Is BBS 0.2 so bad?



REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS

Nukara

Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2017
Messages
339
Awards
0
Age
22
Location
Russia.
I liked 0.2 and in terms of the plot and in terms of gameplay and in terms of graphics.
And recently I learned that most consider the game is not very much in terms of the plot. Arguing that she destroyed the Black Points and the ending of KH1. But after all, in the secret ending of "BBS Volume two" hints of 0.2 were given.
Many even compare the game almost with DDD in terms of the plot. What surprised me most was that for me it always seemed that 0.2 plot was understandable and did not have such difficulties.
Is the game really all bad in the plot plan, and I'm just a "hardcore fan" who has a bad taste and I'm ready to eat everything that Nomura gives us?
If I'm not the only one who is also surprised that 0.2 has a lot of criticism, respond.
 

Chaser

KHI Site Staff
Staff member
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
22,088
Awards
48
Location
Australia
  • Completionist
  • NieR: Automata
  • Beauty Within
  • Keyblade Champion
  • Taciturn Stalwart
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
And recently I learned that most consider the game is not very much in terms of the plot.
It unfortunately isn't. Aqua's story itself just gave us a glimpse into how she's going and what she was doing over the 10 years between BbS and KH1. The stuff that takes place after DDD is summed up as Yen Sid sending all three of the Destiny Trios out on their next journey.


Arguing that she destroyed the Black Points and the ending of KH1. But after all, in the secret ending of "BBS Volume two" hints of 0.2 were given.
I don't hold Blank Points to high regard as others so her knowing Sora and Riku were helping Mickey hasn't really affected how I read the scene of her learning that Sora saved the world twice.

It clashing with the end of KH1 bugs me a little. Riku not seeing or hearing Aqua as he rushes to close the door confuses me as they were being pretty loud and also close to Riku. Also that they added in a reason for Mickey to lose his shirt, but his pants and shoes were different to how they were in Kingdom Hearts as well. And where did he get a shirt in CoM?

Many even compare the game almost with DDD in terms of the plot. What surprised me most was that for me it always seemed that 0.2 plot was understandable and did not have such difficulties.
I haven't heard or seen these criticisms. It makes no sense to me either, 0.2 is fairly straightforward in terms of its plot.

Is the game really all bad in the plot plan, and I'm just a "hardcore fan" who has a bad taste and I'm ready to eat everything that Nomura gives us?
A lot of people expect the latter when they read up on this series. I admit I am a bit guilty of it, but the criticisms that you brought up just surprise me as how are the plots of DDD and 0.2 even comparable. That itself makes no sense.
 

Jochira

Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
74
Awards
9
Age
25
Location
Stockholm, Sweden
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 2.8 Final Chapter Prologue
  • Jiminy's Journal
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5 ReMIX
  • Final Fantasy X/X-2 HD Remaster
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 2.5 ReMIX
cuz the game length of 0.2 is equally as long as the other games

jokes apart, 0.2's story isn't bad at all. majority that played 0.2 played it with the knowledge of it being a very short game and what did they expect from a short game? of cuz, Riku not even noticing Aqua was just weird (and the random fan service), but otherwise I actually enjoyed 0.2

on the topic of DDD: am I seriously the only one that enjoyed the story of DDD the most? must be cuz i'm weak to time travelling stuffs and such
 

DarkGrey Heroine

How much closer could I be?
Joined
Jan 29, 2015
Messages
1,343
Awards
38
Age
22
Website
www.deviantart.com
  • NieR: Automata
  • No Name
  • Ninja'd
  • Master Defender
  • Chilly Academic
  • Key of Destiny
I wouldn't compare 0.2 to DDD, not even a bit. 0.2 seemed to me like a "keep it simple" plot, with our usual KH terms, light vs darkness, crumbling bonds and really rigid dialogue.
Visually, it blew my mind and KH has never been so directly beautiful. It was indeed very short, but I took it as it was, and, since Aqua isn't my favourite character even though she's a strong chick, I'm not head-over-heels or how to say it about 0.2
It's great we got what is closest to that legendary Volume Two BBS from the past. We gotta appreciate that

on the topic of DDD: am I seriously the only one that enjoyed the story of DDD the most? must be cuz i'm weak to time travelling stuffs and such
not the only one definitely, DDD is my fav game for its story as well. It kept my interest high through the whole playthrough! I'll never forget that summer in which I played it.. man...
 

