• Hello everybody! We have tons of new awards for the new year that can be requested through our Awards System thanks to Antifa Lockhart! Some are limited-time awards so go claim them before they are gone forever...

    CLICK HERE FOR AWARDS

The Keyblade Graveyard Makes no Sense



REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS

Twilight Lumiair

Well-known member
Joined
May 1, 2017
Messages
582
Awards
3
Age
21
Location
Virginia
Didn't BBS state for the X-Blade to be forged, the darknesses and lights need to be at equal power?
That's true. So are we saying that the GoL were just too strong for the Organization? In which case, why send Terranort (who wrecked them, realistically or not) out by himself in the first place? Or, alternatively, if it really was just their lights that were too strong, I'm positive the PoH have vastly more potent lights themselves (otherwise, Kairi wouldn't have been able to deny Sora death via that power while everyone else was lost), right? Idk. It just seems weird to me.

Sure, but why actively allow to Guardians to go on undeterred so they can stop him in the end? It may not have technically mattered who died in each clash, but it's definitely in his favour to keep his pieces. Even though they do end up stopping him anyway, I think that only emphasises the importance of him taking those measures.
Fair enough I guess. However, by that logic, shouldn't assembling the GoL have been his back up plan, after the PoH? Why goad Mickey in DDD into creating a faction that has the potential to thwart him yet again, when he could've just as easily went after the Princesses immediately, and been done with it?

Also, I find it odd that he didn't batt an eye when his Seekers were eventually delt with, and then proceeded to turn his back after summoning KH, allowing all of the GoL to converge on his location and attack as a group. Once he got his hands on the X-blade, his first priority should've been shutting down the Guardians, right?
 

SweetYetSalty

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 20, 2018
Messages
2,151
Awards
11
Age
33
Didn't BBS state for the X-Blade to be forged, the darknesses and lights need to be at equal power?
In that case I guess the 13 Darkness's just didn't have strong enough evil thoughts. No kidding when looking at half their members and their motivations or lack of them. So they had to bring the Lights down to their level. I'll keep saying it, Xehanort did not want to win this war.
 

Twilight Lumiair

Well-known member
Joined
May 1, 2017
Messages
582
Awards
3
Age
21
Location
Virginia
In that case I guess the 13 Darkness's just didn't have strong enough evil thoughts. No kidding when looking at half their members and their motivations or lack of them. So they had to bring the Lights down to their level. I'll keep saying it, Xehanort did not want to win this war.
What's funny is that strength of "will" and "body" were requirements given for the New Org by Xemnas in DDD. Bet they were regretting not following their own standards, huh? Now it's all about "ancient knowledge", I guess.
 

Ryuman

Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2019
Messages
64
Awards
2
Location
United Kingdom
Website
twitter.com
Fair enough I guess. However, by that logic, shouldn't the Guardians have been his back up plan, after the PoH? Why goad Mickey in DDD into creating a faction that has the potential to thwart him yet again, when he could've just as easily went after the Princesses immediately, and been done with it?

Also, I find it odd that he didn't batt an eye when his Seekers were eventually delt with, and then proceeded to turn his back after summoning KH, allowing all of the GoL to converge on his location and attack as a group. Once he got his hands on the X-blade, his first priority should've been shutting down the Guardians, right?
I suppose you can reasonably assume Yen Sid would've had them step in anyway. They were aware of Xehanort's return before it truly happened and he's pretty omniscient to the darkness threatening the worlds. Thus Xehanort can take the initiative and pressure them into a scenario they can't turn away from. Finding the Princesses would've taken time and one of them was already a Keyblade wielder.

Xehanort is a bad guy, and as much as it undermines any other argument I make, bad guys are prone to acts of hubris to give the heroes a chance. Not really an excuse, but yeah. Then again, they didn't exactly attack him. The whole Portal thing was rather... unexpected, to say the least.
---
To speak on the issue of the X-Blade methods, I honestly feel like that was one of the smoother retcons. Two completely equal, pure opposing forces VS a clash between 7-13 strongly aligned warriors seems reasonable enough to me. I don't really know how to explain it though.
 

