Why Kairi -can- have two Nobodies

[nehar890]

I think it makes perfect sense because xion looks like kairi in KH1 when the storm happened and namine looks like kairi in KH2.

 

[Angel]

Since, you know, Xion if she's Kairi's Nobody was likely created on the night of the storm - from Kairi, as opposed to Naminé - which brings me to my next point.

I see one flaw in this.

Xion would've been created BEFORE Roxas, although she is one number below him.

This means that in order for this to be true:

A. She was on the run from the Organization from her birth,

OR

B. The Organization simply never found her until after Roxas had joined.

And they seem to have got to him pretty quick, because I got the feeling that Xemnas had somehow anticipated that Roxas was going to be born.

 

[Nutari]

it MAKES TOTAL sense that Kairi had two nobodies, one on the night of the storm(Xion) then one when Sora's and Kairis hearts fuzed. Wow, it does make sense when u type it out...

 

[Swxpert]

see the way i can see it goes the being is made of body, heart, and soul, and the nobody is made of the latter two parts so kairi+sora have

Roxas=Soras body and soul
Namine= Kairis Body and soul
Xion=Kairis Body/soras soul
???=Soras body/kairis soul-man that would be scary

 

[ace_tracker5]

see the way i can see it goes the being is made of body, heart, and soul, and the nobody is made of the latter two parts so kairi+sora have.

See, I agree with you, but I think that Namine is just her soul. I think that the game might journey into no soul and no heart.
A "soul" might be made up of only memories, but no emotion and that would explain Namines importance and Why memory is so important in this series (just a theory on the soul).

What the real question is is what Kairi was when the heartless nabbed her in the first. Maybe just a body and neither heart nor soul.
Her immediate recognition of Sora can be linked to the heart.

 

[Clowde]

see the way i can see it goes the being is made of body, heart, and soul, and the nobody is made of the latter two parts so kairi+sora have.

See, I agree with you, but I think that Namine is just her soul. I think that the game might journey into no soul and no heart.
A "soul" might be made up of only memories, but no emotion and that would explain Namines importance and Why memory is so important in this series (just a theory on the soul).

.....Namine is made of NOTHING. So Nothing + NOTHING = Namine

What the real question is is what Kairi was when the heartless nabbed her in the first. Maybe just a body and neither heart nor soul.
Her immediate recognition of Sora can be linked to the heart.

The heartless never "nabbed" her. Her heart fled to Sora for protection.

 

[ace_tracker5]

Well you don't know she is made of nothing, that is a quick assumption.
And "nabbed" means kidnapped- the entire first game plot, duh

It could have been a convenient plot set up where she has no life energy and is just without a heart yet not a Nobody
or it could be she has no soul or heart.

 

[ace_tracker5]

Oh and In the trailer, Does evil looking man look too much like the real ansem? (off topic). I think Ansem is not he's cracked up to be (more plot twists)

 

[Smile]

I see one flaw in this.

Xion would've been created BEFORE Roxas, although she is one number below him.

This means that in order for this to be true:

A. She was on the run from the Organization from her birth,

OR

B. The Organization simply never found her until after Roxas had joined.

And they seem to have got to him pretty quick, because I got the feeling that Xemnas had somehow anticipated that Roxas was going to be born.

We can't assume Roxas being found immediately is the general rule - like you said, it seems they knew he was coming. They knew Sora turned into a Heartless, already had forces in Twilight Town to detect Roxas's appearance there, and then we have all the shit about Ven and Terra messing this up further.
So we have Xion probably not being found immediately, especially if the Org, like AtW, thought Kairi wouldn't create a Nobody on her own, leaving her to wonder around until she was found under some other "natural" reasons.

Then we have the fact we don't know Xion's own story.
She could've refused drafting;
She could've been used like Naminé as an experiments subject;
Seeing the possibilities for a connection to Aqua as well, she might not have been "stabilized" despite being around for a while until whatever happened happened.
And of course we do have Roxas being a possible catalyst to her joining the org, either because Xemnas didn't want her to join until Roxas did, or because Xion only cared to join when Roxas did.

As I've stated numerous times before - the time when Xion joined the Org is the last reason with which to base her not being Kairi's Nobody; more than enough ways around it.

