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Discussion of the nature of the heart



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Zeal

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Unfortunately it is a long time ago that I played KH1, so I don't remember the Legend of the Keyblade. But I remember that the keybearer can bring darkness as well as light. Well, I personally dislike this seperation between darkness and light, because this is just not the way the world is. Of course everything has positive aspects and negative aspects in KH terms: “Every heart has a dark and a light side”, but I don't know if it is possible to seperate them. I think this is one of the more mature topics Nomura wants to point out. All of you assume that Sora is Light, I don't think he's light, his heart possesses darkness as well. If you would separate both parts the heart will vanish. In Hollywood movies you often have this separation between the good guys and the bad guys and Disney is quite famous for doing that. But we watch those movies from a very one sided perspective, we only get told what we are supposed to know (much like the news in the USA) and do not get to know the motives of the bad guys. It is quite simple to think this way, but is the bad guy always evil? Is it not perhaps possible that they do the things they do because they love someone, for example Ansem: If you start reading his reports you realize that he wants to understand the darkness of the heart in order to fight darkness “before the world is lost to those taken by the Darkness”. So he started all the research not to become the ruler of the universe but to save his world and its people, much like Mickey does. In his report Nr 8 he says “The machine's test run successfully created a Heartless. This may be a step toward creating a heart from nothing.” So Ansem was very aware that the Heartless are a part of peoples heart, but not all of it. The same is for the light side, it is just a part of heart but not a complete heart, thus it may not be called a heart. Only both parts together create a heart similar to the saying: “The whole is more than the sum of its components”. So why did Ansem want to create a heart, perhaps someone he loved has lost it, who knows. But in Japanese stories you often get to know the motives of the bad guys and you come to a point where you can understand them and maybe even think the way they do. Everytime you help someone you hurt someone else, that’s the way of the world, those two aspects cannot be separated and it’s the same with the heart. But as we all know there is not a perfect balance in our hearts, some tend to the dark side and some to the light side and depending on that tendency is the fate of the keyblade, if it is used for good or for bad. The problem arises in Sora, does he tend to be light or dark. Well, from our temporary point of view it seems that Sora is more light, but that can easily change during the course of his adventures and I’m not quite sure about it actually. The same is for the Organisation and especially for Axel, we do not know if they are good or bad, because we do not know their motives yet. Actually I believe there is no good and bad, it’s all the same. If you do good you do bad the same time and if you do bad you actually do good to someone the same time, that’s reality, that’s what Twilight stands for. Maybe the Organisation is even a force to keep the world this way. Just remember if one side gets to strong and separates itself from the other one the whole thing will vanish. It might be the task of the Organisation to prevent that from happening, that’s why they seem to be evil at one time (light is too strong) or good at another time (evil is too strong). Riku became darkish when Sora became lightish, their lives are connected, perhaps in the end Sora will only be able to save Riku from darkness when he puts down his weapon and quits fighting the darkness, abandoning the light. Therefore there will be no more reason for darkness to exist in Riku to counteract Sora and everything will be okay. Maybe this is one of the things Sora will have to learn during his adventure (besides that Sora is only the consciousness of BHK (twilight=reality) ;) ). I think this will be a very cool ending.
 

fantasygurl1227

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w.......t........f? okay what was the point of this exactly we appreciate all the research but i don't think that we want a full fledged lesson on what the hell a heart is. HELLO ANSEM IS BAD REPEAT BAD HE WANTED ALL HEARTS TO RETURN TO DARKNESS AND ALL WORLDS TO BE DARKNESS! sora is the hero why would he be dark ur write though every heart has to be balanced every natural heart sora is a person so duh! darkness and light is ballanced by twilight because with out twilight both sides would crumble. Okay now that i got that out of the way im done
 

LoyalSubject

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Dear Old Shiz
i agree with u as well at least to some degree. i mean if someone wants to blow up the world so for the heck of it i would consider that pure evil^^. but great idea ive thought about that for quite some time, the whole there is no real good and bad thing, after seeing the play wicked.
 

Einon SAMA

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fantasygurl1227 said:
i think u overanalyzed things i meen this game is for kids ya know

Correct and Incorrect. It can be for kids. Yes. On the surface, Kingdom Hearts is a fun story and game. But deep down, it is a deep story and game.. one that "kids" would not understand on the same level of an adult.
 

