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In Regards to the 'World Order'



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disney233

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The bump of the 7-year-old threat actually makes me curious on your thoughts on it now, in this day and age. Back in KH1 the World Order actually felt...genuine, especially if Triton had to spell it out to Sora. But personally in MY opinion, the World Order is basically Disney's excuse not to have ANYTHING to do with their characters now, making SDG....just there. What do you think? You think it still holds up to this day and age, or do you think the same as I, and think that the World Order is just bull.
 

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I think the concept was originally there, but it quickly flew out the window.
How many times have characters with keyblades interacted with different worlds, be it doing good things or bad (Terra, looking at you)? Far too many.

The concept was only ever mentioned in the first game, wasn't it? So, maybe it's no longer important. Perhaps the heartless threat and whatnot is more important than such a World Order.
 

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I don't think it's actually on Disney's side, it's just a very convenient excuse to keep the plots self-contained because it would be waaay too much work to handle things otherwise. It makes it much more easier to write a (somewhat) cohesive story with different worlds when each of them is self contained instead of trying to unite everything into one big interconnected universe.
 

Face My Fears

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I don't think it's actually on Disney's side, it's just a very convenient excuse to keep the plots self-contained because it would be waaay too much work to handle things otherwise. It makes it much more easier to write a (somewhat) cohesive story with different worlds when each of them is self contained instead of trying to unite everything into one big interconnected universe.
Disney has changed their tune nowadays and are enforcing that their characters do not leave their worlds. That's why the summons had to be "elementals" rather than the actual characters.

I think the world order thing makes sense. Why tell Rapunzel "hey I'm from another world and you're this magical princess that some old guy wants to kidnap"? It's interesting that the one occasion where the Disney character actually is aware of outside worlds and offers to join Sora, he declines (Aladdin in Agrabah, KH1).

Not only does it make sense in game, but for storytelling purposes. Imagine adding every Disney party member to the main plot outside of their worlds (and in other Disney worlds), along with the tons of original characters.
 

Noivern

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Disney has changed their tune nowadays and are enforcing that their characters do not leave their worlds. That's why the summons had to be "elementals" rather than the actual characters.

I think the world order thing makes sense. Why tell Rapunzel "hey I'm from another world and you're this magical princess that some old guy wants to kidnap"? It's interesting that the one occasion where the Disney character actually is aware of outside worlds and offers to join Sora, he declines (Aladdin in Agrabah, KH1).

Not only does it make sense in game, but for storytelling purposes. Imagine adding every Disney party member to the main plot outside of their worlds (and in other Disney worlds), along with the tons of original characters.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I know they changed their stance and started to push more rules on Squênix. It's just that I find it most likely that the original reason is simply to make it easier to write the plot, for the very same reasons you stated.

It also makes sense in the overall narrative as well, even if there's a lot of instances where we affect the world order indirectly lol
 

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Oh, don't get me wrong, I know they changed their stance and started to push more rules on Squênix. It's just that I find it most likely that the original reason is simply to make it easier to write the plot, for the very same reasons you stated.

It also makes sense in the overall narrative as well, even if there's a lot of instances where we affect the world order indirectly lol
I just wish the world order rule can go back to the KH1 standard. Genie and Tinkerbell are aware of other worlds, so I don't see why characters like that can't actually join you as summons. It's more contrived to have Ariel's "elemental energy" as a summon, compared to saying Genie is actually with us to help in the fight. It would have been cool to have the summons present during the heartless battle in the Keyblade Graveyard (since I know the Disney party members can't be there).
 

disney233

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I just wish the world order rule can go back to the KH1 standard. Genie and Tinkerbell are aware of other worlds, so I don't see why characters like that can't actually join you as summons. It's more contrived to have Ariel's "elemental energy" as a summon, compared to saying Genie is actually with us to help in the fight. It would have been cool to have the summons present during the heartless battle in the Keyblade Graveyard (since I know the Disney party members can't be there).
I personally stand by the fact that Genie & Tink...Should've been permanent party members.
 

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I personally stand by the fact that Genie & Tink...Should've been permanent party members.
I would only ever want permanent Disney party members IF they improved the RPG elements of the series. Improve it to the point that you don't use all the boosting items on Sora and you actually would use them on party members because you need them.

The only issue with that is imagine if Genie and Tink were in the Gummiship or standing with you during Hollow Bastion. I don't think it would have as much effect losing Donald/Goofy, if you have Genie and Tink to help you lol.
 

disney233

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I would only ever want permanent Disney party members IF they improved the RPG elements of the series. Improve it to the point that you don't use all the boosting items on Sora and you actually would use them on party members because you need them.

The only issue with that is imagine if Genie and Tink were in the Gummiship or standing with you during Hollow Bastion. I don't think it would have as much effect losing Donald/Goofy, if you have Genie and Tink to help you lol.
Hollow Bastion shouldn't be an issue. Why does it have to be? They're the only ones who Sora would have left. They don't follow some sort of King that Donald and Goofy follows. Honestly...it's a good thing to bring up to Genie, now that I think about it. Genie would be there to comfort Sora, and Tink would try to comfort and heal Beast.

......this makes me despise friendship trios even more because of how secluded it is and how meaningless everyone else is.
 

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Hollow Bastion shouldn't be an issue. Why does it have to be? They're the only ones who Sora would have left. They don't follow some sort of King that Donald and Goofy follows. Honestly...it's a good thing to bring up to Genie, now that I think about it. Genie would be there to comfort Sora, and Tink would try to comfort and heal Beast.

