Organization XIII ~ not so bad :/

[xStarSeekerx]

I mean hear me out.

So they are incomplete beings that are stuck in the realm between the RoL and RoD.
and all they're doing is trying to make an artificial kingdom hearts so they can have hearts, and have emotions and live, be free!

is that so bad

alright, i guess Xemnas isn't someone we want to have a heart.

but the others, i mean i like, axel, demyx, xaldin, leaxeaus, zexion, and luxord

they deserve hearts. so why is sora going around whopping ass because some people want so hearts.


of course, i can be totally wrong, so please let me know what u think, i might be missing something.


ALSO: Terranort lost his memories right? so what does Xemnas remember? his days being an apprentice or everything terra and xehanort remember?

 

[Zarin I Yehudahi]

Are you mad? Organization XIII was pretty bad if you considered the fact that they were trying to collect hearts extracted out of anything they could find for their maniacal leader's plans. They were bad, if not worse than Ansem the Seeker of Darkness.

 

[Ehres]

Eh, depends.

If it's just them killing Heartless, it's not that bad. The majority of them weren't wise to Xemnas' plan so you can't exactly blame them when they all seemed to genuinely want their hearts back, save Xemnas, Saïx, Marluxia and possibly Axel.

But, yeah, when it came to hurting people just so they could get to their goal, and being fully aware of the consequences of their actions and fully aware of the distress they were causing, that's pretty bad. It's a sad kind of desperation, really, but it makes you wonder if they were intentionally malicious about it or just plain pining for their humanity.

 

[UnlockedMemories]

Their goal being evil? Sure, I guess not.

The way they went about it? Definitely awful, and evil. They wanted hearts from all living things so they could get hearts of their own. They were ruthless in their efforts.

You gotta weigh both sides of the story before declaring if someone is evil. And if stealing hearts on a mass scale, manipulating people's memories to do that, Xemnas using them as pawns, etc. isn't, I don't know what is.

 

[xStarSeekerx]

Are you mad? Organization XIII was pretty bad if you considered the fact that they were trying to collect hearts extracted out of anything they could find for their maniacal leader's plans. They were bad, if not worse than Ansem the Seeker of Darkness.

im not mad. im just a bit ....hmm....whats the word.....unsatisfied.

they're going around killing heartless.....YAY thats good no one wants friggin heartless!

 

[Silverslide]

Idgaf about their goals but the character themselves and how they were introduced is bad

 

[Fractured_Heart628]

They were evil. I mean, the Organization itself couldn't exactly trust each other. Saix and Axel wanted to take out the elders of the Organization, just like Marluxia and Larxene. Xemnas and the Organization hid Roxas' true identity from him and made him fight his best friends. And, the Organization XIII manipulated other people and stole many hearts.

 

[xStarSeekerx]

They were evil. I mean, the Organization itself couldn't exactly trust each other. Saix and Axel wanted to take out the elders of the Organization, just like Marluxia and Larxene. Xemnas and the Organization hid Roxas' true identity from him and made him fight his best friends. And, the Organization XIII manipulated other people and stole many hearts.

but they're just people who want some friggin hearts to be whole. i mean

if you had 10,000 dollars. it got burned by some pyro maniac, and you really want it back, and everyone else has it.
and your killing hearltess to get what u want.
ur killing the things people dont want to get what u want

 

[Memory Master]

Well, Some members were really bad. Some were good but wanted a heart and sometimes may not have used the most righteous of methods to do so.

Xemnas, Xigbar, Xaldin, Vexen, Marluxia, and Larxene. Lexeaus is debateble as is Saix and Zexion. Now Luxord and Demyx did not seem so bad at all really. And we know Axel, Roxas, and Xion are good.

So most members were evil, though some were not.

 

[Ehres]

I wouldn't call Xaldin evil as much as fixed in an obsession with one person.

 

[Memory Master]

I wouldn't call Xaldin evil as much as fixed in an obsession with one person.

He was trying to turn the Beast into a heartless and he seemed to like the idea of eliminating Xion and Roxas the times they left the organization. Maybe we have two different views of this but I would call Xaldin evil.

 

[Multi_Skyscraper]

What one must remember here, is that while it's true that the morality of the individual Organization-members can be argued, their overall mean of acquiring Kingdom Hearts DID make them into villains that they Keyblade heroes had to put an end to.

You see, all those Heartless they were hunting down with Roxas, Xion and Sora? Usually when the Keyblade destroys a Heartless, it sends the heart back to be 'reborn', if it's Nobody is later on destroyed. If you first destroy the Heartless, then the Nobody, the person is put back together again! But the Organization deliberately TOOK the hearts that were released to create their artificial Kingdom Hearts- essentially the hearts that could have been reborn as real people would be sacrificed, all so that the Organization could reclaim THEIR hearts, as well as possibly the lesser Nobodies.

Of course, this was all a big huge LIE by Xemnas who never intended (as far as I am aware of) to help anyone but himself to divine power to begin with. But even so, the individual members of the Organization were pretty much in the know that they were sacrificing THOUSANDS of people to get their own hearts back. This was of course only made clear in material OUTSIDE KH2 (nice planning there Nomura, Kazushige), so it's understandable that some people paint the Organization in a more sympathetic light than they deserve.