Veevee

Active member
Joined
Aug 1, 2017
Messages
819
Awards
8
Location
darkness within darkness
  • Red Travels the Farthest
  • Luna Diviner
  • Flurry of Dancing Flames
  • Savage Nymph
  • The Gambler of Fate
  • Unicornis Union
I love 0.2 for the gameplay, the music and the graphics, but I heavily dislike the story and the dialogue lines. There are quite a few things that are quite ... strange and don't feel natural, I will point some out:

-> Aqua being able to talk to Terra "through the means of darkness" - wut?
- Mickey telling Aqua how he got to the Realm of Darkness, by "waiting for a world to fall into darkness and then slip in" - I'm sure this is not how it was meant, but it sounds like Mickey waited besides a world that fell into darkness to have a chance to get to the RoD
- how it ruins Blank Points
- how they conveniently got teleported to the Kingdom Key D which is said to be the counterpart of the Kingdom Key. I get that. But why is it on Destiny Islands since the regular Kingdom Key is not really Sora's blade or anyhow tied to DI in a special way?
- and last but not least: Up to this game, it was not known whether any of the characters knows that Aqua is in the RoD so no one could go looking for her. But after this game we know that Mickey knew and decided to ignore this fact for a very long time. And you can't come around with "it was too dangerous" - Riku and him got locked in the RoD after the events in KH1 and Aqua should've been around / you could've targeted her with her wayfinder, so they SHOULD'VE gone back to look for her when they already WERE there. It makes Mickey, who knew all this, look like an asshole (in combination with the "I slipped in"-thingy), especially when he never mentions TAV up to Coded.

Despite that, 'twas a nice game, if unnecessary.
 

DarkosOverlord

Bronze Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
2,808
Awards
4
Age
25
Location
Rome, Italy
  • Keyblade Master
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • The Foreteller
  • Savage Nymph
If I'm not the only one who is also surprised that 0.2 has a lot of criticism, respond.
Wait, so I can't respond? I will anyway, thug life.

It depends on how much is "so bad". After giving it some thought 0.2 will probably never be one of my favourite chapters, more like something that bothers me because of how many missed opportunities it had.

I'm not a huge Blank Points fan, but I get the disappointment for different reasons: I was actually really liking 0.2 when it was about Aqua facing her doubts and fear while advancing in ruined worlds. Just a Pancake made a fair point on how 0.2 improved Aqua's characterization by making it about her struggles with the Darkness and not losing hope, whereas in BbS she was this friendship robot obsessed with her friends but making close to zero effort to keep them as such.

But back to 0.2. The game utterly loses me when it tries to become a retcon for KH1's ending, something I don't think anyone ever asked for nor it felt needed. Aqua fighting Heartless with Riku not noticing her two inches away could be hilarious in some settings, but this isn't an Hot Shots! movie.

And here and there you'll find even more plot points just because. I'll talk later about Mickey's shirt and his delirious rambling about the Kingdom Key Darkside, but even the fact that he just always knew where Aqua was but didn't say anything was in bad taste.

Then other things were kind of a disappointment, you'd see them in the trailers thinking they're a tease of what's to come and it turns out that wasd the entire event.
Like, the Darkside army was so underwhelming. Imagine seeing the 1000 Heartless in a KH II promo only to play the real thing and you battle 10 Heartless before a cutscene happens. I'm sorry, I have very little simpathy for this kind of bait: if you don't commit to the bit, you might as well not show me anything at all.

Pretty much this. I won't say the game is absolute trash and it does have parts I really liked, but I can't bring myself to claim its story is good and there are no gripes with it.
It's the next child born from the utter chaos KH's recent narrative is.

Many even compare the game almost with DDD in terms of the plot. What surprised me most was that for me it always seemed that 0.2 plot was understandable and did not have such difficulties.
I haven't heard or seen these criticisms. It makes no sense to me either, 0.2 is fairly straightforward in terms of its plot.
What they were referring to was probably things like "hey let's retcon Mickey losing his shirt because clearly this has been bothered people way more than, say, where is Terra or something", and adding more stuff to the lore instead of clearing some questions up.

Like, y'all are saying that 0.2's plot was easy and straightforward, and for the most part it is, but Mickey's monologue about going to the dark version of the Islands because there was a dark version of the Kingdom Key because that's how it works apparently and Mickey knew all of that for some reason still isn't really all that clear to me.
It's a part of the Worlds/Keyblade lore never seen before, it's still not that clear and adds yet another footnote on what could be important or maybe not about the Kingdom Key and Destiny's Islands, not enough to have concrete ideas but something to remember.

I definitely see shades of DDD's confusing writing and exposition in this. Oh, and brief Terranort cameo just like YX at the end of every world in DDD: a Nort arrives, something something important name drop, and now he's gone.
 
