Sora vs. Aqua

[zspek09]

Once Sora becomes a keyblade master in KH 3DS: DDD, he WILL be better than Aqua. It's kind of stupid to compare a keyblade master to a NON keyblade master in the first place.

 

[loke13]

Hard to say since we can't really confuse gameplay mechanics with story mechanics but in KH those are sometimes the same thing and if KH3D is any indication Sora and Riku have learned a few new tricks.

 

[Light]

Meh Sora trumps Aqua ANY day. Drive forms kill Aqua in less than the few seconds she sees him. Sora also has friends that FOLLOW him. They don't run away like Terra and Ven...

 

[Smile]

To be precise, she pushed them away xD;;; But unlike in CoM for Sora, they didn't come back for her.

 

[Light]

Your right... She did push them. If this was Terra vs Sora though then I would have a VERY tough time choosing...

 

[Crystal]

Nope, read my previous long ass post I explained it. And overall Keyblade Master >>>>>>>>>> Keyblade Apprentice.

Sora or Riku haven't get their official title as Keyblade Master, yet they posses some chracteristics of KM.
I think at this moment, one should not underestimate Sora(by saying he shit or what ever) because his skills and knowledge haven't been fully explained yet.

Sora all the way.
Granted it's not all that fair since Sora had the chance to work out a lot of his issues whereas all BBS gave us was Aqua becoming Master only to lose it and be part of why Terra fell to Darkness - and no, she's hardly without blame in this mess. BBSv2 had better be her realizing all the shit she caused or I'll officially give up on her.
Sora on the other hand did his hardest even in KH1. He was never that zealous and ate himself from the inside out when he WAS mean to his friends - see CoM.
In that sense he also comes as a lot more mature than Aqua imo.

I agree with you. Sora do something which cares his friends more, see KH2, how he desperately finding for Riku.
And personally, i think friendship between Sora and Riku was clearly indicate than TAV.

 

[rac7d]

im voting sora i mean hes has saved the worlds wat 2 times now i love aqua and she had some gread battles 2 but i think sora will still beat her everyday

but sora is just kinda crazy now all that matrix stuff got on my nerve

 

[Stars]

Sora all the way.
Granted it's not all that fair since Sora had the chance to work out a lot of his issues whereas all BBS gave us was Aqua becoming Master only to lose it and be part of why Terra fell to Darkness - and no, she's hardly without blame in this mess. BBSv2 had better be her realizing all the shit she caused or I'll officially give up on her.
Sora on the other hand did his hardest even in KH1. He was never that zealous and ate himself from the inside out when he WAS mean to his friends - see CoM.
In that sense he also comes as a lot more mature than Aqua imo.

I love your comment on this.

 

[terraisawesome12]

Neither. Both of them suck.

 

[XehanortHeartles]

Sora or Riku haven't get their official title as Keyblade Master, yet they posses some chracteristics of KM.
I think at this moment, one should not underestimate Sora(by saying he shit or what ever) because his skills and knowledge haven't been fully explained yet.



I agree with you. Sora do something which cares his friends more, see KH2, how he desperately finding for Riku.
And personally, i think friendship between Sora and Riku was clearly indicate than TAV.

This is why I say that most people who vote for Sora do it out of favoritism. Yes Aqua is my fav but I am not blind to her, and certaintly if I saw her losing I would say it.

The point Crystal and Smile is that Masterhood is not just a title, with the title you are passed down knowledges that only masters know. Sora learned to use the Keyblade on his own, this alone is testament of his monstrious potential and skill have no doubt about it but he still lacks proper training.

Aqua has her Keyblader armor, she can use the keyblade as glider, she would totally own Sora in magic and I think this is a point no one who reason this match without bias is going to dispute her magic si only second to MASTER XEHANORT. She can use her Keyblade as an interdimensional transportation ship. This alone would allow her to fight with the same style as Lingering Sentinent, anyone here is going to tell me Sora is stronger or would be able to defeat Lingering Sentinent at the CURRENT momment? I think not, and Aqua for all end and purposed would be able to fight like that, even Jimmy journal said LS was far more powerful than him.

