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So...are Xion and Roxas half brother and sister?



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I mean, Roxas was came from both Ventus and Sora, isn’t there a joke that that would make Roxas their son?
If Xion was created from Sora’s memories of Kairi, then, if we’re going by the Roxas logic, that would Xion their daughter? I just find that kinda funny. 😆
 

okhi12

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Doesn't work that way but by that logic, Naminé was created through Sora's body and Kairi's heart so she's Roxas ''twin'' and Xion's sister... kinda. And we still lack an explanation for why she looks different than both Sora and Kairi.
 

SweetYetSalty

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I mean Roxas doesn't come from Ventus, even though they look alike. Roxas was born when Sora stabbed himself. Ven's heart being connected/in Sora effected how Roxas looked but he's still primarily Sora's Nobody. Until they retcon it :p

As for Roxas and Xion...not really? Xion gained her identity/personality from Sora's memories of Kairi and it was the glue that held her existence together. But she was grown in a lab by Vexen, technically not born from Sora. Xion's more like the weird adoptive stepchild if anything.

But as said above it's not really a thing anymore. As these new Replicas Roxas is no longer Sora's discarded dead body, and Xion isn't stitched by Kairi memories anymore, as it's her own memories that make her up now. She's still weird though.
 

Idreamaboutcats

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It's hard to describe, but on a technicality, Naminé and Roxas are like twins, with her having even described their relationship as such in the novel, while he and Xion are literally the same person, but that's oversimplifying it. The longer explanation is more complicated. I just hope this doesn't fan the flames of the ship wars.
 

gulava

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I don't think you can explain Roxas-Xion's connection without making it seems convoluted or contrived lol.
Both of Roxas and Xion are Soras; Roxas has his body and Xion's core is Sora's memories. So technically, yes they can be regarded as siblings, or the same person since she does turn into Sora at the end of kh:days and she tells roxas "I'm you the same way i'm sora".

on a technicality, Naminé and Roxas are like twins, with her having even described their relationship as such in the novel
I can understand calling them twins for being born at the same time, but these two can not be considered twins or siblings in the same way Roxas and Xion might be lol. And I don't think the novels are canon afaik??
Naminé is an abnormality as she doesn't have any of the necessary components of a nobody? she is more of a ghost than a nobody.
 

AegisXIII

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I never understood why she is such an abnormality. In the reports it is mentioned that it is because she lacks a body since kairi's body never turned into a nobody. But that's the same for Roxas. He is having a body and coexist alongside Sora and Ventus that still have their bodies.
 

Kokoko253

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Really depends on what definitions are we using. In a strictly biologically sense, no. Roxas is Sora's Nobody, they share the same DNA, so they are twins, or you could count Roxas as Sora's clone. Xion, however was born in a laboratory. I kind of doubt that "Sora's memories of Kairi" holds his or her DNA, so there is no genetic connection there. Thus the answer is no, Roxas and Xion are not related. Also, now Roxas is also in a replica body, so his body's genetics no longer match Sora's, so now there is no biological connection between Sora, Roxas, Ventus, Xion, Kairi, Naminé.

Unless, of course, we DO belive magic overwrites not just appearances, but genetics as well. If we go down that path, and say the whole "your heart will shape your body/vessel" is doing it through literally copypasting your original body's DNA into the new vessel... then Roxas is Ventus's clone/twin, and Xion is more or less Kairi's twin with some Sora thrown in there. Thus, Roxas and Xion are also not related.

And we still lack an explanation for why she looks different than both Sora and Kairi.

That one is easy. The explanation is that she is Ava. Ava somehow ended up in Kairi's heart, and when Sora did his thing in KH 1, she was freed, but not enterily as Ava, more like 99% Ava, 1% Kairi. Kind of like how Vanitas is not exactly that Darkness, but something like that with a little Ventus mixed in. Trust me, I work in Nomura.
 

AdrianXXII

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I never understood why she is such an abnormality. In the reports it is mentioned that it is because she lacks a body since kairi's body never turned into a nobody. But that's the same for Roxas. He is having a body and coexist alongside Sora and Ventus that still have their bodies.
Actually Sora didn't, Roxas was walking around in his original body. Kairi just somehow restored Sora's Heart and it kinda projected his appearance or she somehow made him a new one, I'm not sure they ever really specified. But officially Roxas was walking around and living a year in Sora's body.
 

AegisXIII

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Actually Sora didn't, Roxas was walking around in his original body. Kairi just somehow restored Sora's Heart and it kinda projected his appearance or she somehow made him a new one, I'm not sure they ever really specified. But officially Roxas was walking around and living a year in Sora's body.
Ooooh, you mean that Sora in the ending of KH1 until KH2 is the abnormality without a body? But then, why did Roxas disappear?
 

