Kingdom Hearts 3 Story Discussion



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DarkosOverlord

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There's definitely a problem for me in the whole treatment of Sora's character.

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FudgemintGuardian

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In the end, I just wish Nomura would stop focusing on what'd be cool for trailers and start focusing on the story not falling flat on its face.
 

DarkosOverlord

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So, this started as a rant/nitpick, but after thinking more about it became sort of a theory.

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Ballad of Caius

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The Caribbean is dark. Like dang.
How so?

I think maybe Destiny Islands since after she was awakened, Riku came for her. I feel like Kairi wants her with her
I kinda see Namine as a traveler. What with being trapped inside a castle for so long, and then inside a mansion, and her contemplating at how the wind passed through her cheek gives me a feeling she might like to travel and see other worlds.

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I WHOLE[B]HEART[/B]EDLY (teehee) agree with EVERYTHING you said here! If you look back at the Kingdom of Corona's ending, with Rapunzel wanting to save Flynn, and him saying it could end her life, I feel like it was foreshadowing to Sora's fate.

Gotta say, I'm very disappointed with how the game ended.

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* Sora time traveling back to a time even before Kingdom Hearts existed could be due to Luxord's Wild Card. We never got to see in KH3 what that did. I am also a fan of the idea that the Master of Masters is a denizen from a time before KHx and is trying everything in order to bring back his home.

* I don't think the MoM's end goal is Kingdom Hearts. Otherwise, he would have stayed for the War, but he didn't. I think there could be something beyond Kingdom Hearts itself that the MoM intends to manipulate in order to achieve whatever it is he wants to achieve.
 

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Finally there’s a discussion about Saix because I definitely need to get some things off my chest about him.

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ImVentus

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I don't like how Sora is constantly scolded by Donald & Goofy. If anything Sora's been through a lot of rough spots without their interference and made it out fine. And the rest of the experienced wielders laughing at him, doesn't really sit that well with me. ( Especially with what happened at the Keyblade Graveyard ) Who's laughing now!?
Sora isn't a little child, he's a teenager that should have a sense of his own without being told he needs others approval to make his mark.
This kind of baffles me, cause some scenes are written with a thought of (what Sora should do) or question the situation. Yet a large amount of scenes he's a ditzy cupcake searching for rainbows with not a care in the world (DDD act 1 reprise). While proven in the past that he can achieve great things and really shouldn't be so underestimated by his peers. And when he does show moments of guilt and emotional distress, fans label him as a pussy and weak!? I mean, make up your mind! If you want him to be human, let him have times where he's not always at top. That doesn't make him uninteresting, that makes him challenged.

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SuperSaiyanSora

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I WHOLE[B]HEART[/B]EDLY (teehee) agree with EVERYTHING you said here! If you look back at the Kingdom of Corona's ending, with Rapunzel wanting to save Flynn, and him saying it could end her life, I feel like it was foreshadowing to Sora's fate.
Yep, and I think that's the real theme behind KH3, not just resolution, but the price of Sora being Sora-like. It's why Organization XIII mocks his whole "my friends are my power" deal. Once they saw how powerful it was in Dream Drop Distance, they realized that it's ALSO his biggest weakness because of his willingness to jump into danger without thinking if it means saving his friends. It's an admirable trait to have, but it's only a matter of time until playing with fire burns you. Young Xehanort knew this, and that's why he kept prodding at it.

In fact, that's why Xemnas took Kairi as hostage and then Xehanort killed her -- Once his friends are in danger, he's not going to think clearly, he's only got one mode: go.

Look back to the very first world, Olympus, specifically the scene with Xigbar. "Does having a heart of light come with an extremely good insurance policy?" "No good will ever come from putting other people first." "You'll finally realize what destiny has in store for you. In fact, your reward might be right around the corner. You're so close!"

