What's your main problem with KH and hope that it'll be improved in 3?

[Deleted member 246005]

Im hoping Sora, Kairi, Xehanort are better used as individuals and we get some forward momentum with them. Less setup more payoff.

Im hoping the data world and replicas are better used as concepts.

 

[NobodyImportant]

Playing through KH2 again, I rediscovered something that bugged the heck out of me.

Where's all the amazing Disney music? There's entire stretches of gameplay with no background music at all. I understand that they'd have to pay royalties on some of them but come on. The one that really got the short end of the stick with this was Pride Lands. I think they wasted too much money making Atlantica a musical. They better not do the same in KH3.

At the very least, if you can't get permission for the music itself, compose something similar like most of the bgm. There's no reason whatsoever to not have background music in any part of the game. When you notice the omission more than what's actually going on in the scene, that's a problem.

 

[raccoonscity]

I second pretty much everything I've seen so far, although I will say KH3 has me more optimistic about the treatment of the Disney worlds.

One thing I'm hoping for in KH3 (and beyond) is that the characters build more relationships outside of just their trios/groups. Expand on that Namine and Terra scene. Have Ven be friends with Xion and/or Roxas after living in Sora's heart together. Let Aqua get to know Kairi, Sora, and Riku as adults. Have the Apprentices interact with the Radiant Garden restoration crew. It could help develop the characters seeing them get to know someone new and get them out of their comfort zones.

 

[Luminary]

Sometimes I feel like the villains want to bore us to death with monologues. None of them feel particularly dangerous.

This is where I’m hoping Larxene will come in. She was very physical in CoM, kicking the snot out of Sora and picking up Repliku with one arm, tossing him aside like he was nothing. She was great as both a physical and psychological threat, in my opinion. I’d love to see more of that from her and the other Seekers. I’m loving what we saw in Toy Box as Young Xehanort uses the Gigas to attack the toys. It feels like there is an actual element of peril as SDG struggle unsuccessfully to fend off the Gigas’ attack. I definitely want to see more of that.

 

[Launchpad]

This is where I’m hoping Larxene will come in. She was very physical in CoM, kicking the snot out of Sora and picking up Repliku with one arm, tossing him aside like he was nothing. She was great as both a physical and psychological threat, in my opinion. I’d love to see more of that from her and the other Seekers. I’m loving what we saw in Toy Box as Young Xehanort uses the Gigas to attack the toys. It feels like there is an actual element of peril as SDG struggle unsuccessfully to fend off the Gigas’ attack. I definitely want to see more of that.

It just seems like almost all the villains are not out to get Sora until the very end of each game. I'd love to see one of the rogue's gallery come out with a very real intention to kill Sora early. If this contests with Xehanort's plans, then have Maleficent come out of the woodwork early and really throw things off course.

 

[Luminary]

It just seems like almost all the villains are not out to get Sora until the very end of each game. I'd love to see one of the rogue's gallery come out with a very real intention to kill Sora early. If this contests with Xehanort's plans, then have Maleficent come out of the woodwork early and really throw things off course.

Yeah that’s a good idea. Maybe a third party wants to stop Xehanort’s plan from happening like how Eraqus tried to kill Ven to prevent the x-blade from being forged. I could see Maleficent or another character taking a similar viewpoint if Xehanort’s goals don’t line up with his or her own.

 

[kirabook]

And that's fine and all, but if my friend compares me to a trash bin I understand it's meant as an insulting joke, but comparing me to stars... is it an insult? A compliment? What...? That was the only time when I fully emphatized with Ventus' total confusion.
If it was about Ven being too pure, then the original complaint still stands, that's not how humans talk.

And it also falls onto BbS' other problem of telling and not showing: it would've been better if Ventus actually said something weird or unbelievably good-natured, like comforting Aqua about tomorrow's exam or saying how he just saw the meteor showers and rushed out in pure ecstasy.
Here's enters Terra: "Ven, you're so pure. It's like you're one of the stars that shine on us, incapable of feeling negative emotions."
Cringe-inducing, but I'd say a bit more effective.
It would've also gave us actual proof that Ventus was indeed pure, instead of taking Xehanort's word for it hours later.

True true. I mean, we got plenty of "Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't meant to scare you people shorter than me D8" and "She was just so pretty I couldn't help but stalk over her bed and watch her sleep D8" kind of Ven, so it wouldn't have been out of character for Ven to say something super cheesy and sweet to cheer them on. Then Terra would just reply with something snotty (or rather, his statement would seem more snotty, in a good way if that makes sense) and then Aqua's laugh would be more eye rolling like, "Here you guys go again, arguing over something dumb."

