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(SPOILERS) Union X: Darkness Makes a Move



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Foxycian

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Well, I do prefer the 13 darkness theory than darkness is just vanitas more
Well all the hints I gathered seem to point that it’s not vanitas

1. Darkness spoke with Sora within Ventus despite vanitas no longer being part of Ventus

2. Darkness keeps referring to itself as we/us so vanitas isn’t darkness but him being born from darkness makes him a part (or fragment) of This Darkness entity, basically like all the darkness’s inside of people
 

yuyayuzu

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Well all the hints I gathered seem to point that it’s not vanitas

1. Darkness spoke with Sora within Ventus despite vanitas no longer being part of Ventus

2. Darkness keeps referring to itself as we/us so vanitas isn’t darkness but him being born from darkness makes him a part (or fragment) of This Darkness entity, basically like all the darkness’s inside of people

I hope it is like that
I just don't feel comfortable when people automatically assume darkness must means Vanitas
 

Sign

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I hope it is like that
I just don't feel comfortable when people automatically assume darkness must means Vanitas
It's definitely going to be an issue going forward especially for all the people who aren't following UX and make assumptions based on what few elements have been incorporated into the console games. Might be alleviated some once Global gets the quests though.
 

Cumguardian69

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UX desperately needs a Back Cover. Fully voiced 3D in UE4 if not UE5. Holy smokes this update was positively spicy. Ephemer got flung by Lauri's already weakened fist. Guess hes a lightweight lmao. Seeing him draw his blade on Ven too has me wondering - was he going for the KILL MOVE a la Terrranort or was he going to bash Venty-wenty's head in?
 

SuperSaiyanSora

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Not necessarily. There being multiple "Darknesses" was a realistic possibility from the start.
I remember from the very first main story quests of the original Browser Chi that Chirithy mentioned there being several "Seekers of Darkness" posing as Keyblade Wielders (dunno if that part was taken over into Unchained/Union X), there was one scene imagined by Player with nine black coats standing against thirteen on the Keyblade Graveyard and there's also the possibility of multiple Dark Chirithys.

Something to remember too is that the Master of Masters has said that the Keyblade War against Light and Darkness has been going on for ages. Since he was a kid, even. Luxu hears this and thinks that all they're essentially doing is running away, because this is an enemy that supposedly hasn't been beaten this whole time. A realistic conclusion to come to, because how in the world do you manage against an enemy like that for THAT long???

Wars tend to not last super long because you only have so many able-bodied people that are willing to put themselves in harm's way (and only so many able-bodied people that can be drafted). If two sides are evenly matched for so long, it sooner or later becomes a literal War of Attrition -- whoever gives out first loses. Whatever the hell these "monsters of darkness" are, they clearly seem strong and resilient enough for the MoM to feel like he has to put this entire plan into action. He made Luxu pass on No Name throughout time just so the MoM can see what happens beyond KH3's Keyblade War. He even says in Back Cover, "You really think the world can be saved with just seven people??" He was being coy there, but maybe there was more to it. A LOT more.

It's possible that he didn't tell the Foretellers anything not because of manipulation, but because he was right: there really wouldn't be anything they can do to change that fate, besides what's been already been told in the Book of Prophecies. With how the Black Box supposedly is containing "hope" inside it, and the MoM told Luxu not to open it under any circumstances (but then told him "You'll see", as if Luxu will eventually know why the box contains what it does)... I wouldn't be surprised if the box just contained light. But not just any light -- Light that could wipe the entire universe, and it's been collecting light throughout multiple eras this entire time. Like a Spirit Bomb. If all these actions are supposedly being taken in order to defeat "Darkness" (whatever it/they are), then it makes sense that they'd need some sort of weapon of light. Something that couldn't have been used in the Chi era, but possibly can be in this current Post-KH3 era.

So if anything, yeah, I agree. I think it's always been a possibility that this would be the road we'd eventually go down.
 

Idreamaboutcats

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I don’t remember a scene like that in the original browser, but it has been a looong time. I do remember Chirithy making us dream about the Master convening a meeting with the foretellers though. I also remember the Seekers of Darkness thing.

It makes sense, masquerade as the enemy and enact a subterfuge. Meanwhile, turn the enemy to your side (i.e. Darklings) and amass those numbers.

To be honest I’m just glad the “whodunit” part of Strelitzia’s murder has been brought to a close. It answers one question…raises so many others.

There definitely was a traitor though, from the looks of it, and the Master might’ve already known from the get go but never did anything about it, because of the long haul.
 

SuperSaiyanSora

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There definitely was a traitor though, from the looks of it, and the Master might’ve already known from the get go but never did anything about it, because of the long haul.

That's what I'm thinking too. Either it was out of his ability to do something now, OR he could've BUT it would've been pointless, as it wouldn't have changed anything in the grand scheme of things -- delaying the inevitable, basically.

