In Regards of the crossover aspect & world building of this series....



REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS

disney233

Active member
Joined
Jan 3, 2015
Messages
544
Awards
0
Age
21
Remember when this game was but a silly crossover with Disney & Final Fantasy? Yeah? Well I don't feel either aspect in this game anymore.

The world building in the Kingdom Hearts series is....VERY bleak. We have such a mighty atmosphere of Disney to integrate into the story, and many memorable Final Fantasy characters to add in like Kefka, Shantotto, maybe even integrate a story for fairy Yuna, Rikku, & Paine.

There's one thought that Maleficent casted a spell on the 3 turning them into fairies so they work for her, there's another thought of them actually living in Neverland, (or Pixie Hollow) like say Yuna resides in her village far from Pixie Hollow, and she's trained there to be a powerful summoner. Many good ideas with both Disney & Final Fantasy....and yet it never happens. Literally the only worlds that matter in the Kingdom Hearts series at this point are the few original worlds we got. Specifically Twilight Town, Destiny Islands, the Keyblade Graveyard, Radiant Garden & Daybreak Town. That's it. While we have an entire solar system of Disney Worlds....it's not used.

I personally feel....worried from here on in with Kingdom Hearts. But I just love the game...I don't know. I just don't feel that Disney magic anymore nor do I even feel that trace of Final Fantasy. I just personally feel that there needs to be more world building than just....everyone is either Sora, Riku, Xehanort or from the Distant Past. Anyone else feels this way? I mean surely you have ideas in regards of this issue right? You're welcome to share them.
 

SweetYetSalty

Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2018
Messages
99
Awards
0
Age
29
KH3 was literally 85% Disney focus, with the 15% main story/Xehanort stuff rushed to the end of the game, lol.

This whole "crossover" thing is being blown out of proportion. Donald and Goofy are the only Disney characters that even go to other Disney Worlds. It's not like Aladdin and Hercules are teaming up to fight Jafar and Hades. Or Ariel and Mulan interacting together in someone else's world. The Disney Villains in KH1 have like two or three scenes together, never work together outside Maleficent, and they are all defeated before you even get to Hollow Bastion, sans Maleficent and Hades, and the latter stops caring about the others not even halfway through the game to do his own thing. Kingdom Hearts was never that to begin with when you really think about it. It's a boy with a magic key going through Disney Worlds looking for his missing friends, while helping Disney characters along the way in their world. It's not like the Disney characters are coming together superhero style to fight Maleficent.

Unpopular opinion. I don't miss the FF characters as much as I thought I would. Doesn't mean I don't want them as I enjoy Leon, Yuffie, Aerith, and Cid for what they are, but when I played KH3, I was like "Where is Aqua? Where is Roxas? Where is Terra? Where are Xion and Namine?" I care more about these characters then say Cloud vs Sephiroth. I can watch Advent Children or Dissidia for that and I'll get the exact same result. Because Sephiroth's subplot has zero Disney/KH elements in it. Donald and Goofy never even help you fight him. Might as well be a FFVII extension. I'm fine either way with Final Fantasy characters because they are not nor have they ever been the reason why I play Kingdom Hearts. I have actual Final Fantasy crossover games for that.

As far as world building goes? For me, so far so good. I love the Heartless and Nobodies and their lore. The more they show of Replicas the more fascinated I am in them, and wish they would show how they are created at birth and what differences they have from regular Nobodies and humans. The data worlds are also a fun concept that I hope returns. Be in Tron's world, Data-Sora's world, or maybe even Ralph's game world. So far the only world building I haven't been a fan of is how to obtain a Keyblade. I wish they remained a mystery.

There is one thing I do agree with, however. I feel that other Disney Worlds should have more importance to the story. King Trident warned Sora that the Keyblade can be used for great evil, and implied it happened before. That was solid world building on a Disney World. I wish we had more of that or show some of the Disney characters knowing about Keyholes, Heartless, and Keyblades like they did in KH1. I heard they are restricted with what they can do with Disney stuff though, like with Frozen so that's too bad.

