When are we expecting news?

[MATGSY]

They’re also bringing EGS to mobile, so we could potentially see the whole KH series on iOS and Android eventually.

This is something I sort of wondered about before with the older games. The HD collections as they are, aren't 100% ideal. Square had to reverse the old retail discs & make them run on the demonic motherboard is the PS3's cell processor. In short, it is some frankensteinian spaghetti code. While Square was able to make it work for most platforms they brought it to, one needs only take a gander at what happened on Switch to see where the problems begin.

& then there's how multiple "games" on these collections aren't even playable, just cutscenes. Like is Square seriously ever gonna do anything about that at any point? Frankly I don't get why they didn't just emulate the DS games & called it a day.

Square (well Tose) made the Pixel Remasters of FF1-6 because even though those games were already on mobile/Steam, they had gotten too old to keep updating for every new OS update. Remaking them in Unity allows for easier ports & updates.

Let's face it, KH could totally stand to get a similar overhaul, remaking all of the games up to DDD on either Unity or Unreal so that porting them to new platforms is less of a hassle. & to be perfectly cynical, I definitely see Mobile being a bigger motivator for Square than Switch.

 

[Chie]

I think no games should be ported or remade and devs should make new games :^)

 

[Launchpad]

I think no games should be ported or remade and devs should make new games :^)

I'm afraid to pry into your logic as to why games shouldn't be ported

 

[Chaser]

I think no games should be ported or remade and devs should make new games :^)

That’s not good for preservation, which the games industry is in a big need of.
Ports and remasters are also good ways for new employees to learn the coding of the company they’re joining. The KH collections were training ground for people before going onto kh3.

 

[Chie]

It was a flippant post that I didn't necessarily want to derail the thread with, but to be clear, commercial ports are absolutely not games preservation in almost all cases (the exception being, say, something like G-Mode Archives). It's just creating a different product that will also need preserving.

If we're talking completely seriously, and in an ideal world, I do think that all games for older consoles should be indefinitely available for print-on-demand purchase, and older consoles themselves should be indefinitely manufactured as well. But the ability to sell you commercial ports/remasters over and over is incompatible with that idea.

 

[Chaser]

In my opinion, having a unified version of a game that carries forward is a form of game preservation. It’s not something that will become obsolete in a few years when hardware advances and the product dies. Putting in the effort to bring old games to modern hardware that will continue to carry forward is a good thing, and ports allow for that. That’s what I meant, apologies for the confusion.

It really would have been a shame for the playable Kingdom Hearts games to have remained stuck on PS2 and the PSP forever, like the DS games currently are. Not to mention Re:CoM never released in Australia so the ports allowed for me to play a game in a series I love. And we wouldn’t have gotten the Final Mix games either.

 

[Chie]

In my opinion, having a unified version of a game that carries forward is a form of game preservation. It’s not something that will become obsolete in a few years when hardware advances and the product dies. Putting in the effort to bring old games to modern hardware that will continue to carry forward is a good thing, and ports allow for that. That’s what I meant, apologies for the confusion.

It really would have been a shame for the playable Kingdom Hearts games to have remained stuck on PS2 and the PSP forever, like the DS games currently are. Not to mention Re:CoM never released in Australia so the ports allowed for me to play a game in a series I love. And we wouldn’t have gotten the Final Mix games either.

The point of art preservation is to preserve the art as it originally was created or as close as possible. An HD version of Kingdom Hearts that changes the aspect ratio of every single frame of the game, replaces many models and audio tracks, and adds new content like the Leaf Bracer is not preserving Kingdom Hearts on PS2, it's a new and different version of Kingdom Hearts (which also deserves to be preserved).

This doesn't make it bad; I personally play the HD PS3 version of Kingdom Hearts when I replay it. But it's not Kingdom Hearts, the original work. Literally speaking, it is not the same game any more than a version of the Mona Lisa with new details painted into the background is the Mona Lisa. And you might say "it's as close as possible to the same game", but that seems irrelevant when the original version is in fact extremely preservable by simply ripping the PS2 disc to an iso, which is playable on emulators or hacked PS2s (the hardware decay of PS2s is a bigger issue, though).

