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How come no-one has a clue what's going on anymore?



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Draxem

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Well the re:coded movie was uploaded yesterday and we got a lovely little new secret cutscene featuring Braig (or Xigbar? who fucking knows at this point) and Young Master Xehanort, which can be watched below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXL8Vuv8kSM">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXL8Vuv8kSM" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="350">

The scene is pretty ambiguous, already I've seen a multitude of theories stating Xehanort may not be who we think he is, but that's not for here right now. An interesting thing to note is that Braig is awake, but Isa isn't, but in the cutscene that chronologically follows this one, both Isa and Braig are missing. At this point it's pretty fair to assume Isa isn't really all clued up on what's going on with the Xehanorts. But who can blame him right? I mean Young Master Xehanort knows just as little, and it's pretty apparent Braig doesn't have a clue anymore either. There's even a slight hint that Master Xehanort may be betrayed by one of his own when watching this scene, at this point we now know that both Braig and Young Xehanort are still clamming on a keyblade.

Something I've taken from this above all things is how strange it is that two of MX's closest organisation members don't actually know what's going on, when in Dream Drop Distance everyone seemed so sure of themselves. Does no-one else find that incredibly odd? I think Braig and Young Xehanort are going to play much larger roles in 3, potentially taking on the roles of second and third antagonists, they have hidden agenda's just like Master Xehanort himself, interestingly enough (at this point it's worth noting that they both hold parts of Master Xehanort's heart, even if Young Xehanort's is just his own really).

Another thing that really comes to light with this new cutscene is despite actually being Xehanort, Young Xehanort is not like his other incarnations, he's a separate entity with his own goals and they don't necessarily match his older self's. It adds an interesting new layer to his character in my opinion, he really could go anywhere from here.
 

The_Echo

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I think it's really important, now more than ever, to make sure everyone knows that Nobodies and their Somebodies are not the same character.

What I mean is, in Dream Drop Distance, we see Xigbar, but in this scene, which chronologically takes place during the events of 3D, we see Braig. We know the difference because they look different. So, obviously this is a really strange occurrence. I find it very hard to believe Braig would recomplete only to become a Nobody again.

We also have no idea how Isa is different visually from Saïx. His face is obscured in this scene, probably on purpose.
While Lea calls Saïx "Isa" upon his reveal, 3D's Reports mark them both him and Xigbar with their Nobody names.

With this in mind, I can't help but remember that Young Xehanort is the one responsible for assembling the new Organization.

These new scenes aren't long, but there's a lot to think about.
 

Lnds500

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The scene is pretty ambiguous, already I've seen a multitude of theories stating Xehanort may not be who we think he is, but that's not for here right now. An interesting thing to note is that Braig is awake, but Isa isn't, but in the cutscene that chronologically follows this one, both Isa and Braig are missing.

Do you mean the scene in which the Somebodies wake up? Cause it looks to me like the scene that follows is the one where Braig gets stabbed by Terra-Xehanort.
 

Saken

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The appearance of xigbar in kh3d, in oppose to Braig, is explainable. Quite simply, using ansem as a gateway, xigbar was able to enter the dream world before he was defeated by sora, as those that travel thru ansem could of come from any time.
Perhaps this is done on purpose so that as Braig he is able to carry out with his own plans while xigbar pleases master xehanort's desires. That sounds so creepy sorry :3
 

The_Echo

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Do you mean the scene in which the Somebodies wake up? Cause it looks to me like the scene that follows is the one where Braig gets stabbed by Terra-Xehanort.
When Xehanort stabs Braig, the only others present are Even and Ienzo, already disappearing.

That scene is placed after Birth by Sleep, roughly a year or so since that's when Apprentice Xehanort takes on the name Ansem and loses himself to Darkness.

Also, Nomura said that this scene was before Lea and the others wake up in the Famitsu interview.
Please tell us about the additional cutscenes.