A example have Mother Gothel knowing about the Keyblade War because she's so old. Not take part in it, but maybe she heard something about it and that's why Marluxia seeks her out. Or have Larxene hire Hans to get Elsa for her. Have Randal and Vanitas be legit partners and try and backstab the other. Use the the tech from San Fransokyo to try and build a body for Roxas and Namine, while the Organization does the same on their side with their Replicas. Have Luxord be the one to have the Heart of Davy Jones and the two are forced to work together instead of a lame retelling of Pirates 3. That's the kind of world building I want in a KH game.
 

disney233

Active member
Joined
Jan 3, 2015
Messages
544
Awards
0
Age
21
KH3 was literally 85% Disney focus, with the 15% main story/Xehanort stuff rushed to the end of the game, lol.

This whole "crossover" thing is being blown out of proportion. Donald and Goofy are the only Disney characters that even go to other Disney Worlds. It's not like Aladdin and Hercules are teaming up to fight Jafar and Hades. Or Ariel and Mulan interacting together in someone else's world. The Disney Villains in KH1 have like two or three scenes together, never work together outside Maleficent, and they are all defeated before you even get to Hollow Bastion, sans Maleficent and Hades, and the latter stops caring about the others not even halfway through the game to do his own thing. Kingdom Hearts was never that to begin with when you really think about it. It's a boy with a magic key going through Disney Worlds looking for his missing friends, while helping Disney characters along the way in their world. It's not like the Disney characters are coming together superhero style to fight Maleficent.

Unpopular opinion. I don't miss the FF characters as much as I thought I would. Doesn't mean I don't want them as I enjoy Leon, Yuffie, Aerith, and Cid for what they are, but when I played KH3, I was like "Where is Aqua? Where is Roxas? Where is Terra? Where are Xion and Namine?" I care more about these characters then say Cloud vs Sephiroth. I can watch Advent Children or Dissidia for that and I'll get the exact same result. Because Sephiroth's subplot has zero Disney/KH elements in it. Donald and Goofy never even help you fight him. Might as well be a FFVII extension. I'm fine either way with Final Fantasy characters because they are not nor have they ever been the reason why I play Kingdom Hearts. I have actual Final Fantasy crossover games for that.

As far as world building goes? For me, so far so good. I love the Heartless and Nobodies and their lore. The more they show of Replicas the more fascinated I am in them, and wish they would show how they are created at birth and what differences they have from regular Nobodies and humans. The data worlds are also a fun concept that I hope returns. Be in Tron's world, Data-Sora's world, or maybe even Ralph's game world. So far the only world building I haven't been a fan of is how to obtain a Keyblade. I wish they remained a mystery.

There is one thing I do agree with, however. I feel that other Disney Worlds should have more importance to the story. King Trident warned Sora that the Keyblade can be used for great evil, and implied it happened before. That was solid world building on a Disney World. I wish we had more of that or show some of the Disney characters knowing about Keyholes, Heartless, and Keyblades like they did in KH1. I heard they are restricted with what they can do with Disney stuff though, like with Frozen so that's too bad.

