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[Spoilers] "That Ventus?"



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chenoehii

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Apparently not! I guess that means that unchained is officially just the sleeping realm after all!

I've been under the impression he was somehow transported to the future by way of some different kind of time travel or by some other means...and he lost his memories like he did pre-BBS. The fact that we don't know where he came from or how he came to be X's apprentice in BBS and the age difference suggests that. At least that's what I took from it. I mean, the end of DDD and so far what we've seen of KH3 says that dream eaters (thereby nightmares and Chirithies too) can exist in the normal realms.
 

Alja

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I've been under the impression he was somehow transported to the future by way of some different kind of time travel or by some other means...and he lost his memories like he did pre-BBS. The fact that we don't know where he came from or how he came to be X's apprentice in BBS and the age difference suggests that. At least that's what I took from it. I mean, the end of DDD and so far what we've seen of KH3 says that dream eaters (thereby nightmares and Chirithies too) can exist in the normal realms.
I mean the sleeping worlds in DDD were stuck in a loop, weren't they? Correct me if I'm wrong, I didn't play DDD yet myself.
So, no matter if the Unchained Realm is the Realm of Sleep or not, it still might follow the same rules.

I'm not sure whether Ven really lost his memories, I think both possibilities are possible, I just kind of always figured Ven knew exactly who he was before Xehanort fucked him up. I know that he was deathly afraid of the X-Blade thanks to his lost memories he couldn't recall and this could very well be the reason he refused to fight, but his insistence on not being strong enough when Xehanort forced him to fight the Heartless kind of always makes me wonder if he didn't know more than he let on. And it would be highly satisfying for Xehanort, too, to have this former Union Leader in his clutches and it would explain why he chose Ven of all people to experiment on.
 

raccoonscity

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I mean, at this point I'm sure it's not going to be as simple as "It's Ven from the past". There has to be something going on, because it logically doesn't make sense. KHUx takes place over 100 years before the events of the other games, yet Ven is supposed to be 10-12 when Vanitas was born, and then 4 years later is when BBS happens.

It could be that while Ven is sleeping, he somehow gets stuck in this "Unchained State". Or it could just be that he was sent from the past and somehow ended up as Xehanort's apprentice.
 

Alpha Baymax

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I mean, at this point I'm sure it's not going to be as simple as "It's Ven from the past". There has to be something going on, because it logically doesn't make sense. KHUx takes place over 100 years before the events of the other games, yet Ven is supposed to be 10-12 when Vanitas was born, and then 4 years later is when BBS happens.

Except that it does make sense. Matter of fact, not only does it make sense, but it's really easy to explain. I'll just leave this quote here.

I've been under the impression he was somehow transported to the future by way of some different kind of time travel or by some other means...and he lost his memories like he did pre-BBS.

Ventus is basically Captain America in terms of his age.
 

Zero Sora

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General consensus seems to be "Ven + Shorter hair in KHUX = Younger Ven" which I completely buy into. Perhaps time moves slower in the Unchained Realm like it does in the Realm of Darkness? Perhaps Ven enters some sort of suspended animation? Or perhaps he gets thrown forward in time by 100? It's hard to say. With the recent reveal that KHUX's core story will be speeding up, we may find out before the end of the year, maybe even before KH3 is released.
 

ImVentus

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Eventually we'll find out how Master Xehanort found him, I hope.
There is clearly going to be a tragic incident for the new union leaders (I just have feeling something will go awfully wrong). Yet, didn't Nomura say that he would expand on the Union X storyline with Ven & Lauriam?
 

Moonlight Aqua

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I kinda thought he was probably the apprentice of the master, and something happens, and he's in KHUx, then from there he gets sent to the future, with no memories of what happened, and he while he's sleeping, he's remembering slowly what he was and what happened.
 

raccoonscity

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Except that it does make sense.

Not really? I mean "time travel" itself is not really a complete answer. DDD established the rules for time travel, so unless they retcon and say "There's actually a third option that is only now known because it's plot convenient", we should follow those rules.

So for Ven to be transported into the future, he'd have to give up his body and then already have a version of himself in that destination. He would've had to give up his body (and end up like robe Ansem) and he couldn't be in the current time until after he time traveled (and therefore, any possible versions of himself wouldn't exist yet... Vanitas wouldn't exist, he'd never form a connection with Sora, etc.).

Which means we need to find out if:
1) There's yet another way to time travel
2) If he was put to sleep and awakened in the current day.
3) Why/how he ended up there in the first place, and what that means for Ephemera, Skuld, and the others.

(The second option, by the way, is whatever Merlin did to summon Timeless River, and it seems like DDD ignored this completely.)
 