Another possibility is that it was a totally mangled take on the "you're my/our light" metaphor, which if I recall in one of the translated chapters of the first BBS novel actually comes up in that both Aqua and Terra literally think of Ven as "their light" just like Sora is supposed to be Riku's and Kairi's supposed to be Sora's.

Thing is though, this fact is conveyed in the novel through Aqua's and Terra's thoughts, not any cringeworthy actual verbal statement.

I took this particular part of Terra always as him trying and hilariously failing to sound somewhat sophisticated and philosophical, which of course flies totally over Ven's head and for the audience is facepalm-inducing.

Yeah, I think we're meant to see Terra as trying to be more sophisticated than he actually is? He does this again in the flashback when he gives Ven the wooden keyblade. He gives a grand old speech (obviously imitating Eraqus) and Aqua's like, "Um, who went and made you master?" In that case, I do think a better voiced acted line would've helped at least a little. Maybe the VA didn't know what feeling he was supposed to give off during this moment.

 

[Vasquez]

gameplay

the locked down demos which allowed for no customization at all worry me

 

[mytomxxx]

gameplay

the locked down demos which allowed for no customization at all worry me

They will bring back the abilities system... Look this video if you want to know more

 

[qbaysan]

Replaying KH2 and I must say, the armor/accessory equipments kinda leaves me miffed. But then again, it's personal preference. Non-main title games didn't have that so I sorta got used to them.

 

[KingMickeyMouse]

Every single original KH character (with the exception of Sora) is generic, boring, cliche anime trash and the writers keep shoving them in our faces even though they have complete access to the Disney vault; filled some of the most iconic and loveable characters ever created — and they opted to make them filler instead. Guess their weaboo tendencies just keep getting the better of their creative and artistic integrity...

Kingdom Hearts is just objectively incompetent in terms of storytelling, basically.

 

[mytomxxx]

Every single original KH character (with the exception of Sora) is generic, boring, cliche anime trash and the writers keep shoving them in our faces even though they have complete access to the Disney vault; filled some of the most iconic and loveable characters ever created — and they opted to make them filler instead. Guess their weaboo tendencies just keep getting the better of their creative and artistic integrity...

Kingdom Hearts is just objectively incompetent in terms of storytelling, basically.

Man you really havent learn. If you are going to criticize offensively characters we love here, you should at least show reasons, instead of saying bad things about characters we like because is your opinion.

Just try to respect, you can hurt other peoples feelings the way you say things.

I mean, you are just being offensive. That's what I feel about your posts. And I see that, everyone does feels the same way.

There is a big difference between being offensive and critic, and you are really not being a good critic.

 

[KingMickeyMouse]

Man you really havent learn. If you are going to criticize offensively characters we love here,

I genuinely don’t care if criticising your fictitious waifus and onichans is offensive to you. There are no rules on this forum against that (as I’ve confirmed with the moderators), so I will continue to express my opinions as thoroughly as I can.

you should at least show reasons, instead of saying bad things about characters we like because is your opinion.

This isn’t the right topic for that.

Just try to respect, you can hurt other peoples feelings the way you say things.

I can’t respect characters I don’t care for, sorry. You can be hurt by that, that’s your choice, but there’s nothing you or I can do about that.

I mean, you are just being offensive.

Indeed...to the fictitious characters that don’t exist.

That's what I feel about your posts. And I see that, everyone does feels the same way.

You’re literally the first and only person thus far to reply to my comment, lol.

There is a big difference between being offensive and critic, and you are really not being a good critic.

I was; by all universal definition, being a critic. Not offensive. Ficiticious characters can’t be offended. If you are offended by my criticism, then that’s strictly your choice.

 

[Meow Wow]

I genuinely don’t care if criticising your fictitious waifus and onichans is offensive to you. There are no rules on this forum against that (as I’ve confirmed with the moderators), so I will continue to express my opinions as thoroughly as I can.

You're right, you have every right to express your opinions. However we can all have an intelligent discussion about our viewpoints as long as it doesn't get too heated and we respect each other's opinions. You could have provided an explanation and arguments as to why you don't like the original characters and how it can be improved later on in your original response. It would have fitted in perfectly here.

As from what I've seen in other threads. Your writing tone comes off as inflammatory. I don't know if that's what you were intending but tone has wonders in how people will react.

Also, I know this is a little hypocritical from me considering I just fueled a spark but can we please not try to have this thread closed like the others?

 

[DarkGrey Heroine]

Sometimes I feel like the villains want to bore us to death with monologues. None of them feel particularly dangerous.