A example have Mother Gothel knowing about the Keyblade War because she's so old. Not take part in it, but maybe she heard something about it and that's why Marluxia seeks her out. Or have Larxene hire Hans to get Elsa for her. Have Randal and Vanitas be legit partners and try and backstab the other. Use the the tech from San Fransokyo to try and build a body for Roxas and Namine, while the Organization does the same on their side with their Replicas. Have Luxord be the one to have the Heart of Davy Jones and the two are forced to work together instead of a lame retelling of Pirates 3. That's the kind of world building I want in a KH game.
I feel I might've been too broad in my statement. This. THIS is what I mean and why I have concerns for it. While I admire the world building in the original aspects of the game, like the dataworld, sleeping worlds, possibly ALTERNATE worlds, though I'm most intrigued in those, there just isn't enough worldbuilding in the DISNEY worlds. It makes the world of KH so small because of the amuont of areas the ACTUAL story takes place, while the Disney worlds are reduced to ridiculous retellings of their movies rather than interest. And I'm talking about worlds AFTER KH2. There were so many...interesting concepts in 2. Like how EXACTLY did Pete summon the door traveling back in time? That would be an interesting thing to touch upon (given how Time Travel was obnoxiously touched on this game) but instead that very thing hasn't been brought up again. And nothing involving the datascape in the Grid/Space Paranoid hasn't been touched upon outside of Space Paranoids. Also Disney villains have been killed off faster than the potential they had outside of their world. I'm not saying like...another villain council but maybe some sort of teamup or alliance with a few original charcters rather than a mediocre TINY interaction. Disney villains know about the outside world. Hook & Hades especially due to their alliance with Maleficent. They could use the outside world or what they've learned for their own gane rather than just useless restriction and retellings. The Disney aspect is vast. It just hasn't been touched onto enough. And my fear is that it'll never will because of Disney killing off their own magic. That's why I say I don't sense much of a crossover. Yes the game is 85% Disney...but it's just there. That 85% in KH3 doesn't contribute to anything on the storytelling side. And that's the same after 1 and a TINY fraction of 2.
 
Joined
Apr 27, 2018
Messages
200
Awards
0
Location
Republic of London
This is a topic particularly close to my heart when it comes to KH, and I won't mince words here, the entire series reeks of missed potential, however KH3 manages to up this by just not even including series staples.

It's the biggest game in the franchise yet feels so utterly small. There is nothing in KH3 that gives off the feeling of something larger than what's already there. This is something that I feel KH1 did the best, but I also think KH2 did a lot to compound on 1's foundations.

KH1 gives off the feeling of a huge mysterious world to discover, but it can feel a little bit lonely at times. I think KH2 invokes that same feeling, but this time we see Sora's relationships throughout many different worlds, mostly returning, and it gives the sense that this is a place that is lived in, that these characters have lives outside of when the protagonist is there.

KH3 may have Sora having a flashback of Elsa and Anna, but nothing that happens in the game tells me that these characters had any effect on each other.

It's small moments like Belle elbowing Xaldin or Jack Sparrow taking the Keyblade that builds a world, character interactions is the name of the game here. It's the most basic stuff to do and it's wholly absent.

I could probably write a whole essay but I suppose I'll save that for another day.
 

SweetYetSalty

Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2018
Messages
99
Awards
0
Age
29
I feel I might've been too broad in my statement. This. THIS is what I mean and why I have concerns for it. While I admire the world building in the original aspects of the game, like the dataworld, sleeping worlds, possibly ALTERNATE worlds, though I'm most intrigued in those, there just isn't enough worldbuilding in the DISNEY worlds. It makes the world of KH so small because of the amuont of areas the ACTUAL story takes place, while the Disney worlds are reduced to ridiculous retellings of their movies rather than interest. And I'm talking about worlds AFTER KH2. There were so many...interesting concepts in 2. Like how EXACTLY did Pete summon the door traveling back in time? That would be an interesting thing to touch upon (given how Time Travel was obnoxiously touched on this game) but instead that very thing hasn't been brought up again. And nothing involving the datascape in the Grid/Space Paranoid hasn't been touched upon outside of Space Paranoids. Also Disney villains have been killed off faster than the potential they had outside of their world. I'm not saying like...another villain council but maybe some sort of teamup or alliance with a few original charcters rather than a mediocre TINY interaction. Disney villains know about the outside world. Hook & Hades especially due to their alliance with Maleficent. They could use the outside world or what they've learned for their own gane rather than just useless restriction and retellings. The Disney aspect is vast. It just hasn't been touched onto enough. And my fear is that it'll never will because of Disney killing off their own magic. That's why I say I don't sense much of a crossover. Yes the game is 85% Disney...but it's just there. That 85% in KH3 doesn't contribute to anything on the storytelling side. And that's the same after 1 and a TINY fraction of 2.
I always preferred how Pete Time Travel's compared to the others. It was simple and I love the use of the Timeless River and doors. I love Kingdom Hearts to tears, but I have always said it was a badly told story. They are clearly just making the stuff up as they go along. Why not use time traveling doors like Pete did in DDD? Probably because they didn't remember using it in the first place, lol. Clearly they didn't think that part fully through.