And this is only the advantadges she has as a trainee, because she had a proper training she knows how to use her keyblade as a glider, she was endowed with a keyblader armor and her magic is only second to master xehanort. Try to imagine Aqua beign a secret boss at KH2, she would fight almost exactly as LS, albeit a little bit weaker because of the infinite stamina of LS.

Again sora COULD have all this if he had a proper Keyblader Traning, he has the potential to pull all this abilities and possibly to extent that would greatly surpass TAV, but unfortunately even if he can physically he doesnt know the HOW and no I am not going to give him those feats saying "well is only becuase he doesnt know how to do it, if he knew he would pull all that but better" because he doesnt.

And this is only as trainee.

As Master again Master is NOT only a title, remember Yen Sid thiks current Sora and Riku arent enough to face reborn Xehanort but properly trained Riku and Sora with mark of maestry are enough.

The difference as far as we know is agan the KNOWLEDGE that is given to the master. Knowledge of how to destroy entire planets like Master Xehanort did pouring darkness in Land of Departure, this is a grear advantadge. Because unlike Sora Aqua doesnt needs a gummi ship, she can simply fight an even fight against Sora and then destroy the planet he is fighting it, Aqua can leave easily via glider Keyblade but Sora will have to board the gummi ship and if it isnt at hand Sora isnt going to survive that or is going to be pulled into the realm of darkness.

If Sora escape, he is going to have to be in Gummi Ship until she finds a planet and Aqua can pursue him with the Keyblade and fight the ship the same way you fought Lignering Sentinent, gliding the Keyblade. Yes Gummi Ship has weapons, but I think we all can agree that Gummi Ship cant defeat or stop a high end warrior, it is only suited to fight fodder heartless and nobodies and Sora cant fight in space.

And another broken abilities given to masters

Apprentices of Keyblade Masters that pass the test have two choices:

• The Keyblade Master may take on their own apprentices, and reshape their world to one more of their liking as Master Eraqus did.
• The Keyblade Master may go out on their own journey as Master Xehanort chose to do. Should one choose to embark on their own journey, many different paths open up to them.

Thats a very broken power, they can reshape entire worlds, and depending on how you take that rule that could mean not only reshaping a world but outright be able to create one and then have totale control over that world (reshape it to your will). But fine I wont give feats out of speculatuion or inflate them so I will just take it as face value and say it is limited to reshape. Aqua knows how to change the scenario to make it more challenging for Sora, Master Xehanort did it at the Keyblade graveyard by creating mountains out of nowhere and manipulationg Keyblade Graveyard to his will.

Sora will be fighting a foe that not only can fight exactly equal as Lingering Sentintent minus the infinite stamina, but also one that can causally destroy the planet he is in and manipulate the planet he is fighting it to fuck Sora's battle style. This is why I see Aqua winning, her knowledge and feats are better. Simply Aqua has more abilities and to all that add that she has been building muscle fighting the strongest heartless at RoD I say she will be to Sora at least as challenging if not more as Lingering Sentinent, could Sora CURRENTLY defeat it? No, I also dont see him defeating Aqua.

When posting guys please try to post out of FEATS and ABILITIES not out of favor towards the character Im trying to be as less bias as possible I am trying to be.

I say Aqua takes this simply because she has more abilities, yes it would be the fight of her life but she would barely come on top at the end.

I will simply put the FEATS and ABILITIES listed here

Sora advantadges over Aqua:

- Possibly has more raw power than Aqua in wielding the keyblade
- His forms, defintively is a big plus
- Her blows

Aqua advantadges over Sora:
- Her armor
- Can reshape entire worlds
- Can destroy entire worlds
- Advantadge magically (yes, even in Wisdom form)
- Can glide in her Keyblade to fight Sora light LS did

For those reasons I think Aqua would take this

 

[Smile]

her magic is only second to master xehanort.

I'd like to see her matched up against Yen Sid then. Also, hear where you pulled that one out from.
I still remain unconvinced Aqua has half the knowledge a proper Master has. It frustrated me when she flashed back to when Eraqus even told her how to change LoD into CO - note though about that that he made it seem like it was unique to LoD, and was a mechanism set into that specific world by the previous Masters. It wasn't Aqua pulled on her own so much as the one who just initiated the process - she didn't seem to have the know-how.
And Glide means nothing if Sora's in Final Form. Duel Wielding flying miniature nuclear bomb, more or less. Gluck to her, I Say.

