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Sora vs. Aqua



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Who do you prefer, Aqua or Sora?


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XehanortHeartles

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^Z3N, i love you for posting this xD
And i agree that, you can't compare a Master with a person who are still on the way on learning to be stronger, sora doesn't go through any trainning, possible in KH3D , sora will be stronger :3

This is what I have been saying all along. I said that CURRENTLY Aqua is equal or stronger but eventually at KH3 or even KH3D Sora will surpass her once he attains masterhood and a proper training. I think people mistook me that I said Aqua will be forever stronger, but no in almost every post I claimed that Sora will eventually surpass her.
 

Nayru's Love

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I never knew that o.o I was over-leveled so the fight was a joke. If that's the case it confirms what I thought up to now, and that the Aqua-Terranort fight is the same as with Aqua-Venitas - she was basically the plot device to take them down from the outside (seeing how I have to wonder if she'd have lived through either fight without her friends helping her from within).

I wouldn't quite say the two cases are the same in that way. Terranort was a case of a heart controlling another heart, whereas Venitas was a case of two hearts becoming one. At least Terranort showed signs of external struggle (also, you might be interested to know that Terra was using MX's keyblade to team up with Aqua against Guardian inside of his heart (which also didn't look like a Station of Awakening, as you might assume)).

That being said, to elaborate on the "Aqua+Terra vs. Terranort" point, while Terra did fight against MX to some extent, Terranort still inherited some advantages from Terra, such as his attacks.
 

yomitchymitch

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I know that someone's gonna yell at me for this but..
Sora. Cause 2 Keyblades are better than 1:)
 

XehanortHeartles

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I know that someone's gonna yell at me for this but..
Sora. Cause 2 Keyblades are better than 1:)

Actually this is one of the best arguments I have heard in favour of Sora along with Smile's argument and Z3N, way better than the "Sora wins because he is the main hero" argument that proves nothing.
 

Smile

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I wouldn't quite say the two cases are the same in that way. Terranort was a case of a heart controlling another heart, whereas Venitas was a case of two hearts becoming one. At least Terranort showed signs of external struggle (also, you might be interested to know that Terra was using MX's keyblade to team up with Aqua against Guardian inside of his heart (which also didn't look like a Station of Awakening, as you might assume)).

It's good enough for me, especially seeing how the X-Blade was actually broken. Ven was fighting.

That being said, to elaborate on the "Aqua+Terra vs. Terranort" point, while Terra did fight against MX to some extent, Terranort still inherited some advantages from Terra, such as his attacks.

I don't find abilities to mean all that much. It's how powerful they were that matters.

Except look what happened when Roxas fought Sora.

It's actually proof that 2 Keyblades are better than one xD;;; seeing how Roxas effectively won that fight. It's due to Roxas's stupidity and arrogance that he lost.
 

rac7d

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at least aqua makes sense when she fights
little 15 year old boy takes on an army and IS ONLY A LITTLE OUT OF BREATH
he is so unreal, its fake which goes against the whole sora suppose to be a normal kid like us thing
everyone esle has put in effor when they fight or had to learn from someon but sora is just handed the power and keyblade is just given he just handeded the skills and knowledge from ven,
 

Smile

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he is so unreal, its fake which goes against the whole sora suppose to be a normal kid like us thing

Everyone in the series are to blame for this, including TAV as a whole, sans battles where they're supposed to lose by plot (see, when Ven meets Mickey (I was kicking Vanitas's ass but the brat still needed saving), Aqua vs. Vanitas, and other occurances). Sora, being the main hero, gets less lose-by-plot battles so they never bother with him.
But... yes he fought an army of WEAK, LOW LEVEL HEARTLESS. Compared to the battles he's been through and how much stamina he must've had by then, a little out of breath is legit.

everyone esle has put in effor when they fight or had to learn from someon but sora is just handed the power and keyblade is just given he just handeded the skills and knowledge from ven,

Wot. Dude, Sora's clueless with the Keyblade. He does what comes instinctively. Otherwise I'd have expected a Glider by now.
 

rac7d

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Everyone in the series are to blame for this, including TAV as a whole, sans battles where they're supposed to lose by plot (see, when Ven meets Mickey (I was kicking Vanitas's ass but the brat still needed saving), Aqua vs. Vanitas, and other occurances). Sora, being the main hero, gets less lose-by-plot battles so they never bother with him.
But... yes he fought an army of WEAK, LOW LEVEL HEARTLESS. Compared to the battles he's been through and how much stamina he must've had by then, a little out of breath is legit.


thats not the same thing at all its common in video games for plot battles where you are suppose to loose you fight the villain till you mark down a cetain part of there life bar
 

Nayru's Love

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It's good enough for me, especially seeing how the X-Blade was actually broken. Ven was fighting.

