Do you think that the Kingdom Hearts series will end up going downhill someday?

[The_Echo]

And I don't see how they could make a villain that could top Master Xehanort. Kingdom Hearts III just seems like a perfect final game to the series for me.

He's already here

 

[AmaryllisMoth]

I think Sora's on the right track with this one: We all just gotta try and think positive!

Who knows what is gonna happen?

After 3 there is a whole plethora of possibilities and until we get to that point there's no reason to say it's guaranteed to be bad. After all, we have no idea what is going to happen at the end of kh3 yet...

I dunno, maybe it's because KH has been a part of my life longer than it hasn't and I can't really see it not being there. I'll go into everything with an open mind.

 

[Nukara]

If the villain is MoM, I will not worry much about the next arch.
If we also make spin-off games not on PS4, the Nintendo Switch will be the most suitable.

 

[Audo]

You don't like Master ​

Xehanort? I personally think he is a great villain, and I think there will never be another villain to top him in the Kingdom Hearts series.

in a single like 60 minute movie, the Master of Masters effortlessly upstaged him as a far more engaging, interesting, personality-filled villain. there is stuff to like about Xehanort, but after like 12 titles, he's still ridiculously not fully fleshed out and is rather one-note. they even make a joke of it in the series that no one knows what he actually wants. that's not great after this long and going into the final battle.

 

[Antifa Lockhart]

I think DDD elevated itself over BBS in polish, if maybe being a little unoriginal.

DDD also had the shortest dev time of them all, announced in 2010 and released in early 2012.

 

[DarkosOverlord]

in a single like 60 minute movie, the Master of Masters effortlessly upstaged him as a far more engaging, interesting, personality-filled villain. there is stuff to like about Xehanort, but after like 12 titles, he's still ridiculously not fully fleshed out and is rather one-note. they even make a joke of it in the series that no one knows what he actually wants. that's not great after this long and going into the final battle.

Earlier this morning I was trying so hard to convey this message but immediately after waking up my brain wasn't in the best shape so I gave up.
Yeah, I'm a notorious Master Xehanort stan and I wholeheartedly agree that this dumb stuff about his endgame goal being completely unknown brings his entire character down several notches. How can you build up a main villain for all these years and still make such an important info unclear?

There is a LOT of stuff you can improve with Master Xehanort and the whole Seeker Saga. Both have huge flaws especially when looking at the bigger picture.
Without going too much into detail, the writing has proven to be pretty messy and unpolished: of Master Xehanort Audo already said, I'll add that we already had "downhill" games in all these years. So many stories that didn't truly matter, or should've mattered but should've been told in a different way.
Or that will matter even when they really shouldn't just because Nomura wants to dump every fart his brain had in the last 10 years into KH III.
I dread to think that there is a possibility people should know and keep in mind characters like Data Sora and Data Riku. In any other series they would be alternative skins or one-time enemies. It's like telling me I should know the fake spidermen Mysterio used in Spiderman 2 or the 2099 iteration just to get the main story of the next game.

Now, what each of us thinks about this or that game or character might differ, but the Dark Seeker Saga was hardly this perfect masterpiece impossible to overthrow.

Lastly, I'll quote what Oracle Spockanort said in the "After KH III" thread, I feel like it really encapsulates what should be improved upon without any excessive criticism.

KH3 should not be an end for the series. I think it should be a new beginning, though. A brand new saga without the baggage of the Dark Seeker Saga. Still have Sora, Kairi and Riku, throw in a popular character or a few, introduce a small amount of new characters that serve as support and as the antagonist(s), but keep the amount low and manageable.

Every following title rotates characters in and out, but never in a way that feels like they were underutilized or one-note. Keep the plot as intriguing but simplistic as possible. Refine what worked in the series before and cut out everything that didn’t.

Either have standalone games or trilogy titles. No 8+ game sagas.

Have a competitive spin-off so everybody can play as their favs again in one game. Rhythm game at the most. Don’t overbloat with nonsense games.

 

[Megavoltage]

Either have standalone games or trilogy titles. No 8+ game sagas.

This would be very nice. If the Foretellers(masked originals and the replacements) do return I guess certain members could have a standalone game and whatever scheme s/he plotted has a concise resolution? Master of Masters eventually shows up for a trilogy and that's how we end the second saga?