When posting guys please try to post out of FEATS and ABILITIES not out of favor towards the character Im trying to be as less bias as possible I am trying to be.

I fail to see why. The question in the topic post was who do we think is better, and in the poll, it's who we prefer. o.o;;; it's not about who's strongest - and that's before we get to the issue that Sora's monsterous potential took down stronger people.

 

[XehanortHeartles]

I'd like to see her matched up against Yen Sid then. Also, hear where you pulled that one out from.
I still remain unconvinced Aqua has half the knowledge a proper Master has. It frustrated me when she flashed back to when Eraqus even told her how to change LoD into CO - note though about that that he made it seem like it was unique to LoD, and was a mechanism set into that specific world by the previous Masters. It wasn't Aqua pulled on her own so much as the one who just initiated the process - she didn't seem to have the know-how.
And Glide means nothing if Sora's in Final Form. Duel Wielding flying miniature nuclear bomb, more or less. Gluck to her, I Say.

Aqua is described by Tetsuya Nomura as being "tricky". A magic-based fighter with agility to boot, she's capable of doing cartwheels while attacking with her Keyblade. While she's more than capable physically, her prowess lies with a more magic-oriented fighting style, being versed in all forms of it. Aqua is second only to Master Xehanort in terms of magic amongst Keyblade Users, displaying superior skill to both Terra and Ven as well as later Keyblade users such as Sora and Riku.

About Yen Sid, well it obviously talks about seen character and it says Keybladers, Yen Sid is a retired Keyblader it appears.
Aqua is a Master, it is stated Masters have this knowledge. Possibly she does on a lesser degree than Eraqus and Xehanort but definitively has it, also didnt Aqua created Castle Oblivion or something? I am not sure about that one sho I will have to re-check but I remember seen or reading that Aqua created a world or helped to shape one.

I fail to see why. The question in the topic post was who do we think is better, and in the poll, it's who we prefer. o.o;;; it's not about who's strongest - and that's before we get to the issue that Sora's monsterous potential took down stronger people.

Because when discussing the strenght of a character we have to meassure on feats, Word of God (metafiction term from words of the author) and powerscaling. This is how battles between fictional characters are formally debated in metafiction which is the part of fiction that contemplates crossovers and so. For example Goku vs Superman etc.

Otherwise it would become a popularity contest and would be different than for example asking "Sasuke vs Living Tribunal" I think we all know who would win that fight, but obviously as almost no one gives a fuck about Living Tribunal and Sasuke has a fanbase of millions if you post this fight in a japanesse forums without adhering to the metafiction standard rules using feats etc. to meassure you will have answers saying "Sasuke wins because he is soo kool" "Sasuke wins because I love him and he is the best" etc.

Also when meassuring 2 characters strenght things like PIS (Plot Induced Stupidity (AKA in general plot) and CIS (Character Induced Stupidity) has to be taken out of the match. If we dont take the plot out of the match even Kairi would be able to defeat Master Xehanort because there would be a plot that would set a sequence of events that could defeat him or without CIS we cant have a proper match too becuase people would say "Well X character might be stronger, but we know he is too arrogant to use his best attacks so Y will win" or "X might be stronger but he is too dumb and eventually will commit a mistake Y wins". So the point when meassuring 2 character strenght is to have them in a total neutral arena, without plot to write events that would favour someone or without their character flaws so both of them fight using the best of their potential and abilities without commiting any mistakes, meassuring your answers with feats, powerscaling and Word of God. This way we can see who is really stronger and have a totally unbaised match where feats and facts will rule and not favouritism, popularity, charisma or personal love for certain character.

As you have stated Sora has defeated more powerful foes, and no doubt he would still defeat many of them even with these rules. But how many strogner foes would Sora had defeated if Character flaws were removed from he adversary, if there wasnt a plot that obviously caused certain events to occur so he would win?

