Because Namine existing in KH2 after being introduced in CoM without being mentioned in KH1 is bad why?
We're not talking about Naminé here. Her situation isn't bad. Why? Because the event that gave her birth didn't happen until the end of the first game and she appeared after in a continuation of the story instead of being thrown in the middle of two games where a hint should have sufficed. It surely didn't stop Roxas from having such by the end of
CoM. The staff also didn't have to create some real apparent half-assed excuse to not let her disrupt what's already there because nothing was written with her in mind.
Oh I blame Kairi's wasted plot potential more than enough on the staff. You wrote a character who's part of the leading trio and you can't even give her proper insight and depth, and keep her as a patheticly passive plot device? What gives?
The difference is that what we do get to see of Kairi as a person I don't like. And that's the difference.
And I blame the wasted potential of everyone in behalf of Xion on the staff, Nomura, and Kanemaki. You have a good load of interesting characters with diverse personalities in a group of emotionless beings (or so we think), who the
supposed main character interacts and lives with. And yet, it's discarded because a new "14th member but not really" character that's as cookie-cutter as the other females, who pales in comparison to her one-dimensional peers I feel, gets the screen time for no purpose that couldn't be handled with better options. And what was the time wasted for? Seeing how many woes she has? I don't need to reaffirm my opinion on Xion regarding her existence considering this whole post has it, and I think that's enough to hold anyone over. I didn't find her curious to watch as a person or anything else. Being nice doesn't have to mean you're boring to watch or have no eye-catching quirks. Some people can find satisfaction in moe and pity, but I don't.
I can't still for the life of me understand why wasn't the Moogle the 14th. I mean, it only took one word out of his mouth for him to steal the show and be memorable.
So see? You hate Kairi for your own reasons, and I hate Xion for my own reasons. And thus, everyone lived happily ever after.
What would've been the relevant, sans fanservice character development? What good would give you Luxord's background achieve? On the grander level. Unless he was somehow some incarnation that related to the bigger plot - something I doubt - they'd have had no reason to include it in the game.
The novels don't have that obligation to remain plot-oriented so they can give you extra stuff. The games, less so.
I mean, even in CoM it's not like we found out about the Org members' backgrounds, or hell - even why Marluxia really wanted to take over the Organization (Replica program aside, it was because he really was displeased with the "management" and not just because he was power hungry. That's a gem of character development right there).
What's relevant of a game, TV series, anime, and story if they don't flesh out their characters and make the essence of it more
fulfilling? What makes a plot good? What was relevant of Axel when we knew nothing about him? (I find no reason why he keeps appearing, I'll put that out there) How do people feel about him now? Was it worth it? Six of the members are already connected to the past. How could we ever think that Xigbar was involved that heavily and to that extent with Xehanort when we didn't previously? How could we ever believe there might be more to Saïx? Tell me, considering that at the beginning all those characters were in the same position that the other members were/are in. Marluxia stated, at least in the novels, that he's witnessed the other Keyblade warriors in the same vein as Xigbar in
KH2. Did Marluxia really trust Larxene? Why would Larxene not want a Heart? How do other members interact with each other? It speaks lot when after
358/2 Days, fans and people alike
still wonder about the Organization. And don't mind more of them. Nomura could have easily given them plot purpose if he wanted to. And even if he didn't, what's wrong in expanding them in the game? They obviously make a point of still contributing to their existences. And they were obviously fine showing repeated scenes of twilight watching and ice cream eating, which half or more was filler. What good did
that do? There's a
gem of an addition to the series right there.
Might as well cover that with something much more becoming of the game's setting. Which was where? Oh, snap, the Organization's
base. Without them, you wouldn't even have your precious Xion.
Oh. I thought
Days was a
character-oriented game too. Since when did
plot purpose come in? Cause there wasn't much plot until the climax of the game, really. And
358/2 Days being in the KH universe isn't necessary.
Yeah, I don't really feel that. Nothing really contradicts. Xion did indeed get Roxas to leave the Organization since she brought all the doubts the kid should have up to the surface. You might be dissatisfied with Xion being a proxy through which those doubts got to Roxas from Riku, but the fact remains Nomura didn't contradict himself in that regard. Roxas left the Organization BECAUSE of Xion - not FOR Xion. That's quite a big difference right there.
Of course Xion contradicted nothing. She
can't contradict anything, or else everything else would not make sense. I'm dissatisfied
because she didn't need to bring "all the doubts the kid needed to the surface". It was an excuse as the rest of her "importance". His environment and the people he lived with 24/7 could have done so just as easily. He's not living with a bunch of saints. He keeps having recurring dreams of Sora, his best friend's lying to him, etc. Pack that with what I explained below in him actually doing something for himself (hell, even more Ventus could have been added in, or a lot more Xemnas and him) and you have very good sound reasons for him to bounce from that group in the long run. Putting in
358/2 Days itself for a bit (though we're speaking as if it didn't exist yet, or I hope that's how you're taking it) he was the one who took to the thought of ditching the Organization and running away permanently. Yet was
stopped by the other two.
He was the one who questioned the Organization's motives to Axel earlier on, but was shrugged off.
Excuse me for thinking he didn't need a proxy to leave and disliking such a turn out.
