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The Persona Thread (Spin-offs galore!)



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Chuuya

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kirabook

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So, I recently got into Persona 3 having never played it before or knew anything about it. It managed to become my favorite one story and characterwise.

I've been trying to figure out why it's my fav and I think I understand. Persona 4 and 5... great games, but the main character truly is like... the MAIN character. Everyone revolves around them (Ren and Yu) feels like. No one truly seems to grow and change without them?

Of course this happens a bit in Persona 3 as well, but honestly, even though Minato/Makoto is literally the messiah, I feel like most of the characters, especially the main characters, are living out their own stories without his help. There's no scene that represents this better than Fuuka's second awakening. Everyone arrives on the roof after all is said and done and she's rambling about her personal growth and everyone is like "Uh... you ok? What are you talking about?" That's right, this is Fuuka's story, not the MC, he doesn't need to know everything or be involved.

All of them have their second awakening on their own terms for the most part. Whether MC was there or not or if the MC existed at all, these developments probably would've happened anyway.

Between main storyline awakenings and social link awakenings, I prefer the former. It doesn't make social links irrelevant. After all, they still allow you to get to know those characters better and have a better insight on what's going on with them. That's an area where Persona 3 is lacking actually (other than forcing you to date girls to reach level 10)

I also like how when Minato meets everyone, they aren't all immediately pals, you know? Sometimes they're a bit snarky with one another or just plain old rude. Junpei is a great example of this, but you know what? Junpei is a true bro and would do anything for the MC despite the occasional jealously and all that.

They really feel like a bunch of randos dragged into this big developing plot that manage to work things out between them and become true friends. Like a family. It also helps that like, 5? of the cast are orphans with little to no family. They are each other's family now. Unlike P4 and P5, once all is said and done, they don't technically have normal/families lives to return to. They are each other's support system. There's no one to go home to other than each other.

I am a sucker for family feels and found family tropes, and Persona 3 nails it for me.

I DO want a remake, but there are some things I don't want them to change and some things I do. I observed this stuff from watching streamers play through the game blind.

I don't want a Persona 3 Portable situation where some characters are able to live. The people who died in the original game (Chidori... maybe, Shinjiro, and Minato/Makoto) should stay dead. Minato/Makoto specifically. His "death" seems kind of important to the plot moving forward even though Persona 3 is finished. It's important enough to be referenced in Persona 4 and Persona 4 Arena, so yeah. That has to stay the same imo.

I'd like for them to add the social links for the male characters into the main game. That outta flush things out a lot more.

When you return to the dorm each day, you're kinda supposed to go talk to all your buddies sitting around for new dialogue and subplots. They should make these moments unskippable. Make them in game cutscene conversations. As the game progresses, make them more and more familiar and friendly with each other during these afterschool chill sessions.

And obviously, the battle system needs an update. It's a bit old skool and could use the benefit of what P4 and P5 improved over the years.

A lot of people complain about pacing, but I haven't really thought about how to fix that, if they even can. The game has to take place over the course of a year. Maybe they can add more plot to do with Strega earlier on? Shinjiro too. That outta work.

Oh, and The Answer... seems like a mixed bag... I think it's important they include the information about Minato/Makoto's soul being a seal that keeps Erebus from reaching Nyx to bring on the destruction of the world. But uh, a lot of the rest of it seems kinda irrelevant. I dunno. Maybe most of that stuff (the flashbacks), should be put in the main game. Like Aki and Mitsuru meeting when they were younger. Maybe Metis can still be included somehow, but... hm... I dunno. I dunno I'll leave that to smarter people to think about.

They've already got some cute updated 3D models for that silly dancing game. Some background environments too. I'd really like to see a remake. For P4 lovers too.

Also, something that annoys me with Persona games, I wish they'd just... pick canon names. I know it's supposed to be "YOU are the main character", but I'm really not. I guess that's just personal preference, I relate to characters obviously, but I not THEM. For the first time recently, I've seen people actually fighting over what the canon names are. Who freakin' cares.

Ok, my rambling is over. Had nowhere else to vomit my thoughts onto.
 
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Ballad of Caius

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Yeah. I've noticed this as years passed by (I played Persona 3 Portable back when it was first released and then got into Persona 4, the Golden and 5). Your Social Links are too dependent on the MC in Persona's 4 and 5. I hope this is something they fix in 6 and 3's approach is very reasonable: you can't just be buddy-buddy with someone you met. Sure, do that with a character, but not with everyone.