Edit: It would be great if Disney Castle World characters could summon time doors. Thus giving characters like Pete more of a role. Maybe even have him and Maleficent co-op with Young Xehanort for a bit because of their abilities.
 

drew0512

Active member
Joined
Jan 16, 2017
Messages
210
Awards
0
Age
25
Location
Rome
It's small moments like Belle elbowing Xaldin or Jack Sparrow taking the Keyblade that builds a world, character interactions is the name of the game here. It's the most basic stuff to do and it's wholly absent.
I guess I'm missing the point here since in KH3 you have SGD and Woody and Buzz/Mike and Sulley/BH6 cast confronting OG villains. "Wholly absent" seems rather out of place here.
 

Oracle Spockanort

the only villain on staff
Staff member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
32,261
Awards
54
Age
27
Location
California
Website
twitter.com
  • Put That Thing Back Where It Came From
  • 15th Anniversary
  • Just Short of the Mark
  • Advanced Chain of Memories
  • Beauty Within
  • No Name
I guess I'm missing the point here since in KH3 you have SGD and Woody and Buzz/Mike and Sulley/BH6 cast confronting OG villains. "Wholly absent" seems rather out of place here.
Those were the best moments of the game, but it was only in those three instances. There is none of that in other worlds. The villains stay manipulators in the background or separate from the villains of those worlds.

Also with the BH6 crew dealing with Riku...well...it’s still rather hollow in the end, isn’t it? They never really learn about Sora’s connection to Riku or really engage with him because Riku is too busy taunting Sora.

Even like Sulley tossing Vanitas or Woody telling Xehanort off isn’t as engaging because at the end of the day, these characters never actually fight the villains. They never have considerably long interactions with the Organization members. They get their crowning moment in a cutscene and that’s it.

It’s all passive engagement except in the one off time it isn’t.
 

drew0512

Active member
Joined
Jan 16, 2017
Messages
210
Awards
0
Age
25
Location
Rome
Those were the best moments of the game, but it was only in those three instances. There is none of that in other worlds. The villains stay manipulators in the background or separate from the villains of those worlds.

Also with the BH6 crew dealing with Riku...well...it’s still rather hollow in the end, isn’t it? They never really learn about Sora’s connection to Riku or really engage with him because Riku is too busy taunting Sora.

Even like Sulley tossing Vanitas or Woody telling Xehanort off isn’t as engaging because at the end of the day, these characters never actually fight the villains. They never have considerably long interactions with the Organization members. They get their crowning moment in a cutscene and that’s it.

It’s all passive engagement except in the one off time it isn’t.
Well, that's my point. Regardless of what we think of those moments, they are in the game. Mentioning the moment with Belle and Xaldin (which isn't exactly much different and subjectively a lot more forgettable) while glossing over similar moments in KH3 and saying that they are "wholly absent" means that we are not giving credit to the game, which is something that happens way too often in my opinion.
 

U.N. Owen

Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2015
Messages
173
Awards
0
My problem is really just how passive the engagement is. In the original KH, we have Maleficent and her council messing with worlds and gathering princesses only to be revealed to be the pawn of the Heartless themselves. The Disney characters felt like they had some stake in their own story: Beast wanted to retrieve Belle, the villains were Disney villains in their respective worlds so their roles were personal compared to Sulley chucking Vanitas through three doors.
 

