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Other 'Birth by Sleep' Thoughts



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bittermeat

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Lately it seems many people have focused on this line 'birth by sleep' and what it could mean in reference to the characters. I'm curious what other people perceive it to mean in a more literal sense. What exactly is born from sleep?

Here are a few ideas to get you started.​

The Station of Awakening
For Sora in KH:I, its in this place that he wields a keyblade for the first time. We know he was sleeping on the beach when it occurred, so in a way sleep bore him the start of his journey. Besides being an introduction to the game, the Station might have more significance in the path of a keyblade wielder. Maybe this 'initiation' was what Xemnas was seeking when he slept in the Chamber of Rest in KH:II FM.

Memories
In the opening scenarios of KH:II, Roxas slowly begins to remember Sora in his dreams. Dreams are probably the most obvious thing sleep gives birth to. Though we know in his case, it wouldn't have been happening if Sora hadn't been asleep in the Pod Room and regaining his memories at the same time.

According to screenshots and trailer reports from BbS, during the scene with Master Xehanort and Ven in Olympus Coliseum, Xehanort seems to be urging Ven to remember things. So maybe the focus is that sleep will somehow release his memories.

Heartless
This is pure speculation, but we know the enemies in BbS are neither Heartless or Nobodies because accordingly Heartless did not exist in the BbS time period, which is 10 years before KH:I. However, they do exist 1 year after, because Radiant Gardens was taken over by Heartless 9 years prior to KH:I.

Darkness did exist back then though, and that seems to be a key 'ingredient' in the becoming of Heartless. Maybe we should consider the DS (MX's Apprentice) the first Heartless, we know that because Master Xehanort explains he has become a 'demon consumed by darkness'.

Heartless had to come from somewhere, and I'm sure BbS will show the 'birth' of them.
 

Charlie K

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Well this will be really helpfull for some people..hint hint

Umm..Your right though, it coyld happen, good BBS thoery-ish I've seen in a while.
 

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Maybe MX woke the TRUE Darkness that kairis grandma speaks in the story inside His apprentice, So Its an awsome theory it all matches, but theres something that concerns me its more about Chain Of Memories so If its allowed I would love to explain it on this theme, or perhaps i have to begin another one?
 

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Lately it seems many people have focused on this line 'birth by sleep' and what it could mean in reference to the characters. I'm curious what other people perceive it to mean in a more literal sense. What exactly is born from sleep?

Here are a few ideas to get you started.​

The Station of Awakening
For Sora in KH:I, its in this place that he wields a keyblade for the first time. We know he was sleeping on the beach when it occurred, so in a way sleep bore him the start of his journey. Besides being an introduction to the game, the Station might have more significance in the path of a keyblade wielder. Maybe this 'initiation' was what Xemnas was seeking when he slept in the Chamber of Rest in KH:II FM.

Memories
In the opening scenarios of KH:II, Roxas slowly begins to remember Sora in his dreams. Dreams are probably the most obvious thing sleep gives birth to. Though we know in his case, it wouldn't have been happening if Sora hadn't been asleep in the Pod Room and regaining his memories at the same time.

According to screenshots and trailer reports from BbS, during the scene with Master Xehanort and Ven in Olympus Coliseum, Xehanort seems to be urging Ven to remember things. So maybe the focus is that sleep will somehow release his memories.
I though (and posted) something just like it not long ago, so I agree with you.:thumbup:

Heartless
This is pure speculation, but we know the enemies in BbS are neither Heartless or Nobodies because accordingly Heartless did not exist in the BbS time period, which is 10 years before KH:I. However, they do exist 1 year after, because Radiant Gardens was taken over by Heartless 9 years prior to KH:I.

Darkness did exist back then though, and that seems to be a key 'ingredient' in the becoming of Heartless. Maybe we should consider the DS (MX's Apprentice) the first Heartless, we know that because Master Xehanort explains he has become a 'demon consumed by darkness'.

Heartless had to come from somewhere, and I'm sure BbS will show the 'birth' of them.
hmmm.... That's a good idea.:thumbsup:
 

Antiquity

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Your idea's pretty well thought. I had an idea that when another Keyblade wielder loses their key/dies/stops wielding it or something in that range, a new wielder is chosen.
 