SweetYetSalty

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 20, 2018
Messages
2,151
Awards
11
Age
33
What's funny is that strength of "will" and "body" were requirements given for the New Org by Xemnas in DDD. Bet they were regretting not following their own standards, huh? Now it's all about "ancient knowledge", I guess.
The line may as well not even exist at this point. Most of the new org are the old org, with numerous traitors in their ranks to fart on the "weakness of trust" line. And several of the trustworthy ones aren't even considered for reserves. One of their reserves is a guy who constantly tells the group he is not cut out for combat which is what Xehanort needs, and yet two very strong and loyal guys from the old org don't make it into the new one? Half of DDD has been retconned to no longer be important.
 

Any

Active member
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
172
Awards
1
Larxene was planning to betray the organization again in 3 too.


The new organization was dysfunctional LOL. Thinking about it, they could have screwed up Xehanort’s plans, unintentionally or intentionally.
 

Twilight Lumiair

Well-known member
Joined
May 1, 2017
Messages
582
Awards
3
Age
21
Location
Virginia
I suppose you can reasonably assume Yen Sid would've had them step in anyway. They were aware of Xehanort's return before it truly happened and he's pretty omniscient to the darkness threatening the worlds. Thus Xehanort can take the initiative and pressure them into a scenario they can't turn away from. Finding the Princesses would've taken time and one of them was already a Keyblade wielder.
Alright, I can at least accept that explanation (even if that makes me question what they would've done with the PoH, if having "too strong lights" was really an issue).
Xehanort is a bad guy, and as much as it undermines any other argument I make, bad guys are prone to acts of hubris to give the heroes a chance. Not really an excuse, but yeah. Then again, they didn't exactly attack him. The whole Portal thing was rather... unexpected, to say the least.
Imperfect answers for imperfect scenarios I guess.

Though, I honestly have to wonder if Nomura remembered what a "portal" in KH actually was. Young Xehanort (who was granted an inherent affinity for manipulating the flow of time) was stated to be the portal for all the members brought forward from the past, and Master Xehanort is just... himself in the present. The two don't have the same disposition, so I'm confused as to how MX was a "portal" during that scene in the first place.
The line may as well not even exist at this point. Most of the new org are the old org, with numerous traitors in their ranks to fart on the "weakness of trust" line. And several of the trustworthy ones aren't even considered for reserves. One of their reserves is a guy who constantly tells the group he is not cut out for combat which is what Xehanort needs, and yet two very strong and loyal guys from the old org don't make it into the new one? Half of DDD has been retconned to no longer be important.
It's such a bad retcon too. Like, that was one of the most important scenes in the entirety of DDD, and people can't just forget it when they've been operating under that information leading up to KH3. If Larxene and Marluxia joining Xehanort is just gonna be hand waved as "oh, they're just there because...", then it would've at least made more sense to have freaking Xaldin, or even Zexion in their place instead. There's no truly good reason for any of them to throw away their agency and freewill (which they would've lost after housing a peice of Xehanort's heart for too long) anyway, so at least pick the people who didn't try to betray Xemnas.

Larxene was planning to betray the organization again in 3 too.


The new organization was dysfunctional LOL. Thinking about it, they could have screwed up Xehanort’s plans, unintentionally or intentionally.
I've said this in another thread, but yeah.

Somehow, despite Xemnas and Young Xehanort spelling out how they weren't going to make the same mistakes twice, the New Organization ended up being even more dysfunctional than the original. What exactly was stopping Larxene and Marluxia from attempting another coup? Am I honestly expected to believe they just dropped the subject entirely at the request of Demyx, and never bothered to attempt it again? Evidence suggest they would've had no issues considering Siax and Vexen successfully tricked Xehanort with ease, and even SoD became an accomplice when he opted to not expose their machinations. It's so damn weird that the writers acknowledge all of this, and then just expect us to swallow it like it's no big deal. :confused:
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Any

SweetYetSalty

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 20, 2018
Messages
2,151
Awards
11
Age
33
Alright, I can at least accept that explanation (even if that makes me question what they would've done with the PoH, if having "too strong lights" was really an issue).

Imperfect answers for imperfect scenarios I guess.

Though, I honestly have to wonder if Nomura remembered what a "portal" in KH actually was. Young Xehanort (who was granted an inherent affinity for manipulating the flow of time) was stated to be the portal for all the members brought forward from the past, and Master Xehanort is just... himself in the present. The two don't have the same disposition, so I'm confused as to how MX was a "portal" during that scene in the first place.