Namine= Kairis Body and soul

What? No, Kairi's B + S Was fine and dandy it was left without a Heart, but never turned into a Nobody.
You know, especially since Naminé was born from Sora.

Xion=Kairis Body/soras soul
???=Soras body/kairis soul-man that would be scary

No and no o_o besides the fact that those Bodies and Souls were used to either make up other Nobodies and Kairi. Roxas has Sora's B+S, so Xion couldn't have Sora's soul, and no other Nobody could have his Body.

See, I agree with you, but I think that Namine is just her soul.

Just a soul = DEATH.
The Body and Soul go together.
Namine has neither.

What the real question is is what Kairi was when the heartless nabbed her in the first. Maybe just a body and neither heart nor soul.
Her immediate recognition of Sora can be linked to the heart.

.....go replay KH1. This has all been explained. Bluntly.

Well you don't know she is made of nothing, that is a quick assumption.

The SARs, being the only thing we really have to go on about this, say so nicely.
Kairi = Kairi's B+S+Heart.
Roxas = Sora's B+S.
Sora = Sora's Heart.
What does that leave Namine with? You get my point, I hope.

It could have been a convenient plot set up where she has no life energy and is just without a heart yet not a Nobody

Yeah, you know, because THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED.

 

[AWOL]

Xion can't be Kairi's Nobody. At all. BBS happens ten YEARS before the FIRST game. It's impossible. Not even Nomura would think to screw up the laws of the real world (physics) in the game. Unless it's magic, which I doubt.

EDIT: Too much...

 

[ruinandchaos85]

Xion can't be Kairi's Nobody. At all. BBS happens ten YEARS before the FIRST game. It's impossible. Not even Nomura would think to screw up the laws of the real world (physics) in the game. Unless it's magic, which I doubt.

EDIT: Too much...

Xion's from 358/2 Days, not BBS. Days takes place between KH and KHII.

 

[Swxpert]

Xion's from 358/2 Days, not BBS. Days takes place between KH and KHII.

i think AWOL is a bit confused

 

[DaisyDuck]

Despite the flaming I know is coming I'm going to say this again anyway.

Diz originally believed that Namine was the one made on DI. He said the process of a POH losing her heart created a very unstable "Heartless" and Nobody. The "Heartless" or more correctly "an existence solely of the heart" was what Sora encounters in the cave and takes up residence in his heart.

Diz later back tracks and says that Roxas and Namine were created at the same time.

To my mind (which has been established to view the world completely differently from anyone else on this forum), it makes more sense that Diz was right the first time, and Namine was the one created when Kairi lost her heart on DI, which would explain why she's super unique even among Nobodies, and that Xion was the one created when Sora unlocked his and Kairi's hearts in HB.

This would:

a) fit with the notion that Xion was around before CoM
b) be a fair explanation of why she can use the keyblade

Were it not for Nomura's comments on the matter in Another Report, I'd honestly believe this to be the case. Although I'm still actually hoping he's got something more original in store.

 

[Swxpert]

Just a soul = DEATH.
The Body and Soul go together.
Namine has neither.



.[/B]

that makes no sense Namine is a Nobody, there for she has everthing but Heart

 

[DaisyDuck]

Despite the flaming I know is coming I'm going to say this again anyway.

Diz originally believed that Namine was the one made on DI. He said the process of a POH losing her heart created a very unstable "Heartless" and Nobody. The "Heartless" or more correctly "an existence solely of the heart" was what Sora encounters in the cave and takes up residence in his heart.

Diz later back tracks and says that Roxas and Namine were created at the same time.

To my mind (which has been established to view the world completely differently from anyone else on this forum), it makes more sense that Diz was right the first time, and Namine was the one created when Kairi lost her heart on DI, which would explain why she's super unique even among Nobodies, and that Xion was the one created when Sora unlocked his and Kairi's hearts in HB.

This would:

a) fit with the notion that Xion was around before CoM
b) be a fair explanation of why she can use the keyblade

Were it not for Nomura's comments on the matter in Another Report, I'd honestly believe this to be the case. Although I'm still actually hoping he's got something more original in store.

 

[Fruity_luigi]

Although I stated in my thread I wasn't going to theorize anymore, I want to ask one question SA......

