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Phoenix

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Again, you forget that "theory" is different than "scientific theory". A scientific theory tries to explain, with proof, how an event happens. Do you think anybody in the scientific community doubts things evolve? No. They debate and debate *how* things evolve.

In short, they debate the theory of evolution. Not evolution.

They debate the theory of the Big Bang. Not the Big Bang.

They debate the theory of global warming. Not global warming.

They debate the theory of relativity. Not relativity.


That's as simple as I can put it. There are many scientists who believe differently about evolution, but they doubt it as much as they doubt gravity.
 

Dogenzaka

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Do you think anybody in the scientific community doubts things evolve? No.

It's debated. There are scientists who don't believe it as fact.

Once again, evolution isn't fact, it's an explanation to how things perhaps happened, using evidence. We still can't go back in time and play everything fast-forwarded to see how it happened =/
 

Phoenix

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It's debated. There are scientists who don't believe it as fact.

5% out of all the scientists don't believe in it, and those scientists are basically engineers, people who don't go near Biology.

Find me a biologist with a worthwhile reputation that doesn't believe in it. Or any biologist whose arguments haven't been destroyed in the past 20 years.

Because when you take the opinion of someone who hates Biology over the opinion of someone who's life is Biology, then you are close-minded as hell.

Once again, evolution isn't fact, it's an explanation to how things perhaps happened, using evidence. We still can't go back in time and play everything fast-forwarded to see how it happened =/

Again, nope. It's not a perhaps happened anymore than an Ice Age perhaps happened, or meteors have perhaps hit the Earth, or erosion has perhaps created cliffs.

Just because we haven't seen them directly doesn't mean they're not as clear as day.
 

square-enix

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Why would we need eyes like octopi again? We don't live in the murky waters of the ocean and where light is hard to reach.
...and? The fact reminds that there are seven layers of cells before the light sensing ones. We also have the muscles that let us wiggle our ears, the appendix, nipples and mammary glands which are all left overs from our ancestors.
I don't see how single-celled organisms billions of years ago simply evolved "eyes" anyway if they didn't need them to survive prior. It had nothing to do with survival, as they were surviving just fine. Eyes weren't mutated out of nowhere.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_life
It's debated.
On how it happens, not if it did.
There are scientists who don't believe it as fact.
Link? Proof?
Once again, evolution isn't fact,
It is. Provide evidence if you wish to contradict accepted fact.
We still can't go back in time and play everything fast-forwarded to see how it happened =/
Then you're also saying we can't prove murder cases.
"The Detective came after the crime so he can't prove it."
 

Dogenzaka

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Again, nope. It's not a perhaps happened anymore than an Ice Age perhaps happened, or meteors have perhaps hit the Earth, or erosion has perhaps created cliffs.

Just because we haven't seen them directly doesn't mean they're not as clear as day.

Actually yes. You nor anyone today has written records of anything seen past a few thousand years before B.C., let alone have you lived before 1900. You have no ideas if animals all looked the same 3 billion years ago, nor if the animals that lived back then died of extinction rather than forming other creatures. It could have very well been there were creatures back then, but that doesn't mean that because they're not here today that we are the evolutions of them. It could simply mean they became extinct. Just because an animal has similar structure doesn't mean it = that animal or once was it. All the mammals have similar skeletons, that doesn't mean that we = eachother. We're different. It doesn't confirm that we came from their prevolved ancestors. Evolution is a theory to how it happened. Fossils can SUPPORT this evidence, fauna can SUPPORT this evidence, but it can not prove it, understand? Unless you get a time machine, you can't prove evolution is a 100% confirmed fact. Just because you have fossils of dead creatures, or that mammals today seem to have similar structures, does not mean that we evolved from them. It doesn't have to be that way. It's a thought, a theory, sure it could have happened, but it's not 100% proven. You need to understand the logic of TIME. No one lives to tell the tale of the creatures back then. Just because there were dinosaurs does not mean we evolved from them, it could simply mean they DIED OUT and we never did or weren't there back then.

Then you're also saying we can't prove murder cases.
"The Detective came after the crime so he can't prove it."

And yet, murder cases are solved with witnesses, testimonies, victims as well.

Link? Proof?