Now- are the members of the Organization as clear-cut EEEEVIL vilains as Maleficents gang from KH1? I don't really see it that way- they were more tragic and had motivations we could sympathize with. But the means to their end were selfish and cruel, the individual members really didn't care that much about each other because they COULDN'T care about each other, and the true end of the organization WAS in fact pure dark eeevil. Even if Xehanort seems to think he's doing it for some good cause, I think we can safely say he's big, bad and evil by now.

So yeah. Those are my two cents.

 

[Memory Master]

What one must remember here, is that while it's true that the morality of the individual Organization-members can be argued, their overall mean of acquiring Kingdom Hearts DID make them into villains that they Keyblade heroes had to put an end to.

You see, all those Heartless they were hunting down with Roxas, Xion and Sora? Usually when the Keyblade destroys a Heartless, it sends the heart back to be 'reborn', if it's Nobody is later on destroyed. If you first destroy the Heartless, then the Nobody, the person is put back together again! But the Organization deliberately TOOK the hearts that were released to create their artificial Kingdom Hearts- essentially the hearts that could have been reborn as real people would be sacrificed, all so that the Organization could reclaim THEIR hearts, as well as possibly the lesser Nobodies.

Of course, this was all a big huge LIE by Xemnas who never intended (as far as I am aware of) to help anyone but himself to divine power to begin with. But even so, the individual members of the Organization were pretty much in the know that they were sacrificing THOUSANDS of people to get their own hearts back. This was of course only made clear in material OUTSIDE KH2 (nice planning there Nomura, Kazushige), so it's understandable that some people paint the Organization in a more sympathetic light than they deserve.

Now- are the members of the Organization as clear-cut EEEEVIL vilains as Maleficents gang from KH1? I don't really see it that way- they were more tragic and had motivations we could sympathize with. But the means to their end were selfish and cruel, the individual members really didn't care that much about each other because they COULDN'T care about each other, and the true end of the organization WAS in fact pure dark eeevil. Even if Xehanort seems to think he's doing it for some good cause, I think we can safely say he's big, bad and evil by now.

So yeah. Those are my two cents.

Ya know I had never thought of it that way, but yeah you're right if they had complete KH and used it then all those hearts would have been sacrificed. Thus those hearts and the people of those hearts would be gone completely with no chance of rebirth. Wow, that really is evil. That's just messed up. It goes beyond killing a person, it's destroying the very thing that keeps their existence going, their heart.

 

[Unusual1290]

Ok, The Organization wanted to collect hearts that were not theirs. They're not stupid, they have common sense, they know that what they were doing was wrong. They just didn't feel regret from it, because they lack emotion. BUT, all of them, except Xemnas wanted a heart. Xemnas didn't care about a heart. He was a traitor just like Marluxia, Larxene, and Vexen were. Xemnas promised them that if they help him collect hearts, that they would all finally become whole, but truthfully, Xemnas didn't really desire one, he wanted power. He wanted to rebuild the world in his vision. Emotion was of no use to him, he just wanted the power that was inside the hearts. So if any of them were evil, it would definitely be Xemnas.

 

[Allister Rose]

i really can't call someone with no emotions evil......it just doesn't seemt o fit the description of evil

 

[Epif]

Well, sure their intentions were good, but the way that they went about achieving their goals can't possibly be "good". And just because they didn't have emotions, they had memories of what is good and what is bad. They knew they were doing something bad (they knew destroying lives was wrong, yet they did it/tried to do it anyway).

 

[Ovafaze]

if Xemnas,Xigbar,and Saix's eyes are an indicator of evil, and darkness..then I don't know what is. They are bad, all of them.

except a few, and Larxene was just straight up PMSing or something, but not EVIL. :/ I guess what I'm trying to say is,not all the members are evil, just bad.

 

[Epif]

Discrimination because of people's eyes? What?! xD That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard...

 

[Allister Rose]

Well, sure their intentions were good, but the way that they went about achieving their goals can't possibly be "good". And just because they didn't have emotions, they had memories of what is good and what is bad. They knew they were doing something bad (they knew destroying lives was wrong, yet they did it/tried to do it anyway).

that's not what i meant. just because they're not doing anything good, doesn't mean they have to be doing something evil. i can admitthey were doing some thing "bad" but "evil" is pushing it.

with no emotions means no morals to hold them back, they're there own person that can pretend to act like they have emotions, so it's like they can choose to follow their memories or not. i'm saying even if someoen does something evil, isn't exactly the same them being evil themselves. i say they need emotions in order for them to be evil. like they enjoy suffering and such. which they can't because they have no emotions.

EDIT:as for the eyes, it seeems like at first that wasn't a trend in kh series considering most of the COM cast had blue eyes (usually meaning good) and hardly enough yellow eyes (meaning evil) but i tihnk after kh2, it started to become a trend in kh series.

i tihnk they are misunderstood, and were very threatening, bt not evil, maybe certain few but other than that, they're not evil. Evil is pushing it

 

[Roxas891011V]

I never thought all the members were bad some were just had the right idea wrong execution really.

I mean Dilan in BBS doesn't seem anywhere near as bad as Xaldin.

I really just want to know what happened to Ienzo I mean didn't see enough of him when he became Zexion.

Also I mean Axel and Sai'x I feel should come back because I mean Isa and Lea didn't seem as bad either and I liked the two of them.

Honestly I think Xaldin, Lexaeus, Zexion, Sai'x, Axel, Demyx, and Luxord should get their hearts back but I honestly think all of Organization XIII will in the next game.

I'd like if Xigbar and Marluxia got their hearts too. I love Braig/Xigbar he is an awesome character.