Whats your definition of a nobody?

 

[Smile]

Xion can't be Kairi's Nobody. At all. BBS happens ten YEARS before the FIRST game. It's impossible. Not even Nomura would think to screw up the laws of the real world (physics) in the game. Unless it's magic, which I doubt.

EDIT: Too much...

...

Xion's from 358/2 Days, not BBS. Days takes place between KH and KHII.

This.
Xion was born any time before CoM. That gives her quite a while to possibly be born as Kairi's Nobody.

Diz originally believed that Namine was the one made on DI. He said the process of a POH losing her heart created a very unstable "Heartless" and Nobody. The "Heartless" or more correctly "an existence solely of the heart" was what Sora encounters in the cave and takes up residence in his heart.

Was it ever even confirmed she was just a Heart then? It would tie in with her disappearing into his Body, but I don't think we can be sure of that. Existences of only Hearts were thus far seemed to possess every last bit of lively energy they had as Whole Beings but Kairi there was listless, which makes me believe the moment she disappeared was the moment her Heart left her Body, leaving the body to go poof into the Darkness.

To my mind (which has been established to view the world completely differently from anyone else on this forum), it makes more sense that Diz was right the first time, and Namine was the one created when Kairi lost her heart on DI, which would explain why she's super unique even among Nobodies, and that Xion was the one created when Sora unlocked his and Kairi's hearts in HB.

I'd have agreed with you on that a while ago, but as you said yourself -

Were it not for Nomura's comments on the matter in Another Report, I'd honestly believe this to be the case. Although I'm still actually hoping he's got something more original in store.

I really supported that notion for Namine since it explained what she said in the original CoM, about being alone for so long.
Though again, while possible, I don't think Xion is Kairi's Nobody. Nomura all but said as much when addressed about them revealing Xion's face.

a) fit with the notion that Xion was around before CoM

So would be her being the one born on the night of the storm.

b) be a fair explanation of why she can use the keyblade

Only you can claim that being a PoH was what let Kairi use the Keyblade Riku gave her, which means that Xion wouldn't have to have a direct relation to Sora at all for her to use Roxas's Keyblade; all she'd have to do would be born from Kairi.

So, no flame, but both what you tried to explain by having her born on HB aren't really crucial.

that makes no sense Namine is a Nobody, there for she has everthing but Heart

Uh yeah go reread the Secret Ansem Reports, and practice your math.
Sora + Kairi = 2 * (B + S + H sets)
Activate Heart Unlocker on Sora.
(Sora - Roxas) + Kairi + Roxas = Heart + (B + S + H set) + (B + S).
Namine doesn't fit into the equation at all, unless you say you're adding nothing to both sides.

Yeah I can't believe I explained it like this either. I blame the calculus class I just came back from

Although I stated in my thread I wasn't going to theorize anymore, I want to ask one question SA......

Whats your definition of a nobody?

Regular Nobody? B + S left behind when the Heart moved on, probably to become a Heartless.
Special Nobody? Anything and everything that was created in the general process of a Heart leaving a Body, and at the end of said process if neither a Heartless (like Sora) nor the Heart. It does not mean we're dealing with the B + S, mind, as is the case with Naminé - Kairi's Soul left Sora's Body; Naminé has no B + S of her own, nor does she possess Kairi's Heart in any manner. Still a Nobody by today's definitions? Still a Nobody.

 

[DaisyDuck]

...

Was it ever even confirmed she was just a Heart then? It would tie in with her disappearing into his Body, but I don't think we can be sure of that. Existences of only Hearts were thus far seemed to possess every last bit of lively energy they had as Whole Beings but Kairi there was listless, which makes me believe the moment she disappeared was the moment her Heart left her Body, leaving the body to go poof into the Darkness.

Officially? I have no idea. I think that what Sora encountered was just her heart and not her whole being, because we don't see a heart leave her body as we we do when we see Mr. Generic Enpeesee is attacked by a heartless in Traverse Town.

I have always wondered exactly how and where Malificent found her body though.

Though again, while possible, I don't think Xion is Kairi's Nobody. Nomura all but said as much when addressed about them revealing Xion's face.

And here I thought I was implying she was Sora's. Incidentally, what Nomura-ism are you referring too? I don't recall a comment like that about her reveal.