Whatever "internal" battle Terra was having, it wasn't the same as Ven vs. Van. Aside from how Terra and Aqua weren't fighting in an Awakening, Terra was fighting not MX, but Guardian. I'd sooner say Terra's fight was a battle of hearts than a battle inside of a heart.

I don't find abilities to mean all that much. It's how powerful they were that matters.
Sure, but knowledge is power, no?

It's actually proof that 2 Keyblades are better than one xD;;; seeing how Roxas effectively won that fight. It's due to Roxas's stupidity and arrogance that he lost.
Fair enough, I suppose. :p
 

XehanortHeartles

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Sora had 3 Keyblades during that fight if you triggered the Reaction Command.
So now we are at an understanding of:
3Keyblades> 2Keyblades >1Keyblade

Sora won due plot, thus it doesnt counts as a victory. It can be demonstrated that if Roxas had fought bloodlusted without PIS and CIS he would have won.

But again 3 Keyblades was just a reaction command, doesnt necessarily mean it is a canon attack so I think effectively this fight proves 2 keyblades > 1 keyblade. This is one of the plot holes that piss me off the most, that Xemnas refused to use his possible 3 keyblades he has access to, because lets be frank if he had used them Sora and Riku would have been schooled in the final fight. Again another victory that instead of going to Sora goes to the plot.
 

XehanortHeartles

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Didn't Terra lock away his body's ability to use the keyblade durring the last fight between Terranort and Aqua? That would mean Xemnas couldn't use his keyblade.

No, he simply wiped away his memories. However Nomura stated that Xemnas was well capable of using the keyblade. Roxas was stronger than Sora with 2 Keyblades. Now imagine Xemnas with 3 Keyblades 2 of them from hearts of true masters.

Xemnas was schooled badly by Sora in their first fight at his tower, he was basically raped by the guy. However if he had used Keyblades he should have been stronger than Roxas.

If this isnt badass enough imagine post merger KH Xemnas when he used all Org XIII weapons at the same time, imagine 3 keyblades included there. I really doubt Sora and Riku which barely defeated ethereal blades Xemnad would had stood a chance against Keyblade Xemnas.

I dont know exactly what was said, ask smile whe is the one who knows. But basically was said or implied that Xemnas simply didnt wanted to use or learn to use the keyblade or was trying that momment to be a very far away momment.

You see a lot of plotholes are here, and when you study the situation you really have to wonder "If it wasnt for plot would Sora even be alive?"
 

Smile

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No, he simply wiped away his memories. However Nomura stated that Xemnas was well capable of using the keyblade. Roxas was stronger than Sora with 2 Keyblades. Now imagine Xemnas with 3 Keyblades 2 of them from hearts of true masters.

Actually, didn't Nomura only imply that Xemnas MIGHT have refrained from using a Keyblade? Was a very trollish quote.
That aside, I'd give him one Keyblade at most. Terra's own was left with his Lingering Sentiment, and Aqua has Eraqus's. He's left with MX's only.

You see a lot of plotholes are here, and when you study the situation you really have to wonder "If it wasnt for plot would Sora even be alive?"

The plot still states that he's the main character. So, regardless of what 'other' plots are there in the series - yes. He'd live. Like any other main hero facing illogical odds. Like TAV and RAX and many other characters in this very series as well. That's just how it goes.
 

XehanortHeartles

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Actually, didn't Nomura only imply that Xemnas MIGHT have refrained from using a Keyblade? Was a very trollish quote.
That aside, I'd give him one Keyblade at most. Terra's own was left with his Lingering Sentiment, and Aqua has Eraqus's. He's left with MX's only.