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Great thought on that. The theory of station of awakening and memories seem to relate more to the title
 

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You know, since this game appears to revolve around Xehanort, Birth by Sleep could be talking about Xehanort's coma. KH2's Xehanort is obviously someone already in the game, whether it's the classic Terra+MX entity, MX himself, or the DS. Most events in the game could crucial to Xehanort's eventual coma, hence the name of the game, Birth by Sleep.
 

HeartlesGuardian

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The game could have nothing to do with the line Birth By Sleep and it could jsut refer to something simple like Ven going to the station of awakening at the end to bring birth to the keyblade masters when they are there
 

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Maybe the title "birth by sleep" has something to do with Ven's memories (if he lost them).
 
A

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Xehanort the apprentice to ATW created the heartless, the first too, which were the pureblood heartless, shadows.
 

hakumei0

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questions if ven was a test subject or something(as because he cant rememmber)- because there have been a great deal of test in teh ansem reports, and teh game could revolve more around those tests and experiments
 
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Well, if we take the phrase literally, what began by Birth by Sleep? All of it. What does that mean? Clearly the events surrounding Kingdom Hearts. So one event, Birth by Sleep, snow balled into what has happened so far.

So then, what would be the cause of it all? Most probably Xehanort. So Birth by Sleep could very well be the process or origin by which Xehanort was created.

On your point of what could be born of sleep, memories and dreams are good examples. Is it possible then that Xehanort was born of a memory or dream? It's not too hard to imagine. If Sora's memories could manifest into corporeal forms in Castle Oblivion, I could very well see a dream figure coming into reality.

Now what this birth by sleep specifically involves (who was sleeping, what they were dreaming, etc) can only be based on guessing. My hunch is that it does in fact revolve around the Stations for someone's Dive into the Heart.

So, hypothetically, let's say a person is in Castle Oblivion or an area like it. They then have their own dive into the Heart to be chosen for a keyblade. Like everyone, they have to fight their dark side (Sora and Darkside, Roxas and Twilight Thorn). This dark side, for whatever reason, is a manifestation of Xehanort, and the powers of Castle Oblivion make him a reality, ie Birth by Sleep. Now, I'm not saying this is what I believe, it's way too specific, but I'm just giving a scenario by which such a case could happen.
 
A

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Here is something I believe, no one else ever thought of noticing, Birth By Sleep refers how KH itself came to be or how the true KH is able to be seen by people who seek it like MX or any other Antagonist.
 

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Everyone has made interesting points so far! Someone mentioned the phrase could be irrelevant, but I don't think thats likely. Chain of Memories had a valid title, it would be strange to go with something random.

Well, if we take the phrase literally, what began by Birth by Sleep? All of it. What does that mean? Clearly the events surrounding Kingdom Hearts. So one event, Birth by Sleep, snow balled into what has happened so far.

So then, what would be the cause of it all? Most probably Xehanort. So Birth by Sleep could very well be the process or origin by which Xehanort was created.

On your point of what could be born of sleep, memories and dreams are good examples. Is it possible then that Xehanort was born of a memory or dream? It's not too hard to imagine. If Sora's memories could manifest into corporeal forms in Castle Oblivion, I could very well see a dream figure coming into reality.

Now what this birth by sleep specifically involves (who was sleeping, what they were dreaming, etc) can only be based on guessing. My hunch is that it does in fact revolve around the Stations for someone's Dive into the Heart.

So, hypothetically, let's say a person is in Castle Oblivion or an area like it. They then have their own dive into the Heart to be chosen for a keyblade. Like everyone, they have to fight their dark side (Sora and Darkside, Roxas and Twilight Thorn). This dark side, for whatever reason, is a manifestation of Xehanort, and the powers of Castle Oblivion make him a reality, ie Birth by Sleep. Now, I'm not saying this is what I believe, it's way too specific, but I'm just giving a scenario by which such a case could happen.

It reminded me of how Maleficent was 'resurrected' by the memories of Flora, Fauna, and Merryweather. If memories can hold that kind of power, it seems like anything is possible, and that a foe like Xehanort could become nearly immortal.
 

Lancelot

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. What exactly is born from sleep?


Dreams are born from sleep... that's about all that is... Fantasies become real during sleep... you can be anything you want to be... I was just thinking, who's to say that the whole game isnt just a figment of someone's dreams? Imagination if you will
 

Lancelot

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But how do you mean? I don't think Xehanort is Sleep.... doesn't sound right to me
 
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