So would be her being the one born on the night of the storm.

Yes but having her born at HB is more plausible for why she wasn't brought in until after Roxas was.

Only you can claim that being a PoH was what let Kairi use the Keyblade Riku gave her, which means that Xion wouldn't have to have a direct relation to Sora at all for her to use Roxas's Keyblade; all she'd have to do would be born from Kairi.

Actually, I don't, by that logic all of the PoH are at the very least potential Keyblade wielders, which isn't to say they aren't. I have other reasons for why I believe Kairi is a keyblade wielder, but I'm not going there today, as it requires a view of the games that most people on this forum would rather slit their wrists with the broken shards of game disk than acknowledge as plausible.

Anyway, Xion being born at HB is a nice explanation of why she can use the KK specifically, which is typically associated with Sora.

Again, I'm not saying this is in fact the truth of the matter. I'm just saying it makes sense. At the very least it makes about as much sense as claiming Xion's height means she's some form of Aqua.

 

[Smile]

Officially? I have no idea. I think that what Sora encountered was just her heart and not her whole being, because we don't see a heart leave her body as we we do when we see Mr. Generic Enpeesee is attacked by a heartless in Traverse Town.

We never really got to see Sora's own Heart leave his Body, only Kairi's Heart leave it. I think you're looking at it too, how to put it, literally.

I have always wondered exactly how and where Malificent found her body though.

Yey Coded? Iono.

And here I thought I was implying she was Sora's. Incidentally, what Nomura-ism are you referring too? I don't recall a comment like that about her reveal.

Two comments by him, one relating specifically to Xion, where he says that people that think they understood everything just from the trailers are dead wrong and then he asks what happened to Xion's Heart. Seeing how we already know what happened to Kairi's, that leaves Xion's identity to be someone else.
Nomura wouldn't really release a trailer where Xion admits to looking like Kairi if she really was Kairi's Nobody; it's too easy.

Yes but having her born at HB is more plausible for why she wasn't brought in until after Roxas was.

Again - her joining after Roxas did is one of the last things we need to worry about. And her being born on HB is all but not going to happen.
She can have Aqua explaining her; as it stands now, Namine has no other means of being explained save for being the one born on HB, not because of how much existence she has - but because of her powers over Sora's Memories.

Actually, I don't, by that logic all of the PoH are at the very least potential Keyblade wielders, which isn't to say they aren't. I have other reasons for why I believe Kairi is a keyblade wielder, but I'm not going there today, as it requires a view of the games that most people on this forum would rather slit their wrists with the broken shards of game disk than acknowledge as plausible.

Ah, I missed your ability to respect other people's opinions.

Anyway, Xion being born at HB is a nice explanation of why she can use the KK specifically, which is typically associated with Sora.

Only we don't know that she specifically need to wield the KK. We know she can, not that it has to be that one.

Again, I'm not saying this is in fact the truth of the matter. I'm just saying it makes sense.

And - contradicts the truths of the matter.

At the very least it makes about as much sense as claiming Xion's height means she's some form of Aqua.

Yeah, you're as pleasant as you were before, DD.
I'll remind this to you next time someone says Xion's height is a means to say she did not come from Aqua and have you rush in to my defense in the matter. Since you know, height doesn't matter either way, going by what you're saying

 

[SilverJ-17]

I see.. Yeah, the whole fact that Namine was based off of Kairi's Heart and Sora's Body and Soul leaves it open for Xion, especailly since a "Special Nobody" doesn't need/ need a complete Body and Soul. Hmm, speaking of which, I wonder if Roxas is actuaully Sora's [bcomplete[/b]] Body and Soul or did Namine's creation take some of it.

Oh, and ten years or not, I still can see a connection to Aqua, via Room of Sleep. Maybe, part of her Body and Soul does still exist within that armor or whatever, trapped for some reason that will be explained with time.. or maybe she was still alive around the time of KH1, but couldn't wield, but some odd circumstances reawake the wielding power, when she or at least part of her became a nobody. I'm not saying anything I just said is true (and it probably isn't), but who knows. Just because BBS was ten years ago doesn't mean that there was some way for her Body and Soul to still exist, ten years later, in some shape or form.