It's such a bad retcon too. Like, that was one of the most important scenes in the entirety of DDD, and people can't just forget it when they've been operating under that information leading up to KH3. If Larxene and Marluxia joining Xehanort is just gonna be hand waved as "oh, they're just there because...", then it would've at least made more sense to have freaking Xaldin, or even Zexion in their place instead. There's no truly good reason for any of them to throw away their agency and freewill (which they would've lost after housing a price of Xehanort's heart for too long) anyway, so at least pick the people who didn't try to betray Xemnas.


I've said this in another thread, but yeah.

Somehow, despite Xemnas and Young Xehanort spelling out how they weren't going to make the same mistakes twice, the New Organization ended up being even more dysfunctional than the original. What exactly was stopping Larxene and Marluxia from attempting another coup? Am I honestly expected to believe they just dropped the subject entirely at the request of Demyx, and never bothered to attempt it again? Evidence suggest they would've had no issues considering Siax and Vexen successfully tricked Xehanort with ease, and even SoD became an accomplice when he opted to not expose their machinations. It's so damn weird that the writers acknowledge all of this, and then just expect us to swallow it like it's no big deal. :confused:
Xehanort was looking for strong bodies/fighters for vessels. I'll never understand why he didn't pick Lexaeus and Xaldin but choose Marluxia and Larxene. Don't give me 'their Keyblade legacy' because apparently Marluxia doesn't remember it and they don't even summon their Keyblades for the war if they have any, which they should if their Somebodies can use Keyblades. And Marluxia and Larxene weren't even brainwashed. It frustrates me they are lackeys for a plot they don't care about, when they were standout villains before this. And since their princess plot goes nowhere they are just barely above a Maleficent and Pete in terms of what they brought to the table. It's almost as frustrating as the Terranort scene. Almost but not quite.
 

Any

Active member
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
172
Awards
1
The only loyal members were the trio norts and Dark Riku.


Vanitas is 50/50. On occasion, he was loyal to Xehanort however Vanitas would screw up Xehanort’s plan whenever he didn’t get his way. Vanitas doesn't care the slightest bit either. As an example, if he successfully killed Aqua in LoD then he could have conceivably ruined Xehanort’s plan since Aqua was a guardian of light. Or on the other hand, if Vanitas successfully absorbed Ventus from Sora in Monstropolis or LoD then Xehanort lost another guardian of light.


Xion was forced to become a member and wasn’t herself so there’s no stance where her loyalty lies

Larxene, Marluxia, and Demyx were traitors


Saix and Vexen worked behind Xehanort’s back.


I don’t know what to think of Luxord.



The new organization was no better than the original organization. Xemnas needs a break. I bet he was embarrassed about his speech in DDD
 

Twilight Lumiair

Well-known member
Joined
May 1, 2017
Messages
582
Awards
3
Age
21
Location
Virginia
The only loyal members were the trio norts and Dark Riku.
Honestly, even that's suspect at this point.

As said before, Ansem SoD allowed Vexen and Siax's schemes to go unnoticed (due to no longer giving a shit about anything), effectively making him an accomplice to their plans. Xigbar, aka Luxu, clearly had ulterior motives for helping Xehanort, and sent him on a wild goose chase for that Black Box, instead of just revealing where it was. And it's even heavily implied (based on dialogue) that he may have confided his true plans in Young Xehanort, requesting him to push Sora further toward his future demise, and making him an accomplice to schemes unknown to his older self as well.

Dark Riku is weird. He's based on Repliku, but the original Repliku (at every stage of his life) was trying to be his own person, and find his own identity. That's why he kept saying "you're not real." And yet he agreed to become a Xehanort vessel? Isn't that the complete antithesis of what he was aiming for?
 

Hirokey123

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 16, 2015
Messages
1,060
Awards
5
I dunno once I read the ultimania it made pretty good sense, the game just wasn't great at making it clear. Sora abuse of the power of waking restoring so many people at once created a time singularity. The thing about a singularity is it's a single-larity as in just one thing. They all showed up alive again after being dead and so the moment in which they all died again was forced to replay to try and kill them all again per the whole "can't change time" factor. Once LW showed up time went off the rails and the singularity was no more, time could now move forward down a whole new path. It's just a single moment that replayed that's why everything only repeats up until the changes.