AdrianXXII

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Ooooh, you mean that Sora in the ending of KH1 until KH2 is the abnormality without a body? But then, why did Roxas disappear?
Well in KH2 he did have his body back it's just in KH1 and CoM, Roxas was taking it for a joy ride. When DiZ returned Roxas to Sora, he regained his original body from what I understand.
 

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Well in KH2 he did have his body back it's just in KH1 and CoM, Roxas was taking it for a joy ride. When DiZ returned Roxas to Sora, he regained his original body from what I understand.
I think I heard about this before. But is it ever explained anywhere ingame?
 

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Not sure. I think KH2's reports mention something about it. But I think usually it's just brought up as Kairi restoring Sora.
 

AegisXIII

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It's all in the Secret Ansem Reports:

Ansem secret reports 12 is my kryptonite. I tried so hard to understand it in my youth. But it still seems like a mystery to me.
"Regain human form". Is it the same as having an actual body?
I started to understand with the replicas that a body is a physical medium to be on the physical space. But sometimes, Sora without a body is able to act on the real world (ReMind during the guardians fight for example).
I have nothing against retconning past stuff by adding some rules, but here they seem to add rules that they do not follow in KH1 already.
 

*TwilightNight*

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If you want to, sure.

I genuinely don't see the issue with this take unless you ship them together. Although to me they are more or less each other.

There is a misconception here, however. Xion doesn't have Kairi's memories, Xion is constructed biologically of a sample of Sora's memories and data. It's similar to how Riku Replica was created. Sora's strongest memories just happen to be of Kairi and that's the form Xion took on eventually. But you can tell it's a mirror reflecting of others' connection to Sora because different people see different things. Axel saw black haired Kairi because Roxas saw her as black haired Kairi. Naminè is Kairi's shadow, so naturally, she would get to see black haired Kairi as well. Xion, with her friends seeing her and treating her that way, therefore took black haired Kairi as her identity.

You never hear this discourse with Riku and Riku Replica. And Xion at one point did turn into Sora.

Roxas: Sora's discarded body
Xion: Sora's (and Roxas') clone/Sora's memories

The fandom can argue about it all they want, but that's also how Xion canonly views it as well with her last statement in 358/2 Days. They both legit rested in Sora's heart because they are a part of him. KHIII showed even further that she rested on Roxas' heart Station.

Ventus has nothing to do with anything either. He's not even a "Sora". Roxas simply took his visual shape. That's his only influence.

Naminè does not count into the equation to whoever brought her up. She's Kairi, 100%, and rightfully returned to her. There was no split when going back or question about who her original was. Unless somebody tells me what she owns that belongs to Sora biologically, then there's nothing of Sora about her. She doesn't have his body. She has no body. She's just ghost Kairi made solid.
 

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Really depends on what definitions are we using. In a strictly biologically sense, no. Roxas is Sora's Nobody, they share the same DNA, so they are twins, or you could count Roxas as Sora's clone. Xion, however was born in a laboratory. I kind of doubt that "Sora's memories of Kairi" holds his or her DNA, so there is no genetic connection there. Thus the answer is no, Roxas and Xion are not related. Also, now Roxas is also in a replica body, so his body's genetics no longer match Sora's, so now there is no biological connection between Sora, Roxas, Ventus, Xion, Kairi, Naminé.

Unless, of course, we DO belive magic overwrites not just appearances, but genetics as well. If we go down that path, and say the whole "your heart will shape your body/vessel" is doing it through literally copypasting your original body's DNA into the new vessel... then Roxas is Ventus's clone/twin, and Xion is more or less Kairi's twin with some Sora thrown in there. Thus, Roxas and Xion are also not related.



That one is easy. The explanation is that she is Ava. Ava somehow ended up in Kairi's heart, and when Sora did his thing in KH 1, she was freed, but not enterily as Ava, more like 99% Ava, 1% Kairi. Kind of like how Vanitas is not exactly that Darkness, but something like that with a little Ventus mixed in. Trust me, I work in Nomura.
I've already read about that theory and it's actualy one of the few I believe in. I don't think she's actually Ava, just that Ava shaped her the same way Ven shaped Roxas. The real Ava is still asleep within either Kairi or Naminé (though Ienzo should have noticed if that was he case), or her heart was freed and went somewhere else.

Naminè does not count into the equation to whoever brought her up. She's Kairi, 100%, and rightfully returned to her. There was no split when going back or question about who her original was. Unless somebody tells me what she owns that belongs to Sora biologically, then there's nothing of Sora about her. She doesn't have his body. She has no body.
If you mean me, I never said Naminé had Sora's body in a literal sense, I said she was created through Sora's body and Kairi's heart. It's not the same thing. Sora's body was only an intermediary because for someone to become a nobody a heartless must be created, and the requirement was met only when Sora's heart became a heartless after he released Kairi. She is Kairi's nobody but created through Sora. Ansem the Wise explicitly stated this in a KH2 report:

Namine emerged as Kairi's Nobody... but the body and soul necessary to exist as a Nobody belonged to Sora. When a person's heart is stolen, a Heartless is born with no sense of self, and the body and soul left behind give rise to a Nobody.

