Why is Final Fantasy XV an Action RPG?

[Hirokey123]

Action combat is much more accessible. Your average gamer finds turn-based combat to be time consuming and dull...

I'm not so sure you can say that with certainty.

Action combat and Turn-based combat require two very different skill sets, and I'd say turn-based is much more accessible because of it. With turn-based combat you have ample time to learn and plan. It's easier to read numbers and do a bit of math than it is to understand mechanics like flinch locking, timed dodging, comboing, etc... Turn-based is much methodical in its process and doesn't require things like honing your reflexes or considering how your moves and what not work in a 3D space.

In fact generally speaking in a series with both turn-based and ARPG based games the turn-based ones reach a larger market and sell better. As for it being "dull" that completely depends on the individual game. Turn-based can be basically as fast paced and hectic as ARPGs are it just depends on the game.

 

[Magnus]

Let's put it like this then; classic ATB is dull and doesn't require any skill at all.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

I'm not so sure you can say that with certainty.

Action combat and Turn-based combat require two very different skill sets, and I'd say turn-based is much more accessible because of it. With turn-based combat you have ample time to learn and plan. It's easier to read numbers and do a bit of math than it is to understand mechanics like flinch locking, timed dodging, comboing, etc... Turn-based is much methodical in its process and doesn't require things like honing your reflexes or considering how your moves and what not work in a 3D space.

In fact generally speaking in a series with both turn-based and ARPG based games the turn-based ones reach a larger market and sell better. As for it being "dull" that completely depends on the individual game. Turn-based can be basically as fast paced and hectic as ARPGs are it just depends on the game.

But I wasn't talking about one series. I'm talking about the market in general. One need only look at what games are selling big right now to see that there is a larger interest in action combat compared to traditional turn-based combat.

 

[KingdomSlayer2]

But I wasn't talking about one series. I'm talking about the market in general. One need only look at what games are selling big right now to see that there is a larger interest in action combat compared to traditional turn-based combat.

That's like saying Lightning Returns sold more than XIII and XIII-2 combined just because it was an ARPG, even though that's not the case.

 

[Magnus]

Did you miss the part where she said she wasn't talking about one series? ARPG's sell better than turn-based JRPG's in general (and most of them are handheld only and usually have nostalgic appeal like Bravely Default).

 

[Hirokey123]

Well actually if you look at market turn-based rpgs are outselling ARPGs by kind of a ridiculous amount mainly because there are many more turn-based RPG games than there are ARPG. Almost all of the biggest RPG series in the world are turn-based ones. That's not to say there aren't action ARPGs within those series but typically they are relegated to spinoffs or normally don't sell nearly as well. Is there a healthy market for ARPGs games, most definitely but there is an equally healthy if not larger market for turn-based RPGs.

Let's put it like this then; classic ATB is dull and doesn't require any skill at all.

On the subject of skill that's not even remotely true in the slightest and again "dull" is going to depend on the game. Classic ATB can be just as skillful and fast paced as any ARPG can. But they will again use very different skill sets and a lot of that is going to come down to personal preference.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Well actually if you look at market turn-based rpgs are outselling ARPGs by kind of a ridiculous amount mainly because there are many more turn-based RPG games than there are ARPG. Almost all of the biggest RPG series in the world are turn-based ones. That's not to say there aren't action ARPGs within those series but typically they are relegated to spinoffs or normally don't sell nearly as well. Is there a healthy market for ARPGs games, most definitely but there is an equally healthy if not larger market for turn-based RPGs.

We must be in different worlds because Bloodborne, Batman: Arkham Knight, and The Witcher 3 all vastly outperformed all turn-based RPGs released this year by leaps and bounds. I want you to tell me which turn-based RPG has even reached the same level of success as those games that has released this year or even last year.

 

[Chuman]

We must be in different worlds because Bloodborne, Batman: Arkham Knight, and The Witcher 3 all vastly outperformed all turn-based RPGs released this year by leaps and bounds. I want you to tell me which turn-based RPG has even reached the same level of success as those games that has released this year or even last year.