Which is why I think Persona 3 stands out a lot from 4 and 5: it's very different. But it's to be expected: it's Persona's first entry into 3D and the first game with the newer Persona formula. But from another pov, it makes sense that Persona 4 characters revolving around the MC is a thing: Persona 4 is veeery different from P3:
β€’ One takes place in the city; the other in a rural town
β€’ Scifi; detective drama
β€’ P3 overall feels like a dark game; P4 feels lighter

In terms of P5 versus P4: I feel like they focused on bringing everything that made P4 explode, seeing as how the expansion of P4's universe is what catapulted Persona into the point where it stands now. P5 was a major success and its enhanced port Royal, but P4 and its spinoffs ran so that P5 could walk.

I'm hopeful for Persona 6. I think it's gonna be a game where they'll focus to differentiate from 5. What I'm worried is that they may try to milk the Phantom Thieves, so P6 could very well be a Persona 5, Part II.
 

kirabook

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Where do you even go with P5 at this point? They already added a huge chunk of story in Royal, right?

The only way I think P5 is gonna be relevant is with the fact that the Phantom Thieves are persona users that can change the hearts of people and the masses. That's kinda exactly what the P3 cast needs/wants to do to free Minato/Makoto's soul from the great seal, to exterminate Erebus once and for all. End the world's desire for death.

Someday, I'd love to see a main game or a spin off (most likely spin off) that seriously tries to tie the plots of 3/4/5 together. Not a time travel AU for shits and giggles like the Q games, but a legit continuation of the story for all three groups. The P3 crew would be in the mid 20's. P4 crew early 20's, and the P5 crew almost finished with high school. (well, depends on how much they skip since apparently P5 takes place in 2016, 6 years after the events of P3). I think P4A was the closest to that concept, so it's not completely impossible.
 

Ballad of Caius

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I think P4A was the closest to that concept, so it's not completely impossible.
I was gonna mention this, even though I haven't played the Arena games.

Where do you even go with P5 at this point?
I ask myself the same thing whenever I worry that P6 could carry on from the Phantom Thieves. Maybe the Phantom Thieves as a concept could get one last game before P7 tries to refresh the series a bit?
 

kirabook

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I kinda feel like P5 was the refresher. Totally new graphics and brought in a shit ton of new fans. It took them forever to make the engine and design they have now and they're pushing it to the limits. I think the graphics of Persona will stay as they are for another long while until technology changes so much that graphics get another overhaul.

At most, maybe they go a P2 route? I haven't actually played P2 and I don't know anything about it whatsoever, but I heard the game is split into two parts, but it's all under Persona 2.
 

Oracle Spockanort

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I think with P5 Royal and Scramble (whenever the hell they decide to release that in the west), they are likely setting up a P5 continuation.

I would be fine with P5 still advancing while they work on P6 with a new cast.
 

Ballad of Caius

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Maaaaaaaaybe Persona 5 Vol. II could be the nicest way they can introduce us towards a Persona game that takes place in college? Then P6 returns to high school.
 

kirabook

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Haven't really looked into the Q games and I don't plan to. But last I heard PQ2 is basically just P5Q. Maybe a 3D arena game with a subplot will do the trick.
 

palizinhas

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I think the first Q game was... bad. They took One trait from each character and played it up for funny, and a lot of them just felt wasted. Q2 has even more characters, but it felt better done. The plot on both is pretty meh, but it was more about the fanservice of seeing characters from different games interact, and I think Q2 at least did that well.
 

Oracle Spockanort

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I think the first Q game was... bad. They took One trait from each character and played it up for funny, and a lot of them just felt wasted. Q2 has even more characters, but it felt better done. The plot on both is pretty meh, but it was more about the fanservice of seeing characters from different games interact, and I think Q2 at least did that well.

I enjoyed Q well enough even though I thought the whole idea was underutilized since it feels weirdly segregated. Also the EO dungeon crawler combat was fun but stressfulβ€”enough that I didn't bother finishing the game because I got too stressed. I am glad to hear Q2 was better, though.
 

Soldier

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What this series really needs, are adults who are persona Users. I'm not counting the P3 cast in ultimax because we already had a game with them as teenagers. Scramble's a step in the right direction featuring the first full adult persona user, but would it be so hard to incorporate that in a future game?
 

kirabook

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Adult protagonist you mean? Because Adachi was definitely an adult but he's an antagonist.