"Throughout the past century there has always existed a significant minority of first-rate biologists who have never been able to bring themselves to accept the validity of Darwinian claims. In fact, the number of biologists who have expressed some degree of disillusionment is practically endless."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis, p. 327.

"I can envision observations and experiments that would disprove any evolutionary theory I know."—*Stephen Jay Gould, "Evolution as Fact and Theory," Discover 2(5):34-37

It is. Provide evidence if you wish to contradict accepted fact.

You can prove something you weren't there to witness?

1 - This is the evolutionary formula for making a universe:

Nothing + nothing = two elements + time = 92 natural elements + time = all physical laws and a completely structured universe of galaxies, systems, stars, planets, and moons orbiting in perfect balance and order.

2 - This is the evolutionary formula for making life:

Dirt + water + time = living creatures.

Evolutionists theorize that the above two formulas can enable everything about us to make itself—with the exception of man-made things, such as automobiles or buildings. Complicated things, such as wooden boxes with nails in them, require thought, intelligence, and careful workmanship. But everything else about us in nature (such as hummingbirds and the human eye) is declared to be the result of accidental mishaps, random confusion, and time. You will not even need raw materials to begin with. They make themselves too.

How did all this nonsense get started? We will begin this paperback with a brief overview of the modern history of evolutionary theory.


But let us not forget that, though it may be nonsensical, evolutionary theory has greatly affected—and damaged—mankind in the 20th century. Will we continue to let this happen, now that we are in the 21st century? The social and moral impact that evolutionary concepts have had on the modern world has been terrific.

Morality and ethical standards have been greatly reduced. Children and youth are taught in school that they are an advanced level of animals; there are no moral principles. Since they are just animals, they should do whatever they want. Personal survival and success will come only by rivalry, strife, and stepping on others.

Here is a brief overview of some of the people and events in the history of modern evolutionary theory. But it is only a glimpse.

Only a few items are listed in this chapter, but they are enough to provide you with a nice entry point to the rest of this paperback. Keep in mind that you can look in the Index, at the back of this paperback, and frequently find still more information on a given subject ("Linnaeus," "Thermodynamics," "Guadeloupe Woman," "Mendel," etc.).

Prior to the middle of the 1800s, scientists were researchers who firmly believed that all nature was made by a Master Designer. Those pioneers who laid the foundations of modern science were creationists. They were men of giant intellect who struggled against great odds in carrying on their work. They were hard-working researchers.

In contrast, the philosophers sat around, hardly stirring from their armchairs and theorized about everything while the scientists, ignoring them, kept at their work.

But a change came about in the 19th century, when the philosophers tried to gain control of scientific endeavor and suppress research and findings that would be unfavorable to their theories. Today’s evolutionists vigorously defend the unscientific theories they thought up over a century ago.

William Paley (1743-1805), in his 1802 classic, Natural Theology, summarized the viewpoint of the scientists.

He argued that the kind of carefully designed structures we see in the living world point clearly to a Designer. If we see a watch, we know that it had a designer and maker; it would be foolish to imagine that it made itself. This is the "argument by design." All about us is the world of nature, and over our heads at night is a universe of stars. We can ignore or ridicule what is there or say it all made itself, but our scoffing does not change the reality of the situation. A leading atheistic scientist of our time, *Fred Hoyle, wrote that, although it was not difficult to disprove Darwinism, what Paley had to say appeared likely to be unanswerable (*Fred Hoyle and *Chandra Wickramasinghe, Evolution from Space, 1981, p. 96).

It is a remarkable fact that the basis of evolutionary theory was destroyed by seven scientific research findings,—before *Charles Darwin first published the theory.

Carl Linn (Carolus Linnaeus, 1707-1778) was a scientist who classified immense numbers of living organisms. An earnest creationist, he clearly saw that there were no halfway species. All plant and animal species were definite categories, separate from one another. Variation was possible within a species, and there were many sub-species. But there were no cross-overs from one species to another (*R. Milner, Encyclopedia of Evolution, 1990, p. 276).