And the REAL interesting quote... "[I]I don't admire one guy leaping into danger if it means someone else might have to jump in to save him. You're all just lining up to lose out. Dooming others to take the fall with ya. Oh, and you can spare me the usual party line. Yes, hearts are powerful when thy're connected. But if you put too much of that power in one place, some of those hearts might end up breaking. Still, Sora, that doesn't mean you should change. Accept the power you're given. Find the hearts joined to yours.[/I]"

They were alluding to Sora's fate the entire time! From the very beginning, they KNEW what was going to happen, because they know Sora is the type to leap in and rely on his friends for power. It's not something you really think about while playing the game, but when you look back... Yeah, it all makes sense, because everybody warned him and even put so much emphasis on Sora being reckless. The ending was foreshadowed incredibly well, but because the entire focus was on saving everyone, we didn't even consider what all that could come with -- neither did Sora.
 

Xickin

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Ballad of Caius

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Yep, and I think that's the real theme behind KH3, not just resolution, but the price of Sora being Sora-like. It's why Organization XIII mocks his whole "my friends are my power" deal. Once they saw how powerful it was in Dream Drop Distance, they realized that it's ALSO his biggest weakness because of his willingness to jump into danger without thinking if it means saving his friends. It's an admirable trait to have, but it's only a matter of time until playing with fire burns you. Young Xehanort knew this, and that's why he kept prodding at it.

In fact, that's why Xemnas took Kairi as hostage and then Xehanort killed her -- Once his friends are in danger, he's not going to think clearly, he's only got one mode: go.

Look back to the very first world, Olympus, specifically the scene with Xigbar. "Does having a heart of light come with an extremely good insurance policy?" "No good will ever come from putting other people first." "You'll finally realize what destiny has in store for you. In fact, your reward might be right around the corner. You're so close!"

And the REAL interesting quote... "[I]I don't admire one guy leaping into danger if it means someone else might have to jump in to save him. You're all just lining up to lose out. Dooming others to take the fall with ya. Oh, and you can spare me the usual party line. Yes, hearts are powerful when thy're connected. But if you put too much of that power in one place, some of those hearts might end up breaking. Still, Sora, that doesn't mean you should change. Accept the power you're given. Find the hearts joined to yours.[/I]"

They were alluding to Sora's fate the entire time! From the very beginning, they KNEW what was going to happen, because they know Sora is the type to leap in and rely on his friends for power. It's not something you really think about while playing the game, but when you look back... Yeah, it all makes sense, because everybody warned him and even put so much emphasis on Sora being reckless. The ending was foreshadowed incredibly well, but because the entire focus was on saving everyone, we didn't even consider what all that could come with -- neither did Sora.
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@Ballad of Caius
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AdrianXXII

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I feel one of my biggest grips with the game is that they spent too much time setting up the next game and not enough resolving the previous plotlines and how Sora centric everything ended up.

It felt like no one, but Sora got to accomplish anything, which is my least favorite shonnen and video game trope.


Not exactly, why do you think that?

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If I remember correctly Young 'nort said the power was meant to travel hearts to reach worlds, like Riku did to get to Sora's Station of Awakening and the Destiny Island in Sora's heart.

From what Xehanort said it seems Sora's using it in the opposite way from what was intended. Traveling worlds to reach hearts and that really frequently.

Still things are so vague I really dont know what the price Sora paid was or how to read the ending. Either way Sora seems to have ended up in Shibuya, so chances of him being on the verge of returning to the final world aren't too unlikely.
But he might have also ended up in the sleeping realm again or another worldline, who knows at this point.


There are several pretty simple explanations actually,


and Ventus does not even need to remember anything specific yet as since this Chirithy is his personal one he would instinctively welcome it regardless of his own memory status.
In this series when you're deeply connected with someone you feel that regardless of current memory status because memories are immortal and never fully lost, only inaccessible for various reasons.

Ven is also such a sweet kid that it is totally within his character to just accept the Chirithy and cuddle it. In one of the story updates of Union Cross when it comes to creating Spirit Dream Eaters he is totally smitten with them too and Chirithy is a Dream Eater after all.