Angel X

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Zeal said:
Unfortunately it is a long time ago that I played KH1, so I don't remember the Legend of the Keyblade. But I remember that the keybearer can bring darkness as well as light. Well, I personally dislike this seperation between darkness and light, because this is just not the way the world is. Of course everything has positive aspects and negative aspects in KH terms: “Every heart has a dark and a light side”, but I don't know if it is possible to seperate them. I think this is one of the more mature topics Nomura wants to point out. All of you assume that Sora is Light, I don't think he's light, his heart possesses darkness as well. If you would separate both parts the heart will vanish. In Hollywood movies you often have this separation between the good guys and the bad guys and Disney is quite famous for doing that. But we watch those movies from a very one sided perspective, we only get told what we are supposed to know (much like the news in the USA) and do not get to know the motives of the bad guys. It is quite simple to think this way, but is the bad guy always evil? Is it not perhaps possible that they do the things they do because they love someone, for example Ansem: If you start reading his reports you realize that he wants to understand the darkness of the heart in order to fight darkness “before the world is lost to those taken by the Darkness”. So he started all the research not to become the ruler of the universe but to save his world and its people, much like Mickey does. In his report Nr 8 he says “The machine's test run successfully created a Heartless. This may be a step toward creating a heart from nothing.” So Ansem was very aware that the Heartless are a part of peoples heart, but not all of it. The same is for the light side, it is just a part of heart but not a complete heart, thus it may not be called a heart. Only both parts together create a heart similar to the saying: “The whole is more than the sum of its components”. So why did Ansem want to create a heart, perhaps someone he loved has lost it, who knows. But in Japanese stories you often get to know the motives of the bad guys and you come to a point where you can understand them and maybe even think the way they do. Everytime you help someone you hurt someone else, that’s the way of the world, those two aspects cannot be separated and it’s the same with the heart. But as we all know there is not a perfect balance in our hearts, some tend to the dark side and some to the light side and depending on that tendency is the fate of the keyblade, if it is used for good or for bad. The problem arises in Sora, does he tend to be light or dark. Well, from our temporary point of view it seems that Sora is more light, but that can easily change during the course of his adventures and I’m not quite sure about it actually. The same is for the Organisation and especially for Axel, we do not know if they are good or bad, because we do not know their motives yet. Actually I believe there is no good and bad, it’s all the same. If you do good you do bad the same time and if you do bad you actually do good to someone the same time, that’s reality, that’s what Twilight stands for. Maybe the Organisation is even a force to keep the world this way. Just remember if one side gets to strong and separates itself from the other one the whole thing will vanish. It might be the task of the Organisation to prevent that from happening, that’s why they seem to be evil at one time (light is too strong) or good at another time (evil is too strong). Riku became darkish when Sora became lightish, their lives are connected, perhaps in the end Sora will only be able to save Riku from darkness when he puts down his weapon and quits fighting the darkness, abandoning the light. Therefore there will be no more reason for darkness to exist in Riku to counteract Sora and everything will be okay. Maybe this is one of the things Sora will have to learn during his adventure (besides that Sora is only the consciousness of BHK (twilight=reality) ;) ). I think this will be a very cool ending.

Okay, I understand what you are saying, but please, this is merely a game. Don't go deeper into something that right in front of us. No offence, but you're simply making life harder for both yourself and others.
 

Angel X

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^^ It won't hurt to read KA! :) Heehee. If you really cared about replying to this thread, you gotta respect what Zeal has to say and read it carefully! Haha...
 

Evarae

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It was well thought out and their was great effort for finding this too but when you think about it, the theories for KH2 will need to be simple so kids will understand because the game is for anyone including kids.
 

Zeal

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The thing is I don't care if I read to deep into the game or not. When I read the Ansem reports I always feel like I understand Ansem a little bit, because he does the same thing than I do, research the very foundation of our existance and therefore I call Ansem my brother of thought. I like to think about things like that about reality is well (I've got a long way to school to go on foot everyday) and just try to relate them to other things as well. If Tetsuya Nomura achieves that we are thinking about the nature of the heart and such he, was successful and that's all that matters, occuping one self with the subject.

And for the kids thing, yeah as Einon and me have said before, it doesn't matter. There are quite a lot of stories out there that are for kids but for adults as well, you just have to read them in a different level, on example here is Peter Pan where adults and their strict conservative and egoistic lifestile is critized, but I advice you to read those books yourself when you've grown up a little (for those of you under 17) and you may understand what I mean. Iin that way I simply have already gathered a lot more Experince Points than some of you. I'm level 24 right now. ;)

//PS: And this was called discussion, I want YOU to come up with some SERIOUS theories as well and think about the subject.
 

Angel X

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^^ Alright Zeal, I think it's actually good to really understand and find what you seek, I respect that, and I'm glade you're sharing it with us. :)
 

Angel X

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Zeal said:
If you find all the posts by me in this thread and read them all, then you start talking about reading too much into a game, but as I said I'm having fun doing this

That's fine with me Zeal, you do what you like and want, no one's stoppin' ya. I personally like researching and getting the answers that I claim as well, it's almost in my nature. And if I don't, I'll feel all crapy and pissed off.
 

emerald keyberer

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I concur with this theory. Also in Com Axel says to Larxene, "He is partly on of us..." I don't know if this has been discussed yet but would that mean that sora is an N.E.O.?
And in Holloween town the docter sayst that "true memories unbalance the heart and cause unpredictable changes within", if Namine` has put sora to sleep to awaken his true memories this must tie in with the BHK somehow, ugh lost my train of thought, oh well....
 
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