Take the battle of Xemnas, Sora won. What would had happened if that spaceship (PIS, Plot, Plothole) wasnt present when Dragon Xemnas pummelled down the tower? Or what would had happened if Xemnas had removed his part of his character unwillingness to use the Keybalde and used it instead of those pseudo-lightsabers? Xemnas has 3 full master hearts he could possibly have used even 3 Keyblades just imagien how insande would had been all Org XIII weapons plus 3 Keyblades against armor Xemnas. Add the fact that the fight was extremelly close and Xemnas was dominating the final part of the fight if it wasnt for that 1 last momment magical light beam that came from that Keyblade (Again the Keyblade was extremelly convenient wasnt he? I guess those 2 didnt even knew how they summoned it) and he would certiantly have won if plot and character werent present during the fight.

Another perfect example is Aladdin vs Jafar, Jafar could control the entire universe and even had already killed Aladdin but saved his life out of arrogance to make him suffer further (CIS) then convieniently the LAST second when Aladdin head's was going to be cut down Iago decided to turn to the good side and release genie and then out of many possible ways to deal with them Jafar decided to create a lava pit which could conveniently destroy the lamp (Plot) and also when he was been completely aware of that fact all other minutes of the film at the last second he forgot genies couldnt kill directly and attempted to do it with Iago and that allowed the good guys to win (Plot).

What would had happened if Aladdin would had faced Jafar in an entirely neutral arena, without plot included and removing all character flaws? Jafar would have completely sodomized Aladdin.

So as you see who wins in a fight isnt always the stronger and sometimes it is entirely different when things like plot and character are in play.

 

[Light]

So your saying that Aqua would win because she can manipulate the world? I don't remember any attacks like that in BBS. Only Terra has something close which is Quake.
She doesn't have armour any more either. Hell she doesn't even have a Keyblade! Can she reshape worlds without her Keyblade? She technically isn't a Keyblader anymore. A Keyblade Master yes Keyblader no.
If this battle takes place after KH3 as well Sora would win easy as PIE.

 

[XehanortHeartles]

So your saying that Aqua would win because she can manipulate the world? I don't remember any attacks like that in BBS. Only Terra has something close which is Quake.
She doesn't have armour any more either. Hell she doesn't even have a Keyblade! Can she reshape worlds without her Keyblade? She technically isn't a Keyblader anymore. A Keyblade Master yes Keyblader no.
If this battle takes place after KH3 as well Sora would win easy as PIE.

Obviously in a fight following the standard metafiction rules for fictional battles, BOTH characters would obviously face in their most powerful current state. I think it is obvious I mean is like if it was done when Sora was asleep and you said "Aqua rapes because Sora is asleep" obviously we are taking in count when Sora is awake and obviously we are taking in count Aqua with all her weapons and at the height of her current power same with Sora. Note I said CURRENT power becuase I know if I dont specify that people will come and say "Well if it is at their strongest, then Sora will become the most powerful beign in KH at the end of all the serie, so he takes this easily". I mean we take them at their strongest of their current quantifiable known power.

Read above, Keyblade Masters CAN and KNOW how to destroy and reshape worlds it is one of the options they have once they become masters and pass the mark of maestry they have 3 options, one of them is to have their own world and reshape it to have it nice and fit for their trainees.

And Master Xehanort actually did the reshape thing at the Keyblade Graveyard battle, he was creatting mountains and manipulating the enviroment with hand waves.

Standard metafiction rules: (this are the standard general rules you will find in any forum that is spcialized in vs battle between characters)