Like I said above, the fact that his master plan involved passing down a Keyblade through multiple eras in order for it to reach beyond KH3's Keyblade War, it pretty much gives weight to idea that he wasn't able to do anything at that time. If he was, why didn't he do it? Why is the Book of Prophecies so powerful, why does it matter so much?

He's quite obviously not just some any old dude if he's able to pluck out an eye, put it in a Keyblade, and it somehow is able to see events well beyond the current era... If we're to take what he said literally. It really makes me wonder exactly what he experienced in his youth, what's his backstory? (Assuming the guy isn't somehow Sora lmao) Whatever happened to him back in the day, it must've been nuts, because somehow he's doing things that seem outright impossible to anyone else so far.
 

SweetYetSalty

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If there are possible 13 Darknesses like there are seven lights, would that make Ventus the Kairi of the Darknesses, especially if they are in Disney villains like people are making theories of, and we see Xehanort is able to see Darkness from the Queen of Hearts. This is why I think he'll see Darkness when he meets Ventus.
 
D

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That's what I'm thinking too. Either it was out of his ability to do something now, OR he could've BUT it would've been pointless, as it wouldn't have changed anything in the grand scheme of things -- delaying the inevitable, basically.
Looking at the conversations between the MoM and Luxu, plus Luxu's conversation with Ava, I think the MoM planned for the world to end and the traitor, as part of his plan to defeat the darkness. He said to Luxu that to defeat the darkness 'we will end the world' and thereby 'discard' time and the borders of the world.
If there are possible 13 Darknesses like there are seven lights, would that make Ventus the Kairi of the Darknesses, especially if they are in Disney villains like people are making theories of, and we see Xehanort is able to see Darkness from the Queen of Hearts. This is why I think he'll see Darkness when he meets Ventus
That makes sense to me. In his BBS report, Xehanort does say he felt he and Ventus were 'destined to meet' and it seemed odd that he would think meek and gentle Ventus had enough darkness to serve his purposes for no reason. This is why I've always been throught that Ven's appearance in UX isn't one of Nomura's most wild retcons but that's just me.
 

WayFinder gang

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UX desperately needs a Back Cover.
I think we will get one relatively soon as the Union leaders chapter is about to end. If I recall correctly we got Back Cover when the mobile App was still unchained X, right right before the Uion leaders chapter begins. If we get Kingdom Hearts 3.5, that'll be the third part of the game, the second being Melody of Memory.
 

LoneFox

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Let's return to that old question: How did this Darkness know that Strelitzia is one of the new leaders? Isn't the most likely answer now that the Darkness is connected to the Master of Masters (possibly even created by him) and got the information directly from him?
 

Idreamaboutcats

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(Wall of Text)
It’s as you say, it’s most likely a War of Attrition. Honestly, what I want to understand is his motive. Why is he dealing in absolutes like Eraqus, forcing a plan that would eradicate the Darkness rather than accepting it as a coexistence with the Light? Did he suffer some sort of trauma? Was it dogmatic influence? Hypnosis?

The BoP is powerful alright, even into the current age it can bring about leftover projections on the worlds’ reconstruction, long after the first war ended and fractured the original World. In that case, the question turns from why didn’t he do it to why he did. If he didn’t write the book and mislead his apprentices, didn’t give tacit approval to the formation of unions, didn’t force Luxu to pass on No Name through the ages, none of it would’ve happened. The answer to that is that in any other worldline where the war didn’t occur, something disastrous still happens. It was a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation. It brings about another question, was the War a necessity in comparison to the disaster that fell on the worldline where it didn’t happen?

With an eye like that though, the Master is definitely something not human, or at least, ordinarily human.
Let's return to that old question: How did this Darkness know that Strelitzia is one of the new leaders? Isn't the most likely answer now that the Darkness is connected to the Master of Masters (possibly even created by him) and got the information directly from him?
Let me answer that question with another question, or rather, add on to it.

What was the sentient Darkness before it was the Heartless in the current age?

The Master did create a darkness, Chirithy, a dream eater, the darkness manifested during sleep as opposed to the waking world, but somehow exists in waking. Even in darkness, it is a friendly creature, but once it gets a taste of malice, become a corruptible thing, and so do all dream eaters that it sired and were created from its blueprints. But discarding almost all of it, let me ask another question and compound to it.

What Darkness existed back in the Age of Fairy Tales when the war was about to occur, not counting the projections from a book because it isn’t real? First, dream eater Chirithy. Second, darkness that masquerades as humans and is capable of sentience and speech. Third, Darklings, fallen wielders who succumbed to darkness and steal Lux, particles of light which has unclear purpose other than encouraging competition and eventual distrust.
 

