Nobodies

[shadowred3]

ok peoples shadow here and yes im confused about something again. nobodys are born when someone witha strong heart turns into a heartless right? and then the BODY turns into a nobody right? so then when kiari lost here heart why did her body stay? shouldnt it have become namine? could this mean namine isnt kiaris direct nobody?. and also you need a storng heart right? kiaris heart isnt strong! there must be a mixtake!!!

 

[Malevolence]

Re: nobodys

Namine is a special Nobody. She was created when Kairi's heart hid within Sora's and released when Sora decided to do the kamikaze maneuver on himself. That's why she had power over Sora's memories. Because she was created from his heart.

 

[Key of Valor]

Re: nobodys

Yeah, there's are a lot of theories about
how Namine was born or what she is.

I personally support Ansem's theory
about Namine being composed of
Sora's vessel, and being born as a
result of both Sora and Kairi's heart
departing Sora's vessel when he
became a Heartless.

 

[shadowred3]

Re: nobodys

so wait namine only has power over soras memories? then how she crush the riku replicas heart?

 

[Malevolence]

Re: nobodys

His theory is correct obviously.

 

[OneWingedAngel45]

Re: nobodys

so wait namine only has power over soras memories? then how she crush the riku replicas heart?

I think is was because he was created from Sora's memories so Namine had power over him. Am I right?

 

[Muse]

Re: nobodys

I believe what was said was that Namine has powers over Sora's memories and the memories of those close to him. Seeing as Repliku was a replica of Riku, it would technically have been 'close' to Sora, so she would have been able to do that to him.

Or something.

 

[Smile]

Re: nobodys

Body and soul, yes.

so then when kiari lost here heart why did her body stay? shouldnt it have become namine?

Nope, because Kairi is a PoH. She as far as we know, her Body - due to her Heart not having became a Heartless - was never cast off into the Darkness and thus never became a Nobody (until Xion'll possibly rebunk this).

could this mean namine isnt kiaris direct nobody?

She's much more Sora's Nobody than Kairi's in that aspect, seeing how even Nomura confirmed her existence was made possible by Sora.

and also you need a storng heart right? kiaris heart isnt strong! there must be a mixtake!!!

1) <3
2) see, that's the thing though, Kairi's Body and Soul didn't become a Nobody. Sora's did - it became Roxas. Kairi's Heart leaving that same Body+Soul on its way to becoming a Nobody made for a by-product based on Kairi's Sense of Self - being Namine. Another reason why Namine is all but nothing, possibly - because the Heart she was based on wasn't truly strong enough to sustain a Nobody (though they could always shrug it off with Kairi's Pure-Heartness making up for it).

 

[Key of Valor]

Re: nobodys

I think is was because he was created from Sora's memories so Namine had power over him. Am I right?

Possibly,
Namine's powers and the existance of Riku Replica have always
been complicated subjects with no definite explaination.

Personally I think Namine has power over memories in
general. She can't alter memories of those whose hearts
aren't connected to Sora. Riku Replica's heart though
wasn't real so maybe her general memory power could
still influence his fake memory.

 

[Choc]

Re: nobodys

I think is was because he was created from Sora's memories so Namine had power over him. Am I right?

Personally I think Namine has power over memories in
general. She can't alter memories of those whose hearts
aren't connected to Sora. Riku Replica's heart though
wasn't real so maybe her general memory power could
still influence his fake memory.

Didn't Namine also change (or in this case create) the same fake memories for the Repliku? As in she made it so he thought he had made a promise to her on Destiny Islands too, as well making a paopu fruit charm out of a card? It was in the RR scene where the Repliku was first introduced to Larxene and Axel and Larxene convinces Vexen to have Repliku's memories altered.
I know it doesn't explain how Namine had power to change his memories but it explains how she was able to crush his heart.

 

[Smile]

Re: nobodys

Repliku = Replica of Riku. It would make sense even if Namine really is that much Sora-specific in power that she'd have some control over him.
Throw in the fact they were performing experiments in general and it fits, even with them rewriting Repliku's memories at one point.