Last edited:

Nukara

Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2017
Messages
339
Awards
0
Age
22
Location
Russia.
Wait, so I can't respond? I will anyway, thug life.

It depends on how much is "so bad". After giving it some thought 0.2 will probably never be one of my favourite chapters, more like something that bothers me because of how many missed opportunities it had.

I'm not a huge Blank Points fan, but I get the disappointment for different reasons: I was actually really liking 0.2 when it was about Aqua facing her doubts and fear while advancing in ruined worlds. Just a Pancake made a fair point on how 0.2 improved Aqua's characterization by making it about her struggles with the Darkness and not losing hope, whereas in BbS she was this friendship robot obsessed with her friends but making close to zero effort to keep them as such.

But back to 0.2. The game utterly loses me when it tries to become a retcon for KH1's ending, something I don't think anyone ever asked for nor it felt needed. Aqua fighting Heartless with Riku not noticing her two inches away could be hilarious in some settings, but this isn't an Hot Shots! movie.

And here and there you'll find even more plot points just because. I'll talk later about Mickey's shirt and his delirious rambling about the Kingdom Key Darkside, but even the fact that he just always knew where Aqua was but didn't say anything was in bad taste.

Then other things were kind of a disappointment, you'd see them in the trailers thinking they're a tease of what's to come and it turns out that wasd the entire event.
Like, the Darkside army was so underwhelming. Imagine seeing the 1000 Heartless in a KH II promo only to play the real thing and you battle 10 Heartless before a cutscene happens. I'm sorry, I have very little simpathy for this kind of bait: if you don't commit to the bit, you might as well not show me anything at all.

Pretty much this. I won't say the game is absolute trash and it does have parts I really liked, but I can't bring myself to claim its story is good and there are no gripes with it.
It's the next child born from the utter chaos KH's recent narrative is.





What they were referring to was probably things like "hey let's retcon Mickey losing his shirt because clearly this has been bothered people way more than, say, where is Terra or something", and adding more stuff to the lore instead of clearing some questions up.

Like, y'all are saying that 0.2's plot was easy and straightforward, and for the most part it is, but Mickey's monologue about going to the dark version of the Islands because there was a dark version of the Kingdom Key because that's how it works apparently and Mickey knew all of that for some reason still isn't really all that clear to me.
It's a part of the Worlds/Keyblade lore never seen before, it's still not that clear and adds yet another footnote on what could be important or maybe not about the Kingdom Key and Destiny's Islands, not enough to have concrete ideas but something to remember.

I definitely see shades of DDD's confusing writing and exposition in this. Oh, and brief Terranort cameo just like YX at the end of every world in DDD: a Nort arrives, something something important name drop, and now he's gone.
I never thought the story in DDD was too complicated?
There are no difficulties in it, and I understood certain moments only from the second time, but I can not name the game that is absolutely impossible to challenge.
 

DarkosOverlord

Bronze Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
2,808
Awards
4
Age
25
Location
Rome, Italy
  • Keyblade Master
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • The Foreteller
  • Savage Nymph
I never thought the story in DDD was too complicated?
There are no difficulties in it, and I understood certain moments only from the second time, but I can not name the game that is absolutely impossible to challenge.
Oh, DDD's storytelling is a hot mess.
Time travel is explained once at the beginning, then another time at the end in a long and uninterrupted Young Xehanort monologue where things go a hundred miles a second. "You need to leave the body behind in order to time travel. Got that? Good, because I'm already talking about how Ansem did it. I'm not going to mention he was able to because he's a Heartless, figure that out yourself. And while you're at it, keep listening, for I'm explaining that he met me, passed onto me the power to time travel, now you got me and him to keep track since we're both doing important stuff. How did I time travel without losing my body, or did I actually lost that? Not relevant right now. Hey look, Xigbar's back. Or maybe it's Braig, who knows."

The whole Dream shebang is not even fully explained. The worlds failed to awaken from their slumber and are trapped in a loop. Then why are Destiny's Islands also in the Realm of Light and one can go there no problem? Does being a Sleeping world doesn't affect that? ...then WHAT does it affect? Unlocking them saves them from what, exactly? *cue Captain Hook* "And why those seven?" Who or what decides which world becomes Sleeping and which doesn't?
And let's not forget my all time favourite: The Grid is not a dream. It's a real world. Which means... heck if I know. Something.
Oh, and Riku visited Sleeping worlds while being in Sora's dream, and that still counted. Then again, why wouldn't it? I don't understand the first thing of this dream concept!
That's an awful lot of unanswered questions for what is supposed to be the game's main theme.