They need all that time to set the mood right. Especially Mansex needs all that time to build sexual tension between him and the player. Feeling dangerous was never their goal, being unbearably sexy is. They mostly fail miserably though, and this is my biggest problem with KH. In this essay I will..

 

[KingMickeyMouse]

You're right, you have every right to express your opinions. However we can all have an intelligent discussion about our viewpoints as long as it doesn't get too heated and we respect each other's opinions. You could have provided an explanation and arguments as to why you don't like the original characters and how it can be improved later on in your original response. It would have fitted in perfectly here.

I did provide an explanation: they’re “boring, generic, cliche anime trash”.

I say they’re boring because they have no depth or tangible dilemmas/characterisation. You can’t improve characters that are fundamentally terribly written. I haven’t seen one example of a character that was established abysmally and then went on to become a great character. It just doesn’t happen.

As from what I've seen in other threads. Your writing tone comes off as inflammatory. I don't know if that's what you were intending but tone has wonders in how people will react.

How is my writing tone inflammatory, exactly?

Also, I know this is a little hypocritical from me considering I just fueled a spark but can we please not try to have this thread closed like the others?

I don’t feel you fuelled a spark at all. It’s up to the mods to choose wether to close down threads, not us.

 

[MrFranklin95]

*sigh*

Look, I don't want to do this song and dance again because I got a warning for it, which I'll admit, I had it coming (I still don't regret saying it) for the way I responded to you because I have basically zero tolerance for disrespectful behavior no matter if it's someone's opinion. But I can't be hypocritical when it comes to this, especially with the rules on this forum that we all have to follow. So, I'll just say this.

Everyone can have an opinion and no opinion is right or wrong. What I have a problem with is the insults that you blatantly ignore when you get called out for it and being way too stubborn about it. Especially the "weeboo" comments which are uncalled for and makes it seem like anyone who has the opinion of liking these characters doesn't have a leg to stand on and are lesser in critical thinking in your eyes. You may not have that intention but you definately come across that way. I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion but please, try to at least be less hostile about it with your language, behavior, and how you present your opinion. Using phrases like "weeboo" and "anime trash" does not help your case and makes people not want to engage in any genuine conversation with you. I've had many discussion with people who don't like certain characters and they are way less hostile then you are because we understand it's all just opinions, not facts. You keep saying it's just your opinion but you keep presenting them as facts and using gross language that comes off very insulting. No, not to fictional characters but to the people who may like those characters and want to have a discussion as to why they disagree. But they can't do that if you continue behaving the way you do, as if you don't want a discussion at all and just want to spout your opinion in the most harsh way possible.

That's all I'll say on the matter. Let's not derailed the thread any further for the sake of healthy discussion.

 

[Luminary]

Every single original KH character (with the exception of Sora) is generic, boring, cliche anime trash and the writers keep shoving them in our faces even though they have complete access to the Disney vault; filled some of the most iconic and loveable characters ever created — and they opted to make them filler instead. Guess their weaboo tendencies just keep getting the better of their creative and artistic integrity...

Kingdom Hearts is just objectively incompetent in terms of storytelling, basically.

You’re actually incorrect about Square Enix’s freedom with using Disney characters. It has been stated since the conception of the series that Disney places restrictions on how SE can use their properties. For example, this is why Mickey was only in one scene of KH1. At E3 this year, Nomura said that these restrictions are even tighter now than ever before. Particularly with the film characters, they aren’t really able to build the original story of the game around those characters because Disney wants to keep those characters under a certain status quo.

The game is a Disney/Square Enix crossover. If you don’t like JRPG-style characters, there are plenty of other Disney games you can play like Epic Mickey, Disney Infinity, or tie-in games like LEGO Incredibles. Maybe those would be more enjoyable for you? It is ok if you don’t like the concept of this series, but that is your subjective opinion that most people on this site are not going to agree with. For the majority of KH fans, the Disney worlds being connected by JRPG mythos and characters is what makes this series special. Without them, it would just be another Disney tie-in game. Even if you kept Sora, he wouldn’t be near as special because he wouldn’t have his lifelong friends that he is fighting for.

If you still choose to play KH3, you should know that they are not going to change the Disney/Square Enix crossover elements and you shouldn’t expect them too. That is the core DNA of the game’s story. If people did not enjoy it, we wouldn’t even be getting KH3. It’s noteworthy that a crossover franchise like Disney Infinity was canceled while KH is thriving 16 years in.

In KH3, almost every original character will be returning to finish up their arcs as the game completes 16 years worth of story surrounding these characters, so you might want to mentally prepare yourself for that if you opt to play it. That said, I do hope the Disney worlds will feel more integral to the overall plot rather than being one-off adventures. The current trailers suggest this will be the case. Maybe there will at least be enough balance for you to have an overall positive experience.