As for Terra and Aqua, they probably just run with it since the Chirithy does not seem dangerous and it obviously makes Ven happy so they're ok with having it around.
Who knows, the Chirithy may actually become the new mascot and/or "housekeeper" for Land of Departure when TAV are away meeting their other friends or fulfilling a mission.
I agree Ven even if he doesn't recognize him wouldn't reject him and upon noticing the shy timid little guy would welcome him to come forward and become his friend.

I love the idea of Chirithy looking after the place while the others are out and about.

What puzzles me about Chirithy being at the land of departure, is how is he in the realm of light. I thought dreameaters could only exist in the realm of sleep.

The heartbinder making a temporary exception for Sora's dreameaters.


Considering the size of the mansion, we'd probably get to see Lea, Roxas, Xion, and Isa reside there too. So they can all be together. If it's even bigger than we get to see or if it's renovated bigger, Hayner, Pence, and Olette could live there too. Having the group live there they could have their own Ansem's castle situation.
I think it'd probably be a great place for RAXIN to live, seeing they could be together as much as they want and wouldnvt have to worry about rent, being squaters and all haha

I donvt think HPO should join them though, seeing they're still going to school and have families to live with.


There's definitely a problem for me in the whole treatment of Sora's character.

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yeah the treatment of Sora by his friends bugged me too. I get some friendly teasing, but Donald and Goofy were at times just flattout mean and disrespectful towards Sora, shuffing him away and not letting him talk etc.

I also feel like this game more than any before has the issue that the dialog says one thing but the story itself says another.

Like Sora's bot being ready, but being the only one to accomplish anything or Kairi being the one to do the protecting, only to end up needing saving and dead, to name a few examples.
 
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I really feel like you guys are being too harsh on the whole Donald and Goofy thing. Sora picks on them too? Like the whole game they all just playfully pick, but then say something cute or sweet. Like they are like family at this point, they know each other's flaws and they don't care. Also, there are literally so many moments toward the end where it all comes to fruition. When they send him off to the Realm of Darkness like loving parents. When they stay behind with Yen Sid and tell him he is a whole pint. And obviously when they want to go to the final battle with him, and support him to the end. They even want to go with him to awaken Kairi again. So yeah I dunno. I don't see where all this too harsh stuff is really coming from.

What puzzles me about Chirithy being at the land of departure, is how is he in the realm of light. I thought dreameaters could only exist in the realm of sleep.

The heartbinder making a temporary exception for Sora's dreameaters.


Well, I thought Daybreak Town was the Realm of Light as well? Which is where Chirithy was created in the first place.
 

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I really feel like you guys are being too harsh on the whole Donald and Goofy thing. Sora picks on them too? Like the whole game they all just playfully pick, but then say something cute or sweet. Like they are like family at this point, they know each other's flaws and they don't care. Also, there are literally so many moments toward the end where it all comes to fruition. When they send him off to the Realm of Darkness like loving parents. When they stay behind with Yen Sid and tell him he is a whole pint. And obviously when they want to go to the final battle with him, and support him to the end. They even want to go with him to awaken Kairi again. So yeah I dunno. I don't see where all this too harsh stuff is really coming from.
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My theory is that the trio's are going to be remixed, and we're going to see different friendship dynamics...

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Sora2016

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Should I be buffering still I guess?

LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS LET'S GO FELLERS

Yeah I would have loved that to get resolved in the middle since I don't think it would have made a huge difference whether Aqua and Ven got saved earlier or later. In fact, I think it would have been nice for them to be around earlier. I guess maybe it wouldn't have helped everyone else getting saved so late in terms of pacing much? Since so many of them were Xehanorts. Roxas is the only other stand out that could have happened sooner. But yeah, I agree with that. It was stall things for sure. I guess in character, they were worried about him. And I guess...the ending showed that maybe that was a right call? That he can't always just pull through with no plan "cuz he is Sora".
My theory is that the trio's are going to be remixed, and we're going to see different friendship dynamics...