......this makes me despise friendship trios even more because of how secluded it is and how meaningless everyone else is.
Well at that point of the game - narrative speaking - Nomura wanted Sora to be at his weakest and most vulnerable. He was left with nothing but The Beast (who he didn't know) and had to struggle to get into the castle. If Tinkerbell and the all-powerful Genie were there to help him... it wouldn't have as much effect.
 

disney233

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Well at that point of the game - narrative speaking - Nomura wanted Sora to be at his weakest and most vulnerable. He was left with nothing but The Beast (who he didn't know) and had to struggle to get into the castle. If Tinkerbell and the all-powerful Genie were there to help him... it wouldn't have as much effect.
I mean...I GUESS it makes sense? Isn't really impactful when the scene literally took until a few minutes for them to come back to him...but it SOMEWHAT makes sense. idk, that whole scene felt...kinda awkward and forced, anyway.
 

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I mean...I GUESS it makes sense? Isn't really impactful when the scene literally took until a few minutes for them to come back to him...but it SOMEWHAT makes sense. idk, that whole scene felt...kinda awkward and forced, anyway.
I think because of how much time has passed since you saw that scene/played KH1 for the first time, you're not remembering the impact that scene really had. Sora was on this grand journey with Donald/Goofy, he's getting stronger with the keyblade and actually helping people... then Riku takes the keyblade and your friends. You have no idea where this is going, but you're left with The Beast and a wooden sword from Destiny Islands. It's a moment of tremendous loss for Sora, but also the player. You can't exit the world, so all the fun of Disney worlds is not accessible and you're stuck in this intimidating location (Hollow Bastion). Sure it took maybe 30 minutes to get them back, but experiencing it for the first time hit me very hard.

If Genie and Tinkerbell were with you at that point, it wouldn't have seemed so hopeless. In fact, it wouldn't have been that big of a deal since Genie/Tink could have just opened the door for you to enter Hollow Bastion.
 

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Honestly the worst world order scene in Arendelle, where apparently Sora can't even warn Elsa about what Larxene said cuz it would break the order even though none of what Larxene said even involved "oh yea there are different worlds"

Feels less like "keep the order" and more like "keep your original stuff away from our movie"
 

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Honestly the worst world order scene in Arendelle, where apparently Sora can't even warn Elsa about what Larxene said cuz it would break the order even though none of what Larxene said even involved "oh yea there are different worlds"

Feels less like "keep the order" and more like "keep your original stuff away from our movie"
Biggest missed opportunity in Arendelle was having Larxene torment Elsa, leading up to a lightning/ice fight. It would have been amazing to see a Disney character actually fight back (in cutscene) against an Organization member.

I mean, they could have had Rapunzel hit Marluxia with a frying pan. Mike/Sulley and Woody had the best interactions with Organization members, and the world order wasn't ruined (although for the monsters and toys, I don't think they really care too much about world order).

Anyway, I just think they could have squeezed one scene in with Larxene/Elsa fighting. I would have put it right after "Let It Go", so Elsa feels powerful. Then Larxene makes her question herself, then Elsa fights back. Which causes her to rage more when Anna visits. Larxene didn't have to mention anything outside of the Frozen story. She could have said something like "Hans is going to take your sister away and you'll be left alone in the cold".
 

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But personally in MY opinion, the World Order is basically Disney's excuse not to have ANYTHING to do with their characters now, making SDG....just there.
Yeah basically.

Disney wants all the worlds separate, and tries to justify it with the "world order" narrative.
But since SDG and the others are constantly involving themselves in the affairs of the worlds as per their purpose as Keyblade wielders, it's a flimsy premise at best and Nomura/his team rightly threw that phrase in the trash where it belonged after KH1.
It only came back in KHIII 'cause Disney stepped into a more active development role again.
 

Face My Fears

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Yeah basically.

Disney wants all the worlds separate, and tries to justify it with the "world order" narrative.
But since SDG and the others are constantly involving themselves in the affairs of the worlds as per their purpose as Keyblade wielders, it's a flimsy premise at best and Nomura/his team rightly threw that phrase in the trash where it belonged after KH1.
It only came back in KHIII 'cause Disney stepped into a more active development role again.
But it's not like Sora went around revealing he was from another world to the new worlds that he visited. Beast, Hercules, Aladdin, and Simba already knew Sora was from another world. It was just Mulan and Jack Sparrow that he had to keep it from (Mushu already knew). The fact that the people of Port Royal didn't figure it out means that they don't even deserve to be told. So I don't think the phrase being ignored in KH2 made the Disney worlds any better. The only thing that makes the Disney worlds in KH2 trump the KH3 ones is simply having Disney boss fights.
 

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I think because of how much time has passed since you saw that scene/played KH1 for the first time, you're not remembering the impact that scene really had. Sora was on this grand journey with Donald/Goofy, he's getting stronger with the keyblade and actually helping people... then Riku takes the keyblade and your friends. You have no idea where this is going, but you're left with The Beast and a wooden sword from Destiny Islands. It's a moment of tremendous loss for Sora, but also the player. You can't exit the world, so all the fun of Disney worlds is not accessible and you're stuck in this intimidating location (Hollow Bastion). Sure it took maybe 30 minutes to get them back, but experiencing it for the first time hit me very hard.

If Genie and Tinkerbell were with you at that point, it wouldn't have seemed so hopeless. In fact, it wouldn't have been that big of a deal since Genie/Tink could have just opened the door for you to enter Hollow Bastion.
Better yet, Genie still has some magic left at this point after being freed from the lamp. Whose to say Sora cant just say "Genie, turn Hollow Bastion into a falafel or something" and just erase the castle from existence.
 
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