And then we have meaningful and self-explanatory phrases such as "Darkness within Darkness awaits you". Sounds cool, but what does it means? What am I supposed to get from it on a concrete level? What are the additional dangers a Darkness within Darkness holds over mere Darkness?
But let's focus on more positive things: Master Xehanort possessed Young and within him used No Name but with a different keyholder. And this actually makes sense: Young cannot use a Keyblade since he hasn't undergone proper training yet, so Master Xehanort had to do the honors. Which means he broke Mickey's Stopza like a boss, and then Riku battled technically Master Xehanort.

I'm not gonna lie, that's pure badassery. Man, I wish I was able to get all of that from playing the game, and not from reading it in an interview.
Oh, and Riku and Sora still have dream world clothes and powers at TWTNW. Well, that's because that world is weird. Makes sense I guess. And Dream Eaters are also still around, so... where the hiffle is everyone now? Is Mickey in the Dream World, or are Sora, Riku and the time travelling Norts in the Realm of Light and in the present?

Secret bonus post-credits nitpick: Lea, Pete and Maleficent are Darkness wielding beings who appeared at Disney Castle through dark portals. Because screw the Cornerstone of Light and what it represented in KH II.


Look. This still isn't rocket science. It's still plenty understandable... well, for the most part. Heck, if you got all of it during the first view, more power to you. Sincere congratulations. And we can still cook up some possible explanations for the unanswered mysteries, these forums are littered with them.
I'm afraid however that doesn't change how badly DDD decided to tackle all of this, delving into complex explanations but glossing over pretty important "details", throwing a bunch of new stuff in the canon at us with no other choice but to accept them without questions.
The X-Blade is now made of 20 parts, please engrave this in your mind or we can't proceed. Forget all you experienced in Ventus' story in BbS.
Honestly, KH III could conjure out of thin air ANOTHER method to forge the X-Blade without explaining why, and I will just take it. I already did it once.

One person's ability to understand even the most complicated matters doesn't mean there isn't a bad and a good way to show and narrate stuff.
And to further clarify, that doesn't mean you can't ENJOY this or that, or that I'm passing judgement to whoever enjoys DDD: I don't hate DDD myself, and I wasn't foaming at my mouth in rage while writing all of this. In fact, it's one of the KH titles I play the most. You don't need to hate something to point out its flaws, and vice versa.
If you feel depreciated or that this is too negative of a post I apologize, that wasn't the intention.
I was just poking a bit of fun at certain moments and how they've been realized.
 
Last edited:

Nukara

Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2017
Messages
339
Awards
0
Age
22
Location
Russia.
Oh, DDD's storytelling is a hot mess.
Time travel is explained once at the beginning, then another time at the end in a long and uninterrupted Young Xehanort monologue where things go a hundred miles a second. "You need to leave the body behind in order to time travel. Got that? Good, because I'm already talking about how Ansem did it. I'm not going to mention he was able to because he's a Heartless, figure that out yourself. And while you're at it, keep listening, for I'm explaining that he met me, passed onto me the power to time travel, now you got me and him to keep track since we're both doing important stuff. How did I time travel without losing my body, or did I actually lost that? Not relevant right now. Hey look, Xigbar's back. Or maybe it's Braig, who knows."

The whole Dream shebang is not even fully explained. The worlds failed to awaken from their slumber and are trapped in a loop. Then why are Destiny's Islands also in the Realm of Light and one can go there no problem? Does being a Sleeping world doesn't affect that? ...then WHAT does it affect? Unlocking them saves them from what, exactly? *cue Captain Hook* "And why those seven?" Who or what decides which world becomes Sleeping and which doesn't?
And let's not forget my all time favourite: The Grid is not a dream. It's a real world. Which means... heck if I know. Something.
Oh, and Riku visited Sleeping worlds while being in Sora's dream, and that still counted. Then again, why wouldn't it? I don't understand the first thing of this dream concept!
That's an awful lot of unanswered questions for what is supposed to be the game's main theme.

And then we have meaningful and self-explanatory phrases such as "Darkness within Darkness awaits you". Sounds cool, but what does it means? What am I supposed to get from it on a concrete level? What are the additional dangers a Darkness within Darkness holds over mere Darkness?
But let's focus on more positive things: Master Xehanort possessed Young and within him used No Name but with a different keyholder. And this actually makes sense: Young cannot use a Keyblade since he hasn't undergone proper training yet, so Master Xehanort had to do the honors. Which means he broke Mickey's Stopza like a boss, and then Riku battled technically Master Xehanort.