Sign

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Eventually we'll find out how Master Xehanort found him, I hope.
There is clearly going to be a tragic incident for the new union leaders (I just have feeling something will go awfully wrong). Yet, didn't Nomura say that he would expand on the Union X storyline with Ven & Lauriam?

Pretty much. I'm paraphrasing but in regards to Ven and Lauriam, he said it'll all connect when we play KH3.
 

Alpha Baymax

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Not really? I mean "time travel" itself is not really a complete answer. DDD established the rules for time travel, so unless they retcon and say "There's actually a third option that is only now known because it's plot convenient", we should follow those rules.

So for Ven to be transported into the future, he'd have to give up his body and then already have a version of himself in that destination. He would've had to give up his body (and end up like robe Ansem) and he couldn't be in the current time until after he time traveled (and therefore, any possible versions of himself wouldn't exist yet... Vanitas wouldn't exist, he'd never form a connection with Sora, etc.).

You can't use Kingdom Hearts current means of travelling thorough time to explain Ventus and Lauriam simply due to the fact that Young Xehanort never permanently left his era. He still lived his life as normal.

I believe that Ventus and Lauriam didn't technically travel through time, they catapulted through it (seeing as they are able to exist in their present timeline without fading away). That's different from travelling because they're not travelling, they're bypassing and can't go back.
 

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My theory on Ventus:

Ventus is originally from the past (The real past; not the realm of sleep or book of prophecies, etc.) when Chi takes place. During the Keyblade War, the Dandelions went to the Realm of Sleep which is where the events depicted in Union x take place. At some point, someone (probably a form of Xehanort) will come along and wake Ventus, bringing him back to the Realm of Light where he will become MX’s apprentice with no recollection of his past.

Now... what we see happening in Unchained x/Union Cross is Ventus’ dream now that he is once again in a state of sleep. It is my thought that Lauriam has entered the Realm of Sleep and is now manipulating the dream to deviate from the events that originally took place so he can get near Ventus for whatever diabolical reason. So for example, in the original events, Strelitzia was not murdered and became a Union leader according to plan. In the dream, however, we see Lauriam (almost certainly) kills her to take her place.

I hope that this makes even a modicum of sense.
 

raccoonscity

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You can't use Kingdom Hearts current means of travelling thorough time to explain Ventus and Lauriam simply due to the fact that Young Xehanort never permanently left his era. He still lived his life as normal.

I believe that Ventus and Lauriam didn't technically travel through time, they catapulted through it (seeing as they are able to exist in their present timeline without fading away). That's different from travelling because they're not travelling, they're bypassing and can't go back.

Yeah, I get that the only way they could have moved through time has to be different, but they haven't established how this would be possible. They made up the "leave your body behind and erase your memories when you return" rules so there was at least a limit, so that catapulting through time wasn't something that Xehanort could do. These rules were written because they didn't want someone to just forward into time and never come back. Being forced back without memory of it and being confined to your lifetime was its drawback.

"They catapulted through time" is still not a complete answer.
 

Alpha Baymax

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Yeah, I get that the only way they could have moved through time has to be different, but they haven't established how this would be possible. They made up the "leave your body behind and erase your memories when you return" rules so there was at least a limit, so that catapulting through time wasn't something that Xehanort could do. These rules were written because they didn't want someone to just forward into time and never come back. Being forced back without memory of it and being confined to your lifetime was its drawback.

"They catapulted through time" is still not a complete answer.

Xehanort didn't need to catapult from one era to another because he had time travelling powers. Unless Nomura states otherwise, neither Ventus nor Lauriam have that power.

The only reason as to why they haven't established that is because it's being left a mystery for now. I get that I'm crystal balling the whole situation but that's honestly my take. Why immediately introduce the reason why Ventus and Lauraim are in the present era when they've only recently been introduced? Union X has to maintain its install base so some things are being left ambigious until the time is right.
 

Silver_Soul

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I've been thinking. What if the data inserted into Sora by DiZ is the unchained realm? It might explain why Ventus is living through these events.
 

Sephiroth0812

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I've been thinking. What if the data inserted into Sora by DiZ is the unchained realm? It might explain why Ventus is living through these events.

Main question would be however how Ansem the Wise got access to it and how the real Maleficent managed to enter it if it is sealed within Sora.
Riku had to literally travel into the core of Sora's heart to meet the Data-DiZ/Ansem and gain the data.

The explanation as to why Ventus is living through them is much simpler when one simply accepts that Ventus himself has a firm connection to the Unchained Realm, no matter how it actually pans out in detail.
 
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