Nomura: There are two new scenes and one of them talks about the Foreteller’s Script from KINGDOM HEARTS chi. Many people have the impression that KINGDOM HEARTS chi is separate from the main series but I wanted to tell you that because this element is in KINGDOM HEARTS HD 2.5 ReMIX, there is a connection and that was my intention. There is another scene that happens before when Lea wakes in KINGDOM HEARTS 3D. As you have these insights and think about a variety of questions and mysteries, please try to use your imagination.
 

Lnds500

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The scene that follows this one is definitely when the somebodies wake up.

When Xehanort stabs Braig, the only others present are Even and Ienzo, already disappearing.

That scene is placed after Birth by Sleep, roughly a year or so since that's when Apprentice Xehanort takes on the name Ansem and loses himself to Darkness.

Also, Nomura said that this scene was before Lea and the others wake up in the Famitsu interview.

I see..

- why did Braig expect to see Xemnas though? the logical thing would be to expect a Somebody. why not Terra-Xehanort or Master Xehanort?
- what "has started", the gathering of the XIII darknesses?
- where is everyone getting that Young Master Xehanort is thinking about betraying MX? :confused:
 

Draxem

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I see..

- why did Braig expect to see Xemnas though? the logical thing would be to expect a Somebody. why not Terra-Xehanort or Master Xehanort?
- what "has started", the gathering of the XIII darknesses?
- where is everyone getting that Young Master Xehanort is thinking about betraying MX? :confused:

- I think he's in reference to the fact Master Xehanort is re-completing somewhere else (as he returns to his original form remember), lets not forget he doesn't truly regain form until the end of Dream Drop Distance which is obviously after this cutscene, so it's not that he expects to see Xemnas, it's that he know's what's happening BECAUSE Xemnas isn't there. Took me a while to click on to.
- ^ Xehanort's return has started.
- I would say there's definitely something not right with Young Xehanort in this cutscene, the way he smiles when Braig talks about his own goals. It's obviously just speculation, I'm not sure he'll betray him but I do believe there's more to his character now than what we know of.

Another interesting note, Braig references Xemnas as "our boss" when talking to Young Xehanort, but when has Xemnas ever been Young Xehanorts boss?
 

The_Echo

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- why did Braig expect to see Xemnas though? the logical thing would be to expect a Somebody. why not Terra-Xehanort or Master Xehanort?
No clue. He may have expected to see Xemnas' body. Or maybe he expected not​ to see it.
- what "has started", the gathering of the XIII darknesses?
Probably referring to the plan for the events of 3D, if I had to guess.
- where is everyone getting that Young Master Xehanort is thinking about betraying MX? :confused:
I saw in another thread that apparently his English VA was directed to sound as if he wasn't entirely convinced of what he was doing.

On top of this, he says Master Xehanort's Keyblade is a "will that is passed on," and that he hasn't inherited that will yet. Now, why would he mention this? Obviously it's in his future; he knows this very well. So if he wanted that Keyblade, he knows that he'll get it.

And of course, he assembled Xigbar and Saïx for the Organization instead of Braig and Isa, for reasons unknown. Very suspicious behavior.

Edit: Rewatching the scene, it seems odd to me that Young Xehanort refers to Master Xehanort by that name, rather than "my older self," or something similar. It almost feels like he's referring to a different person in this way.
 

The_Echo

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Are you suggesting that Xigbar and Saix are currently existing at the same time as Braig and Isa?
Not in the sense that they belong to the present time, no.

Of course, I also have certain thoughts about The World That Never Was in regards to its nature as a world, spurred on by this:
— In the latter half of The World That Never Was, despite returning to the real world, why do Sora and co. stay in that form and why do Dream Eaters appear etc?
Nomura: Sora and co.’s form is due to Yen Sid’s magic, so the way it works is that they can’t turn back until they return to the Mysterious Tower, and Dream Eaters were appearing because Sora was still asleep. Also, ever since Organisation XIII was defeated in KH2, the The World That Never Was’
existence as a world has become uncertain. In the first place, the worlds in the rift between darkness and light have different rules than other worlds.
The Mysterious Tower isn’t always standing in a fixed place. Traverse Town too reforms its shape every time, which is why the version that appears in this title is clearly different than the version in KH1.
 

