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Unbirth



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HeartSeams

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I still believe they actually were supposed to be the "Unbirth" for a few reasons, the two big ones being:

1. It's Birth by Sleep. I don't think that's a coincidence. By the time we got the finished product, really, the game has hardly anything to do with that term at all. It's only mentioned in the secret ending, and only there as a vague concept. You would figure Nomura would have a better reason for that choice.
It's actually showcased in the opening of the game, too. (The scene where Ventus connects his heart to Sora is called "Birth By Sleep" and that -is- what is happening)

I personally liked "Unversed" for their connection to "Reverse/Rebirth".
 
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I still don't consider that a very good justification for naming the game.
It would be like calling KH1 "Kingdom Hearts: Dive to the Heart" because Sora does that at the beginning of the game.

And Unversed has nothing to do with Reverse/Rebirth. Hell, even the word "Reverse" has a lot more poignancy and meaning in R/R than Unversed does in BbS.
 

HeartSeams

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I still don't consider that a very good justification for naming the game.
When you consider that that moment is the driving point for everything in the game and by extension everything in the series... it seems fitting enough for me.

Not to mention the "bookended"-ness of it all, with the saga opening with a birth by sleep and ending with one (assuming those who get saved get saved)

And Unversed has nothing to do with Reverse/Rebirth.
Says who? Unversed were named that because they were not "well versed in life". Reverse was about Riku becoming "versed in life" again, as far as I'm concerned.
 

Oracle Spockanort

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OH SHI-- I remember the Ambers! XD That had made my week before we got the proper translation.

And I miss the Unbirths. But now I think that is what those monsters in "Catherine" should be called.

And Unversed definitely gives you the sense of negative composition.
 
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When you consider that that moment is the driving point for everything in the game and by extension everything in the series... it seems fitting enough for me.

There are a lot of things in each of the games that could be considered a starting/driving point that, nonetheless, I think are inappropriate for titles. Chain of Memories and Days (despite its horrific aesthetic) are at least named aptly, because they're not concerned about starting points so much as they are themes that are inherent throughout and integral to the game they represent. "Birth by Sleep" was just not a very important concept in BbS outside of its beginning.

Not to mention the "bookended"-ness of it all, with the saga opening with a birth by sleep and ending with one (assuming those who get saved get saved)

So we should name KH3 Kingdom Hearts: More Birth by Sleep.

Says who? Unversed were named that because they were not "well versed in life". Reverse was about Riku becoming "versed in life" again, as far as I'm concerned.

That was only stated by Nomura. In actuality, the whole "not well versed in life" thing was never presented in the game, and we are given an alternate reason as to why they are named Unversed. A dumb one at that.
 

HeartSeams

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There are a lot of things in each of the games that could be considered a starting/driving point that, nonetheless, I think are inappropriate for titles. Chain of Memories and Days (despite its horrific aesthetic) are at least named aptly, because they're not concerned about starting points so much as they are themes that are inherent throughout and integral to the game they represent. "Birth by Sleep" was just not a very important concept in BbS outside of its beginning.
A Birth By Sleep, summed up simply, is a second chance. And I personally saw that as a theme that ran through the game in a number of places, especially in concern with Terra.



So we should name KH3 Kingdom Hearts: More Birth by Sleep.
I forgot just how hilarious you are.
 

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I still believe they actually were supposed to be the "Unbirth" for a few reasons, the two big ones being:

1. It's Birth by Sleep. I don't think that's a coincidence. By the time we got the finished product, really, the game has hardly anything to do with that term at all. It's only mentioned in the secret ending, and only there as a vague concept. You would figure Nomura would have a better reason for that choice.

2. Nomura has already admitted that he essentially dumbed the game down because he thought some of the more Eastern concepts would not be understood by Western fans. For instance, Sora was supposed to have connected with Ven's heart, in Nomura's original conception, before he was born. You know. Pre-birth. Unborn so to speak. Instead, he altered this so that he connected to Ven when he was born.

So my thinking is that if Nomura really thought we were too stupid to understand that, then if the enemies themselves were based around a similar concept, he may have opted to change their entire nature. And given that "Unversed" and "Unbirth" are homonyms in the Japanese language, he made the swap. I mean, really, the reason they gave for their names is probably one of the dumbest things to come out of this series. WE DON'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT THEM SO WE WILL CALL THEM UNVERSED. Which is a damn shame because they ended up being nothing more than pointless filler enemies.

Also, on topic:
Dis-soul

I agree completely. The game is freaking called "BIRTH by Sleep" and Unbirth only made sense for a game revolving around the concept of birth. And honestly "Unversed" I mean the name didn't even go with what the enemies were made from. They were called Unversed because they are emotions which means they are part of another's exist and so the unversed are not their own existence therefore they are not well versed in life and so they are called "Unversed" how dumb, I mean really it's dumb. Look don't get me wrong the idea of an enemy being born from negative emotion is fine but they ruined it in BBS, they were as you say filler enemies.

I mean it's almost as dumb as the X-Blade thing, I mean where did that idea come from?

And while we're on the subject, why IS the game called "Birth By Sleep" it had very little to do with Birth or Sleep. Why didn't they just call the game "Kingdom Hearts Zero" that would have made more sense.
 

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Dis-Souls! lol damn back way back when. The Unbirth were outrageous. good times. good times. people thought Vanitas was a terra look alike...ah...good stuff.
 

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I still believe they actually were supposed to be the "Unbirth" for a few reasons

They actually were! Olivia showed me a scan of one of the older interviews and 'Unbirth' was written in English, with 'anbaasu' written in little furigana over the top. So yeah, it wasn't an error by some fan translator, it was a full on change.

(Ambers on the other hand... I can see how anbaasu looks like Ambers! Don't know how much better I would have done myself XD;)
 

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Lol, i remember this xD
Because during secret ending in KH2 FM+,Vani actually seem taller..

Oh yeah, I remember that theory! It was about how Terra and the darkness acted as the full moon and the werewolf. Basically, each time Terra was overtaken by darkness, he'd turn into Vanitas, it was pretty interesting. I think Grass was the one that made it.

I ALSO remember linking Vanitas and Master Xehanort with Ansem Seeker of Darkness and the Guardian and Xemnas and the Dragon. Those were the days where interview didn't plague our ideas and we had fun debating, speculating and theorizing.
 

Oracle Spockanort

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You seem interesting like you're the one making this theory? lol

He likes learning the history here.



@Hamster Lord, you can probably check out Grass' theories. I'm sure he mentioned it somewhere in his bundle of theories.

And I also think when Audo was a member he had made that "Everything we know about BBS" thread. There should be some info there.
 
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