Face My Fears

She's not an "it"!
Joined
Apr 9, 2007
Messages
3,246
Awards
0
I just feel like KH3 got some things right (NPCs visible and Disney characters actually interacting with main villains), but then got some other things wrong (story pacing, world building).

Somehow I feel like Disney is responsible for having the engagement so limited. Donald has never been so over-protective about the world order as seen in KH3, when world order seems to have been thrown into the trash minus the Disney worlds. So Disney might be OK with Sulley throwing Vanitas into doors, but he just cannot know who Vanitas is or what is going on outside his world. The Disney worlds in KH3 were fun, but there are the little moments that are missing -- Sora asking about Rapunzel's hair, Woody and Buzz wondering whether the keyblade was "sold separately" from Sora, Sora mixing up Monstropolis with Halloween Town, Hiro wanting to run tests on the keyblade, Sora talking to Elsa more than once.

I think KH needs to go the Final Fantasy/Pokemon route to help building worlds. Have NPCs in all the worlds that say stuff that add depth, so that way you can get more of the Disney world story and maybe add some KH original lore in there. People around Corona could talk about the story of the missing princess and the flower. Mother Gothel (as NPC) could mention that the keyblade "looks familiar" (alluding to her having seen other keyblade wielders before). I feel like keeping the cutscenes succinct is a good idea, but don't throw all the other information away. Have people around that will fill in some blanks. People in The Caribbean could have said stuff to Sora like "I remember you when the monsters were here last time" or "Did you change your clothes?" or "What chest did you find that weapon in?". You know, something to at least feel like that world acknowledges Sora's existence, but also little tidbits that help make the greater plot feel like it at least affects the worlds. I never understood why during the "destruction of worlds" in all of the numbered games, we don't see any fall out in the Disney worlds. No dark skies, no shaking ground... nothing. That would ADD to the emotion in the last battle, if we felt like those worlds that we spent time saving are at risk because of Ansem/Xemnas/Xehanort.
 

LostArtist

Active member
Joined
Nov 15, 2016
Messages
462
Awards
0
In terms of world building within the disney worlds, I appreciate post world commentary from party members, like herc being amazed at sora for beating rock titan, etc. But they aren't enough.

Worlds still feel empty despite the increase of npc's. The npc's only inhabit a few rooms. They could've and should've went all out within the disney worlds.

-Like in Corona, there could've been guards scattered all over the forest areas(maybe as enemies?), or even ruffians wandering around the forrest since the pub isn't there. (I'm still salty about the lack of the pub). During the post story game maybe they could have allowed us to access places like the pub? or inside the tower since it's already modeled, or the castle?

-In Olympus, they could've had gods all over the realm of gods (smh at that trailer that showed two gods, that whole snippet is literally the only time they appear). Like maybe change that cutscene so that there are plenty of gods chained up instead of just two, then in the post story world, since they are now free, they are scattered all over the realm of gods and they would have all sorts of post world challenges/hercules bosses to beat.

-In arendelle they could have had real wolves as enemies like in the movie, to make it feel more alive (heartless flying wolves don't count). They could've had struggling ice worker npc's saying stuff like 'our ice business is failing because of elsa' idk. After the end of that world, Elsa thaws the town, giving you access to it after the story and when you revisit the ice business guys, they're like back in business getting ice, since the town is thawed. Idk. They ask you to bring the ice they've cut down to the town/ or the town people ask you to go up the mountain for some ice? idk

-They could've had toy npc's in the toy stores, (not enemies), like barbie esque figures/action figures, kinda like in al's barn in toy story 2, also zurg wya tho. Idk there's so much they could've done.

In terms of disney being more integrated into the story and interconnected with other disney characters, I have low hopes :/.
I hope if sora enters the wreck it ralph world, they acknowledge eachother, kinda like mushu in kh2 acknowledging he was a summon lmao.
 