Xehanort's plan actually makes perfect sense. They need only the 7 most powerful light and they don't even need them alive, it will work if they are alive but it's just better for Xehanort if they kill them and use their hearts directly. Because if they are dead they can't mess things up after the forging is complete, you know do the very thing they ended up doing. To that end Xehanort tried to just kill them outright, to break them physically and emotionally.

The army was meant to exhaust, Terranort was a mean targeted attack who specifically focuses on causing emotional/mental damage by pretending to be Terra and then trying to take out the weaker members they really care about like Ven and Kairi. Once they were broken then came in Demon Typhoon as pretty much Xehanort's ultimate "screw the rules I have darkness", the demon typhoon was basically unbeatable and was the actual thing meant to rip their hearts from their bodies and in the process kill any lights too weak to serve. Xehanort's plan was flawless it worked perfectly then Sora with the help of the MoM's foresight screwed up everything. But Xehanort had another plan in place and set another weaker army at them to exhaust them, which Yensid ruined at the last moment. Still Xehanort got what he wanted, the group was paired down from 9 to 7, and so the fight was ready.

Even then Xehanort didn't play fair he immediately split the group up creating a maze that would force them into unfair odds that played on their emotional/mental states and made it difficult to regroup. Riku was forced to fight AnsemSoD, Xigbar, and Dark Riku. Mickey was forced to fight Larxene, Marluxia, Luxord, and Xemnas. Aqua and Ventus were forced to fight Terranort and Vanitas. Lea and Kairi were forced to fight Saix and Xion, and Sora he was isolated from all of them. Sora is also the one who recognized Xehanort's strategy for what it was and he does not get enough credit for that. YX, AnsemSoD, and Xemnas were all held back for later incase the heroes managed to win their fights essentially using his strongest pieces to form a last ditch defensive wall around MX their king piece and they had Kairi as final chip to get the last clash. Once the X-blade was made all Xehanort had to do waste their time until the reset occurred and that's exactly what happened, Xehanort had planned successfully for every eventuality and he had won. The only reason he fails is because he WILLINGLY gave up the X-blade to Sora, because the real battle was never combat strategies as no one was outfoxing Xehanort in that, it was wills. Sora with the help of Eraqus checkmated Xehanort into yielding the game by beating him out in will, in conviction, in heart.

As for forging nothing is actually contradicted it just wasn't till DDD we got the full story, and what we got doesn't contradict BBS. The original X-blade first split into two halves, light and dark, that's where your equal light and darkness bit comes from and then then light and dark further divided itself. The light split into 7 to protect the seven pure hearts that remained in the world and the darkness split into 13. We don't know why the darkness split into that or what even happened to those pieces but that doesn't matter it's just unexplained lore that may or may not be important one day. That's where MX's idea in BBS came in, the X-blade originally split into two so it make sense you could make at least some sort of X-blade using just two pieces even if it was weaker. He wasn't wrong either it did work it just turned out the weakness of the blade was its undoing and caused his plans to fall apart.

I honestly think the organization was fine to.

-MX, YX, Xemnas, AnsemSoD, and Terranort are all the same core dude even if some become burnt out near the end they all still shared the same original goal and since most of them were already dead by this point in time betraying now serves no purpose so they just had hollow existences.
-Saix and Vexen are specifically in the organization in order to make use of its resources, they traded their agency for access to the replica program and a chance to fix things
-Xigbar is Luxu and carrying out this plan was part of his role for the MoM and doing so meant he got to reunite with the people he actually cares about.
-Repliku was stuck in dick KH1 Riku mode which is back when he thought like Xehanort, he only got his memories of being a replica back when he started to glitch out due to Riku beating the tar out of him (repliku inside of Riku may also have to do with it) and Xion was in mindless puppet mode.
-Larxene is there because she tags along with Marluxia, because she has no past and nothing else in life to cling to.
-Demyx is there because he was sweet talked but more accurately he's always been a coward afraid to say no to the organization.

