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Theory of the Sentiments



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Horizon's Knight

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When playing over KH2FM+, Nomura discovered a secret boss he did not tell his staff to make. He then used it to his advantage saying that the being known as the Lingering Sentiment wasn’t canon, but only his words that were relevant to Terra. Later, Nomura decided the keep the fight non-canon, but make the Lingering Sentiment itself canon. The only thing Nomura truly told us about Sentiments is that as a whole, they are final thoughts and emotions of a person. However, what relevance does that give us? Well, that is what this thread is about. I’m going to decode the mystery of the Sentiments, or at least try. In fact, because of the Eraqus Armor you fight in the Mirage Area in BBSFM, I’m almost sure about this theory. I might also try and fit connections that could have resulted of the current Sentiments we already know about, and one other possible Sentiment. So, let’s kick off this theory with our prior knowledge first.

First of all, this is what we know for sure about the Sentiments.
· Embody the final thoughts and emotions of a person
· Seem to lack shells of their own, so they inhabit other objects (only armor was shown so far)
· Have the ability to wield a Keyblade
· Don’t have a Heart

Now, which of these things seems to contradict the behavior of the Sentiments? Well, that’s actually quite easy. The fact that they don’t have a Heart seems to be unbelievable, doesn’t it? You should have a Heart to be able to wield a Keyblade and have true emotions. How is that even possible? Well, let us first look at the Lingering Sentiment. As we know, Xehanort stabbed himself with his own Keyblade and entered Terra’s body, then dominated Terra’s Heart and took over. Anything ring a bell yet? Terra harbors Eraqus in his Heart, and there is an Armored Eraqus we get to fight in the Mirage Arena. As some people believe, Vanitas is hiding within Riku’s Heart, and we get to fight the Vanitas Sentiment as an optional boss in BBS. Although the Vanitas Sentiment isn’t canon, that was the way the Lingering Sentiment started out. With Nomura, you never know.

The point is that all of these Sentiments are of people whose Heart laid within another Heart, and they were most likely all resilient of it to an extent. So, what if those people’s Hearts weren’t truly lost, and an imprint of said Heart’s essence got into another object? What if those Sentiments were the projection of the Heart’s will and its power? It’s not that illogical, really. Riku somehow could project his image out of Ansem SoD. If you don’t believe me, then here is the proof.



If you look from 18:25 to 18:52, clearly you should be able to see that Riku was capable of projecting his Heart from Ansem SoD to save Kairi, Donald, and Goofy. So, why can’t other people project their Heart when they are devoured by another Heart? So, it should make perfect sense that the Heart of the consumed could be projected and use another object as a vessel. Thus, projecting the Heart’s essence should be able to give the Sentiments emotions and a Keyblade as well. So, in a nutshell, Sentiments are projected imprints of the Heart’s power when it is consumed by another Heart and the person doesn’t want to give up their existence.

Now that we know what a Sentiment is, let’s look at who is a Sentiment, and why they are as such. The Lingering Sentiment isn’t too hard to figure out. Basically, Xehanort consumed Terra’s Heart and Terra was resilient enough to create a Lingering Sentiment based on his hatred for Xehanort. Now, let’s look at some other examples, shall we?

Armor of the Master

As we know, we get to fight an armored version of Eraqus called “Armor of the Master” in BBSFM. The fight isn’t canon because it is in the Mirage Arena, but that doesn’t mean that Eraqus doesn’t have a Sentiment. As we know Terra harbors Eraqus in his Heart. However, from what we know from the Lingering Sentiment, it was resisting Xehanort. As far as we know, Eraqus doesn’t seem to mind being in Terra. However, Terra is in Xehanort’s Heart, and we all know Xehanort is a regular user of darkness. And, since Eraqus hates darkness very much, that makes him resilient enough to create a Lingering Sentiment with his own armor.


Vanitas Sentiment

As we know, the Vanitas Sentiment is currently not canon. However, the Lingering Sentiment wasn’t canon at first either, and if fans care enough, it could be very well canon sometime in the future. Now, none of us even know what happened to Vanitas, the dark half of Ven’s Heart, when the X-Blade was destroyed. However, if the Vanitas Sentiment indeed becomes canon in the future, then we know that Vanitas’ Heart isn’t completely gone. However, where would it go and in whom would it reside? Well, as you might as guessed, I’m jumping on the Riku bandwagon, and it’s for several different reasons.