Is it convenient for many, many players, including me? Yes, very. Is it related to preservation, an academic field dedicated to the conservation of art and its history? Not at all. And I think this misuse of the idea of games preservation is not doing any favors to people who are actually involved with games preservation, who frequently have to go against copyright holders and commercial interests in order to preserve games that would truly be lost forever in every way if not for preservationists' efforts.

 

[Chaser]

You’re right, my apologies for using the term “preservation” to refer to ports.

 

[Launchpad]

The point of art preservation is to preserve the art as it originally was created or as close as possible. An HD version of Kingdom Hearts that changes the aspect ratio of every single frame of the game, replaces many models and audio tracks, and adds new content like the Leaf Bracer is not preserving Kingdom Hearts on PS2, it's a new and different version of Kingdom Hearts (which also deserves to be preserved).

This doesn't make it bad; I personally play the HD PS3 version of Kingdom Hearts when I replay it. But it's not Kingdom Hearts, the original work. Literally speaking, it is not the same game any more than a version of the Mona Lisa with new details painted into the background is the Mona Lisa. And you might say "it's as close as possible to the same game", but that seems irrelevant when the original version is in fact extremely preservable by simply ripping the PS2 disc to an iso, which is playable on emulators or hacked PS2s (the hardware decay of PS2s is a bigger issue, though).

Is it convenient for many, many players, including me? Yes, very. Is it related to preservation, an academic field dedicated to the conservation of art and its history? Not at all. And I think this misuse of the idea of games preservation is not doing any favors to people who are actually involved with games preservation, who frequently have to go against copyright holders and commercial interests in order to preserve games that would truly be lost forever in every way if not for preservationists' efforts.

I appreciate you being thoughtful and thorough with explaining yourself, but the notion that old hardware should be produced and sold indefinitely and that ports of older games shouldn't be made at all is extremely unrealistic from every angle. Indefinite production on older consoles that no one is buying is not a wise financial decision. The repeated rejection of new hardware is fine when it's your own opinion but the assertion that ports shouldn't *ever* be made for new hardware is.. really stubborn and over the top lol

Also, at risk of being pedantic, leaf bracer WAS in the original version of KH Final Mix, which 1.5 is a port of

 

[Chie]

I know it's unrealistic, and said as much, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be better. Also, theoretically people would be buying the older hardware to play the older games; clearly there is a demand to buy older games, otherwise people wouldn't be asking for remasters of them all the time and using "it's more difficult to acquire used hardware+games" as their reasoning. I think selling people the thing they say they wish was easier to buy is a better solution than spending exorbitant amounts of dev time + money + event time on constant remasters. Again, this is all "in an ideal world"; I know no company would ever do this because it conflicts with the need to market new consoles every however many years. (Although I think Square Enix actually DID continue to support their PS2 games for quite a while, or at least their most popular ones? There are some little instances of stuff like that happening, like that Canadian games store that somehow got the rights to reprint Infinite Space for a bit. Idk how that all works.)

the assertion that ports shouldn't *ever* be made for new hardware is.. really stubborn and over the top lol

No, I know, I said it flippantly cause I think saying "they need to remake all of KH again" is kind of silly, since KH is one of the most ported series around, excepting the DS games/original CoM. So I went fully in the opposite direction.

Also, at risk of being pedantic, leaf bracer WAS in the original version of KH Final Mix, which 1.5 is a port of

I think I was confusing Final Mix's addition of Leaf Bracer with 1.5's addition of EXP Zero and Combo Master.

 

[Launchpad]

At the very least, the teams that port these games are people who specialize in doing just that. They wouldn't be making a new KH in the vacuum of not porting older KH games.

I definitely agree that older versions of games should remain accessible, but as a PCSX2 enjoyer that's dumped his own copies of the older titles, I'm not concerned about preservation... these games will be preserved forever. Scene skip and 60fps has me coming back to the newest port of KH1 time after time lol

 

[KeybladeLordSora]

Can not think of someone who deserves that award more. Yoko Shimomura has worked so hard across so many franchises, creating the iconic music millions listen to and enjoy. So good!