So the only two members that don't "make sense" are Marluxia and Luxord but that's because they don't have a stated motive which isn't the same as being illogical. Luxord is clearly playing a long game of some kind as ReMind is showing us but where that's going remains to be seen. Marluxia will probably never be explained though since he got back his memories and thus his original goal and purpose in life, so what came before wouldn't matter and that goes for CoM we never got a reason for his coup in that game either. As for Xehanort welcoming them back the game made sure to cover that by showing he needed the numbers and he needed them specifically because they have secrets he wants to get his greedy hands on.

The writing is kinda weak and the presentation needs work but as a whole it's pretty solid, but it's trying to cram so much in while players are still not even given the time to fully process the stuff before the graveyard it's comes out more like a hard puzzling grey mush.
 

disney233

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 3, 2015
Messages
1,162
Awards
2
Age
25
Question. Can anyone in the New Organization even wield keyblades? I mean...It's clear the 3 norts and Luxu can but...like...Keys of light and Keys of darkness right?
 

Hirokey123

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 16, 2015
Messages
1,060
Awards
5
Saix is the only non-wielder in the group funnily enough, Vexen to but he was benched and he was only brought on for the replica project so benching him was always the intent.

Xehanort, AnsemSoD, Xemnas, Terranort, and YX are all the same keyblade wielder dude.
Xigbar, Marluxia, Larxene, Demyx, and Luxord are all ancient keyblade wielders.
Xion and Repliku are replicas of wielders with Repliku being a Riku replica and Xion being a Sora/Roxas/Kairi replica.
Vanitas is half of an ancient keyblade wielder.

Saix was the only non-wielder in the 13 but now that I think about it Xehanort made everyone there half him so really they all are wielders by that proxy. Of course being a wielder and having a keyblade are different but in the end that didn't seem to matter.
 

Any

Active member
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
172
Awards
1
Question. Can anyone in the New Organization even wield keyblades? I mean...It's clear the 3 norts and Luxu can but...like...Keys of light and Keys of darkness right?

I think all them except for Ansem since he was a heartless and Saix
 

KeyToDestiny

Active member
Joined
Mar 20, 2015
Messages
273
Awards
3
I wonder if sometimes people paid attention to the games or not. Marluxia's reasons for siding with Xehanort while not fully explored literally hints that he agreed with Xehanort's endgame plan about the whole light and darkness balance as he told Sora and co. himself in Corona. How he came to this thought is anyone's guess but that was his reason to be loyal to Xehanort as he now had reason to even if he understood that Xehanort just saw him as a vessel.

And the others never really betrayed Xehanort either and had no real reason to anyways. Vanitas was always Xehanort's loyal dog so he's not going anywhere, Terranort, Ansem and Xemnas are extensions of him so they'd go with his plan by default(and no. Ansem not saying anything about the traitor does not make him an "accomplice". It just means he doesn't give a damn about it at all as it's really doing nothing to stop their plans), Young Xehanort is Xehanort so he'd help by default, Xigbar's goals coincides with Xehanort's so it's a reason for him to be loyal and Luxord's always been loyal to the Organization so yeah. Dark Riku's also an asshole so any chance he gets to mess things up for Sora and Riku he'd take it. It was probably one of the reasons for Marluxia and Larxene as well despite the latter saying she came back for Marluxia. They both clearly loved tormenting Sora and the others so it was another reason to join Xehanort's cause despite the other reasons.

Demyx had nothing really better to do plus he clearly wouldn't have minded coming back anyways seeing as he got upset that he got benched in the end. Vexen and Saix wanted to atone but the latter still wanted to get back at Axel at the same time. Plus they did their parts in helping Xehanort for the most part so Xehanort could not care less about any "treason" from them since it hardly took away from their contributions for the real Organization.

As for Xion, she was recruited when she was still new to the old Organization so before she met Roxas and Axel. So it made sense for her to be loyal because she was created for the Organization's cause.

So in the end, all the members played their parts for Xehanort and helped with his goal. There were hardly any real betrayals in the new Organization compared to the old Organization so the whole "the new Organization was as dysfunctional as the old Organization" claim is pretty laughable.
 

Ivan3295

New member
Joined
Dec 16, 2019
Messages
4
I will respond to this in my own post "concerning keyblade graveyard time travel confusion" with an I'm depth explanation 👍🏻
 

Ballad of Caius

Player 💀
Joined
Jan 4, 2014
Messages
7,270
Awards
9
Location
Shibuya
I presume "the Guardians being incompetent" in the Terranort scene is going to be explained in Re:MIND, seeing as how something along those lines is hinted when Aqua sees versions of her Anti form in the tornado.
 