 

[OneWingedAngel45]

Re: nobodys

Repliku = Replica of Riku. It would make sense even if Namine really is that much Sora-specific in power that she'd have some control over him.
Throw in the fact they were performing experiments in general and it fits, even with them rewriting Repliku's memories at one point.

Nicely said SA.

 

[shadowred3]

Re: nobodys

so then namine is like a sora + kairi nobody? then could xion be kairis real nobody?

 

[Key of Valor]

Re: nobodys

Well Kairi never left her vessel behind to become a Nobody,
so if Xion is somehow Kairi's Nobody, it would need to obtain
a vessel from another source like how Namine used Sora's
to come into existence... or Xion's vessel would need to
have a valid reason to materialize on its own.

About Namine having Sora's vessel though...
this may or may not be the case, a lot of people
would theorize differently, though I personally do
support Ansem's theory.

One thing to consider though might be this:

If Namine is composed of Sora's vessel... then what is
Roxas composed of? It's not like Roxas' vessel vaguely
resembles anyone other than Sora... (except for maybe
Ven, lol)

 

[Smile]

Re: nobodys

so then namine is like a sora + kairi nobody?

Born when Sora turned himself into a Heartless, thus creating a Nobody. Kairi's Heart also leaving his Body made for Namine to be born as a by-product.

then could xion be kairis real nobody?

If we say she was born on the night of the storm (when Kairi's Heart moved into Sora's Body), then yes.

Well Kairi never left her vessel behind to become a Nobody

Only she did leave her vessel. The B+S themselves might not have became Xion, but seeing how Sora's B+S didn't become Namine yet Namine is still around, it's possible.

it would need to obtain
a vessel from another source like how Namine used Sora's
to come into existence...

This exactly. Namine has no vessel; one could argue Xion wouldn't need one either so long as a Heart left a Body at all and Darkness had to do with it - as was the matter when the Islands disappeared.

About Namine having Sora's vessel though...
this may or may not be the case, a lot of people
would theorize differently, though I personally do
support Ansem's theory.

only had that been AtW's theory, he wouldn't have wanted to kill her. and she wouldn't have returned to Kairi. two facts you keep ignoring. I don't know why I even bother with you, and this has nothing to do with how one sees the SARs.

If Namine is composed of Sora's vessel...

She's not.

 

[Key of Valor]

Re: nobodys

Then we shall continue our debate here, SA.

only had that been AtW's theory, he wouldn't have wanted to kill her.

Ansem the Wise gave no sympathy to Nobodies,
he was a logical man who was aware that they
were empty beings who couldn't really feel anything.
He regarded a Nobody's existance in itself with no
value. Namine was of use to him but she served
her purpose in restoring Sora's memories, and
now Ansem had no further use for her, which is
why he wanted Riku to get rid of her.

and she wouldn't have returned to Kairi.

Namine had to return to her original self or
else she would have disappeared completely.

In conclusion, my logic prevails.

 

[WilliamTheWise]

Re: nobodys

Ansem the Wise gave no sympathy to Nobodies,
he was a logical man who was aware that they
were empty beings who couldn't really feel anything.
He regarded a Nobody's existance in itself with no
value. Namine was of use to him but she served
her purpose in restoring Sora's memories, and
now Ansem had no further use for her, which is
why he wanted Riku to get rid of her.

Seeing how ATW apologized to Roxas before he "died" he did regret causing him pain so he could get revenge.

 

[Audo]

Re: nobodys

Ansem the Wise is soooooo not a logical man.
He is a man driven by revenge and hates anything and everything that reminds him of how he lost everything. Being Nobodies. Logical, he isn't. He was overrun by thoughts of revenge.

 

[Key of Valor]

Re: nobodys

Indeed, in Ansems (maybe) last moments
he felt regret for his cold nature and for
what he did to Roxas.

 

[Audo]

Re: nobodys

Ansem the Wise is a bit of a douche. Roxas didn't need to be apologized, Roxas got what he wanted. He SHOULD have apologized to Naminé if anyone.