I'm not gonna lie, that's pure badassery. Man, I wish I was able to get all of that from playing the game, and not from reading it in an interview.
Oh, and Riku and Sora still have dream world clothes and powers at TWTNW. Well, that's because that world is weird. Makes sense I guess. And Dream Eaters are also still around, so... where the hiffle is everyone now? Is Mickey in the Dream World, or are Sora, Riku and the time travelling Norts in the Realm of Light and in the present?

Secret bonus post-credits nitpick: Lea, Pete and Maleficent are Darkness wielding beings who appeared at Disney Castle through dark portals. Because screw the Cornerstone of Light and what it represented in KH II.


Look. This still isn't rocket science. It's still plenty understandable... well, for the most part. Heck, if you got all of it during the first view, more power to you. Sincere congratulations. And we can still cook up some possible explanations for the unanswered mysteries, these forums are littered with them.
I'm afraid however that doesn't change how badly DDD decided to tackle all of this, delving into complex explanations but glossing over pretty important "details", throwing a bunch of new stuff in the canon at us with no other choice but to accept them without questions.
The X-Blade is now made of 20 parts, please engrave this in your mind or we can't proceed. Forget all you experienced in Ventus' story in BbS.
Honestly, KH III could conjure out of thin air ANOTHER method to forge the X-Blade without explaining why, and I will just take it. I already did it once.

One person's ability to understand even the most complicated matters doesn't mean there isn't a bad and a good way to show and narrate stuff.
And to further clarify, that doesn't mean you can't ENJOY this or that, or that I'm passing judgement to whoever enjoys DDD: I don't hate DDD myself, and I wasn't foaming at my mouth in rage while writing all of this. In fact, it's one of the KH titles I play the most. You don't need to hate something to point out its flaws, and vice versa.
If you feel depreciated or that this is too negative of a post I apologize, that wasn't the intention.
I was just poking a bit of fun at certain moments and how they've been realized.
Perhaps I will agree with you that in DDD could and better explain some things related to travel in time.
I'm OK with the complexities in KH, but in DDD, there are a lot of incompleteness.
So in this regard, I agree with you. ;)
 

DarkosOverlord

Bronze Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
2,808
Awards
4
Age
25
Location
Rome, Italy
  • Keyblade Master
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • The Foreteller
  • Savage Nymph
Perhaps I will agree with you that in DDD could and better explain some things related to travel in time.
I'm OK with the complexities in KH, but in DDD, there are a lot of incompleteness.
So in this regard, I agree with you. ;)
Hey you do you, if you still like DDD and don't see all the problems I had with it I am no one to take that from you.
I know wall of text answers can sometimes be annoying so feel free to just dismiss me by singing the party pooper song ;)
 

Grono

KH ☼ D&D ☼ Music ☼ Wack.
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
2,188
Awards
29
Location
Somewhere, surely procrastinating
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
  • Dandelion
  • Dandelion
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • The Foreteller
I love the gameplay of 0.2 - in fact, I did a thread describing what I love about it about a year ago.

As for the story... eh, Nomura said he had trouble writing the dialogue for the first half of the game, and that really shows.

Blank Points sets up that Aqua is beaten down, worn to the thread, and tired of the Realm of Darkness. It's not the idea of this entire thing happening necessarily that destroys our perceptions of Blank Points, but that the information that was so powerful when first revealed in blank points now becomes useless and redundant. Why did she ask about how the outside world has been going? SHE ALREADY ASKED MICKEY THAT AND HAD A FOLLOW-UP ON IT. Why did she think that Ven and Terra could have been out there saving the world when she clearly must have known that Riku and Sora were the active keyblade wielders at that point? Better yet, but how could she have FORGOTTEN about those two?! The only thing she learns from Blank Points after it was retconned is that Sora is more important than he could have ever realized and that the worlds almost fell a second time, but even then this isn't impactful anymore since we just went through this with her in 0.2.

It just makes me angry that one of the best secret endings the series has ever had was retconned for a short III demo and not even redone for the end of that game or anything! I mean, why leave all of this important information in here if she just looks like an idiot asking obvious questions now?!

Sorry, the ending of that game does have me pretty heated.
 

redcrown

Active member
Joined
Dec 21, 2015
Messages
900
Awards
0
I don't like BBS.2 solely because it's not a full game about the "period of absences" like it promised it would be back in 2010. This game was this series' last shot at exploring just a little more of the secondary character's stories that we didn't get to see much of during KH1-KH2, before releasing KH3, because now it's guaranteed we're never going to see it.

