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Yes, we may all be living in the Matrix, say physicists



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Marly

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TGDaily said:
German scientists say they've found a way to tell whether or not our universe is a giant computer simulation - and that there's evidence to suggest that it is.

The basis of the idea is that, if the universe is a simulation, then it would have certain observable constraints.

The laws of physics, which appear continuous, would have to be superimposed onto a discrete three-dimensional lattice which advances in steps of time.

This lattice spacing, says Professor Silas Beane of the University of Bonn, would impose an otherwise unnecessary limit on the energy that particles can have, because nothing can exist that is smaller than the lattice itself.

And, he says, precisely such a a cut-off in the spectrum of high energy particles exists: a limit to the energy of cosmic rays known as the Greisen–Zatsepin–Kuzmin (GZK) cut-off. High energy particles interacting with the cosmic microwave background lose energy as they travel across long distances.

And there's something else to look for that could, perhaps, confirm things one way or the other. If we're living in a simulation, 'the angular distribution of the highest energy components would exhibit cubic symmetry in the rest frame of the lattice, deviating significantly from isotropy."

In other words, the cosmic rays would have a tendency to travel along the lines of the lattice, so that they wouldn't show up equally in all directions. And this is something that can be checked using current technology.

There are a couple of caveats. First, this technique would only identify a certain type of simulation - and we could be living in one that's constructed completely differently.

Second, the preferential travel of cosmic rays would only show up if the lattice cut off is the same as the GZK cut off. This occurs when the lattice spacing is about 10^-12 femtometers; if it's much smaller than that, there's no way of knowing.

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uh, yea, discuss this shizz
 

Xblade13

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If we were in a giant simulation, that would be...creepy. o_O

I think if they answer that question with a yes, then everybody will flip out.

Also, it would bring up the morality of making simulated worlds on our computers.
 

Luap

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If our existence was just a computer simulation, we wouldn't be able to know how the computer we are on works. The laws of our simulated universe could be different from what the real universe is like (slightly or significantly), if that real universe even had laws. Our universe's laws could even be completely made up for the inhabitants of the real universe's enjoyment.

But, hey, maybe God is just our programmer. And if you believe in him, he'll print out a picture of you when you die. And if you don't, he deletes us from the recycling bin.
 

Taylor

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that could be kind of neat but i feel like scientists are just kinda fucking around here.
 

Solar

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i never understood the fascination regarding these sort of questions

i'd rather live my life, "real" or otherwise, then waste it away dwelling on such matters
 

dr.korytco

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Well, I'm a fan of holographic universe theories . But it's usually dismissed as new age bull...
 

Wehrmacht

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i never understood the fascination regarding these sort of questions

i'd rather live my life, "real" or otherwise, then waste it away dwelling on such matters

if we really are living in a simulation i would like to know, but even if we are it doesn't invalidate all the experiences we've had as human beings.
 

Cosmic+Amarna

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if we really are living in a simulation i would like to know, but even if we are it doesn't invalidate all the experiences we've had as human beings.

Right. Simulations simulate things: Life. It doesn't degrade the experience in any way.

I do think the universe and everything in it is a simulation of sorts.
 
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Solar

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if we really are living in a simulation i would like to know, but even if we are it doesn't invalidate all the experiences we've had as human beings.

but are understanding of simulations are limited to this "simulation" then. plus if we are in one, who knows how much power people in the outside world grasp? and all these terms are extremely subjective too, who knows how much weight do they hold in the "real" world? etc etc

see? that sort of thinking is inherently limited and i find it time-wasting but w/e

not dismissing the specifics of the article posted, no, but the whole simulation theory discussion as a whole
 

ajmrowland

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And yet, scientists also say that every universe and dimension can be seen if you separate particles or something like that.
 

Nayru's Love

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Or maybe we really are in some Matrix, and the designers of it are introducing these concepts to us as a means to prevent self-awareness
 

dr.korytco

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Computer is a concept. If this is some sort of virtual reality it doesn't need to be a computer or even virtual, that just might be a front. I don't have the imagination or creativity to see what else it could be. But if the universe is some sort of data that doesn't necessarily mean it has to be a computer as we understand one to be. Nothing that we see as data as we truly understand it to be. Most things we base things on are not under the grand assumption that it's computer data.

We are so convinced of reality, simply because of our own seemingly isolated systems that we live within.

It may appear to be like a computer , but we are just studying systems and we do not fully know what other systems there may be outside of our own. I'm beginning to truly believe that out side of our span of knowledge, universe doesn't even have to truly make sense. All of that we know may just be very simple abstractions to something that doesn't have a true form, or order out side of OUR systems .

We have no true way of proving anything outside of what we know to be systems and we never will. And we will never be able to measure anything outside our systems. All we could comprehend is that some beings in our own systems seem to be extra dimensional .

All we can comprehend is our own systems and their functions or their substituted functions based on how we perceive and measure reality. Everything we see could very well have another function if you change a system here or there within the "school" of systems. A little , minute change in any constant of our reality would have very serious ramifications. Reality is built on interfaces , observation action and measurement.