SweetYetSalty

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 20, 2018
Messages
2,151
Awards
11
Age
33
I dunno once I read the ultimania it made pretty good sense, the game just wasn't great at making it clear. Sora abuse of the power of waking restoring so many people at once created a time singularity. The thing about a singularity is it's a single-larity as in just one thing. They all showed up alive again after being dead and so the moment in which they all died again was forced to replay to try and kill them all again per the whole "can't change time" factor. Once LW showed up time went off the rails and the singularity was no more, time could now move forward down a whole new path. It's just a single moment that replayed that's why everything only repeats up until the changes.

Xehanort's plan actually makes perfect sense. They need only the 7 most powerful light and they don't even need them alive, it will work if they are alive but it's just better for Xehanort if they kill them and use their hearts directly. Because if they are dead they can't mess things up after the forging is complete, you know do the very thing they ended up doing. To that end Xehanort tried to just kill them outright, to break them physically and emotionally.

The army was meant to exhaust, Terranort was a mean targeted attack who specifically focuses on causing emotional/mental damage by pretending to be Terra and then trying to take out the weaker members they really care about like Ven and Kairi. Once they were broken then came in Demon Typhoon as pretty much Xehanort's ultimate "screw the rules I have darkness", the demon typhoon was basically unbeatable and was the actual thing meant to rip their hearts from their bodies and in the process kill any lights too weak to serve. Xehanort's plan was flawless it worked perfectly then Sora with the help of the MoM's foresight screwed up everything. But Xehanort had another plan in place and set another weaker army at them to exhaust them, which Yensid ruined at the last moment. Still Xehanort got what he wanted, the group was paired down from 9 to 7, and so the fight was ready.

Even then Xehanort didn't play fair he immediately split the group up creating a maze that would force them into unfair odds that played on their emotional/mental states and made it difficult to regroup. Riku was forced to fight AnsemSoD, Xigbar, and Dark Riku. Mickey was forced to fight Larxene, Marluxia, Luxord, and Xemnas. Aqua and Ventus were forced to fight Terranort and Vanitas. Lea and Kairi were forced to fight Saix and Xion, and Sora he was isolated from all of them. Sora is also the one who recognized Xehanort's strategy for what it was and he does not get enough credit for that. YX, AnsemSoD, and Xemnas were all held back for later incase the heroes managed to win their fights essentially using his strongest pieces to form a last ditch defensive wall around MX their king piece and they had Kairi as final chip to get the last clash. Once the X-blade was made all Xehanort had to do waste their time until the reset occurred and that's exactly what happened, Xehanort had planned successfully for every eventuality and he had won. The only reason he fails is because he WILLINGLY gave up the X-blade to Sora, because the real battle was never combat strategies as no one was outfoxing Xehanort in that, it was wills. Sora with the help of Eraqus checkmated Xehanort into yielding the game by beating him out in will, in conviction, in heart.

As for forging nothing is actually contradicted it just wasn't till DDD we got the full story, and what we got doesn't contradict BBS. The original X-blade first split into two halves, light and dark, that's where your equal light and darkness bit comes from and then then light and dark further divided itself. The light split into 7 to protect the seven pure hearts that remained in the world and the darkness split into 13. We don't know why the darkness split into that or what even happened to those pieces but that doesn't matter it's just unexplained lore that may or may not be important one day. That's where MX's idea in BBS came in, the X-blade originally split into two so it make sense you could make at least some sort of X-blade using just two pieces even if it was weaker. He wasn't wrong either it did work it just turned out the weakness of the blade was its undoing and caused his plans to fall apart.

I honestly think the organization was fine to.

-MX, YX, Xemnas, AnsemSoD, and Terranort are all the same core dude even if some become burnt out near the end they all still shared the same original goal and since most of them were already dead by this point in time betraying now serves no purpose so they just had hollow existences.
-Saix and Vexen are specifically in the organization in order to make use of its resources, they traded their agency for access to the replica program and a chance to fix things
-Xigbar is Luxu and carrying out this plan was part of his role for the MoM and doing so meant he got to reunite with the people he actually cares about.
-Repliku was stuck in dick KH1 Riku mode which is back when he thought like Xehanort, he only got his memories of being a replica back when he started to glitch out due to Riku beating the tar out of him (repliku inside of Riku may also have to do with it) and Xion was in mindless puppet mode.
-Larxene is there because she tags along with Marluxia, because she has no past and nothing else in life to cling to.
-Demyx is there because he was sweet talked but more accurately he's always been a coward afraid to say no to the organization.

