Where Kingdom Hearts is failing

[Elysium]

I think when KH4 will be released, people will look at KH3 like we are looking at KH2 right now. When KH2 got released, there were a lot of criticism if I remember correctly.

This is partly why I enjoyed KH3's release, because the fanbase always do this thing where the new game is the holy grail and the old is inferior. Well, to me, KH2 was inferior to 1 immediately and that opinion hasn't changed (I think 3 is superior to 2 as well, although I agree with the point that 2 has better pacing because it has a midpoint and doubtless it has better original worlds / content thanks in large part to the FF characters that are nonexistent in 3), but I had to go through years of it being treated like the best thing that ever graced the PS2. KH2 finally getting put under the microscope was refreshing.

I don't believe the casuals' reaction to 3 is more divisive than the reaction to 2 was back when it came out, having lived through both. I think social media's existence is all that's different; Twitter pushes hatred for everything, even what is popular. On Twitter, there is never such a thing as a "generally unanimous" opinion. No matter the person or subject, someone will inevitably treat it like it, or they, are the Devil incarnate and their histrionic commentary will be echoed 10x over with retweets. It makes minority opinions feel like they're very common. And there's both an up and a down side to that, as far is comes to how Square will respond to feedback going forward.

 

[Launchpad]

Thank you. lol. This board is a particularly mad tea party that hasn't yet embraced the fantabulous geniosity of KH2. We're all entitled to our opinion and all but you guys... are some nutsy cookoos if you think KH3 will have the same legacy as KH2. The whole point of KH3 is that it's bad. It's a tonsil, filtering out the shadows. The average person who plays KH3 can probably tell, something's a little off here. KH4 WILL be waaay better than KH3. Count on it. Belieeeve.

one of the dumber posts I've read on here in a while thank you for the content.

If you were online in 2006, you'd have heard every bad thing people had to say about KH2. I don't even need to explain it. I was disappointed in KH2. It was a popular opinion. 'Something's a little off' was the exact sentiment.

 

[Dark Rot]

You're welcome, always a displeasure reading your rotten posts too. I'm on the same internet as you, and I've seen it all. I was disappointed in KH2. It's still a wonderful piece of game art and if you think KH3 even comes close to approaching it, well I'm sorry that you are that way. KH4 will be better than KH3.

 

[Elysium]

@DarkRot: I think KH2 is a decent game although I had a lot of problems with it. I personally don't feel that it's better than KH3... Well, I think the problem is the discussion of the two is complicated. I think both KH2 and KH3 are flawed, but their flaws are entirely different and it depends on how much those flaws bother you or what you prioritize rather. KH2's major flaw (lack of platforming, poor level design) really, really irked me whereas KH3's worst flaw (poor original worlds / content), while it does bother me, didn't ruin the experience for me. I suppose because Disney is one of my primary reasons for following this and the Disney levels were pretty amazing all things considered in 3 compared to 2. The thing is I still want great original worlds, too--and FF characters!--but I guess it does hold less weight for me if I had to pit the two things against each other, personally. That said, you have a right to your opinion, too.

And I agree that it's very possible KH4 will be better than KH3. Disney might have pulled back on their restraint, they hopefully won't lose a year of development time, and they don't have a bunch of plotlines Nomura has to tie up that everyone could've foreseen from a mile away he wouldn't wrap up too successfully considering past experience with this franchise, they'll be on PS5 now with even less limits, etc. Plus, there was the fact Nomura had a clear disinterest in KH3's story--like he was already wanting to move on but had to finish the past plots--which won't be a factor in KH4 either.

 

[Dark Rot]

I respect your opinion Elysium. I just think that, as a whole, KH2 does something magical beyond just being another Kingdom Hearts. It's about something (the body). The Nobodies and original worlds, and the use of Underworld and Tron in particular, build up to something that, to me, is grander than the sum of its parts. Plus, I find the battle system incredibly clever and while it took me years to appreciate, it's such a neat and surprising evolution of KH1's system.

While the lack of original worlds was also my least favorite thing about KH3, the deeper issue is a lack of focus, and purpose. The Power of Waking and all that is never successful visualized, it all feels like a lot of huff for nothing. It really feels like a product of obligation... because as far as we know from Nomura's interview... it was! Compare how psyched he was about KH2 all those years ago to his updates during KH3's production. And the stuff he was excited about (getting people to love Riku more, playable Xehanort and Eraqus prologue, full Scala where you can do anything) didn't make it in. He was fired from his dream game, that he repeatedly said HAD to come first, and I think it shows. It feels like a lot of filler.

Like you said, there is a sense of disinterest in the goings-on in KH3's story. It's all setting up something (presumably/hopefully) better. Sure, KH2 did introduce Xehanort without any payoff there, but it's a marvel within itself. I'm beginning to appreciate aspects of KH3 more, in particular there's something eerie/creepy about it that other games don't have. But. I have to believe we're going someplace better. KH is emotional, and KH3 is full of hurt. But the pain is healing, and the artist is still a genius after all.