Chaser

KHI Site Staff
Staff member
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
21,972
Awards
48
Location
Australia
  • Completionist
  • NieR: Automata
  • Beauty Within
  • Keyblade Champion
  • Taciturn Stalwart
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
Kingdom Hearts was billed as “you never know who you will run into next,” which was great because it was an understanding that two completely conflicting IPs would be merging and you had no idea who would turn up.

Unfortunately the reality of that game was all Final Fantasy characters were in one world, with the exclusion of one who was integrated into a Disney world.

And it’s the one Disney world that has been the home of four different Final Fantasy characters (two who did jump ship to an original world), which was exciting.

Disney and Square Enix really needed to reach an agreement on letting Final Fantasy characters into their IPs. Fans have come up with exciting crossovers, like Balthier, Fran, and/or Zidane in Peter Pan or Treasure Planet, Lightning, who is a champion of the Gods, being in Olympus, or Kefka in a Dumbo / Pinocchio world.

Nomura has claimed that because of the various Final Fantasy crossover games that it isn’t necessary for Kingdom Hearts to host that kind of crossover, but I strongly disagree. Kingdom Hearts offers something unique compared to those, especially since these characters aren’t lifted one for one from their original games, and could make a deeper interaction between both Square Enix and Disney.

Both parties just need to ease up and be a bit more lenient with how their IPs are treated. I watched the cutscenes from Monsters Inc, Pirates, and Big Hero 6 because I forgot the plots of those worlds and it made sense to me why they were so forgettable. Nothing happens. Sora meanders around for a while doing nothing until he is forced into action at the end fo the world. Monsters Inc dedicated a lot of time to making Boo laugh various times. Pirates was a tutorial until you collect the 300-500 crabs and then you’re on a rush to the boss fight, and Big Hero 6 is over within an hour with the only connection to the overall plot being data bloxs somehow being around in that world.

If Disney and Square Enix could just work out and trust that a new story, or enhancements to the stories, would work by re-writing and inserting Final Fantasy characters then I’d be happy. But alas, I am left feeling empty and hollow because it’s ultimately a waste of everyone’s time.
 

disney233

Active member
Joined
Jan 3, 2015
Messages
544
Awards
0
Age
21
Kingdom Hearts was billed as “you never know who you will run into next,” which was great because it was an understanding that two completely conflicting IPs would be merging and you had no idea who would turn up.

Unfortunately the reality of that game was all Final Fantasy characters were in one world, with the exclusion of one who was integrated into a Disney world.

And it’s the one Disney world that has been the home of four different Final Fantasy characters (two who did jump ship to an original world), which was exciting.

Disney and Square Enix really needed to reach an agreement on letting Final Fantasy characters into their IPs. Fans have come up with exciting crossovers, like Balthier, Fran, and/or Zidane in Peter Pan or Treasure Planet, Lightning, who is a champion of the Gods, being in Olympus, or Kefka in a Dumbo / Pinocchio world.

Nomura has claimed that because of the various Final Fantasy crossover games that it isn’t necessary for Kingdom Hearts to host that kind of crossover, but I strongly disagree. Kingdom Hearts offers something unique compared to those, especially since these characters aren’t lifted one for one from their original games, and could make a deeper interaction between both Square Enix and Disney.

Both parties just need to ease up and be a bit more lenient with how their IPs are treated. I watched the cutscenes from Monsters Inc, Pirates, and Big Hero 6 because I forgot the plots of those worlds and it made sense to me why they were so forgettable. Nothing happens. Sora meanders around for a while doing nothing until he is forced into action at the end fo the world. Monsters Inc dedicated a lot of time to making Boo laugh various times. Pirates was a tutorial until you collect the 300-500 crabs and then you’re on a rush to the boss fight, and Big Hero 6 is over within an hour with the only connection to the overall plot being data bloxs somehow being around in that world.