Sephiroth0812

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Why is he dealing in absolutes like Eraqus, forcing a plan that would eradicate the Darkness rather than accepting it as a coexistence with the Light? Did he suffer some sort of trauma? Was it dogmatic influence? Hypnosis?
It might have something to do with said "sentient Darkness" latching onto people, as Xehanort in Dark Road says "even completely innocent people who have no malicious intent at all", like a parasite and using those people as a shield in order to commit atrocities like murder, destroying the current world and generally create mistrust, chaos and strife.

You cannot coexist with a force that is constantly trying to undermine, hurt and destroy you and those who are like you. Or to say it with Brains words:
This was the darkness's motive...

Anxiety… Fear… Suspicion… Rage...

To throw our hearts into disarray, and sever the connections between us...

At least that is the picture that is drawn so far about these "Darknesses". It is similar to what Xehanort does during BBS and also arguably Xemnas as the leader of the original Organisation, but on a vastly bigger scale.

If these "Darknesses" are like this by nature or not cannot really be answered right now, but what we've seen so far of their actions and behavior makes "peaceful coexistence" not really an option.
There is also a difference between an element of nature that might just have some dangerous properties and an actual sentient entity with a will of their own which may intentionally take harmful actions.
 

kirabook

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Light and darkness are elements of nature, agreed. In current day Kingdom Hearts as evidenced by Ven's shutdown, you can't have one without the other. You'll probably die unless you're a Princess of Heart.

But "Darkness" doesn't seem to be an element of nature. It seems to be a sentiment creature out to cause destruction and harm. I'd say, it's not heartless level "sentient" either which all seem to be mindless creatures wandering around. "Darkness" seems just as human as actual humans.

If the battle of "Light" and "Dark" is actually a battle between mostly normal people and these weird ghouls who call themselves "Darkness", then that's something different. Or maybe, "Darkness" used to be human as well, but lost their physical form to the darkness and inhabit other people instead.
 

Chie

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I'm also on the these are either people called Darkness, or the "monsters" from MoM's time which were called Darkness. If these were just manifestations of the same god damn darkness in general that we've talked about for the whole series, that would be... pretty boring?
 

Blizzard-

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Let's return to that old question: How did this Darkness know that Strelitzia is one of the new leaders? Isn't the most likely answer now that the Darkness is connected to the Master of Masters (possibly even created by him) and got the information directly from him?

There’s a possibility, if MoM is playing the long game, he either told Darkness that information or he purposely made sure Darkness knew it someway or another. I’m starting to think this is all part of MoM’s plan somehow, so he’s making sure everyone involved “does their role.”
 

Ballad of Caius

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HmmmMMmMmmMmm..........

I think Darkness is a natural force of nature. Pureblood Heartless are a natural evolution of Darkness in the sense that they're primitive beings that are wild. While the Seekers of Darkness, or the Darknesses, are the more evolved species of Darkness.

This is what the MoM was referencing to Luxu in a previous update: Darkness that took a humanoid form. Perhaps the MoM comes from an age where Darkness made an army of humanoid warriors and devoured everything.

Either a time or a Worldline. Perhaps the MoM's plan is to investigate Worldlines that don't have Darkness taking humanoid forms and figuring out a way to stop this process, and by a long shot, stop this process in every single Worldline.

It wouldn't be farfetched to think that the MoM's grand plan is to fuse all Worldlines and kill the humanoid Darknesses in one fell swoop.

That said, it wouldn't surprise me that the Keyblade was originally a weapon developed by the Darkness in order to control the Light, easy navigate through it and what the MoM did was modify the Keyblade to fight Darkness, and without realizing it, generations of Keyblade Wielders and Masters have been using a weapon that was originally intent to destroy the light.
 

Chie

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I guess my problem with "Darkness is literally darkness itself" is that I still believe the idea that darkness and light are just forces. Darkness is a really dangerous force, so it's usually used by people who are reckless or let themselves lose out to it, and thus why the antagonists use it. But I don't know if I can like Kingdom Hearts if it comes down to "darkness is literally evil and light is literally good". But I do agree the Darkness characters are the "monsters" from his past that MoM spoke about (as I've guessed in my thread about the unversed symbol).
 

Noivern

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I guess my problem with "Darkness is literally darkness itself" is that I still believe the idea that darkness and light are just forces. Darkness is a really dangerous force, so it's usually used by people who are reckless or let themselves lose out to it, and thus why the antagonists use it. But I don't know if I can like Kingdom Hearts if it comes down to "darkness is literally evil and light is literally good". But I do agree the Darkness characters are the "monsters" from his past that MoM spoke about (as I've guessed in my thread about the unversed symbol).

Eraqus was quite literally bathed in Light with no hint of Darkness in him and was still a tragic hero-turned-villain in BBS for both Ventus and Terra's routes.
The Foretellers are also another case to be made.
So I don't think they necessarily intend to do that.

@ Thread

If my theory of Darkness = The 13 missing pieces of Darkness from the X-Blade split ends up being true somehow even thought Darkness was around before the Keyblade War I will genuinely loose my mind lol
 
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