And that is where not only do our opinions split paths, but it once again supports my point about expectations. I never expected any of what you said about Roxas. Badass? Bitter? Agressive? I never thought he was like that THE ENTIRE TIME HE WAS IN THE ORGANIZATION. Granted at the end he was and that's why he left, but no one ever said he was like that at the get-go or even somewhere along the way. That would be quite contradictory to his origins, as wlel, being of, lo and behold, two happy-go-lucky puppy-type people.
We didn't see him being stupid or unmotivated either. Even when we have a short scene of all the members in the white meeting room in
KH2 (we don't know in
what time frame it was, mind you) and they closed up on a glaring, serious Roxas you could tell the kid wasn't exactly the happy camper. Not that he couldn't be, naturally, but he definitely wasn't all roses and cherries. Not even remembering his past changed the way he was in the Data Twilight Town. Pack with what he was doing in Deep Dive and him driving his tutorial a lot more than he did the game he was suppose to take over, there's no reason why it would be hard to believe that he didn't sit on his ass, watched the sunset, and ate ice cream all the time without doing anything while letting someone else do so.
Who wasn't even thought of, by the way.
When in the series did it ever say that the people with their
own sense of self had to act like the others they came from? Roxas from the moment he was born was obviously more quiet and introverted, and this was
without memories. If you took that as reality, then Naminé should've been a spitting persona of Kairi. And even if that was the case, it still isn't contradictory because the place they spent their time in molded them into what they would be. Roxas was living with a contrasting influence than the others, and that would build up to his personalty. I see nothing that's "contradicting" here.
could've. But as someone who, Xion or not, sees nothing wrong with Roxas's characterization in Days (egg and chicken, I know).
And that's you.
And that's where I say Xion was put in whereas you say she was the cause. We've been through this.
You've also completely missed the point. You can't seriously think that if Nomura wanted to make a game that covered Roxas' time he wasn't going to do it because he couldn't think of anything else but an insert character that never existed. Who he wasn't even truly behind of at all in terms of the idea. A character who didn't do anything to affect the end of the overall story any differently because it couldn't. Self-contained. It's not that hard to have Roxas continue off from him actively seeking his answers from
KH2 into
358/2 Days. Oh, go search for information? He could have done it. Have the memories flow from Sora into him (and stay there before it was sucked off by...a
certain clone)? He could have done it. Interact with Riku? He could have done it. And it seemed to be the original plan from the get-go. Xion's more of a distraction than anything. You know, like a magnet who hogs what would've went to other objects into itself. There was no point into her creation. It's disappointing that such a character got all the attention for absolutely nothing.
The fact that it wasn't done well makes it all the more damning.
Stuff like that really makes me go with HeartSeams's The Author is Dead Approach xD And I am happy I stopped in time for Re:Coded and 3D <3
Go ahead, it doesn't affect me. Just don't turn around and then use an interview from Nomura when it's convenient for you if that's your approach.
The only other installment I've seen that had Roxas in so far was KH2 and aside from being a forcibly tragic character who then went away (where did I hear that one before? Oh right...) Roxas didn't have all that much substance to him. Granted it changed how some of the Organization members treated him, but they'd have came after him regardless for the Keyblade. About the biggest difference this would've caused was that Kairi might not have been kidnapped by Axel but who's to say she wouldn't have been kidnapped anyway for the Organization's sake to "feed Sora's anger" and get him to chase them more?
Suddenly KH2 Roxas doesn't have all that much substance to him either, if you ask me.
Roxas wasn't forced. The game didn't shove all his "tragic" down my throat as if I
should feel sorry for him. You could, but you didn't have to. His short-tempered attitude didn't ignite that much pity. He wasn't crying in his bed, had people hug him, touch him, give him comfort, etc., just to get out that "poor thing" aspect. He wasn't suffering almost half the time for some reason or other. They didn't over dramatize it. And to be honest, his fate wasn't even that sad in the first place. He returned to Sora, yes, and had to leave his life behind, but he got a better deal overall.
And he kept making himself known throughout
KH2. Still does after. He definitely has his own conscious stuck inside a vessel.
But define your type of substance. I mean, having to sacrifice your existence and all that you know for the benefit of someone else or that person would be left in a coma forever (making the whole of
KH2 not happen, let alone anything else) was quite the original concept before it was ripped off by another character with another rip containing Riku Replica.
And aside from saying yet again that I liked what they did with Luxord, Demyx and Xaldin, I've nothing else to add. Wasn't expecting the grand things you did so I wasn't disappointed.
I
just said that I wasn't expecting grand things in the first place. I was expecting
something more than what was given, which wasn't even much. What about the people who didn't give a damn about the Organization and hated
Days and Xion anyway because it was mishandled? Ooooh, yes, they
do exist. I mean, you usually always speak as if the whole section of anti-
358/2 Days are Organization fans who wanted more of them and got butthurt when they didn't get it. Yet you got it all twisted in what I call a stereotype. It's either you can't see that not everyone cares about the members, or it's easier to argue that they do than not.
I'd have somewhat agreed, but... dude. One trailer was enough to know that what was advertised was a Xion game.
I think I remember Nomura saying not to get misled and that it was Roxas' story. Actually, he always kept stating that Xion was simply a key character and that we will be truly following Roxas throughout the whole advertisement for the game. The trailer could have played with the only "big surprise" about Xion turning out to have Sora's penis.