As for the KH4 news, at least it means they're actively writing and recording. Seems like Reality in the Dark might have just been an early commissioned piece, but good to know they've got enough locked in to get going with the soundtrack.

How far would this place 4 on the development timeline

 

[Luminary]

How far would this place 4 on the development timeline

We really can’t tell by this quote alone unfortunately. A lot of people are saying music is one of the last things in the development process. But that isn’t always the case. For example, some songs may be written early based on concepts shared by Nomura.

If I were to really read into it though, I would lean toward it being in the latter stages. Especially if she’s working on a “number” of songs rather than just one or two for a trailer or something. To me, that sounds like she’s full speed ahead on the soundtrack. And it makes sense to wait until the game is far enough along to be a strong reference point and past the point of major content cuts or direction changes. You don’t want to write a bunch of songs early on for things that may ultimately get scrapped.

 

[HakaishinChampa]

We really can’t tell by this quote alone unfortunately. A lot of people are saying music is one of the last things in the development process. But that isn’t always the case. For example, some songs may be written early based on concepts shared by Nomura.

If I were to really read into it though, I would lean toward it being in the latter stages. Especially if she’s working on a “number” of songs rather than just one or two for a trailer or something. To me, that sounds like she’s full speed ahead on the soundtrack. And it makes sense to wait until the game is far enough along to be a strong reference point and past the point of major content cuts or direction changes. You don’t want to write a bunch of songs early on for things that may ultimately get scrapped.

The music could also be general music we'll be hearing across the Lost Master arc like new character themes, new recurring boss battle music.

some Disney worlds could still be under negotiation so it would suck if one of the Disney worlds don't fall through and Yoko ends up making a song for said world and it gets scrapped.

 

[MATGSY]

I think no games should be ported or remade and devs should make new games :^)

The task of ports/remakes is typically handled by different dev teams than those working on new games. Crisis Core Reunion and the Pixel Remasters were done by Tose. Virtuos was behind the Switch port of Automata, not Platinum.

KH4 would not be impacted by remakes.

 

[NoWay]

To be honest, although I’m happy about hearing something about KH4, it’s not like “Yoko Shimomura is working on the soundtrack” is big news in my opinion.. I mean, isn’t it self explaining that she’s working on music? I was like “Yeah cool but we already know that”. Still, it’s cool to have the confirmation that Shimomura herself is again working for KH4.

 

[Launchpad]

To be honest, although I’m happy about hearing something about KH4, it’s not like “Yoko Shimomura is working on the soundtrack” is big news in my opinion.. I mean, isn’t it self explaining that she’s working on music? I was like “Yeah cool but we already know that”. Still, it’s cool to have the confirmation that Shimomura herself is again working for KH4.

"I am working" and "I will be working" carry two very different connotations. We didn't hear any original* KH3 music until the Arendelle Xbox presentation trailer, which appeared like seven months before launch. I have my suspicions that they don't really get cracking on music unless the game is far along. It's pretty anecdotal, but the fact that KH3's final boss theme was done by Ishimoto and not Shimomura is demonstrative, at least to me, that they plum ran out of time. If she's writing now, there's a chance that the game has largely taken shape.

*we DID hear the Classic Kingdom menu music in the brief Classic Kingdom trailer first, but thats like 16 bars of pretty cheaply produced music

 

[KeybladeLordSora]

I wanna believe this means the game is in the latter-late stages. Cuz workin' on "a number" of tracks can only really be a thing if uh...there's concrete stuff

Edit: Never mind...IGN updated the article with this.

Correction: A previous version of this story said Shimomura was working on several songs for Kingdom Hearts 4. That was a misunderstanding, and this article has been updated to reflect that Shimomura instead meant she's working on various tracks for several different games.

 

[Phoenix]

We're denied even scraps

 

[Luminary]

I wanna believe this means the game is in the latter-late stages. Cuz workin' on "a number" of tracks can only really be a thing if uh...there's concrete stuff

Edit: Never mind...IGN updated the article with this.

Correction: A previous version of this story said Shimomura was working on several songs for Kingdom Hearts 4. That was a misunderstanding, and this article has been updated to reflect that Shimomura instead meant she's working on various tracks for several different games.

Dammit IGN…