First Law of Thermodynamics (1847). Heinrich von Helmholtz stated the law of conservation of energy: The sum total of all matter will always remain the same. This law refutes several aspects of evolutionary theory. *Isaac Asimov calls it "the most fundamental generalization about the universe that scientists have ever been able to make" (*Isaac Asimov, "In the Game of Energy and Thermodynamics You Can’t Even Break Even," Journal of Smithsonian Institute, June 1970, p. 6).

Second Law of Thermodynamics (1850). R.J.E. Clausius stated the law of entropy: All systems will tend toward the most mathematically probable state, and eventually become totally random and disorganized (*Harold Blum, Time’s Arrow and Evolution, 1968, p. 201). In other words, everything runs down, wears out, and goes to pieces (*R.R. Kindsay, "Physics: to What Extent is it Deterministic," American Scientist 56, 1968, p. 100). This law totally eliminates the basic evolutionary theory that simple evolves into complex. *Einstein said the two laws were the most enduring laws he knew of (*Jeremy Rifkin, Entropy: A New World View, 1980, p. 6).

Guadeloupe Woman Found (1812). This is a well-authenticated discovery which has been in the British Museum for over a century. A fully modern human skeleton was found in the French Caribbean island of Guadeloupe inside an immense slab of limestone, dated by modern geologists at 28 million years old. (More examples could be cited.) Human beings, just like those living today (but sometimes larger), have been found in very deep levels of strata.

Gregor Mendel (1822-1884) was a creationist who lived and worked near Brunn (now Brno), Czechoslovakia. He was a science and math teacher. Unlike the theorists, Mendel was a true scientist. He bred garden peas and studied the results of crossing various varieties. Beginning his work in 1856, he concluded it within eight years. In 1865, he reported his research in the Journal of the Brunn Society for the Study of Natural Science. The journal was distributed to 120 libraries in Europe, England, and America. Yet his research was totally ignored by the scientific community until it was rediscovered in 1900 (*R.A. Fisher, "Has Mendel’s Work Been Rediscovered?" Annals of Science, Vol. 1, No. 2, 1936). His experiments clearly showed that one species could not transmute into another one. A genetic barrier existed that could not be bridged. Mendel’s work laid the basis for modern genetics, and his discoveries effectively destroyed the basis for species evolution (*Michael Pitman, Adam and Evolution, 1984, pp. 63-64).

Louis Pasteur (1822-1895) was another genuine scientist. In the process of studying fermentation, he performed his famous 1861 experiment, in which he disproved the theory of spontaneous generation. Life cannot arise from non-living materials. This experiment was very important; for, up to that time, a majority of scientists believed in spontaneous generation. (They thought that if a pile of old clothes were left in a corner, it would breed mice! The proof was that, upon later returning to the clothes, mice would frequently be found there.) Pasteur concluded from his experiment that only God could create living creatures. But modern evolutionary theory continues to be based on that out-dated theory disproved by Pasteur: spontaneous generation (life arises from non-life). Why? Because it is the only basis on which evolution could occur. As *Adams notes, "With spontaneous generation discredited [by Pasteur], biologists were left with no theory of the origin of life at all" (*J. Edison Adams, Plants: An Introduction to Modern Biology, 1967, p. 585).

August Friedrich Leopold Weismann (1834-1914) was a German biologist who disproved *Lamarck’s notion of "the inheritance of acquired characteristics." He is primarily remembered as the scientist who cut off the tails of 901 young white mice in 19 successive generations, yet each new generation was born with a full-length tail. The final generation, he reported, had tails as long as those originally measured on the first. Weismann also carried out other experiments that buttressed his refutation of Lamarckism. His discoveries, along with the fact that circumcision of Jewish males for 4,000 years had not affected the foreskin, doomed the theory (*Jean Rostand, Orion Book of Evolution, 1960, p. 64). Yet Lamarckism continues today as the disguised basis of evolutionary biology. For example, evolutionists still teach that giraffes kept

stretching their necks to reach higher branches, so their necks became longer! In a later book, *Darwin abandoned natural selection as unworkable, and returned to Lamarckism as the cause of the never-observed change from one species to another (*Randall Hedtke, The Secret of the Sixth Edition, 1984).
 
