind repeating myself, lol), but Riku's memory worlds were a missed opportunity. Ursula, Hook, Jafar, Oogie, and Hades should've at least made some generic one liners about the darkness to him before their boss battles, and he should've been confronted by Geppetto & Pinocchio in Monstro as well as Jasmine in Agrabah--maybe the Beast, too. (Perhaps he could've met Alice in Wonderland as well, since he technically had to have seen her at Hollow Bastion even if they never spoke.) It would've been interesting if he fought an Antiriku at Neverland to mirror how he created Antisora for Sora. Riku and Mickey totally should've got world-specific designs for Halloween Town and Atlantica (SDG should've changed in Atlantica, too, bw). I know they wanted Riku's side to be abbreviated, but adding one extra room to Monstro and Agrabah wouldn't have been that big of a deal.
I blame fan complaints about swimming in KH1 for why they don't transform in CoM. Which is bizarre because they could still have operated the same way as walking while being transformed since it was a GBA game with sprites. Now the 3D remake would've been more complicated, but I'm sure they had no plans to remake CoM back at the time they were first making it.