Plot wise I didn't actually play this game myself but I've heard the synopsis; and like with the other plots and add-ons I feel undermine contradict or needlessly bloat pre-established stories and mythos in this series, I throw into my mental non-canon bin/straight up ignore it so I can still nourish my enjoyment and basic understanding of the series.

It did look pretty snazzy though. And the ending with the other characters was nice to see too.
 

Grono

KH ☼ D&D ☼ Music ☼ Wack.
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
2,188
Awards
29
Location
Somewhere, surely procrastinating
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
  • Dandelion
  • Dandelion
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • The Foreteller
I don't like BBS.2 solely because it's not a full game about the "period of absences" like it promised it would be back in 2010. This game was this series' last shot at exploring just a little more of the secondary character's stories that we didn't get to see much of during KH1-KH2, before releasing KH3, because now it's guaranteed we're never going to see it.

Plot wise I didn't actually play this game myself but I've heard the synopsis; and like with the other plots and add-ons I feel undermine contradict or needlessly bloat pre-established stories and mythos in this series, I throw into my mental non-canon bin/straight up ignore it so I can still nourish my enjoyment and basic understanding of the series.

It did look pretty snazzy though. And the ending with the other characters was nice to see too.
Yeah, the game was pretty bloated retrospectively. A lot of it was unfortunately filler, as Nomura said he had trouble scripting many scenes where Aqua would be alone, and the only "mysteries" that were solved by it were the questions of how one enters the realm of darkness, where the Kingdom Key D came from, and why Mickey wouldn't have retrieved Aqua at the end of KH.

Then again, that question could have been swept away with a simple "he just didn't bump into her, since the realm of darkness is one enormous world", and due to the fact that he didn't even mention her until 2.8 so it could have been assumed that he didn't even know where she was. And it opens up the question as to where Mickey went while Riku was searching Castle Oblivion... maybe he was just getting some clothes? Ugh, never mind, this game didn't answer any questions.
 

DarkosOverlord

Bronze Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
2,808
Awards
4
Age
25
Location
Rome, Italy
  • Keyblade Master
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • The Foreteller
  • Savage Nymph
I don't like BBS.2 solely because it's not a full game about the "period of absences" like it promised it would be back in 2010. This game was this series' last shot at exploring just a little more of the secondary character's stories that we didn't get to see much of during KH1-KH2, before releasing KH3, because now it's guaranteed we're never going to see it.

Plot wise I didn't actually play this game myself but I've heard the synopsis; and like with the other plots and add-ons I feel undermine contradict or needlessly bloat pre-established stories and mythos in this series, I throw into my mental non-canon bin/straight up ignore it so I can still nourish my enjoyment and basic understanding of the series.

It did look pretty snazzy though. And the ending with the other characters was nice to see too.
Spot on.
I was a stark defender of 0.2 before it came out, hoping it was going to get some story and lore off KH III's back since I was and still am kinda worried about how are they going to handle all of that. Instead, it turned into... what I already said earlier.
 

VoidGear.

red gay
Joined
Jun 6, 2015
Messages
5,617
Awards
54
Age
24
Location
Germany
  • No Name
  • Put That Thing Back Where It Came From
  • Melodious Nocturne
  • Luna Diviner
  • Cloaked Schemer
  • Chilly Academic
0.2's main story issue is that it doesn't offer much story at all. The game tries to make Aqua a more believable character and give her character more depth, but - in my eyes - fails miserably. Okay, well, she's not as bad as in BBS, but that's pretty hard to match anyway.
I'm not against games that mostly develop characters. Reverse/Rebirth did the exact same thing - but in the exact opposite way. We see Riku understand his flaws and mistakes, his desperate fight to prove himself worthy of returning to the people he loves, and trying to set things right. He grows. He changes.
We do see Aqua struggle with her own issues for a change, too, instead of just being the mom to run after Terra and Ven. That's cool, she needs that. However the execution is not good at all. It doesn't develop her character (and when it does, like the Phantom Aqua fight, it's ruined again immediately afterwards by her going full "lol I just beat my inner demon and found my reason to fight. Oh, illusions of Terra and Ven, my F R I E N D S, remember how they were all I was relevant for in BBS? Yeah, watch them be my plothole now" and deciding that she doesn't care if she's chasing them in vain after all. It renders the whole part about her fighting "herself" and her doubts right before that entirely useless).
She doesn't grow, she doesn't change, all she finds is her reason to fight, and that's mostly when she finds Mickey and realizes there is probably some way for her to get out eventually. It has nothing to do with her overcoming her issues or questioning her own previous choices and trying to do better.