So the only two members that don't "make sense" are Marluxia and Luxord but that's because they don't have a stated motive which isn't the same as being illogical. Luxord is clearly playing a long game of some kind as ReMind is showing us but where that's going remains to be seen. Marluxia will probably never be explained though since he got back his memories and thus his original goal and purpose in life, so what came before wouldn't matter and that goes for CoM we never got a reason for his coup in that game either. As for Xehanort welcoming them back the game made sure to cover that by showing he needed the numbers and he needed them specifically because they have secrets he wants to get his greedy hands on.

The writing is kinda weak and the presentation needs work but as a whole it's pretty solid, but it's trying to cram so much in while players are still not even given the time to fully process the stuff before the graveyard it's comes out more like a hard puzzling grey mush.
That's a solid argument for Larxene's case. So from this point on I won't complain that much on her involvement given how shallow it is. Luxord makes sense to return because he was loyal to the old Organization. In Days we see he's low on the pecking order but doesn't politic with the other big wigs of the group to get a better sitting like Saix and Marluxia do, thus never drawing attention to himself. Among members 9-12 he's the only one to make sense as a recruit as there is no reason to suspect him of anything and they know he'll follow orders.

Honestly I wouldn't have such a problem with Marluxia being in the new Organization if they had a way to make sure he doesn't do anything out of Xehanort's control and if Xemnas didn't deliver that line in DDD about the old Organization. That's what makes his inclusion so frustrating to me because unlike Terra and the replicas, he has his free will. I'm sure if they had gotten Sora like they originally wanted he would be brainwashed too, so why is this traitor free to do as he pleases? He could not show up at the Keyblade Graveyard and totally mess with Xehanort.
 

kingofthekey

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2009
Messages
15
Awards
4
Age
32
Location
Kentucky
Yeah, while that scene initially hyped me, taking another look at it made me realize that it was just a complete mess from a character and writing perspective.
  • I also don't understand why the Xehanorts found the guardians' light too bright? Too bright? The backup plan was 7 hearts of literal pure light, just fight them or extract their hearts. Why does their light suddenly need to dim?

  • Then Xigbar shows up after the heartless tornado claiming they need to do another mark of mastery exam to ensure "they brought the goods." Again, why? They don't need to be keyblade masters. You only need them to clash.

  • Some characters just seemed to love giving up. Aqua, Sora, and Donald. Sora I at least understood, but after everything they've been through and having literally just come back to life, Donald is willing to cower and give up in front of heartless? They've taken down millions at that point, including a massive army of similar size just a little while ago.
I loved this segment of the game for the battles and some of the story beats, but the overall narrative for many moments was such a mess and it seems Nomura just threw together some dialogue because he couldn't come up with anything that made sense for so many battles. He needs a team of dedicated writers for the next saga.

I completely agree, though before all* was revealed, I understood it as that all 7 guardians needed to be Keyblade Masters for this particular event but that was tossed out of the window.
And one more itch I have as far as writing/story telling goes,...are the Princesses of Heart really relevant anymore?
I've played this series since day one and the princesses were a main driving force for the first game, but they've been benched in KH3, and even then, not all of the new 7 hearts were revealed(unless I missed something.)
I ramble, but also agree that perhaps there should be a team taking point on the story writing.
Rushing into anything leaves alot to be desired.
 

Zettaflare

Shibuya
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
11,764
Awards
4
Location
California
I presume "the Guardians being incompetent" in the Terranort scene is going to be explained in Re:MIND, seeing as how something along those lines is hinted when Aqua sees versions of her Anti form in the tornado.
At least Aqua having PTSD was was implied before the Re:MIND trailer layed it out for us. I'm not sure what reason the DLC could provide that could explain Aqua, Riku, and Mickey not reacting before the giant heartless Tornado. They all seemed ready to go before Terranort struck Ventus
 
Top