The_Echo

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But they are all in the present anyway because of time travel?
Yeah, as far as my current understanding of things goes.

Then again, who knows what's up with The World That Never Was.
 

FudgemintGuardian

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Yeah, as far as my current understanding of things goes.

Then again, who knows what's up with The World That Never Was.
And why would Xehanort recomplete there when he dissipated at the Keyblade Graveyard? Unless The World That Never Was is somehow the Graveyard. But that would be kinda....dumb?

EDIT: Still a little miffed that Braig looks like he did in BBS, because Xigbar looks cooler. But I take it that it means one of two things. Either Xigbar's appearance was because of his Nobodyness, or that when your recompleted, you look how you did beforehand. The latter not making much sense since Ienzo was a kid when it happened and he's clearly still an adult like Zexion was.
 
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Draxem

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And why would Xehanort recomplete there when he dissipated at the Keyblade Graveyard? Unless The World That Never Was is somehow the Graveyard. But that would be kinda....dumb?

EDIT: Still a little miffed that Braig looks like he did in BBS, because Xigbar looks cooler. But I take it that it means one of two things. Either Xigbar's appearance was because of his Nobodyness, or that when your recompleted, you look how you did beforehand. The latter not making much sense since Ienzo was a kid when it happened and he's clearly still an adult like Zexion was.

Remember Roxas was born in Twilight Town but Sora had never been there, it's just one of those things I guess. I don't know why he appeared in The World That Never Was.

If you watch the My Name Is Ansem cutscene Ienzo looks like he does as Zexion just before he becomes a nobody. I think it might be a case of characters looking like they did beforehand so they have an excuse for making Terra young again should he survive it all.
 

kuraudoVII

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I KNEW Young Xehanort was probably going to take part in this scene somehow! I just knew it!

Anyway, I thought that the whole scene was really interesting to say the least. Like The_Echo said, the scene may not have been long, but damn does it make you think...

- I think he's in reference to the fact Master Xehanort is re-completing somewhere else (as he returns to his original form remember), lets not forget he doesn't truly regain form until the end of Dream Drop Distance which is obviously after this cutscene, so it's not that he expects to see Xemnas, it's that he know's what's happening BECAUSE Xemnas isn't there. Took me a while to click on to.
- ^ Xehanort's return has started.
- I would say there's definitely something not right with Young Xehanort in this cutscene, the way he smiles when Braig talks about his own goals. It's obviously just speculation, I'm not sure he'll betray him but I do believe there's more to his character now than what we know of.

Another interesting note, Braig references Xemnas as "our boss" when talking to Young Xehanort, but when has Xemnas ever been Young Xehanorts boss?

Young Xehanort's reaction to all of this is very interesting. He displays far more emotion here than he did throughout nearly the entirety of Dream Drop Distance.

No clue. He may have expected to see Xemnas' body. Or maybe he expected not​ to see it.
Probably referring to the plan for the events of 3D, if I had to guess.

I saw in another thread that apparently his English VA was directed to sound as if he wasn't entirely convinced of what he was doing.

On top of this, he says Master Xehanort's Keyblade is a "will that is passed on," and that he hasn't inherited that will yet. Now, why would he mention this? Obviously it's in his future; he knows this very well. So if he wanted that Keyblade, he knows that he'll get it.

And of course, he assembled Xigbar and Saïx for the Organization instead of Braig and Isa, for reasons unknown. Very suspicious behavior.

Edit: Rewatching the scene, it seems odd to me that Young Xehanort refers to Master Xehanort by that name, rather than "my older self," or something similar. It almost feels like he's referring to a different person in this way.