Conspiracy nuts will tell you that UFOs have technologies that bend our rules of science like play dough. But respectively it's conspiracy. Change facts, change knowledge, discover a new fact, no matter how strenuous or how contrived or how creative the means, you change reality and every system of reality and knowledge based within it. It's a matter of MEASUREMENT and Perspective.


If these extra dimensional, hyper intelligent beings exist they may have changed reality on every level that we know it to be.

Some systems of knowledge may have the same meaning or significance , but may have more meaning or significance as they've learned more. Evolving every system and changing the laws of science even as constants. Such as our silly conception of what a computer is. Reality being a computer within a computer gives us way too much credit. It almost makes us god. Reality may seem to be a computer, even act as one . That doesn't say anything. It may have similar meaning, value , similar functions but that does not limit the universe and unknown to our limited minds and knowledge. That does not mean that there aren't other systems of reality beyond our own or other functions for our systems. Or other functions for what we think we know ,and hold as knowledge or measured observations.



That's why pseudo philosophers believe that we are limited by subjective fields of consciousness. And they put a heavy emphasis on the observer and systems within reality.

On a level most people won't look to, there are even life forms on our earth in our dimensions that actually live by different rules than we do and arguably only live in our dimensions partly and partly in another.

There are theories that we are multidimensional and orchestrated beings . That there are extra dimensional, pan dimensional beings out there. And that a extra dimensional being would have hyper communication, intelligence within our very own dimensions. I know it sounds crazy and I'm just musing now. But I wonder if there is any research into organisms that appear to have extra senses than our own . Even organisms we all ignore.

Ever hear of cross dimensional beings? Maybe it happens more than we realize. Some people don't think cross dimensional beings is possible because of barriers between time and space , dimensions. Some do...

At the end of the day no one really knows. If you simply alter the electromagnetic field of any object you can change it. If you simply alter DNA with very specific sound and light frequency you can change it. Russians figured that out as of last year.

DNA being changed in a vacuum outside our "systems" , in a limited way. Still in our own but it shows that things can evolve or change simply based on what system you put them in . The universe changes to us, the more aware we think we are, and the more we think we discover outside of our limited very minute knowledge.

We are limited by our physical minds and bodies and our physical laws. Teleportation is a quantum non physical science. Einstein called the physical a mirage, the grand father of time science.

We are limited by our physical laws and way of thinking because our systems of reality are isolated to physical interfaces if you would and physical laws, physical facts. We are hard science, physical thinkers. Only now that we newly dive deeply into quantum sciences will our universe change .

Our brain has many systems in which information is abstracted based on PATTERNS. That doesn't mean our brains comprehend or are truly able to see reality as it is within our isolated systems.

The only true reality is of the physical mind, physical brain, physical body. The only true reality is I think there for I am . For human beings that is . That is the only thing we can rely on in a physical reality centered in physical interactions, physical results. If we evolved for centuries as quantum thinkers we would have likely left behind the physical ages ago.

I think there for I am because reality will never evolve beyond our subjective fields until our subjective fields evolve. Reality is solely based on any given observer.

( I know I take both sides lol. I did it intentionally)
 
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Orion

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On a level most people won't look to, there are even life forms on our earth in our dimensions that actually live by different rules than we do and arguably only live in our dimensions partly and partly in another.
Haha, sure thing.

There are theories that we are multidimensional and orchestrated beings.
Theory is a bad word to use here, since a hell of a lot of it is still conjecture, and that which isn't total speculation is usually grounded in favoured but still unproven hypotheses.

But I wonder if there is any research into organisms that appear to have extra senses than our own . Even organisms we all ignore.
We already know there are creatures who have senses more precise than our own, that perceive the world in greater spectrums than we can, and even observe phenomena we can't. They're still natural creatures, though.

At the end of the day no one really knows. If you simply alter the electromagnetic field of any object you can change it.
So? On a technical level the same goes for if you change the pressure, temperature, luminosity, etc of the space around an animal. Such a statement is meaningless because it doesn't induce any miraculous alteration of a subject.

We are limited by our physical minds and bodies and our physical laws. Teleportation is a quantum non physical science.
You just said that our extremely minute knowledge is still in the process of expanding, but you consider yourself well-versed or confident enough to to explicitly claim that? Our understanding of microscopic teleportation is only just in its infancy, and its not even 'true' teleportation by any conventional, popular definition.

We are limited by our physical laws and way of thinking because our systems of reality are isolated to physical interfaces if you would and physical laws, physical facts. We are hard science, physical thinkers. Only now that we newly dive deeply into quantum sciences will our universe change.
The universe doesn't change, our knowledge of it does. The quantum world is still the physical world.

The only true reality is of the physical mind, physical brain, physical body. The only true reality is I think there for I am . For human beings that is . That is the only thing we can rely on in a physical reality centered in physical interactions, physical results. If we evolved for centuries as quantum thinkers we would have likely left behind the physical ages ago.
Again, no we wouldn't, and we couldn't. We're small creatures living in small durations, dealing with the world in small sizes. None of that is suited to the quantum.
 

ajmrowland

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Or maybe we're all the characters in a video game god created ;)

*cookie to whoever gets that reference*
 

Nostalgia

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I'm sorry but this whole thing is easy prey for Conspiracy Keanu.
 
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