yeah it just means they'd have to be norted post-kh2, as in after they were recompleted. time travel wasn't used for every member, so the fact that some might've been added without it doesn't negate the fact that it was needed for some.
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I was under the false assumption that everyone had time traveled to that 'gathering' at the end of KH:3D, but yeah, since Nomura directly confirmed otherwise, there's a definite likelihood that many people were seeded post-KH2.
It's definitely possible, but I would be surprised if both Terra AND Ven were both darknesses. Just because there wouldn't be enough people left over to fill up the lights. SRK, Mickey, Aqua, and Lea make six, but we would still need one more - which is most likely going to be Ven.
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Did you really brought back a dead post to point out Pete and Mickey as MX's vessels? oh god
This makes my post looks plausible in comparison. It is a funny list though.
I really like your list tbh :3
thus I dont really agree with them all, but most of
Cheers, nice to hear something positive about my list for a change. Truth be told,it's hard to pinpoint the remaining members because we don't know what games they span from and how Xehanort nort's them.
I'm just not sure about Luxord not being there and the 6th apprendice being a half-nort D:
That's all, so I agree with everything in your list (seems quite possible) but Luxord and the 6th apprendice
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I would say that too on first sight, but there is one problem.
The problem is Young Xehanort. Why is he at seat 12?
If YX (Past) is at 12 and MX (Future) is at 1, then shouldn't the list be the other way around?
From the past to the future?
I have the feeling that the seats are sorted to YX' grabbing of Xehanorts and the order of who was seeded first, because he can only move forward as the rule of time.
The order of Young Xehanort's Grabbing would be like this starting from his timeframe:
1 - Young Xehanort (The first Xehanort)
2 - Vanitas (BBS Time - First seeded Xehanort)
3 - Braig (BBS Time - Second seeded Xehanort)(Re:coded Secret Ending)
4 - Terra-Xehanort (BBS Time - Third seeded Xehanort)
5 - Terra as Lord Xemnas / AX (Present - Terra reformed)(Braig mentioned him as he is nowhere to be seen)
6 - Isa as Saix (Present - Fourth seeded Xehanort - Isa reformed)
7 - Marluxia's Somebody (Present - Fifth seeded Xehanort)(Nobodies spawning as seen on the trailer)
8 - Luxord's Somebody (Present - Sixth seeded Xehanort)(Dice-Chesspiece as seen on the trailer)
9 - Braig as Xigbar (Present - First seeded Xehanort's Nobody reformed - appearance)(There are two Gun-Chesspieces)
10 - Ansem (Present - Between Space and Time)
11 - Xemnas (Present - Between Space and Time)
12 - Master Xehanort (Present - the most future self reformed)
13 - The last Xehanort (obviously present)
So in our view the order would be like this:
1 - Master Xehanort
2 - Xemnas
3 - Ansem
4 - Xigbar
5 - Luxord's Somebody
6 - Marluxia's Somebody
7 - Saix
8 - AX
9 - Terra-Xehanort
10 - Braig
11 - Vanitas
12 - Young Xehanort
13 - Last Xehanort
There is no way that any of Chi's characters are Xehanorts. As nomura mentioned all of those Xehanorts are familiar characters.
D
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I'm pretty doubtful of the amount of doubles in your list, personally.
But the reverse order is an interesting idea... I don't think it really matches up though. Wouldn't that basically be saying that the last person YMX "collected" before Sora was Vanitas? but that doesn't really make sense. I see it more as YMX being the 12th because he is the second to last to join the new Organization because he had to collect all the other members first (so 11 would hypothetically be the last member he collected before Sora joining). The Org's order, after all, was the order in which they joined the Organization and I think we're led to believe the same would hold true for the New Organization with the exception of MX/Xemnas/Ansem. We're told the seating is deliberate, and I don't think the fact that Isa is sitting in his same spot is meant to be coincidental. Terra-Xehanort and AX are literally the same character.
After all, with the reverse order, wouldn't that be suggesting that Sora is the "first" Xehanort? That doesn't seem right.
But it's anyone's guess.
But the reverse order is an interesting idea... I don't think it really matches up though. Wouldn't that basically be saying that the last person YMX "collected" before Sora was Vanitas? but that doesn't really make sense. I see it more as YMX being the 12th because he is the second to last to join the new Organization because he had to collect all the other members first (so 11 would hypothetically be the last member he collected before Sora joining). The Org's order, after all, was the order in which they joined the Organization and I think we're led to believe the same would hold true for the New Organization with the exception of MX/Xemnas/Ansem. We're told the seating is deliberate, and I don't think the fact that Isa is sitting in his same spot is meant to be coincidental. Terra-Xehanort and AX are literally the same character.