I think games and stories like this focus on childhood/teenagers because their growth as a person fits into the "coming of age" idea, which I've always enjoyed reading since I was young. Even as I'm older, seeing people become comfortable with themselves or discover what they truly want out of life feels fulfilling somehow, even if they make some mistakes along the way. Which is why unless a youngin just does something so stupid and absolutely unforgivable, I don't really condemn them for minor offenses anymore. They're not even 18, of course they're gonna trip and then.

But, I have always been in search of fantasy stories involve college aged or adults honestly? College is also such an interesting time to figure yourself out and come into your own. I'm writing an original story with the characters that age for that very purpose. It opens so many doors to explore more adult themes and problems I'm not just talking lewd stuff, but financial issues and long term relationships, as well as familial relationships which can start getting sticky once you're on your own as a full fledged adult.

Whenever I try to read a "adult" fantasy though... it almost always ends up on the lewd "Oh I hate but he's SO hot when he slaps me across the face and nearly KILLS me!"

No wonder I barely read anymore. YA fantasy has become knock off Twilight galore and fantasy is too horny for its own good.

ANYWAY, I think it'd be pretty awesome if P6 tackled slightly older protags. It's so interesting about P3 though, it kinda felt like they were in college in a way. They were living in a dorm attending school. Other than whatshisface, there were no adults around. I think if they do a college setting, it could end up resembling P3's set up quite a bit.

If they go even older.... it'd feel like Catherine?
 

Soldier

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Adult protagonist you mean? Because Adachi was definitely an adult but he's an antagonist.

I think games and stories like this focus on childhood/teenagers because their growth as a person fits into the "coming of age" idea, which I've always enjoyed reading since I was young. Even as I'm older, seeing people become comfortable with themselves or discover what they truly want out of life feels fulfilling somehow, even if they make some mistakes along the way. Which is why unless a youngin just does something so stupid and absolutely unforgivable, I don't really condemn them for minor offenses anymore. They're not even 18, of course they're gonna trip and then.

But, I have always been in search of fantasy stories involve college aged or adults honestly? College is also such an interesting time to figure yourself out and come into your own. I'm writing an original story with the characters that age for that very purpose. It opens so many doors to explore more adult themes and problems I'm not just talking lewd stuff, but financial issues and long term relationships, as well as familial relationships which can start getting sticky once you're on your own as a full fledged adult.

Whenever I try to read a "adult" fantasy though... it almost always ends up on the lewd "Oh I hate but he's SO hot when he slaps me across the face and nearly KILLS me!"

No wonder I barely read anymore. YA fantasy has become knock off Twilight galore and fantasy is too horny for its own good.

ANYWAY, I think it'd be pretty awesome if P6 tackled slightly older protags. It's so interesting about P3 though, it kinda felt like they were in college in a way. They were living in a dorm attending school. Other than whatshisface, there were no adults around. I think if they do a college setting, it could end up resembling P3's set up quite a bit.

If they go even older.... it'd feel like Catherine?
Not necessarily, An adult can still grow through personal goals/conflict, as we'll likely see with wolf (the codename assigned to the new adult member of the phantom thieves). Having a persona and having it receive an awakening is symbolic of the growth in one's heart, which people can still experience well past their teen years. And Persona 5 actually opens the door to this quite a bit.
Think about it,
Using what limited knowledge i have on 3 and 4, most of their specific events surrounding shadows and personas were entirely locked within their small communities. Persona 3's protagonists had the dark hour, which not everyone in the general public knew about. In the small town of Inaba, the crimes committed there were mostly handled by the local police force, and even if there was media attention from Rise/Naoto's presence. Adachi's method of "pulling people into a TV" is far fetched, and isn't necessarily a known method of death, even in the game's universe.

But persona 5's setting of Tokyo presents a greater chance for common folk to know about it, and they do. Mental shutdowns, Admittance of crimes committed by antagonists and the ebbing and flowing tide of phantom thieves brings the metaverse into the limelight a bit. We know that other characters have been mentioned in persona 5 from previous games (I believe Chie, Naoto and Adachi are referenced by watching TV in the protagonist's room) By this point in the narrative, everyone's had to have at least heard one of the two curious events.
 
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