If Disney and Square Enix could just work out and trust that a new story, or enhancements to the stories, would work by re-writing and inserting Final Fantasy characters then I’d be happy. But alas, I am left feeling empty and hollow because it’s ultimately a waste of everyone’s time.
Which is why it's hard for me to see ANY aspect of Final Fantasy OR Disney. The gameplay is so stylized that it's shown to be nothing more than a facade or bait to cover up the NOTHING that goes on in just about every Disney world. When I first played Corona, I was just...EXCITED upon seeing the village. I was also hoping to see some things in Corona like "At Last I've Seen the Light" since Disney decided to shoe-horn SO much effort on Let it Go. But the Kingdom was too small, missed opportunity, and just disappointment plotwise. As everyone can clearly see the contradiction between the movie and the game. It's hard for me to be excited about what comes next...if THIS is what the outcome of KH3 was. And that goes with Square & Disney's restrictions all around destroying what could've been the more memorable Kingdom Hearts game of the series.
 

Chaser

KHI Site Staff
Staff member
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
21,972
Awards
48
Location
Australia
  • Completionist
  • NieR: Automata
  • Beauty Within
  • Keyblade Champion
  • Taciturn Stalwart
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
Which is why it's hard for me to see ANY aspect of Final Fantasy OR Disney. The gameplay is so stylized that it's shown to be nothing more than a facade or bait to cover up the NOTHING that goes on in just about every Disney world. When I first played Corona, I was just...EXCITED upon seeing the village. I was also hoping to see some things in Corona like "At Last I've Seen the Light" since Disney decided to shoe-horn SO much effort on Let it Go. But the Kingdom was too small, missed opportunity, and just disappointment plotwise. As everyone can clearly see the contradiction between the movie and the game. It's hard for me to be excited about what comes next...if THIS is what the outcome of KH3 was. And that goes with Square & Disney's restrictions all around destroying what could've been the more memorable Kingdom Hearts game of the series.
The Kingdom was so pretty and stylised. I agree, I would have loved to have seen and explored more from Corona. It’s not like it’s hard to get Clancy Brown to voice a character, either.

Kingdom Hearts has just been really disappointing and it’s clear that the way for it to stop being disappointing is if both properties loosened the reigns a bit and had some fun but they won’t and we’re stuck with Disney worlds that ultimately mean nothing and main story shoved into a 3-4 hour block.

Before KH3 released, I really thought it’d be awesome that we’d be collecting guardians of light in the middle of disney world hopping, and that we’d go to a world and someone like Aqua would be there and we’d join them for a story that taught everyone a lesson and tied into and progressed the overarching story but alas, That did not happen.
 

LostArtist

Active member
Joined
Nov 15, 2016
Messages
462
Awards
0
Disney and Square Enix really needed to reach an agreement on letting Final Fantasy characters into their IPs. Fans have come up with exciting crossovers, like Balthier, Fran, and/or Zidane in Peter Pan or Treasure Planet, Lightning, who is a champion of the Gods, being in Olympus, or Kefka in a Dumbo / Pinocchio world.
That would totally work in both their favors too, as it would potentially get people from one fanbase more interested in the other and vice versa. And people who are fans of both could be super excited about how well the two worlds/stories/characters fit together. Damn they need to do something like this
 

Veevee

Active member
Joined
Aug 1, 2017
Messages
736
Awards
8
Location
darkness within darkness
  • Red Travels the Farthest
  • Savage Nymph
  • The Gambler of Fate
  • 15th Anniversary
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5+2.5 ReMIX
  • Unicornis Union
The Kingdom was so pretty and stylised. I agree, I would have loved to have seen and explored more from Corona. It’s not like it’s hard to get Clancy Brown to voice a character, either.

Kingdom Hearts has just been really disappointing and it’s clear that the way for it to stop being disappointing is if both properties loosened the reigns a bit and had some fun but they won’t and we’re stuck with Disney worlds that ultimately mean nothing and main story shoved into a 3-4 hour block.