After all, with the reverse order, wouldn't that be suggesting that Sora is the "first" Xehanort? That doesn't seem right.
But it's anyone's guess.
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I like this alternate list. Sure, it goes against my list because it doesn't have any Chi characters (and by familiar, Nomura could have meant that they're all familar character from every series before Kingdom Hearts III including the upcoming X series at the time).
There is one thing I have to disagree with in regards to the list: Two Xigbar's. Even for Nomura's standards, that'd just be really lazy and be received negatively. If we do take Nomura's comment of a "surprise" character by face value, one of the slots could be provided to a character introduced in Kingdom Hearts III. So, here's what I think based on your framework Emperor Pursuit.
1 - Master Xehanort
2 - Xemnas
3 - Ansem
4 - Xigbar
5 - Luxord's Somebody
6 - Marluxia's Somebody
7 - Saix
8 - Adult Master Xehanort
9 - Terra-Xehanort
10 - Braig
11 - Vanitas
12 - Young Xehanort
13 - Exclusive Kingdom Hearts III Character
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In my reverse order, the last Xehanort (Sora) was left out, because he wasn't collected until MX was shown, so the list goes straight from XII. (YX) to I. (MX), like a clock. I should have been more specific on that case. xD
YX can only move forward, so he can't switch space and time. First from the BBS Time, then between BBS and KH1, then KH1, then between KH1 and KH 2, then KH2 and then the present time. He should collect as many past versions of Xehanorts as he could as time passes and there are only four of them I can think of. Including Apprentice Xehanort, if he really has built his own personality (Braig, Vanitas, Terra-Xehanort, Apprentice Xehanort) or AX could have seeded Isa after MX was back in control.
And the same person could have seeded Marluxia's Somebody and Luxord's Somebody in the present time, otherwise I can't think of which person other than AX / Terra could have seeded them. MX himself wasn't there until the very end.
Yes, Terra-Xehanort and Apprentice Xehanort are the same person, except if AX has built his own personality, but we only know that MX was back in control (eye color).
But without some minor doubles, I can't think of which versions of Xehanort could have been collected else, because YX can only move forward hmm. /:
If Nomura meant by that, then it would be odd, cool, but odd and how would YX do that? Ansem SoD may have told him which Xehanort he should collect. If that's really the case, then those Chi characters can only be collected in the present time in the dream world the same way how YX could collect Ansem and Xemnas. If we combine that info with my reverse order and delete doubles, then we would have this:
1 - Master Xehanort
2 - Xemnas
3 - Ansem
4 - Xigbar
5 - Chi Character
6 - Chi Character
7 - Saix
8 - Luxord's Somebody
9 - Marluxia's Somebody
10 - Terra-Xehanort
11 - Vanitas
12 - Young Xehanort
13 - Exclusive Kingdom Hearts III Character
But then what's the purpose of having time travel. It's all speculation though. xD
One of those characters will definitely be Adult Master Xehanort. We've already got Xehanort in his youngest and oldest incarnation and I feel as though his adult incarnation has contributed just as much to the current events of the series.
As far as the key Chi characters go, the ultimate question is whether they would survive after the Keyblade War. If so then they have a likeliness of being a Seeker of Darkness as a more present version of Xehanort could have seeked them out.
D
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I agree on this. There is little to suggest that Braig and Xigbar are different, aside from one instance of model reuseal in a two minute cutscene.
Once again, Nomura never said there would be a surprise character. There's no comment to take at face value, unless you can provide it. I looked back over the interviews given since KH3D's release and the closest I could find to such a comment was Nomura saying that the final identities of the 7 lights and 13 darknesses might not be as expected. Which is a far cry from promising there being a surprise character among them. Unless you have this interview where he says that?
Yes, which means they would not be added in reverse order...?
I mean the reverse order is an interesting concept, I just don't see the evidence for it. You mention how YMX can only go forward in time, which I'm not disputing at all, but I don't see how that would translate into a guaranteed reverse order, instead of the order of YMX collecting them (as in people earlier in the timeline would have a higher number than those collected at the end)
They're only like a year apart. I really doubt we'd see both being used.
X characters are unlikely to be in the lineup (except maybe the thirteenth spot). YMX says at the end of the game that he is considered the Xehanort from furthest in the past. Obviously, any X character would be from further in the past than Xehanort.
How do you figure? Why would a Xehanort that we've never seen before, and thus has little to no relevancy to the story as we've known it, be included? And why would that be considered "definitely" true.
How? He hasn't done anything that is relevant in the series at this point. MX's adult self just traveled worlds alone and learned stuff. He didn't start doing events that would affect the series until he was an old coot.
