Spoilers ► Do you think KARMA will play a role in the next game?

[MasterOfMasterOfMasters]

This word is mentioned in the back of Verum Rex's box art. There is also a Yin Yang imagery with Yozora and the female character, which is pretty cool and super hype. Kinda like the whole Sin thing in FFX. However, Kingdom Hearts is owned by Dinsey and im not really sure if the developers are allowed to use religious terms. For example, the spell "Holy" is called "Faith" when Minnie uses it. Im pretty sure they had to change it because a disney game cant use words like that. Then again, im not sure what disney allows or not because I think there is a cross in the original KH1 box art.

 

[okhi12]

The Holy spell is named Sanctus (latin for holy or sacred) in the spanish version of FF and KH games. If Disney forbids the use of religious terms they would ban those words in european countries as well, not only in USA.

I'm pretty sure Disney can allow some religious words and imagery in KH as long as it's not too heavy or offensive. But I agree they probably try to tone down religious references as much as possible. The Notre Dame cathedral appears in KH3D, although the religious themes from the movie were removed almost entirely.

 

[MasterOfMasterOfMasters]

But I agree they probably try to tone down religious references as much as possible.

which is interesting considering there is lots of satanic imagery in the game

 

[okhi12]

which is interesting considering there is lots of satanic imagery in the game

At first I was gonna say there isn't, but to be honest armored Xehanort in KH3 and Maleficent look like demons and Chernabog is a demon. The seven deadly sins in the Lost Masters' names are frequently associated with demons, and heartless are evil creatures which dwell in the darkness.
However I wouldn't say the KH games are satanic. KH just takes some inspiration from the traditional concepts of good (light) and evil (darkness) and the way these concepts are depicted in culture and religion.

 

[Face My Fears]

which is interesting considering there is lots of satanic imagery in the game

It's not satanic imagery. KH uses A LOT of Christian/Biblical imagery and references. However, the basis for storytelling pretty much came from Bible stories (and ancient greek plays). Anyway, just stating that KH is using satanic imagery is trying to lean your point towards something negative versus just saying that KH uses Biblical imagery - which can go both ways.

Regarding the KARMA thing... I think we already saw it used in KH3. Sora basically "got what he deserved" by messing with time just to save Kairi. Master Xehanort even talked to him about how he defied the natural law. It will be interesting if they go in-depth in this... like WHO made the judgement to have Sora die in KH3 or WHAT even caused it.

 

[MasterOfMasterOfMasters]

At first I was gonna say there isn't, but to be honest armored Xehanort in KH3 and Maleficent look like demons and Chernabog is a demon. The seven deadly sins in the Lost Masters' names are frequently associated with demons, and heartless are evil creatures which dwell in the darkness.
However I wouldn't say the KH games are satanic. KH just takes some inspiration from the traditional concepts of good (light) and evil (darkness) and the way these concepts are depicted in culture and religion.

its just imagery not that the games are actually satanic. though they kinda allude to xehanort being a version of satan

 

[MasterOfMasterOfMasters]

Anyway, just stating that KH is using satanic imagery is trying to lean your point towards something negative versus just saying that KH uses Biblical imagery - which can go both ways.

i didnt say its negative or anything, i just found it strange that disney doesnt mind

Sora basically "got what he deserved" by messing with time just to save Kairi. Master Xehanort even talked to him about how he defied the natural law. It will be interesting if they go in-depth in this... like WHO made the judgement to have Sora die in KH3 or WHAT even caused it.

the same WHO that reincarnates someone as a nobody when their heart falls into darkness?

 

[Face My Fears]

i didnt say its negative or anything, i just found it strange that disney doesnt mind



the same WHO that reincarnates someone as a nobody when their heart falls into darkness?

I don't think someone chooses for a person to be brought back as a nobody. I think that's a natural process in their world. If they have a strong heart and get consumed by darkness, the body craves that heart and becomes conscious on its own.

I suppose Sora dying because he abused the natural law could also be justified as "just the way things are". But then why did he go to Quadratum instead of The Final World?

 

[QuiteMaybeOfYou]

I suppose Sora dying because he abused the natural law could also be justified as "just the way things are". But then why did he go to Quadratum instead of The Final World?

He did go to the Final World, though? That's where he meets Yozora in Remind. After that, it's really unclear what's happening. We don't really know what's going on. In the "Yozora" secret ending we see Sora wandering Quadratum and Riku who is also wandering Quadratum. Crucially, they don't ever meet. This could be a situation like in DDD where they are in different versions of the same place. it's also possible none of Sora, Riku, Yozora, or the Master of Masters are in the same version of Quadratum. None of them are ever seen in the same uncut shot which would definitively prove that they were. Although not uncut, the way it is cut seems to suggest the Yozora and Riku are in the same place, at least.

In Remind, the Quadratum that Sora and Yozora fight in is, if my theory is correct, not actually real Quadratum (My theory is that Yozora used the power of waking on Sora and they fought in a dream version of the Verum Rex videogame version of Quadratum). But regardless, If Sora wins the fight, he's seen in the final world. If Sora loses he is crystalized in (possibly) Quadratum. Yozora wakes up in a car which is presumably driving through Quadratum. If it is Quadratum, then where they were fighting can't have been Quadratum.

So, who knows. Maybe Sora is actually in Quadratum, maybe he's not.

 

[Face My Fears]

He did go to the Final World, though? That's where he meets Yozora in Remind. After that, it's really unclear what's happening. We don't really know what's going on. In the "Yozora" secret ending we see Sora wandering Quadratum and Riku who is also wandering Quadratum. Crucially, they don't ever meet. This could be a situation like in DDD where they are in different versions of the same place. it's also possible none of Sora, Riku, Yozora, or the Master of Masters are in the same version of Quadratum. None of them are ever seen in the same uncut shot which would definitively prove that they were. Although not uncut, the way it is cut seems to suggest the Yozora and Riku are in the same place, at least.

In Remind, the Quadratum that Sora and Yozora fight in is, if my theory is correct, not actually real Quadratum (My theory is that Yozora used the power of waking on Sora and they fought in a dream version of the Verum Rex videogame version of Quadratum). But regardless, If Sora wins the fight, he's seen in the final world. If Sora loses he is crystalized in (possibly) Quadratum. Yozora wakes up in a car which is presumably driving through Quadratum. If it is Quadratum, then where they were fighting can't have been Quadratum.

So, who knows. Maybe Sora is actually in Quadratum, maybe he's not.

He did go to The Final World, but how was he able to escape? Whatever natural law that exists to send someone that abuses time travel to their demise shouldn't be able to be overwritten so easily, right? Unless beings from unreality are somehow able to affect reality - at the brink of existence?

I think that Sora fights Yozora in Yozora's dream - which happened to be a dream version of Quadratum. The day/night aspect of the secret video is interesting too. The Final World and Quadratum fight are night time, then when Yozora wakes up in presumably the real Quadratum, it's day. Maybe there's some sort of sleeping version of Quadratum?

 

[MasterOfMasterOfMasters]

I don't think someone chooses for a person to be brought back as a nobody. I think that's a natural process in their world. If they have a strong heart and get consumed by darkness, the body craves that heart and becomes conscious on its own.

yep, and the same nature could be the one who wrote sora off reality

But then why did he go to Quadratum instead of The Final World?

because Sora didn't technically die. his body didnt die like Xehanort's. instead he vanished from existence