And then there's the ending of the game, from the moment on that Mickey joins. It all feels so forced - be it the shirt scene, or the fact that Riku is fucking oblivious to Aqua's presence - that it simply didn't leave any impact on me. It wasn't believable, so why would I care?
 

DarkosOverlord

Bronze Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
2,808
Awards
4
Age
25
Location
Rome, Italy
  • Keyblade Master
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • The Foreteller
  • Savage Nymph
0.2's main story issue is that it doesn't offer much story at all. The game tries to make Aqua a more believable character and give her character more depth, but - in my eyes - fails miserably. Okay, well, she's not as bad as in BBS, but that's pretty hard to match anyway.
I'm not against games that mostly develop characters. Reverse/Rebirth did the exact same thing - but in the exact opposite way. We see Riku understand his flaws and mistakes, his desperate fight to prove himself worthy of returning to the people he loves, and trying to set things right. He grows. He changes.
We do see Aqua struggle with her own issues for a change, too, instead of just being the mom to run after Terra and Ven. That's cool, she needs that. However the execution is not good at all. It doesn't develop her character (and when it does, like the Phantom Aqua fight, it's ruined again immediately afterwards by her going full "lol I just beat my inner demon and found my reason to fight. Oh, illusions of Terra and Ven, my F R I E N D S, remember how they were all I was relevant for in BBS? Yeah, watch them be my plothole now" and deciding that she doesn't care if she's chasing them in vain after all. It renders the whole part about her fighting "herself" and her doubts right before that entirely useless).
She doesn't grow, she doesn't change, all she finds is her reason to fight, and that's mostly when she finds Mickey and realizes there is probably some way for her to get out eventually. It has nothing to do with her overcoming her issues or questioning her own previous choices and trying to do better.
That's true, a small step forward doesn't mean complete improvement.
Another reason why I think the last third of the game didn't need to be there: it makes seem like all that personal struggles up til that point were just filler.
Aqua was left floating in the Darkness after learning Xehanort was still active and her friends in danger, but when she wakes up Mickey is there talking about keys and doors and whatnot so let's follow him in this sidequest and let's put all that other boring personal stuff aside
It's not like Aqua questioning herself and what to do was important or something, after all she's just another figurine waiting to be collected by the main cast
 

Grono

KH ☼ D&D ☼ Music ☼ Wack.
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
2,188
Awards
29
Location
Somewhere, surely procrastinating
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
  • Dandelion
  • Dandelion
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • The Foreteller
I will give 0.2 this, though; it might have the best Terra speaking scene in any of these games ever. I actually really liked and cared about him this time around, and it actually broke my heart when I realized what had happened after his hair turned white. The cool thing is they didn't just play it as "another trick of the darkness" or anything, either; he actually got repossessed by Xehanort and lost control of his body again. That scene where he strangles him and later when he screams "ENOUGH!" is just so good and especially needed for his character, which I thought was more than lacking in his original game.

While I understand how and why that scene wouldn't have continued on from there, and I actually agree with the decision to cut to Mickey after it, it does suck how we don't really see as much of Ven as maybe we were led to believe this time around.

Oh, and one very small thing that I'm sure nobody but me probably cared about. It always bothered me how Xemnas completely knew about Aqua's "special knowledge" that she got when she was anointed to master, since technically Terra himself should not have been privy to knowing about the Chamber of Waking. There was always the possibility that maybe Xehanort knew about it (he probably just knew the name), but with the way their previous master set their relationship up it seemed like everything was set up so that Xehanort could never get to that point, and that he would need something like Eraqus attempting to kill Ventus to sneak in and destroy The Land of Departure. Knowing that Aqua had to let him know exactly where Ventus was hiding made me feel like he wouldn't just be following a false trail, and made me feel like Xehanort actually had some footing in his goal instead of just "knowing" where he was.

Also, is it just the Master's Defender that can unlock the Land of Departure? Because, if not, then Xehanort could have just opened up the heart of the world himself and destroyed it that way. Ugh, this is confusing. I love this series though
 

Rydgea

"contrary little shit"
Joined
Oct 21, 2011
Messages
2,433
Awards
5
Website
backloggery.com
  • News Hound
  • Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5 ReMIX
  • Theatrhythm: Final Fantasy
  • Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance
0.2 is mostly style, no substance unfortunately. You would think the concept, being diluted from whole book to prologue, would have tight storytelling. Yet, Aqua's would-be-development is little improved. I might be one of the few who actually found her more believable in BBS. I also found Mickey's presence muddying up the storyline rather than enhancing it.

However, one of my least favorite moments was when the base Demon Tide organize to push Aqua through the pin-sized door back to DI. I literally died from the stinky cheese.