Master Xehanort
Xemnas
Ansem SoD
Young Master Xehanort
Terra (controlled by Xehanort)..brown hair, yellow eyes
Terranort (the one we see in BBS)
Xehanort the Apprentice (the one we all know and love who started this)
Vanitas
Saix/Isa
Braig/Xigbar
Dilan/Xaldin (something about this guy...and the way he went around in the KH series. He acted as a leader as well, and was extremely devoted to Xemnas. He also gave no shits about getting a heart. Also he was still "recovering" apparently in KH DDD
Vexen/Even
Number 13.....Roxas. It's only fitting, isn't it?
Xemnas
Ansem SoD
Young Master Xehanort
Terra (controlled by Xehanort)..brown hair, yellow eyes
Terranort (the one we see in BBS)
Xehanort the Apprentice (the one we all know and love who started this)
Vanitas
Saix/Isa
Braig/Xigbar
Dilan/Xaldin (something about this guy...and the way he went around in the KH series. He acted as a leader as well, and was extremely devoted to Xemnas. He also gave no shits about getting a heart. Also he was still "recovering" apparently in KH DDD
Vexen/Even
Number 13.....Roxas. It's only fitting, isn't it?
This kind of respond is a little puzzling given the fact that Xehanort's thirteen Seekers of Darkness are essentially 13 Xehanort's. Why shouldn't Adult Master Xehanort be entered into the fray? He is literally a definitive Xehanort. This is the Xehanort Saga and the one aspect of Xehanort's life that has intentionally been left out is his adulthood. It would be outright silly for Nomura not to cover it.
And besides, Kingdom Hearts III needs new fleshed out content aside "The Keyblade War" and travelling to Disney Worlds. I think that the history and relevance of Xehanort in his adult years are more than welcoming. We still don't know how Ven was truly like before Master Xehanort split his dark half and formed it into Vanitas. How young was Ventus when he was taken by Master Xehanort? and why did they use to share a bond as student and Master? aren't you the slightest bit curious about that aspect?
D
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Because he isn't a character that has been introduced? Because he's had no relevancy to the plot aside from being Xehanort? It would be such an ass-pull at this point. "Oh look, we've filled out the roster with a version of Xehanort you've never seen before and hasn't done anything in the plot". Even YMX actually appeared and was set-up before KH3D + KHIII. There would just be no real point to it aside from being a filler character.
KHIII is already stuffed to the brim with stuff it has to resolve and cover and address. The story of MX in his middle-years thus far is hardly worth taking up screentime and development of everything else.
We have no reason to suspect that Ven was MX's apprentice for very long before he tried to force him to use darkness.
And even if Xehanort took Ven on as an apprentice when Ven was a newborn, that's still only 15 years difference from Geezernort. Definitely not worth exploring (and of course, he wouldn't have taken Ven on as a baby, and at best you could maybe argue 2-5 years difference). None of this would be rife material for exploring "Adult Master Xehanort".
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Hm... I'd agree if it weren't for Trollanort. That character started out as some person whose main contribution to the series was looking out to sea and a single, uncredited line (which, if I recall correctly, was voiced by Riku's VA... he didn't even have his own voice back then!). But then DDD happened, which gave him an active role in the story (and his own unique voice). If it weren't for DDD, I'm pretty sure you'd be questioning Trollanort's inclusion too.
So, who's to say that the same thing won't happen with the original adult incarnation of Xehanort in III? Remember that even if he wasn't going around, actively ruining people's lives back then, he was still developing into the creep who would.
I definitely agree that Adult Xehanort's inclusion is far from a certainty, though.
D
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The difference was that YMX was being set up for more. He appears in the opening. He is talked about by Riku. Terra "sees" Riku turn into him, Xehanort's backstory puts emphasis on this time, etc. Like there was stuff in the story that was setting him up. The Mysterious Figure then further set up his plot, to which DDD finally fulfilled. If an adult version of Master Xehanort had appeared in any title before this, then yeah I'd say there's a chance he'd be important. But we're talking about a completely unseen version of Xehanort being introduced in KHIII without any prior appearance and then being used as the true identity of one of the mysterious vessels. It just isn't the same as YMX. If YMX had only been shown in KH3D, then you'd have a case. But as it is now, it'd just be a cop-out development that would feel rather cheap.
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How in the world would it be a cop-out for character development if Adult Master Xehanort was in Kingdom Hearts III? That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. You act as though we already have everything we need to know about Master Xehanort and that any more development to his character is overkill? There is nothing cheap about fleshing Master Xehanort further through his adult life.
Kingdom Hearts III is the conclusion to Master Xehanort's saga and skipping his adulthood entirely would raise more questions than answers. Why would his adulthood be any less important than his youth and elderly years in the construction to his character?
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