Is batman arkham knight considered a true ARPG? where my ARPG batman game at?

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Is batman arkham knight considered a true ARPG? where my ARPG batman game at?

Technically it is considered action/adventure 8D

 

[Chuman]

Technically it is considered action/adventure 8D

Gotham is a bad place to live if ten blocks is an adventure lmao

 

[KeybladeLordSora]

Gotham is a bad place to live if ten blocks is an adventure lmao

Gotham is a bad place to live in general

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Gotham is a bad place to live if ten blocks is an adventure lmao

Ten blocks and a whole night of bombs, racing, bombs, racing, racing, and like 11 villains to take down. Did I mention racing?

 

[Chuman]

Ten blocks and a whole night of bombs, racing, bombs, racing, racing, and like 11 villains to take down. Did I mention racing?

You forgot un-batman, clanky tank battles. And racing.

 

[KeybladeLordSora]

You forgot un-batman, clanky tank battles. And racing.

Don't forget the racing, guys.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

But anyways, XV. I'm not sure if there is much else that can be said on this topic.

 

[Magnus]

On the subject of skill that's not even remotely true in the slightest and again "dull" is going to depend on the game. Classic ATB can be just as skillful and fast paced as any ARPG can. But they will again use very different skill sets and a lot of that is going to come down to personal preference.

I beg to differ.

Real turn-based systems like CTB (FFX) require the player to think strategically and plan ahead.

Action-based system like AXB (FFXV) require quick reflexes, get an overview of the current situation and quickly adapt to the environment.

ATB is a weird compromise that is set up in a way that would encourage the player to take their time and think things through, but as the name of the system suggest the game still stays active forcing the player to make hasty decisions. It's counter productive. And please don't tell me that "you can set it to wait!!!" because then it's no longer ATB as the defining feature of the system is lost.

Final Fantasy games in general are super easy compared to other games in the genre, but not even the most difficult bosses in the classic games require skillful use of the actual battle system to beat. The solution is almost always to just grind.

 

[Sakide]

One of the things that kind of kept me from playing the original FFVII (apart from the graphics, missing voice acting and the fact that I don't own a PS1) is the turn-based combat. I did love Crisis Core. While it featured rather slow combat, it was still more dynamic than any turn-based RPG. I don't actually loathe turn-based - I've played at least some pretty awesome turn-based RPGs, like the Dragon Quest IX remake and of course Pokemon... But real-time battles just feel more intense and realistic, and they blend better into the story in my opinion because they don't elongate it that much. Actually, they don't necessarily even have to be separated from the actual story.

Well, the combat in FFXV looks pretty awesome. I haven't analyzed every detail of it, but if they did something like this for the FFVII remake too, I'd be happy.

 

[Crazee]

This forum is primarily a Kingdom Hearts forum, and so obviously most people here prefer ARPGs or even vastly prefer them. I pretty much just lurk here to see opinions on Final Fantasy announcements. I've never even played a Kingdom Hearts game. I did play Crisis Core and enjoyed it a lot but I haven't played it in a while.

I guess I registered primarily to speak my mind on this...I think Turn based RPGs and ARPGs are different sub genres. They require different skill sets, different design principles etc. You can be a beast at one type of game and pretty average or terrible at a different type of game. If someone has played different variations of turn based combat for...20 years it's hard to suddenly adjust to playing in real time. I've never liked action games...ever. I never play them. Well, except for 2D run and gun platformers. So when my favorite RPG franchise changes gameplay styles, it feels like...a new Mario game being Action Adventure. It's just jarring.

And I hated the FFXV demo. Part of it's just throwing me into a new gameplay style I've never played before without getting to hone my skills slowly through the course of the game...it just felt like a hack and slash and I hate those games with a passion. I'll probably buy the game and maybe I'll get used to the combat like I did eventually with Crisis Core .

I think eventually nostalgia will lead to turn based gameplay getting it's niche in the market...like how we still get 2D platformers. Big budget cinematic ARPGs, low budget turn based RPGs like Nintendo's New Super Mario Bros or something. Why can't we do both?