Before KH3 released, I really thought it’d be awesome that we’d be collecting guardians of light in the middle of disney world hopping, and that we’d go to a world and someone like Aqua would be there and we’d join them for a story that taught everyone a lesson and tied into and progressed the overarching story but alas, That did not happen.
Yeah, there was this beautiful time where the fandom speculated which organisation member would fit in which world and in the end, it was totally pointless because the choices felt random overall. Larxene creating an ice castle - how? Why? It would've been much more intriguing if the Orga actually had something to do with the Disney world on a contextual basis because the way it turned out was that you can basically swap nearly every member in every world since they don't add anything specific to the plot. Marluxia can put people to sleep? Larxene creates ice castles? Vanitas lives off scream power? Yeah, whatever, those people have never shown something like that before, so they've just been assigned that ability because it was needed for the plot - basically it could've been everyone else and it wouldn't have made a difference.

What annoys me most is that worldbuilding in KH has gone from being told by citizens of the respective worlds or being *le gasp* actually SHOWN instead of told, we are now being spoon-fed everything via Word of God, respectively the Ultimanias and such. Plus, we are just expected to accept these things without any proof or disproof because that's what we need to go on. People are actually all from another timeline? "hey, there hasn't been a single hint for that, but you also can't disprove that!"; basically everyone gets revived, so death has NO meaning anymore? - "heeeey, wait for the next game to see how I rewrote the Foretellers into the plot"; Roxas just warps onto the battlefield, Xion gets out of Sora somehow, Axel's keyblade breaks and is magically fixed in the next instance, Sora already can abuse a power he has learned like five minutes before to mess up the complete life and death circle? Yeah, why not. The pieces of the plot feel so disconnected from each other.

Nothing of that is shown or explained in-game and KH today is basically waiting for the next interview to come out, so Nomura can actually explain his wonky story with more wonky stories. I'd prefer things to be simpler, but explained IN-GAME instead of playing, understanding nothing and waiting for someone to give me a lecture about what I've just seen.

A lot of friends (including me) have recently (after playing KH3) said to me: KH has become so confusing, illogical and weird that the only thought they had while playing the game was "that doesn't make any sense ... well, whatever, just enjoying the ride" - there's nothing wrong with enjoying the ride per se, but enjoying the ride because there's no apparent depth to the plot since you don't understand what's even going on is different from enjoying the ride as a whole. I feel KH should go back to simpler, emotional, but self-contained storytelling because that's where it was good. Yeah, it's famous for being complicated, but it being complicated was never what made it going in the first place, it was gripping character moments and emotions.
 

Neo_GFX

Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2015
Messages
593
Awards
0
Location
Cleveland, OH
You're right: if they didn't have to worry about "world order" and keeping the Disney characters separate, this could be a living, breathing universe and KH would be bigger than it currently is; alas, KH at its core is "pay $60 to play through some of your favorite Disney films", and some people happen to enjoy the story Nomura has to tell as well. I don't know if he had to tell a story, but he had to come up with something to string Square and Disney together.

I could probably write a whole essay but I suppose I'll save that for another day.
I would like to read that lol; your post was great.
 

dianted

Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2017
Messages
38
Awards
0
Age
23
KH2 was a struggle, but KH3 was disappointing because I feel it had more to offer. The lack of Final Fantasy and consequences in Disney worlds make the game feel flat.

If SDG were the ones who were tasked with taking Rapunzel to the Kingdom and Flynn was integrated in a completely different manner, SDG would have more stakes in the story and it would feel more personal; if Donald or Goofy were injured and were healed by Rapunzel (or even they were just around to see Flynn being healed), then Rapunzel losing her hair would matter to the audience; if we saw Mother Gothel being awful with Marluxia or something, we'd care more about her death; if SDG helped in killing her (or were there to witness it directly at least) and felt bad about it or talked to Rapunzel and she expressed how she felt, then we'd be more integrated and we'd care more.

There's so many big and little things that could be done with any aspect of the Disney worlds that would bring back Kingdom Hearts' magic, but at this point, it might be too late to hope for it to pop up in the future.
 
Top