- Characters are at their height of their current power, you cant either nerf the strenght of any character by putting one at the weakest and another at the strongest, neither try to give the advantadge by using speculative future versions of the characters as they dont exist right now.
- Feats are used, not popularity, fanboyism or favouritism to determine the strenght of a character
- Word of God is used alongside with feats, this mean statements from the author, or statements from a source with enough autorithy that isnt contradicted latter. For example if the author, a text or a character with credible authority to claim that say a character can do a certain feat or power even if said character dont show it, is safe to assume they can.
- Powerscaling is used alongside with WoG and feats, powerscaling means for example if a character has an impressive feat displayed in lets say manipulating fire, and then we have another character that is without a doubt the best fire manipulator and is leagues and bounds above the char with the impressive feat, is safe to ammount that the best fire manipulator can replicate the feat even to higher levels and defeat said char.
- The battle takes place in a neutral ground, for example if we have a character that is a master at manipulating darkness it would be unfair for the adversary to place the fight at the realm of darkness the contrary also applies for example it would be unfair for the dark character to place the battle at an arena made of pure light. However if any character has the capacity to change or transform the previously neutral ground into one to their advantadge by using their own power, they are entitled to do it, since they are just using a power of their powerset.
- Plot is taken out of consideration when meassuring 2 characters strenght, they simply encounter each other at the battle arena as a plot would mean give the advantadge to a certain character.
- Character flaws are taken out of consideration, for example sometime villains are much stronger than heroes and they lose out of arrogance or other flaws in their character. Other times there are incredibly powerful characters but they are dumb and get defeated by other character despite they should be able to WTFPWN said characters if they used their power to their highest potentia. Basically any flaw in the character of any of the parts that prevents them from using their full potential (morals that prevent them to fight at full power, arrogance, cowardice or idiocy) are out of the equation.

Ways of attaining victory:

- Elimination: If a character kills the other character it is fighting a victory can be claimed for the killer.
- Incapacitation: Sometimes a character doesnt have the mean to kill their powerful adversary, however they can render them unable. For example they might be able to seal their adversary away, take away their powers, make them fall asleep, etc. In short anything that will render the adversary uncapable of fighting anymore while you can still fight. Unless of course the adverasy is capable of reversing the condition in a reasonable time.
- Surrender: Is a valid form of winning if the other 2 are unable for example a character doesnt have the power to kill their adversary or incapacitate them for battle like sealing them. For example if a character has the capacity to control the mind of the adversary to force a surrender or make them fall in love they can claim the victory if the adversary has no way of re-gaining their will in a reasonable time.
- Battlefield Removal: Beign forcibly removed from the battlefield are and unable to return from a reasonable time is count as a lost. For example if a character has super strenght and can punch the adversary to another galaxy and it cant return to the battlefield in a reasonable time then said thenit counts as a win for the one who gives the punch. Another example would be teleporting your enemy to very far place or dimension and cant come back, basically what Mickey did to Pete.

 

[Light]

I know that he did that. Well it leaves us with a pickle. Two very strong weilders.

 

[Smile]

Aqua is second only to Master Xehanort in terms of magic amongst Keyblade Users

And there's the loophole I was looking for in regards to Yen Sid. Though to be frank I'm rather unimpressed with MX's magical abilities. We didn't really get to see too much of it.
For general knowledge, which interview is that from?

So as you see who wins in a fight isnt always the stronger and sometimes it is entirely different when things like plot and character are in play.

Of course. A horde of pink elephants can fall on all of them and they'll both die. Poor writing aside (lol space scooter) and most everything else aside, seeing how I still don't believe Aqua knew how to reshape worlds so much as to activate the mechanism installed into the LoD, Final Form trumps her. Hell maybe even Master Form.

 

[Light]

Say Final Form would almost have to trump her. The description is.
Unleashes the True power of the Keyblade.
I don't think Aqua has anywhere near this.

 

[Crystal]

Aqua advantadges over Sora:
- Her armor
- Can reshape entire worlds
- Can destroy entire worlds
- Advantadge magically (yes, even in Wisdom form)
- Can glide in her Keyblade to fight Sora light LS did

I fail to see how Aqua can actually destroy or reshape the entire worlds?
It seem like a goddess in KH.
Yeah, her magic is stronger if compare to anyone,but i don't think she was the second strongest after MX, perhaps Yen Sid has his strength too. But he just lazy in showing off.

 

[Light]

I fail to see how Aqua can actually destroy or reshape the entire worlds?
It seem like a goddess in KH.
Yeah, her magic is stronger if compare to anyone,but i don't think she was the second strongest after MX, perhaps Yen Sid has his strength too. But he just lazy in showing off.

That is what Smile and I are arguing about. Yen Sid would be stronger. But Smile has proven the loophole.

 

[Crystal]

That is what Smile and I are arguing about. Yen Sid would be stronger. But Smile has proven the loophole.

Yeah. Master Xehanort, Master Eraqus and Yen Sid could be the strongest.