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I mean I am down with all that. Though what about Mickey, Donald and Goofy? I don't want them getting pushed to the wayside. Them getting to develop with other characters would be fun as well. Also I guess Kairi is back lol. She needs to do....something?
 

AdrianXXII

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I really feel like you guys are being too harsh on the whole Donald and Goofy thing. Sora picks on them too? Like the whole game they all just playfully pick, but then say something cute or sweet. Like they are like family at this point, they know each other's flaws and they don't care. Also, there are literally so many moments toward the end where it all comes to fruition. When they send him off to the Realm of Darkness like loving parents. When they stay behind with Yen Sid and tell him he is a whole pint. And obviously when they want to go to the final battle with him, and support him to the end. They even want to go with him to awaken Kairi again. So yeah I dunno. I don't see where all this too harsh stuff is really coming from.
I might have sounded harsher than I intended to, but Donald and Goofy's behavior especially around the King towards Sora, really rubbed me the wrong way.

The fact that they'd shove him out of the way, mid-sentence and wouldn't let him come to word was a bit frustrating to me.
In particular because Sora told them a few times to stop that.

Most of the rest seemed just like banter.
It's clear they care for each other a lot, they just dont always treat each other in the best way, which is kind of realistic I guess.




Well, I thought Daybreak Town was the Realm of Light as well? Which is where Chirithy was created in the first place.
Honestly i thought that the events in Chi were actually set in the realm of Sleep, because of the Chirithies or that the rules and realms were different before the Keyblade War.

I also kind wonder, what kind of realm places like the datascape, 300 Acre Woods and projections from the Book of Prophecies even fall under.
 

Ballad of Caius

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I also kind wonder, what kind of realm places like the datascape, 300 Acre Woods and projections from the Book of Prophecies even fall under.[/spoilers]
* The Datascape is inside the Realm of Light, it's just that you could say it's a Realm-esque creation.

* 100 Acre Woods? It's a book, so it'd work anywhere.

* The Book of Prophecies could work as the Acre book as well.
 

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* The Datascape is inside the Realm of Light, it's just that you could say it's a Realm-esque creation.

* 100 Acre Woods? It's a book, so it'd work anywhere.

* The Book of Prophecies could work as the Acre book as well.
Wouldn't the same apply for thedatascape, move the computer and it'd work anywhere?

Upon further reflection i guess they all fall under realm of light seeing the realm of they are inhabited by humans like in the RoL and some few heartless and not dreameaters.

Still a part of me feel the might border closer to the realm of sleep, seeing their unique nature.
 

Ballad of Caius

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Wouldn't the same apply for thedatascape, move the computer and it'd work anywhere?

Upon further reflection i guess they all fall under realm of light seeing the realm of they are inhabited by humans like in the RoL and some few heartless and not dreameaters.

Still a part of me feel the might border closer to the realm of sleep, seeing their unique nature.
The Realm of Sleep is a creation of the worlds that were overtaken by darkness. As they slumber in the darkness, they dream their memories, and these memories create the Realm of Sleep.

The Datascape is just a man-made creation that you could say functions as an inner realm inside the Realm of Light. Think of it as a house with a room.
 

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Hayer Pence Olettle, they do not know Roxas, they only hear about him in passing. Suddenly they want to save him and be his friend because sora told them too. Their is no connection among them at all. If anything HPO data version probably grew their own hearts and are missing their friend
 

AdrianXXII

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Hayer Pence Olettle, they do not know Roxas, they only hear about him in passing. Suddenly they want to save him and be his friend because sora told them too. Their is no connection among them at all. If anything HPO data version probably grew their own hearts and are missing their friend
Actually Roxas befriended them sorta in Days, their interactions were few, but they all seemed to get along pretty well.

That's probably why their data counterparts were chosen as his friends and why the name seemed familiar.

Also KH2 implied that there was some bleedover from the data counterparts, but it was never explained.
 
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