 

[KingMickeyMouse]

Everyone can have an opinion and no opinion is right or wrong. What I have a problem with is the insults that you blatantly ignore when you get called out for it and being way too stubborn about it. Especially the "weeboo" comments which are uncalled for and makes it seem like anyone who has the opinion of liking these characters doesn't have a leg to stand on and are lesser in critical thinking in your eyes.

I didn’t call a single person on this forum a ”weaboo”, so...not really sure what your point was there.

You may not have that intention but you definately come across that way. I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion but please, try to at least be less hostile about it with your language, behavior, and how you present your opinion. Using phrases like "weeboo" and "anime trash" does not help your case and makes people not want to engage in any genuine conversation with you.

I don’t get it. What’s the distinction between calling them trash and “anime trash”?

I refer to them as anime trash because they conform to every single anime character trope and cliche.

I've had many discussion with people who don't like certain characters and they are way less hostile then you are because we understand it's all just opinions, not facts. You keep saying it's just your opinion but you keep presenting them as facts and using gross language that comes off very insulting.

Does it matter if I present them as facts?

Clearly it’s meant as a hyperbole to illustrate my point. None of this is factual anyway. It’s all subjective.

No, not to fictional characters but to the people who may like those characters and want to have a discussion as to why they disagree. But they can't do that if you continue behaving the way you do, as if you don't want a discussion at all and just want to spout your opinion in the most harsh way possible.

I mean, no one actually refuted what I said. One person expressed how they were “offended” but I didn’t see anyone develop a rebuttal or say “hey, actually I think Riku is fine because...” — so again, why would there be a discussion if no one shows any interest in that?

 

[KingMickeyMouse]

You’re actually incorrect about Square Enix’s freedom with using Disney characters. It has been stated since the conception of the series that Disney places restrictions on how SE can use their properties. For example, this is why Mickey was only in one scene of KH1. At E3 this year, Nomura said that these restrictions are even tighter now than ever before. Particularly with the film characters, they aren’t really able to build the original story of the game around those characters because Disney wants to keep those characters under a certain status quo.

I’m pretty sure Disney aren’t the ones forcing the SE guys to keep shoving their original characters down our throats...

Even a world like Toy Story which is completely original and canon to Disney has to be riddled with Org 13 nonsense...

As I understand it; the rules are that no Disney characters can cross over with each other (besides Mickey, Donald & Goofy) and that each Disney World has to make sense within the context of their stories at that particular point in their chronology.

Otherwise, Nomura has expressed frequently how much freedom they have with those properties besides some of the newer Disney movies that still have their original creators working on them.

The game is a Disney/Square Enix crossover. If you don’t like JRPG-style characters,

I do.

Love them. Some of my favourite characters are from JRPGs.

there are plenty of other Disney games you can play like Epic Mickey, Disney Infinity, or tie-in games like LEGO Incredibles.

Yes the tie-in Lego game can go toe-to-toe with a AAA 70-hour RPG.

To further illustrate how weak your argument was; there has not been a single Toy Story game on the market in the last 8 years. And how many anime-style JRPGs have we had since then?

Maybe those would be more enjoyable for you? It is ok if you don’t like the concept of this series, but that is your subjective opinion that most people on this site are not going to agree with. For the majority of KH fans, the Disney worlds being connected by JRPG mythos and characters is what makes this series special.

Same here.

I loved the JRPG references in the KH3 Toy Story demo. That’s the reason I’m most excited for the game.

It’s the terrible implementation of that balance of the series since the spin-off games that’s the issue.

If you still choose to play KH3, you should know that they are not going to change the Disney/Square Enix crossover elements and you shouldn’t expect them too. That is the core DNA of the game’s story. If people did not enjoy it, we wouldn’t even be getting KH3. It’s noteworthy that a crossover franchise like Disney Infinity was canceled while KH is thriving 16 years in.

Probably because Disney Infinity was just adevrtisement for toys and not a full-fledged RPG?

In KH3, almost every original character will be returning to finish up their arcs as the game completes 16 years worth of story surrounding these characters, so you might want to mentally prepare yourself for that if you opt to play it.

You got an early copy of the game?

That’s crazy.

That said, I do hope the Disney worlds will feel more integral to the overall plot rather than being one-off adventures. The current trailers suggest this will be the case. Maybe there will at least be enough balance for you to have an overall positive experience.

That’s literally my entire point.

I want the 50/50 balance back from KH1 & KH2.