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Square Ninja

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Evolution is a theory to how it happened. Fossils can SUPPORT this evidence, fauna can SUPPORT this evidence, but it can not prove it, understand? Unless you get a time machine, you can't prove evolution is a 100% confirmed fact. Just because you have fossils of dead creatures, or that mammals today seem to have similar structures, does not mean that we evolved from them. It doesn't have to be that way. It's a thought, a theory, sure it could have happened, but it's not 100% proven. You need to understand the logic of TIME. No one lives to tell the tale of the creatures back then. Just because there were dinosaurs does not mean we evolved from them, it could simply mean they DIED OUT and we never did or weren't there back then.

Electormagnetism can't be 100% proven, nor can we fully comphrehend it. Does that mean we should be building devices based off the scientific theory? Hell, the most commonly known law of the universe, gravity, is the most enigmatic of all the laws. Should we simply discard it because we don't know every facet of it?

How about we take a look physiology? Virtually all our medical science today is based off of Evolutionary Theory. I guess since it's "only a theory" we should stop developing cures for diseases and stop using all medicines and treatments. Does your grandmother have diabetes? Whoops, I guess she doesn't get her insulin doses anymore. Congratulation, you've just killed off Granny. How about cancer patients? I guess they don't get their chemotherapy. We can't risk them living, because we don't know everything about cancer, and what we do know is based off of Evolutionary Theory. The only thing absolute about science is that isn't absolute. That's why we still have scientists researching today. Just because you don't understand conic sections doesn't mean you stop doing mathematics.

I have a genetic disorder that causes my colon to literally tear itself apart. If my condition went untreated I would be shitting blood and likely would get a nasty infection which would slowly and painfully kill me. I think I'll take my chances with "just a theory" and subject myself to the treatments, even though current scientist know very little about the disorder.


You can prove something you weren't there to witness?

Oh, and you've witnessed anti-matter being created? No? Really? Huh...I guess that means anti-matter doesn't exist...even thought it was scientifically proven and the samples remain in a lab.

1 - This is the evolutionary formula for making a universe:

Nothing + nothing = two elements + time = 92 natural elements + time = all physical laws and a completely structured universe of galaxies, systems, stars, planets, and moons orbiting in perfect balance and order.

2 - This is the evolutionary formula for making life:

Dirt + water + time = living creatures.

Evolutionists theorize that the above two formulas can enable everything about us to make itself—with the exception of man-made things, such as automobiles or buildings. Complicated things, such as wooden boxes with nails in them, require thought, intelligence, and careful workmanship. But everything else about us in nature (such as hummingbirds and the human eye) is declared to be the result of accidental mishaps, random confusion, and time. You will not even need raw materials to begin with. They make themselves too.

I must have missed that day in Biology, because I never remember Evolutionary Theory mentioning anything about how life was created. Last time I checked, Evolution only dealt with how creatures adapted to survive.

But let us not forget that, though it may be nonsensical, evolutionary theory has greatly affected—and damaged—mankind in the 20th century. Will we continue to let this happen, now that we are in the 21st century? The social and moral impact that evolutionary concepts have had on the modern world has been terrific.

Morality and ethical standards have been greatly reduced. Children and youth are taught in school that they are an advanced level of animals; there are no moral principles. Since they are just animals, they should do whatever they want. Personal survival and success will come only by rivalry, strife, and stepping on others.

One look at the second paragraph is enough to toss all credibility of this argument out the window. Clearly this was composed by some Christian feeling threatened that his faith was somehow undermined because of some technicality that has nothing to do with the faith itself. The idea that Evolution discards all morals is ridiculous. We are indeed animals, but we have high enough thought processes capable of constructing morals. We can think on a greater scale and scope than a simple chimpanzee. So yeah...argument completely destroyed. Next.
 