There were also many other cool elements they could have implemented but didn't. I'd been lusting after the IDEA of being able to explore a twisted version of Cinderella's castle since the Secret Ending of BBS -Final Mix-. So, blue balls there. Then they didn't even properly translate the rigid, angular art direction of the Sleeping Beauty film in Enchanted Dominion like they had with the original BBS. Hell, if all you're really doing here is just showing off your graphic's muscles, making us believe in your Kingdom Shader or whatever it is, do your due diligence. I'm still not completely sold on the character models either, personally, but then you're going to water down the iconic backgrounds?

Listen though, even with all the nitpicks, the gameplay (note, most important aspect of a game) is pretty fun! I like playing 0.2. Just don't expect much anything from the narrative.
 

Grono

KH ☼ D&D ☼ Music ☼ Wack.
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
2,188
Awards
29
Location
Somewhere, surely procrastinating
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
  • Dandelion
  • Dandelion
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • Final Fantasy XV
  • The Foreteller
0.2 is mostly style, no substance unfortunately. You would think the concept, being diluted from whole book to prologue, would have tight storytelling. Yet, Aqua's would-be-development is little improved. I might be one of the few who actually found her more believable in BBS. I also found Mickey's presence muddying up the storyline rather than enhancing it.

However, one of my least favorite moments was when the base Demon Tide organize to push Aqua through the pin-sized door back to DI. I literally died from the stinky cheese.

There were also many other cool elements they could have implemented but didn't. I'd been lusting after the IDEA of being able to explore a twisted version of Cinderella's castle since the Secret Ending of BBS -Final Mix-. So, blue balls there. Then they didn't even properly translate the rigid, angular art direction of the Sleeping Beauty film in Enchanted Dominion like they had with the original BBS. Hell, if all you're really doing here is just showing off your graphic's muscles, making us believe in your Kingdom Shader or whatever it is, do your due diligence. I'm still not completely sold on the character models either, personally, but then you're going to water down the iconic backgrounds?

Listen though, even with all the nitpicks, the gameplay (note, most important aspect of a game) is pretty fun! I like playing 0.2. Just don't expect much anything from the narrative.
I mean, to be fair, the level design for enchanted dominion in 0.2 is so much improved from the original. BbS had a couple of spots of platforming in their version of the world, but nothing in there was nearly as deep and enthralling as it was exploring that straight darkness jungle leading up to the darkside rush.

I don't even care if the art design isn't that accurate, because quite frankly if it was that accurate it would look strange with this new engine. It worked for the original, but if we're going full 3D models now I've got to imagine something like that would probably have to be compromised. That being said, maybe if they did completely change it up for the Enchanted Dominion part it would have proved to be a good example of the Kingdom Shader. Ah well, take what you can get I suppose.
 

Rydgea

"contrary little shit"
Joined
Oct 21, 2011
Messages
2,433
Awards
5
Website
backloggery.com
  • News Hound
  • Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5 ReMIX
  • Theatrhythm: Final Fantasy
  • Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance
I mean, to be fair, the level design for enchanted dominion in 0.2 is so much improved from the original. BbS had a couple of spots of platforming in their version of the world, but nothing in there was nearly as deep and enthralling as it was exploring that straight darkness jungle leading up to the darkside rush.

I don't even care if the art design isn't that accurate, because quite frankly if it was that accurate it would look strange with this new engine.

It worked for the original, but if we're going full 3D models now I've got to imagine something like that would probably have to be compromised. That being said, maybe if they did completely change it up for the Enchanted Dominion part it would have proved to be a good example of the Kingdom Shader. Ah well, take what you can get I suppose.
I don't buy most of that, tbh. I have the imagination to visualize it anyways. While I agree there was a bit more fleshed out (though still mostly long hallway) exploration, the aesthetic of the bg models would'nt have any bearing on whether or not platforming elements were involved. You can just as easily land on a square as you can a circle.

The teams have been able to properly convert these worlds into 3D translations of their 2D counterparts up until this moment in the series (speaking of ED only). Mulan's The Land of Dragons world retained the Eastern inspiration, the watercolor effects and shapes presented in the original film in KH2. Halloween Town, Port Royal, Space Paranoids and The Grid all embraced the separation from the normal Disney canon style with great success imho. Chalk it up to this stage of the Kingdom Shader (if they even play a part in the backgrounds vs just the characters) or tooling with this new level of realism being in it's infancy, but I believe they are more than capable of delivering something stylized. It just looked generic here. The rich art is one of the most celebrated aspects of that film and they just completely missed the mark.
 
Top