Nah dude, it was clearly shown that Master Xehanort and Terra were debating the new body inside Apprentice Xehanort, giving him Eraqus might or not be so take it as you want. But Terra and MX are definitively there. And Eraqus went to Aqua? Wasnt the heart also trapped in Apprentice Xehanort? I am confused now, can you please explain?

The plot still states that he's the main character. So, regardless of what 'other' plots are there in the series - yes. He'd live. Like any other main hero facing illogical odds. Like TAV and RAX and many other characters in this very series as well. That's just how it goes.

No, I am talking about plotholes and outright Deux Ex Machina specifically. You cant say "he is the main character so he cant die" thats really a very poor argument, specially when used in fictional character battles. I mean is like making Sora fight Living Tribunal and say "he is the main character so he cant lose, thus he is stronger".

However I think there are critical momments where plot,PIS,Deus Ex Machina or whatever you want to call it, acts to save his ass. These are the momments I am talking about.

For example TAV may be main character however as well as Sora however there are victories and events that are credible and can be attributed to the characters rightfully instead of plot. For example Aqua beating Xigbar's person I mean Aqua dominated him on her own right and obviously there was no plot element or Deux Ex Machina used to secure her victory or save her ass. Hell even extremelly doubtful momments like X-blade Vanitas not killing her could count since well its in order that Ven was fighting Vanitas inside.

However there are other momments where no matter how you look at it, specially with Sora. He survived only due plot, not because of his own strenght.

The prime example beign Enigmatic Man and Xemnas final battle. I think anyone that isnt a hardcore Sora fanboy will agree that if Enigmatic Man had wanted to, Sora would have died. He "didnt killed him because he needed him to form KH". But that argument is irrelevant taking in count

- He had Roxas
- He simply refrained from using the Keyblade.

I mean COME ON, when you can defeat the main hero immediatly and you dont do it only becuase you dont want to use a weapon yourself. I mean come on. This was outright PIS or at least CIS.

The second time he encountered Xemnas was full of this shit. Specially because it was a very even fight, and anything that would have made the heroes spend more energy or get more tired would had been fatal, such flaws are:

- Xemnas not fighting at his full power, because he refrained from using the Keyblade. Thus allowing Sora to rape him in the first battle, and obviously without a master keyblader to face the battle overall was easier. I mean yout lifetime plan depends on this battle, and Xemnas still refrained from using the keyblade? Come on, this was PIS to the face. If this wasnt PIS then it was CIS at least.
- When Xemnas at the end was finally gaining the upper hand over a tired Riku and Sora they pulled a superpower out of their ass to defeat Xemnas. Apparently a totally random power that neither of them was aware they could use. Thus a superpower conveniently activated by accident just at the righ time. PIS.
- Perhaps the worst PIS during the entire series, when Dragon Xemnas appeared and was about to smash the duo into the ground with the Nobody Castle CONVENIENTLY just at that area was an spaceship that allowed them to survive and follow Xemnas. It was also CONVENIENTLY situatated at the same side of the tower that was crumbilng allowing Sora and Riku to discover it in the first place.

Thus my question is, would Sora be alive today if it wasnt for plot? I think the answer is clearly no.
 

Zul

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- Perhaps the worst PIS during the entire series, when Dragon Xemnas appeared and was about to smash the duo into the ground with the Nobody Castle CONVENIENTLY just at that area was an spaceship that allowed them to survive and follow Xemnas. It was also CONVENIENTLY situatated at the same side of the tower that was crumbilng allowing Sora and Riku to discover it in the first place.

Thus my question is, would Sora be alive today if it wasnt for plot? I think the answer is clearly no.

Aside from defeating Ursula with a sing-a-long, that little hovercraft was the most roflworthy part of KH2. Don't forget that the Org uses corridors of darkness, thus have no need for miniature hovercrafts.
 

XehanortHeartles

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Aside from defeating Ursula with a sing-a-long, that little hovercraft was the most roflworthy part of KH2. Don't forget that the Org uses corridors of darkness, thus have no need for miniature hovercrafts.

Yes totally, this was just a plot device to allow Sora and Riku win.
 

Mr. Crowley

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Sora would have been fine, seering as how he can glide. Riku's the one who would've been screwed without the hovercraft. And as for the Xemnas fight in KH1, I'm pretty sure he was only testing him.
 
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