Phoenix

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And building on what SN said, Dogen please, *do* try to understand the difference between evolution, abiogenesis and the Big Bang. They're 3 very different things, and you can believe one without believing in the other two.
 

square-enix

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And yet, murder cases are solved with witnesses, testimonies, victims as well.
And evolution is proven through Paleontology (fossils), Distribution of Animals and Plants, Comparative Anatomy, Embryology, Vestigial Organs, Natural Selection, Sexual Selection, Genetics and Molecular Biology
"Throughout the past century there has always existed a significant minority of first-rate biologists who have never been able to bring themselves to accept the validity of Darwinian claims. In fact, the number of biologists who have expressed some degree of disillusionment is practically endless."—*Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis, p. 327.
And have these no name ‘first-rate’ biologist ever provided proof to support their supposed claims, and the words of a believer in ID?
"I can envision observations and experiments that would disprove any evolutionary theory I know."—*Stephen Jay Gould, "Evolution as Fact and Theory," Discover 2(5):34-37
I can envision little pink rabbits getting slaughtered but that does not make it so.
You can prove something you weren't there to witness?
As much I can car accidents and murder cases.
The rest is moot but I feel inclined to contradict these ‘contradictions’
1 - This is the evolutionary formula for making a universe:

Nothing + nothing = two elements + time = 92 natural elements + time = all physical laws and a completely structured universe of galaxies, systems, stars, planets, and moons orbiting in perfect balance and order.
1 – This is the Big Bang formula for making a universe:
Expansion of matter and energy at an immense temperature and density. Matter is composed of elements, so they have always existed just as energy.
2 - This is the evolutionary formula for making life:

Dirt + water + time = living creatures.
Miller’s experiment And it's supposed to be 'Origin of Life theory'. There's a difference.
Evolutionists theorize that the above two formulas can enable everything about us to make itself
Despite the fact that these two formulas were not labeled correctly nor given the correct formulas.
You will not even need raw materials to begin with.
We started off with Earth’s fluctuating axis of rotation, acidic atmosphere, and oceans. (Big Bang impied)
The social and moral impact that evolutionary concepts have had on the modern world has been terrific. Morality and ethical standards have been greatly reduced.
O really?
Children and youth are taught in school that they are an advanced level of animals; there are no moral principles. Since they are just animals, they should do whatever they want. Personal survival and success will come only by rivalry, strife, and stepping on others.
Ah, yes I recall the time my biology teacher told me burn the school down.
Prior to the middle of the 1800s, scientists were researchers who firmly believed that all nature was made by a Master Designer. Those pioneers who laid the foundations of modern science were creationists. They were men of giant intellect who struggled against great odds in carrying on their work. They were hard-working researchers.

In contrast, the philosophers sat around, hardly stirring from their armchairs and theorized about everything while the scientists, ignoring them, kept at their work.