Well, he kinda says she has Sora's body and soul but that can't be the case in a strict sense. When someone becomes a heartless the original body vanishes, if the heart was strong the body is reconstituted as a nobody, apparently in a world in between. If the body disintegrates before reappearing as a nobody it does not become a nobody straight away, so it's not a biological transfer, it's more like a reconfiguration of matter. I guess this somehow explains why Roxas and Naminé both had some of Sora's ''body'' at the same time but not his biological features.

Anyway biology does not work in the KH series as it does in our world. We have seen that a heart can change the appearance of a natural human body and not only replicas when someone's heart inhabits or possesses someone else's body. Sometimes it only changes hair and eye colour (Terra-Xehanort), sometimes it retains the former owner's appearance (Braig/Luxu), sometimes it changes completely (Ansem seeker of darkness in Riku's body). There's no consistent explanation other than there are several different kinds of possession.
 
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KeybladeLordSora

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I really don't see the point of this whole discussion post-KH3 tbh.

Just like how I don't see the point in calling Roxas "Sora's Nobody" because he isn't a Nobody anymore.

Like, I legit get kinda annoyed whenever Roxas, Xion, and Namine are referred to as "Soras" even pre-KH3 because the whole point was that they weren't despite their origins. They're their own selves.
 

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I really don't see the point of this whole discussion post-KH3 tbh.

Just like how I don't see the point in calling Roxas "Sora's Nobody" because he isn't a Nobody anymore.

Like, I legit get kinda annoyed whenever Roxas, Xion, and Namine are referred to as "Soras" even pre-KH3 because the whole point was that they weren't despite their origins. They're their own selves.
Outside shippers, most don't care about this topic. The KH3 Replicas made them their own people with separate bodies so what are we even trying to accomplish in this thread?
 

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If you mean me, I never said Naminé had Sora's body in a literal sense, I said she was created through Sora's body and Kairi's heart. It's not the same thing. Sora's body was only an intermediary because for someone to become a nobody a heartless must be created, and the requirement was met only when Sora's heart became a heartless after he released Kairi. She is Kairi's nobody but created through Sora. Ansem the Wise explicitly stated this in a KH2 report:

Namine emerged as Kairi's Nobody... but the body and soul necessary to exist as a Nobody belonged to Sora. When a person's heart is stolen, a Heartless is born with no sense of self, and the body and soul left behind give rise to a Nobody.

Well, he kinda says she has Sora's body and soul but that can't be the case in a strict sense. When someone becomes a heartless the original body vanishes, if the heart was strong the body is reconstituted as a nobody, apparently in a world in between. If the body disintegrates before reappearing as a nobody it does not become a nobody straight away, so it's not a biological transfer, it's more like a reconfiguration of matter. I guess this somehow explains why Roxas and Naminé both had some of Sora's ''body'' at the same time but not his biological features.

Anyway biology does not work in the KH series as it does in our world. We have seen that a heart can change the appearance of a natural human body and not only replicas when someone's heart inhabits or possesses someone else's body. Sometimes it only changes hair and eye colour (Terra-Xehanort), sometimes it retains the former owner's appearance (Braig/Luxu), sometimes it changes completely (Ansem seeker of darkness in Riku's body). There's no consistent explanation other than there are several different kinds of possession.
Keep in mind this is one of many hypotheses that runs in the Ansem Reports concerning Naminè. Which means they are not actual facts, just theories. Following them, Ansem never says she has Sora's body and soul, just that she was made/born from them, which is technically true. Kairi's heart left Sora. But he's nothing but an intermediary. Ansem also talks about how Naminè is the Kairi that came into contact with Sora's heart.

So there was no configuration -- all Sora did was allow Naminè to make her form corporeal (i.e. it's her own, not anyone's), not that she has any of Sora's discarded body and/or soul. Hence, a Kairi ghost/shadow made solid. Labeling her as a Nobody is even just a tentative term because Ansem has no idea what the heck she really is. Nomura once stated in an interview she may be a subspecies of a Nobody. Whatever normally applies to Nobodies wouldn't exactly apply to her. Furthermore, Sora did not need her to be complete (like Roxas and Xion) and there was no adverse reaction to her touching him in CoM in comparison to her touching Kairi in KHII when they were running together. Naminè started visibly dissipating into her.

Naminè's not a Sora, not even partially, and doesn't obtain anything from him. She would have had to be divided in two otherwise. That didn't happen at all as well.

The Sora aspect is taken literally when it shouldn't be the case. In every sense, Naminè is Kairi.

And basically a freak accident.
 
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