Is the Old KH2 Secret Movie still valid...?

[Vulcrypt]

TMM doesn't seem to think so!

Way to Dawn being in the Secret Video was a concept, the entire trailer is simply a concept video, meaning not every single detail is a canon event. The keyblades that they picked up, notice how they're not there in the second Secret Video? Nomura probably dropped the idea, or they were simply meant to be symbolic, and that they weren't actually there

i do think that it is still valid for a number of reasons.

1. the two videos could have taken place at differnt times.
2. the person walking toward VAT has a totally different stance then MX
3. The sky looks different, as if it is a different place, or time of day.
4. The three keyblades in the ground aren't in VAT's hands in the second movie.
5. if we take everything as symbolic, then we can't beleive anything!

Do you think it is still valid?

 

[Wehrmacht]

1. the two videos could have taken place at differnt times.

Uh, no. They clearly take place one after the other. Common sense much?

2. the person walking toward VAT has a totally different stance then MX

Concept video/symbolism.

3. The sky looks different, as if it is a different place, or time of day.

It's the same time of day, it's probably either sunset( hence the name of the track "Sunset Horizons"), or MX just made the sky darker.

4. The three keyblades in the ground aren't in VAT's hands in the second movie.

Concept video/symbolism.

5. if we take everything as symbolic, then we can't beleive anything!

We're not taking everything as symbolic. Just what should be. I mean, come on: it's a concept video. Meaning not everything in it is canon and should be taken at face value. What part of that don't you get? For one thing, WtD couldn't have existed at the time they're picking up those keyblades.

Not everything in Deep Dive was used in KH2. Roxas' glowing eyes were scrapped completely. The scene where Roxas and Xemnas meet is changed. A lot of the stuff was altered.

It's the same thing here: I don't think you understand what "concept video" means, or the fact that Sunset Horizons IS a concept video.

Do you think it is still valid?

No. BBS contradicts things in Gathering, and since BBS is closer to the finished product, the first secret ending is now largely symbolic, and nothing more.

I don't think many are going to agree with you. Pretty much all of your reasons are, well, bogus.

 

[Vulcrypt]

For one thing, WtD couldn't have existed at the time they're picking up those keyblades.

WHY?!?!

Not everything in Deep Dive was used in KH2.

That was a video made FOURYEARS before KH2. KH2's secret movie was made 1.5 years before the start of BBS.

 

[Kyrios]

Uh, no. They clearly take place one after the other. Common sense applies here. Concept video/symbolism.



you just rebuked yourself, obviouls they dont have the three keyblades in the next video so what happened to them? not symbolism because then it would NOT take place right after this.


srry kind of messed up the quotse

 

[Wehrmacht]

WHY?!?!

Because it was originally Soul Eater. Soul Eater turned into a keyblade. This was either caused by Riku's heart, or another keyblade choosing Riku, manifesting itself through Soul Eater, and the two transforming into WtD.

And in any case: the WtD has a heartless symbol keychain. And that symbol wasn't created until after BBS.

That was a video made FOURYEARS before KH2. KH2's secret movie was made 1.5 years before the start of BBS.

So? That doesn't change the fact that it's a concept video, and that things were obviously scrapped.

you just rebuked yourself, obviouls they dont have the three keyblades in the next video so what happened to them? not symbolism because then it would NOT take place right after this.

How does the fact that it takes place right after Gathering have any relevance? Gathering is a concept video. And in the next concept video, those keyblades were scrapped because they were no longer needed. It's as simple as that.

So, they are clearly symbolic now, because they couldn't have been anything else. And as I pointed out, WtD didn't exist at that point anyway, so that makes the fact that they were symbolic fairly obvious.

 

[Vulcrypt]

Way to Dawn could have existed before riku got it, because Soul Eater was the intermediate weapon that he used before he got a keyblade. So, if he earned WtD, he doesn't have to be the first wielder.

 

[Eagl]

Okay I think that the video is more like introducing the charachter and show some connections. Even if its a concept video it can still include some good details.