But a change came about in the 19th century, when the philosophers tried to gain control of scientific endeavor and suppress research and findings that would be unfavorable to their theories. Today’s evolutionists vigorously defend the unscientific theories they thought up over a century ago.
Those that have contributed to modern science were mostly all philosophers.
He argued that the kind of carefully designed structures we see in the living world point clearly to a Designer. If we see a watch, we know that it had a designer and maker; it would be foolish to imagine that it made itself. This is the "argument by design."
By that logic, the designer of the watchmaker would also require a designer. In turn, that designer would require a designer of greater intellect, and so forth. It gets you no where.
say it all made itself
Why not?
Carl Linn (Carolus Linnaeus, 1707-1778) was a scientist who classified immense numbers of living organisms. An earnest creationist, he clearly saw that there were no halfway species. All plant and animal species were definite categories, separate from one another. Variation was possible within a species, and there were many sub-species. But there were no cross-overs from one species to another (*R. Milner, Encyclopedia of Evolution, 1990, p. 276).
Genetics say otherwise
First Law of Thermodynamics (1847). Heinrich von Helmholtz stated the law of conservation of energy: The sum total of all matter will always remain the same. This law refutes several aspects of evolutionary theory. *Isaac Asimov calls it "the most fundamental generalization about the universe that scientists have ever been able to make" (*Isaac Asimov, "In the Game of Energy and Thermodynamics You Can’t Even Break Even," Journal of Smithsonian Institute, June 1970, p. 6).
This particular law only applies to conversation of energy in thermodynamic (heat producing) systems.
Second Law of Thermodynamics (1850). R.J.E. Clausius stated the law of entropy: All systems will tend toward the most mathematically probable state, and eventually become totally random and disorganized (*Harold Blum, Time’s Arrow and Evolution, 1968, p. 201). In other words, everything runs down, wears out, and goes to pieces (*R.R. Kindsay, "Physics: to What Extent is it Deterministic," American Scientist 56, 1968, p. 100). This law totally eliminates the basic evolutionary theory that simple evolves into complex. *Einstein said the two laws were the most enduring laws he knew of (*Jeremy Rifkin, Entropy: A New World View, 1980, p. 6).
In a closed space, a system will tend toward disorder. However, it does not apply to the Earth, because we live in an open system with energy constantly streaming in from our sun. This is the energy that powers almost all life on our planet. Thus the 2nd law of thermodynamics does not apply to evolution or any living being.
Gregor Mendel (1822-1884) was a creationist who lived and worked near Brunn (now Brno), Czechoslovakia. He was a science and math teacher. Unlike the theorists, Mendel was a true scientist. He bred garden peas and studied the results of crossing various varieties. Beginning his work in 1856, he concluded it within eight years. In 1865, he reported his research in the Journal of the Brunn Society for the Study of Natural Science. The journal was distributed to 120 libraries in Europe, England, and America. Yet his research was totally ignored by the scientific community until it was rediscovered in 1900 (*R.A. Fisher, "Has Mendel’s Work Been Rediscovered?" Annals of Science, Vol. 1, No. 2, 1936). His experiments clearly showed that one species could not transmute into another one. A genetic barrier existed that could not be bridged. Mendel’s work laid the basis for modern genetics, and his discoveries effectively destroyed the basis for species evolution (*Michael Pitman, Adam and Evolution, 1984, pp. 63-64).
…Mendel crossed pea plants with pea plants. They resulted in pea plants that had different traits, which is speciation. His work on genetics supports evolution so I don't know what you're on about.
Louis Pasteur (1822-1895) was another genuine scientist. In the process of studying fermentation, he performed his famous 1861 experiment, in which he disproved the theory of spontaneous generation. Life cannot arise from non-living materials. This experiment was very important; for, up to that time, a majority of scientists believed in spontaneous generation. (They thought that if a pile of old clothes were left in a corner, it would breed mice! The proof was that, upon later returning to the clothes, mice would frequently be found there.) Pasteur concluded from his experiment that only God could create living creatures. But modern evolutionary theory continues to be based on that out-dated theory disproved by Pasteur: spontaneous generation (life arises from non-life). Why? Because it is the only basis on which evolution could occur. As *Adams notes, "With spontaneous generation discredited [by Pasteur], biologists were left with no theory of the origin of life at all" (*J. Edison Adams, Plants: An Introduction to Modern Biology, 1967, p. 585).
Because Spontaneous Generation is the only theory about the Origin of Life, right? Pasteur is the one who disproved this theory (somewhat) and in turn supported the cell theory and Darwin with his experiment, but that’s besides the point. What Pasteur said was sometime in the mid 1800s, but it wasn’t till the 1950s that the soup theory arose.
August Friedrich Leopold Weismann (1834-1914) was a German biologist who disproved *Lamarck’s notion of "the inheritance of acquired characteristics." He is primarily remembered as the scientist who cut off the tails of 901 young white mice in 19 successive generations, yet each new generation was born with a full-length tail. The final generation, he reported, had tails as long as those originally measured on the first. Weismann also carried out other experiments that buttressed his refutation of Lamarckism. His discoveries, along with the fact that circumcision of Jewish males for 4,000 years had not affected the foreskin, doomed the theory (*Jean Rostand, Orion Book of Evolution, 1960, p. 64). Yet Lamarckism continues today as the disguised basis of evolutionary biology. Yet Lamarckism continues today as the disguised basis of evolutionary biology.
The basis of evolutionary biology is natural selection (alternative/superior to use and disuse) and genetics
For example, evolutionists still teach that giraffes kept

stretching their necks to reach higher branches, so their necks became longer!
I advise the Christian/IDer that wrote this to pay attention in biology next time.
 

Phoenix

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I too advise for the IDer who wrote that to use arguments that weren't disproven in the 1980's, thank you.

You know what? I'm going to make your life easier, Dogen:

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/list.html

Every time you have an argument against evolution, go here. It'll disprove it, and everybody wins.
 