We have several playable characters exploring the Realm of Light, Realm of Darkness, Datascape, Realm of Sleep, books, and other places. Plenty more games to be had.

 

[Deleted member 246005]

Regardless if KH4 goes downhill or uphill it's going to be an interesting time for Kingdom Hearts. Whatever happens in KH3 it's going to be the end of an era and the beginning of a new one. That brings a lot of worry but also excitement and wonder.

Lets savor that moment when it comes.

 

[Hakan Xatos]

The potential of the next arc being great is there. With a clean slate to work with besides Sora and his immediate allies it really just depends if Nomura can write the next great chapter. Definitely think that making non numbered titles on handhelds would be a bad idea. I'd probably play them, but it drives a lot of the casual fans away from the series if they need different platforms. I don't know if the series can take that hit again. Now if they can make decent non numbered titles for the main consoles then it'd probably be fine. I don't see the gameplay suffering if KH3 does well and if they keep a similar formula. I mainly concerned about a well thought out story.

 

[kaseykockroach]

It went 'downhill' after KH2's sleep-inducing prologue, Disney worlds offering nothing to the narrative in even a thematic sense, the Ansem identity 'twist', Goofy's "death", Kairi and Namine both being insultingly sidelined, level design being stripped of any interest, lame villains, a laughably awful replacement voice for Scar, etc.

 

[Neo_]

I believe that day was when Nomura decided Ansem wasn't Ansem & some other guy was Ansem was a totally sensible plot twist. Frickin' snowball effect after that point.

It went 'downhill' after KH2's sleep-inducing prologue, Disney worlds offering nothing to the narrative in even a thematic sense, the Ansem identity 'twist', Goofy's "death", Kairi and Namine both being insultingly sidelined, level design being stripped of any interest, lame villains, a laughably awful replacement voice for Scar, etc.

+1

I think it's still possible for the series to go downhill even if Nomura is still working on the games. There's a limit to how many good ideas that someone has before they run out. It happens all the time with story writers.

I would argue that the guy doesn't even have good ideas; like someone hands you Square + Disney, you really have to be dumb to f that up. It's like people who say Smash Bros. was an unlikely success... really? Mario fighting Link, Pikachu, etc? Seems like a bonafide hit to me, and again: hard to mess up.

So many parallels between Smash and KH: just as people are curious of a Nomura-less KH, many Smash fans can't wait for a game without Sakurai; borderline blasphemous, but if they delivered exceptional products, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I think it was Somecallmejohnny who had the salient point in one of his videos that we need the true Kingdom Hearts experience where Alice can go to Deep Jungle, Aladdin to Neverland, etc, but maybe Disney is the one who enforced the "world order" thing though.

I know 90% disagree with this, but I would like to see them have a f*** all mentality towards KH4 and just have a new protagonist visit all the crazy properties like Marvel, Star Wars, Muppets, Simpsons, etc. to get to a new villain (flop or not, but I have a hard time believing that would flop).

Listen I've been a fan since late 2003, and I've read a lot of stuff online, most of it is negative. The positive stuff I read is mostly from this website and others that are KH-centric.

A lot of players, both casual and core believe that its been on the decline for years.

Again, I have unpopular opinions, but I'm a member of this site and believe the series has been on a gradual decline since the first game, but even the ending of that game was a bit of a precursor to the madness that would ensue.

 

[Deleted member 246005]

I'd be ok with a new protagonist over Sora returning as the lead. Technically the series has had other leads but their stories dove into his or were connected in some way. So it would be interesting to see if they could try introducing a new hero for a new saga.

Potentially I'd like to see Sora as an older character and it might help with some of his writing flaws. It could backfire as that would be more ambitious than introducing a new lead to me.

To me, the weakest moments of the post kh2 era was when Sora came back onstage (DDD).

Outside this fandom/forum KH's story has more of an acquired taste to it. Most people I've talked to said it was in decline since KH2 :/.

A change in the storytelling might bring them back or might not. Its hard to say without knowing what the future would bring.

 

[Elysium]

When Sora is replaced as protagonist is when KH will really begin its death as a franchise. Writing-wise, it's been in decline for a while, but bells and whistles have disguised that enough for the average consumer apparently. If anything, I think KH3 might be an upswing for KH.