 

[Destiny's End]

Didn't I start a long thread about this a few days ago?

It's the same time of day, it's probably either sunset( hence the name of the track "Sunset Horizons"), or MX just made the sky darker.

Same thing I was thinking. His prescence must have brought upon a darker atmosphere.

Not everything in Deep Dive was used in KH2. Roxas' glowing eyes were scrapped completely. The scene where Roxas and Xemnas meet is changed. A lot of the stuff was altered.

The Roxas/Xemnas meeting looked the same except Roxas didn't have Glowing Eyes.

The fight with Riku and Roxas was used. The same scene appeared in KH2: Final Mix.

- What looks like 1000 Neo-Shadows rising out of the floor with Roxas standing in the middle.

- Roxas whips out The Oathkeeper and Oblivion Keyblade and locks them in a cool motion and starts fighting the Heartless.

- Roxas sees Riku at the top of that building and runs up to meet him. Riku jumps off and Roxas throws him Keyblade and they pass each other the same way they did in Deep Dive.

Why they re-enacted that scene as a reaction command with Sora and Xemnas is beyond me. I stated it before, but I think because Roxas is Sora's Nobody and Since Ansem was Xehanort's Heartless and still held a dark corner of Riku's Heart, Xemnas being there was understandable.

The message in a bottle was used at the end of KH2.

Way to Dawn could have existed before riku got it, because Soul Eater was the intermediate weapon that he used before he got a keyblade. So, if he earned WtD, he doesn't have to be the first wielder.

How could that it be if Way to Dawn was just a transformation of The Soul Eater? A weapon Maleficent gave to Riku to use in KH1? 10 Years after BBS even happened. Riku learned how to control the Darkness in his heart, thus making him stronger than he originally was. If I remember correctly, he knows how to harness the power of Darkness and use it as a weapon. He probably used that to change the appearance of his Soul Eater into The Way to Dawn. It has a Heartless Keychain making it irrelevant that it appeared in BBS when Heartless weren't even around then.

 

[Wehrmacht]

Way to Dawn could have existed before riku got it, because Soul Eater was the intermediate weapon that he used before he got a keyblade. So, if he earned WtD, he doesn't have to be the first wielder.

And I guess the fact that it looks so much like Soul Eater is a complete and total coincidence, right?

Also, there's still the fact that the keychain is a heartless symbol: which wasn't created till after BBS.

The Roxas/Xemnas meeting looked the same except Roxas didn't have Glowing Eyes.

Roxas asked for Xemnas' name so does that mean that scene shows him meeting Xemnas for the first time and that's when he joined the Organization?

Not really. It's true that he had a conversation with Xemnas at that beach before but that's not their first meeting and their conversation wasn't like that either. The conversation at the beginning of the game was Roxas' dream, mixed with his memories and feelings. The part where he asked for Xemnas' name but instead was asked back for his real name was a reflection of Roxas' feelings on who really is. Roxas didn't know his real name, remember? If he remembered that he was Sora, I think he wouldn't join the Organization in the first place.

The fight with Riku and Roxas was used. The same scene appeared in KH2: Final Mix.

- What looks like 1000 Neo-Shadows rising out of the floor with Roxas standing in the middle.

- Roxas whips out The Oathkeeper and Oblivion Keyblade and locks them in a cool motion and starts fighting the Heartless.

- Roxas sees Riku at the top of that building and runs up to meet him. Riku jumps off and Roxas throws him Keyblade and they pass each other the same way they did in Deep Dive.

Why they re-enacted that scene as a reaction command with Sora and Xemnas is beyond me. I stated it before, but I think because Roxas is Sora's Nobody and Since Ansem was Xehanort's Heartless and still held a dark corner of Riku's Heart, Xemnas being there was understandable.

The message in a bottle was used at the end of KH2.

I was talking more about the captions, words, phrases, etc.