The first one is kind of obvious, but Riku wears the same suit as Vanitas along with having the same fighting stance. Plus, Nomura loves making connections through appearances. Another example is Kairi’s statement about Riku in KH1.

Kairi said:
Riku’s changed.

Normally, I wouldn’t take merit in what such a badly written character says, but she is a Princess of Heart, so she might have been able to sense a gradual change in Riku’s Heart. Once again, I’m not a Kairi fan, and most of you reading this probably don’t like her either. However, there is evidence in her words. In BBS, Terra and Aqua both sense a light coming from Destiny Islands. Terra was the one to notice that this light came from Riku, not Sora. So, it would be logical for Riku’s Heart to change as a result of Vanitas being in there.

However, the true reason that I support this is that since Sora harbored Ven’s Heart in his, Vanitas would obviously want to get as close to Ven as possible. However, Vanitas might have wanted to get into Sora’s Heart to merge with Ventus faster, but Sora’s Heart might have subconsciously kept Vanitas out to protect Ven. So, Vanitas used the next best thing, Sora’s best friend Riku. Now, you’re probably wondering why this would created a Sentiment if Vanitas deliberately entered another’s Heart, correct? Well, just because he entered that Heart willingly doesn’t mean that was the Heart he wanted to be in. Remember, Vanitas wants to reform the X-Blade as soon as possible, so his impatience with being in Riku could have accounted for willingly creating a Sentiment. This impatience with creating the X-Blade is reflected with the Vanitas Sentiment using moves Vanitas could only use as a result of the X-Blade.

Ventus Sentiment (?)
By now, it is pretty much common knowledge that Ventus currently resides in the Heart of Sora. However, I’m just going to point out that Ventus did not create a Sentiment from Sora. Why? Well, unlike all the Hearts that have created Sentiments, Ventus went into Sora willingly. Even the first time when Sora’s newborn Heart offered Ventus to connect his Heart untill his Heart got better; Ventus willingly accepted the help from Sora’s Heart. So, why would Ventus want to fight against someone who is keeping him alive? However, there is another source Ventus could have formed a Sentiment from. That source is Vanitas.
Now, before you start complaining or approving, I’m just going to be blunt and say that it isn’t very likely, but it still can happen. In order to create the X-Blade, Vanitas needed to clash with Ven once their strengths were on par with one another, being that one had a Heart filled with light and the other had a Heart of pure darkness. So, once they were equal in power, Vanitas tried to merge with Ven to create the X-Blade, and it was pretty clear that he wanted to be the dominate personality. However, did one Heart truly dominate the other Heart? Well, from Aqua’s perspective, the X- Blade looks complete and Vanitas is clearly in control. However, if you look and the inner battle between Ventus and Vanitas, you’ll see that the X-Blade is incomplete. In order to have a complete X-Blade, Vanitas and Ven had to merge completely. Vanitas himself even comments on this.
Vanitas said:
Our union was not finished. The X-Blade shouldn’t stay broken like this. Join me now, and we can complete the X-Blade.
However, Ventus clearly rejected the idea, knowing that along with the X-Blade, both his and Vanitas’ Hearts would get destroyed. Luckily for Ventus, he managed to survive through Sora, although Ventus’ Heart did not get away unscathed. That is why it is highly unlikely that Ventus created a Sentiment. However, even though Terra created one, Terra was still fighting Xehanort for control, despite his Heart being consumed by Xehanort’s. So, there is still a possibility that Ventus created a Sentiment because of Vanitas.
There are a few other characters I consider Sentiments, but there explanations might be quite long, and it has other variables involved, so they deserve their own threads. Please read and review. I’m open to constructive criticism.

I need to add one more thing in here, and it won't let me copy and paste it in here. I was only goin to add one possible, but unlikely Sentiment. However, you are free to critizize what I have right now if you wish. It is pretty much complete.

EDIT: The bug is fixed. You may now pour out your thoughts an critizism.
 
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chasespicer056

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One of the better theories I've heard in a while. I can't really find any holes in this, so I give you tons of credit for that.

In your opinion though, why are the sentiments alive? I was always under the impression that living was the function of the soul, not the heart, but if both could do that, then there's nothing wrong here.

Overall great theory. Nice job!!!
 

Horizon's Knight

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One of the better theories I've heard in a while. I can't really find any holes in this, so I give you tons of credit for that.

Thanks man!

