Theory: The Dwarf Woodlands COULD have been in the original kingdom hearts (Spoilers)



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Soldier

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Hello all,

This is a theory I thought up one day when playing through the game, but before I continue, SPOILERS for bbs and kh1! You've been warned, With that out of the way, lets begin. Most of you are aware of the classic scene where alice is brought before maleficents league of evil shortly after completing Deep Jungle, and some are also aware of the alternative scene should you go through Olympus coliseum to get to DJ, where Snow White appears instead, here is a video link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Qh3MzynjE4 (I do not own this, credit goes to the respective owners)

This scene can be interpreted many ways, some say it's non canon, others say it just shows maleficents rate of rapid progress at that point compared to Sora's, while I think something else. I believe the Dwarf Woodlands was still around during the events of KH, while SRK were still on Destiny Islands building the raft, then it fell into darkness sometime after completing the coliseum. This could mean that there were other worlds that Sora didn't go to because he wasn't fast enough (or the Navi G's only have so much power). Snow White was the first of many masterpieces produced by Disney, so it would have made some sense to put it in the 1st game, but could have been cut later on. Granted this is just my head canon, but let me know what you think.
 

Ballad of Caius

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There is a possibility that Snow White's world was intended to be included in the original KH. I think Disney Castle was intended to be in the game, but was cut, reason as to why you can see the world's icon in the map, but can't access it.
 

DarkosOverlord

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I think it just means Dwarf Woodlands fell around that period, you just "alter" the timeline depending on when you let Alice be kidnapped.
It's probably just a nod to that, kinda like Beast and Maleficent mentioning the fall of Beast's Castle, I don't think they planned for the world to be there.
 

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You are correct about Disney Castle being a planned world. I think they just left it off to the left of traverse town to show that it didn't fall to darkness, and that you likely wouldn't revisit it at the End of the World.
 

Alpha Baymax

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I'm glad Dwarf Woodlands wasn't in the original Kingdom Hearts, I liked how it was executed in Birth by Sleep and X.
 

Tartarus

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I agree that Dwarf Woodlands had to still be around (or only recently fallen into darkness) by the events of KH1, but I doubt it was ever intended to appear in that game. Disney was overly protective of their properties during the first game. They wouldn’t even allow Mickey to appear in more than one scene, so I doubt they’d have let Nomure/Square touch their first animated film.
 

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My assumption was that Snow White would have been the princess that was taken prior to Alice in the timeline, since it's an alternate scene if you leave Wonderland before Alice disappears.
I believe I read in an interview or Director's Report from Nomura that the characters on the platforms at the beginning tell us that the world has fallen. Since Snow White, Cinderella, Aurora and Belle are sleeping, their world had fallen to darkness prior to Sora's departure from the DI. And if you notice, Beast's eyes are still open. It also makes sense that the three silhouettes on the pink platform represent Alice, Jasmine, and Kairi, whose worlds have yet to fall.
As for including the world in the first game, Nomura says this about the process in choosing worlds:

Nomura : Several factors come into play. First off, Disney will sometimes offer us ideas of worlds to integrate, and then there are the worlds that I really want to include personally in KINGDOM HEARTS III. I also think of the worlds of the previous games in order to maintain consistency in the story. My team will not hesitate to provide suggestions for their own ideas. After deciding what worlds will be present, we start planning the conduct of the story in these worlds but also to make them interesting and fun for the players.
Source: https://www.khinsider.com/news/KHDestiny-KHisland-Interviews-Tetsuya-Nomura-at-Japan-Expo-3362
 

DarkosOverlord

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I believe I read in an interview or Director's Report from Nomura that the characters on the platforms at the beginning tell us that the world has fallen. Since Snow White, Cinderella, Aurora and Belle are sleeping, their world had fallen to darkness prior to Sora's departure from the DI.
If you read it that's okay, however that could cause some issues in the timeline, like Riku not knowing Beast was at HB until after Neverland.
Truly there weren't that many areas he could've been hiding (I'm assuming Beast never set foot into the actual fortress before Sora helped), and Riku was accustomed with the open areas.
And of he was indeed there since the beginning, why not telling Riku? What if the two met when he wasn't strong enough or something?
And Beast FOLLOWED Belle all the way to HB, he didn't search for her in a later moment. When we see him, he says he "finally found her".

I dunno, all the factors point at Belle being captured towards the end of the game.
 

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Another thing to consider is the nature of HOW the beast got there, he could have just popped out of a corridor of darkness that a heartless used before his castle fell, either that or his sheer determination got him there instead of placing him in Traverse Town.
 

DarkosOverlord

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He did follow them by sheer force of will.
That's actually why he was a target for the Organization later, he has a willpower equal or greater than the main characters.
Just imagine that Nobody.
 

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So I guess that means he appeared mere moments during the scene after completing Neverland, announcing his presence with one of his famous roars. I doubt he would be smart enough to stealthily crawl through the castle to get to bell alla solid snake, but it would be cool to find him hanging from the ice in the rising falls.
 

tlemmens10

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Bringing up the Beast, he seemed to be the only prince of his respective princess who actually went to the effort of following the kidnappers of his respective princess.

Also, I can't help but wish now for a KH game where the Beast is the main character and you follow his adventure to get Belle back, up until the scene where he appears in KHI.
 

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Bringing up the Beast, he seemed to be the only prince of his respective princess who actually went to the effort of following the kidnappers of his respective princess.
Prince Philip was also captured by Maleficent in BbS for trying and save Aurora.
 

tlemmens10

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Yes, but that was linked to the storyline from the animated feature in which the same thing happens to him. And this was 10 years before the events of Kingdom Hearts take place.
 

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Yes, but that was linked to the storyline from the animated feature in which the same thing happens to him. And this was 10 years before the events of Kingdom Hearts take place.
And you didn't mention any of these things in your previous post, so point still stands.
Also I'd say that's more on Belle being special: Phillip does the same things in the movie, because Aurora's story is basically the same as in the movie.
 

tlemmens10

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And you didn't mention any of these things in your previous post, so point still stands.
Fair point. Let me be more specific in what I meant: So, when all the worlds fell, they started kidnapping the princesses and the beast went after Belle and from that particular event, he seems to be the only prince who went after his princess (discounting Alice's world, 'cause she has no actual boyfriend. And Sora, obviously went after Kairi, but he is no prince). Philip may have come to Aurora's rescue in Birth By Sleep, but in the events of the very first Kingdom Hearts game, he is nowhere to be seen. So, why only the beast and not the others?
 

Rodin

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Fair point. Let me be more specific in what I meant: So, when all the worlds fell, they started kidnapping the princesses and the beast went after Belle and from that particular event, he seems to be the only prince who went after his princess (discounting Alice's world, 'cause she has no actual boyfriend. And Sora, obviously went after Kairi, but he is no prince). Philip may have come to Aurora's rescue in Birth By Sleep, but in the events of the very first Kingdom Hearts game, he is nowhere to be seen. So, why only the beast and not the others?
It's possible Beast was the only prince who survived the heartless attack on his world and was strong enough to get away. The other princes might have died in the fighting.
 
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