 

[safire inthe sky]

I would just like to point out that nomura had a much better idea of what he was going to do for the next game in this one. here is a little piece of the interview from the kh2 ultimania book

"After the ending, there’s a secret movie this time, too. What exactly is the movie trying to tell?

Nomura: I actually have a solid idea on what the movie’s setting will be in my head. In the previous game’s secret movie, I wasn’t even sure if I would be making a sequel or not, so some parts of it were quite vague. But this time I already have an idea my head where I think “This is it.”

Did that scene happen in the future or in the past?

Nomura: I would at least say it’s an episode in the past, but…. Hmm, how should I say this? It’s in the past but you can also think it’s in the future, something like that."

so what I think is that maybe the first video with everyone's keyblades is in the future, and maybe the other one is in the past, this is just my opinion though

 

[Wehrmacht]

I would just like to point out that nomura had a much better idea of what he was going to do for the next game in this one. here is a little piece of the interview from the kh2 ultimania book

So? You think you're making some kind of point with that? It doesn't change the fact that it's a concept video, and that Nomura could have (and did) changed his mind.

so what I think is that maybe the first video with everyone's keyblades is in the future, and maybe the other one is in the past, this is just my opinion though

Even though it's pretty clear that one happens right after the other, and that Nomura said it was the past TWICE...?

Also, it being in the future wouldn't really make much sense at all.

Honestly: I don't get what part of "concept video/symbolism" you guys don't get, nor do I understand why you guys would think they take place at different times...it's pretty easy to come to the conclusion that those keyblades were scrapped, or were symbolic, since BBS takes place right after Gathering, and that's a blatantly obvious fact.

 

[safire inthe sky]

I was just saying that it is a little more concrete, not that the whole thing is for sure. and the other thing was just an idea

 

[Wehrmacht]

I was just saying that it is a little more concrete, not that the whole thing is for sure.

Well, yeah, I'm pretty sure that most of us know that. I knew that. I read that interview.

 

[safire inthe sky]

Well, yeah, I'm pretty sure that most of us know that. I knew that. I read that interview.

then why did you still say that it being in the future wouldn't sense even though the interview says you could also think of it being in the future

 

[Wehrmacht]

then why did you still say that it being in the future wouldn't sense even though the interview says you could also think of it being in the future

I think we're interpreting his statement in different ways:

I interpret his statement as meaning that history repeats itself, and that the events of BBS will eventually occur again (MX coming back, or something), and Sora and company will have to deal with it. Given the context of the videos, and knowing Nomura, I find it a plausible way of interpreting that quote.

 

[safire inthe sky]

oh okay i didn't know that you were thinking of it that way. but as I said before, I wasn't trying to make a point, I was just trying to point something out. but I can see your point a lot better now, that makes more sense

 

[The Twilight Prince]

TMM doesn't seem to think so!



i do think that it is still valid for a number of reasons.

1. the two videos could have taken place at differnt times.
2. the person walking toward VAT has a totally different stance then MX
3. The sky looks different, as if it is a different place, or time of day.
4. The three keyblades in the ground aren't in VAT's hands in the second movie.
5. if we take everything as symbolic, then we can't beleive anything!

Do you think it is still valid?

You're looking FAR too deeply into this Vulcrypt. Listen to what everybody here is saying. Do you honestly believe that the first video and the one from FM+ took place at different times? Absolutely not. Like Hades said, common sense. Why in the world would Nomura make a completely different video just to show that part with them picking up the keyblades? Wouldn't it just make more sense to have shown the video from FM+ in Kh2 along with it.

And WtD DID come from Soul Eater. Im positive its stated someplace. Either in the manga or someplace else. But even if its not, its pretty obvious. The video was shown to show VAT's connections to what each keyblade represents. It was purely concept

Kingdom Key :: Realm of Light Key
Inverse Kingdom Key :: Dark Realm's Key
WtD :: Represents Twilight, hence why Ven picked it up. Twilight=Roxas. Roxas looks like Ven. Catching my drift?

You're just looking far too deeply into things.