In your opinion though, why are the sentiments alive? I was always under the impression that living was the function of the soul, not the heart, but if both could do that, then there's nothing wrong here.

The power of the Heart is what makes them a type of being. Think of it like Sora during the end of KH1, all throughout CoM and Days, and the beginning of KH2. The only difference here is that the Heart is trying to avoid being completely consumed, so the best it can do is project its power and motive into an object until either the Sentiment completes said or the Heart that projected the Sentiment is finally released from the Heart that held them captive. To put it in a more simple way, the heart is too stubborn to not live on, even if it can't be the Heart itself that lives on. I have a feeling that Nomura isn't going to fully explain the Soul until the next saga.
 

Crystal

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Nice theory,especially when explainning about the armor of the master :D
 

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This is a very well thought out theory, but I think I see a small problem with part of it. Even if Riku had changed because of Vanitas entering his heart, Kairi wouldn't have known about that because she didn't arrive at DI until a while after the events of BBS while this probably happened right after.
 

Horizon's Knight

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This is a very well thought out theory, but I think I see a small problem with part of it. Even if Riku had changed because of Vanitas entering his heart, Kairi wouldn't have known about that because she didn't arrive at DI until a while after the events of BBS while this probably happened right after.

Thank you from pointing that out. I have an explaination for that. Since Ven's heart was severly damaged by the X-blade when he entered Sora, he became dormant soon afterwards. Therefore, the influence of Ven's power affected Sora gradually. Since the X-Blade was made of both Ven and Van's heart, Vanitas would be in the exact same state as Ven. Therefore, the change in Riku didn't happen right away, but gradually over time.
 

chasespicer056

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Thanks man!



The power of the Heart is what makes them a type of being. Think of it like Sora during the end of KH1, all throughout CoM and Days, and the beginning of KH2. The only difference here is that the Heart is trying to avoid being completely consumed, so the best it can do is project its power and motive into an object until either the Sentiment completes said or the Heart that projected the Sentiment is finally released from the Heart that held them captive. To put it in a more simple way, the heart is too stubborn to not live on, even if it can't be the Heart itself that lives on. I have a feeling that Nomura isn't going to fully explain the Soul until the next saga.

You actually have a point there.

In that case, I don't see anything wrong with this theory. Well done.
 

Taochan

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Overall, this is a really cool theory. I've been wondering if the sentiments would become enemies in the future... due to how Nomura is popularizing them right now. This theory makes me feel like my thought could be possible. :D
 

Crystal

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Overall, this is a really cool theory. I've been wondering if the sentiments would become enemies in the future... due to how Nomura is popularizing them right now. This theory makes me feel like my thought could be possible. :D

So you're saying next enemy will be made from sentiments?
 

Taochan

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So you're saying next enemy will be made from sentiments?
That's what I think will be the next enemy. They could be linked to nobodies/heartless through Horizon's Knight's theory fairly easily, so it seems reasonable. And they're really being "shoved down our throats" in BBS:FM.
 

Crystal

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That's what I think will be the next enemy. They could be linked to nobodies/heartless through Horizon's Knight's theory fairly easily, so it seems reasonable. And they're really being "shoved down our throats" in BBS:FM.

Not a bad idea actually.. :)
 

HeartSeams

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When playing over KH2FM+, Nomura discovered a secret boss he did not tell his staff to make.
I don't think it actually happened like this. You have to remember that Nomura is the director and everything has to be approved by him. I doubt his staff would go out of their way to make a boss battle that he might say no on. Also, you have to consider that LS is both canon-ly important in both the cutscenes and the battle. The battle brought forth many concepts that became Key in BBS (primarily the Keyblade Gliders and ShotLocks). I think that alone should show that Nomura was well aware this battle was being made, and contributed to it no less.

He then used it to his advantage saying that the being known as the Lingering Sentiment wasn’t canon, but only his words that were relevant to Terra.
Nomura never said this. He never said the fight wasn't canon, or that only his words were canon. The most he's ever said on the canonicity of that battle was "You can think it's Terra or not, it doesn't matter" (or something to that effect) it was just that many of us assumed that meant the fight wasn't canon. To this day, Nomura hasn't really given a strong comment on whether or not it is canon (but honestly, more things point to it being so than otherwise).

Later, Nomura decided the keep the fight non-canon, but make the Lingering Sentiment itself canon.
Again... he never made the fight non-canon.