NIGHTMAREQUEEN

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Maybe thinking that god has always been there isn't so unbelivable or him just making the world I mean who put into are heads the limitations of the world and saying what can be done and what can't be done. When we were younger was it so unbelivable then back when we didn't have people questioning and cutting down are imaginations or criticizing us. I mean do any of us remember what we thought before teachers and fellow people stared telling you this is the world and these are it's boudries and crushing anythought that was scientifically impossiple in the eyes of people.Usually people who think outside the box are outcasted in are society or called crazy.
 

Voltron

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this is what me and my friend say- we would rather live believing in god and end up being wrong than not believeing and end up spending eternity in torment. but thats juss me and my friend not everyone agrees with us
 

Phoenix

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Maybe thinking that god has always been there isn't so unbelivable or him just making the world I mean who put into are heads the limitations of the world and saying what can be done and what can't be done. When we were younger was it so unbelivable then back when we didn't have people questioning and cutting down are imaginations or criticizing us. I mean do any of us remember what we thought before teachers and fellow people stared telling you this is the world and these are it's boudries and crushing anythought that was scientifically impossiple in the eyes of people.Usually people who think outside the box are outcasted in are society or called crazy.

It's not about being impossible or possible, it's about the big events in the Bible should leave buttloads of proof, and there's not such thing, so either:

a. They didn't happen
b. God deleted them

If you pick B, God's a real jerk.

this is what me and my friend say- we would rather live believing in god and end up being wrong than not believeing and end up spending eternity in torment. but thats juss me and my friend not everyone agrees with us

What if the muslim God is the real one? You go to Hell. What if Jesus wasn't the Messiah, and the Jews are right? You're going to Hell.

what if the God that exists is one that puts reason over blind faith? You go to hell. either way, you're playing the lottery because you're afraid.
 

Athletics Legend

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Look,

Im only 12 so this might sound stupid, No one can prove god without a book infulenced by HIMSELF

In the bible, Gods followers write about him and how great he was..
they also say that youshould kill people if they didnt believe in God...so lets say you were born into a family where they didnt believe in God...people would come and kill you...Do you really think that a true god would want that...

And how did God get created....

When we talk about evolution, theres heaps of proof.....

But there are still Religions that believein evolution such as Jain.......I believe in that coz' its got none of that mythological stuff that god talks about..

Jesus was a cool man but a normal man with divine ideas...not a divine man with divine ideas...

If god was so great like they describe he or she in bible...how come he couldnt stop the snake from talkin' to EVE in the first bloody place..

Really, why should we trust a person we havent seen or know what gender he is with our lives...the only reason people believ in him is because they need hope when sumthing bad happens....

If i was you...u take what u think is right.....even if it doesnt have the majority vote on this thread
 

Phoenix

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Sora Blade, you posted that exact same post in another thread. Don't spam.
 

CK the Fat

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Phoenix, do these forums have a maximum signature size? Some of these signatures that take up an entire page length just annoy me...

Anyway, I'm exactly sure how this debate came back to evolution (as there is another thread about that,) but I will state again that evolution is a theory accepted as fact, and despite all the evidence we have supporting it we lack what we really need to PROVE it as completely true, observation over time itself. As stated before, it is possible that similar bone structures does not definitely mean one modern species came from an older one. It is an indication, but without being able to look at the entire animal's chain of fossilized skeletons and observe the subtle differences in a single bloodline, evolution will remain an unproven theory considered fact.
 

xxept0

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Just something my friend told me the other day. Your though of "Where did God come from" was a question... IS a question I constantly struggled with. I confided to my friend about this, and you know what he said?

If you could figure God out, He won't be God anymore. YOU would be.
 

Phoenix

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If you could figure God out, He won't be God anymore. YOU would be.

Except you didn't ask about the nature of God. You merely asked where he came from. This is nothing but a cop-out.
 

CK the Fat

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According to Douglas Adams, the meaning of life is ever found, everything will start again. Which has happened several times already.

Before you say it's all nonsense because it's from a comedic writing, consider the actual possibilities of it.

To know "the meaning of life," or perhaps God or the Ultimate Truth or whatever you call it, means you are superhuman. And if you are superhuman, you aren't human anymore. In a sense you have "died," or "ceased to exist."
 
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