The emotionless way he acted in Dream Drop Distance automatically signaled to me that there was more to his plans than he was letting on. From what I gathered, he is most likely trying to attain Master Xehanort's keyblade prematurely for his own purposes. Whether it's to further a different goal or perhaps to maintain the essences of time travel or whatever or even something else is up to the imagination at this point.

Also, that smirk at the end was both awesome and creepy all at the same time...

And why would Xehanort recomplete there when he dissipated at the Keyblade Graveyard? Unless The World That Never Was is somehow the Graveyard. But that would be kinda....dumb?

EDIT: Still a little miffed that Braig looks like he did in BBS, because Xigbar looks cooler. But I take it that it means one of two things. Either Xigbar's appearance was because of his Nobodyness, or that when your recompleted, you look how you did beforehand. The latter not making much sense since Ienzo was a kid when it happened and he's clearly still an adult like Zexion was.

That kind of confused me, too. Unless Braig was lying and he was somehow from the past, he should appear similar to his Nobody. As you pointed out, Ienzo looks like Zexion did but with a change of clothes.
 

FudgemintGuardian

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Remember Roxas was born in Twilight Town but Sora had never been there, it's just one of those things I guess. I don't know why he appeared in The World That Never Was.
I think it's been stated that Nobodies are born in a random location and people are always recompleted from where the separation happened. Not sure on that, though.

If you watch the My Name Is Ansem cutscene Ienzo looks like he does as Zexion just before he becomes a nobody. I think it might be a case of characters looking like they did beforehand so they have an excuse for making Terra young again should he survive it all.
MFsU7dn.png

That's the best shot I could get of the My Name is Ansem scene unfortunately. I'll try to get a better shot later, but you can tell here that's his BBS appearance in the first shot. He's much smaller in it compared to his return in DDD.
 

Draxem

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I think it's been stated that Nobodies are born in a random location and people are always recompleted from where the separation happened. Not sure on that, though.


MFsU7dn.png

That's the best shot I could get of the My Name is Ansem scene unfortunately. I'll try to get a better shot later, but you can tell here that's his BBS appearance in the first shot. He's much smaller in it compared to his return in DDD.

No ways, my mistake! I'm sitting here trying to decide if Ienzo is actually in the same place when he wakes back up.
 

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I think the reason we see Ienzo/Zexion, Isa/Saix, and Lea/Axel age, but not Braig is because Braig was already an adult while the other three were kids/teenagers when they lost their hearts. It seems like the adult apprentices in the series, such as Braig, Dilan, Even, and Aeleus haven't aged over the past 10 years because they were in their 20s during Birth by Sleep and now their 30s in the present. Perhaps Nomura didn't feel that warranted new appearances as opposed to the younger members who would have gone from childhood to adulthood in those 10 years and, thus, definitely needed new designs.

Ansem the Wise, too, could be used as an example. He looks the same between Birth By Sleep and the recent games, chronologically.
 

Draxem

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I think the reason we see Ienzo/Zexion, Isa/Saix, and Lea/Axel age, but not Braig is because Braig was already an adult while the other three were kids/teenagers when they lost their hearts. It seems like the adult apprentices in the series, such as Braig, Dilan, Even, and Aeleus haven't aged over the past 10 years because they were in their 20s during Birth by Sleep and now their 30s in the present. Perhaps Nomura didn't feel that warranted new appearances as opposed to the younger members who would have gone from childhood to adulthood in those 10 years and, thus, definitely needed new designs.

Ansem the Wise, too, could be used as an example. He looks the same between Birth By Sleep and the recent games, chronologically.

Braig definitely aged as Xigbar though, he has a different appearance so it's unusual that he wakes up with shorter hair. However I genuinely believe this is simply a gimmick by Nomura so that Terra will be back to his normal age when he is saved.
 
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