In fact, because of the Eraqus Armor you fight in the Mirage Area in BBSFM, I’m almost sure about this theory.
That battle isn't exactly canon or have story implications....

Now, which of these things seems to contradict the behavior of the Sentiments? Well, that’s actually quite easy. The fact that they don’t have a Heart seems to be unbelievable, doesn’t it? You should have a Heart to be able to wield a Keyblade
Nobodies can wield the Keyblade if their somebodies could. They don't have hearts but they can still wield it. The same could be true for the Lingering Sentiment.

Terra harbors Eraqus in his Heart, and there is an Armored Eraqus we get to fight in the Mirage Arena.
There's no proven connection between those two events though, especially since one of them happens in "NonCanon Just-For-Fun Land!"

Although the Vanitas Sentiment isn’t canon.[/FONT]
Nomura never said -that- either.

So, what if those people’s Hearts weren’t truly lost, and an imprint of said Heart’s essence got into another object?
Uh... kind of like a Nobody?

Sentiments are projected imprints of the Heart’s power when it is consumed by another Heart and the person doesn’t want to give up their existence.[/FONT]
Or, simply, Sentiments are leftover thoughts and emotions.
Which is what they are -confirmed- to be.

As we know, we get to fight an armored version of Eraqus called “Armor of the Master” in BBSFM. The fight isn’t canon because it is in the Mirage Arena, but that doesn’t mean that Eraqus doesn’t have a Sentiment.
Yeah... it doesn't mean he does, either. Nowhere was it said that this was a Lingering Sentiment anyway.

Seriously, these Mirage Arena fights were thrown in for fun and were given names like "Armor of the Master" and "No Heart" so that people would be able to distinguish that these events aren't happening in the story. You're not going up against Eraqus' Sentiment or Xemnas in these battles, you're going up against things -like- them. There will be no story explanation for why you can fight AotM or NH or Monstro. They are literally just there for fun. This doesn't show that Eraqus has a sentiment.

As we know, the Vanitas Sentiment is currently not canon.
We actually don't know that.

However, the Lingering Sentiment wasn’t canon at first either
Same as above.

However, there is evidence in her words. In BBS, Terra and Aqua both sense a light coming from Destiny Islands. Terra was the one to notice that this light came from Riku, not Sora. So, it would be logical for Riku’s Heart to change as a result of Vanitas being in there.
OR it could be as simply as Riku having an obsession with leaving and that obsession caused darkness to be born in his heart, similar to how Terra's obsession with power gave birth to darkness in -his- heart.

I think you're overthinking the sentiments. We have an explanation for them already, and honestly, that's probably the extent of the explanation. I feel like people overdo the Sentiment thing, like, since Terra had one, now it is easy for any character to have one or that they are created through a magical procedure that nearly guarantees one always being made. The Sentiments could be just as simple as Nomura and the games make them out to be: left-over thoughts and emotions.
 

Crystal

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Maybe... or KH3... It's so hard to speculate what the crap is going to happen in 3D.

I think KH 3D maybe reveal :
1) Sora and Riku Mark of Mastery
2) Research data which AtW hidden in Sora?
3) Possible how Eraqus, Terra and MX's hearts or memories divided between Ansem SoD and Xemnas.

Correct me if i'm wrong ;)
 

Taochan

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I think KH 3D maybe reveal :
1) Sora and Riku Mark of Mastery
2) Research data which AtW hidden in Sora?
3) Possible how Eraqus, Terra and MX's hearts or memories divided between Ansem SoD and Xemnas.

Correct me if i'm wrong ;)
That all sounds right. :D And I really hope you're right about point 3; fluff that is a confusing division of hearts.
I just mean is there any idea of what enemies we will be fighting? Heartless, nobodies... sentiments? Or maybe, like HeartSeams mentioned in another thread... something like "dream bugs". o_-
 

Crystal

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That all sounds right. :D And I really hope you're right about point 3; fluff that is a confusing division of hearts.
I just mean is there any idea of what enemies we will be fighting? Heartless, nobodies... sentiments? Or maybe, like HeartSeams mentioned in another thread... something like "dream bugs". o_-

What is dream bugs o.o;;;
I personally think it will be heartless and nobodies? xD
 

Taochan

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What is dream bugs o.o;;;
I personally think it will be heartless and nobodies? xD
A play on "data bugs" from Coded. xD
It could be the heartless/nobodies again... since Days just re-used the heartless and didn't introduce any new enemies.
 
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