Huge question about Roxas the org and Kingdom Hearts

[violent_anger]

think of it this way. even if roxas is a part of sora, how could he weild two keyblades while sora could only weild one?

and let me ask you this, if i geta big wad of clay,a nd shape it to look likea keyblade, would you consider that a real keyblade?

 

[Souretsu Gear]

no because its made by you not by pure light. Of course the you say that kingdom key is the true form of the keyblade but! But there are other true forms of other keyblades. For Example, the kingdom key is the true form of the keyblade because it is found in its form but when you equip another keychain it becomes stronger/weaker and changes its form to another form which is not its true form. However if you change the keychain to another keychain, its because the keyblade changed to another keyblade that has a true form of the keyblade you are using. In other words there are many types of keyblades with their own true form because then it wouldn't be that great if all the keyblades were kingdom keys. Each Keychain represents a world. Oblivion= forgotten; this keyblade came from hollow bastion because it is known as a forgotten world which nobody remembers for it was destroyed partially. Way to dawn; represents the choosing of dawn in the split roads of decision. Kingdom Key; represents a kingdom of light or darkness used for good purposes. Oathkeeper; of course everybody knows this one. So on and so forth that each key represents a world. Just think of a keychainless keyblade accidently turned into a keychain and is portable so you can change forms of keyblades.

 

[violent_anger]

so let me ask you this, the ultima keychain was made, what does that represent?

 

[wtholyf]

Gah sorry I couldn't respond earlier, my internet broke down on me . Anyhow, the kingdom key is not the "pure" form of the keyblade, it still has a keychain attached to it, the kingdom key is just the first keyblade that Sora summons. Sora started off with the kingdom Key because of some connection with his heart. The reason this is true, is because when Riku summons the keyblade, he recieves the Soul Eater keychain of the keyblade, this is because of some connection with his heart. Next, Roxas is a very different nobody then the rest, unfortunatly kh2 didn't supply us knowledge with the full extent of how different Roxas is. However, an interesting statement is made by Roxas, "My hear belong's to me." Knowin Nomura, he wouldn't just put that in there for no reason, there is definitly some mystery behind the keyblade. Next, Roxas' keyblades DO come back to him like Sora's. In the beginning of the game, when Roxas throws down his keyblade, he comes right back to him. He posses the same powers as Sora, in memory skyscraper, he was just surprised that Sora called it back because he thought he had already won. The fact is this argument is mostly based on assumptions, no one here should talk down to anyone or act arrogant. Next my assumption would be that the Ultima keyblade is a keyblade that is a little bit of every world, this is because you must gather materials from other worlds to make it. As far as I can tell, Roxas' keyblades are not fake, it's not like there is only one of each keychain. Mickey also posses the kingdom keychain. It seems as though it is very possible that Roxas has some sort of a heart, he can feel sadness you know. Infact, unlike the other nobodies, Roxas DOES feel sadness, Roxas is sad about the whole thing with Haynar, Roxas is made when he finds out about the truth (when he beats up the computer). Hmm then again Axel was became angry at Roxas, seems like kh2 has some contradictions. But the main point is, Roxas posses many traits that other nobodies don't have. The line "My heart belongs to me" truly befuddles me. As for the Org, remember Roxas was with the Org for about a year before he decided to leave. KH2 truly didn't answer as many questions about the keyblade as hoped, merely, it created more questions about the keyblade.

 

[HeartofTwilight]

hmmm.... I still think that it is interestiong that the org refers to him and the discovery key seeing as no other member is named for thier whepons. One thing is, if the org had starteed to use Roxas as a key, or even hinted to Roxas that he was important in that regard, the whole flashback with axel doesn't reeally make much sense. when Roxas is leaving he says "No on will miss me" if he was the key to kingdom hearts clearly they all would miss him... I really don't know,m my comments are mearly food for thought

 

[wtholyf]

HeartofTwilight that's what I'm saying, why didn't they use Roxas? it didn't make sense at all, Marluxia was trying to get Sora's Keyblade to do the very thing that Roxas could have done

 

[violent_anger]

im not gonan bothewr reading your long post, so ill just answer your recent one. roxas has fake ekyblades, that is why he wouldnt have been able to release hearts. and as for marluxia, we cant be sure roxas would have joined him.

 

[wtholyf]

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT. If you're not gonna read my post, then you won't know what I'm saying, man violent_anger, I hate having to deal with you. You always act this way! Listen up, you can't just say they are fake, Roxas shows emotions, The Keyblade comes back to Roxas when he throws it away, Roxas said he hart belongs to himself! Pfft. Why should I even respond to you if you don't take the time to respond to me

 

[RikuHeroOfDark]

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT. If you're not gonna read my post, then you won't know what I'm saying, man violent_anger, I hate having to deal with you. You always act this way! Listen up, you can't just say they are fake, Roxas shows emotions, The Keyblade comes back to Roxas when he throws it away, Roxas said he hart belongs to himself! Pfft. Why should I even respond to you if you don't take the time to respond to me

OMG LIEK HE THWOO ZE KEYBADE ANZ IT CAME BAKK TO ZIM

you do realize that that kingdom key was completely fake, it was a computer simulus by DiZ so before you try to challenge some one get your facts straight......good day............life lesson #1

 

[Darkstar]

Hmm. I just rejoined the forums; I haven't been around since the fancraze that followed KH1. I haven't had time to post in the New Members Area, to add an avatar or a signature, or to post up any of my personal theories, but....I felt that this topic needed a little help. So...*KA-POOF*....here I am.

Ok. As far as I can tell, none of your conjecture about Roxas's keyblades being "shells" or "fakes" has answered the original question asked. Just to refresh all of your memories:

Roxas was a nobody, who just like the rest of the nobodies in the org, who wanted to be real, or to exist. Saix said that each heartless slain by the keyblade adds to kingdom hearts (as long as they collect the hearts). Once kingdom hearts is full of hearts, they can use the power to make themselves "real" (like full beings). Roxas had the power of the keyblade right? Why didn't the org just summon loads of heartless, ask Roxas to kill them, collect the hearts, and repeat the process again.

The answer to this isn't all that complicated. All you have to do is refer back to the last game, and be attentive to the timeline of KH2.

Point 1: Are Roxas's Keyblades Fake?

~ Really, it all comes down to personal opinion. In MY opinon, the answer is no, simply because I see no reason for a fake set of keyblades to be created for Roxas. Does it take a heart to wield the keyblade? Yes, but we know from the Secret Ansem Reports that Roxas and Namine are incredibly special Nobodies, capable of things that Nobodies simply shouldn't be able to do. In the same way that Namine can modify the memories in people's hearts without having a heart herself, Roxas can wield the keyblades without having a true heart.

Point 2: WHY is Roxas fighting Heartless in Deep-Dive?

~ When you think about it, Roxas fighting Heartless in DD most likely has little to do with adding captive hearts to Kingdom Hearts. As we learn in KH2, the Nobodies and Heartless have become enemies due to their allegiences to Xemnas and Maleficent. This most likely occurred while Sora was sleeping. As such, an obvious goal of the Heartless would be to take over Organization XIII's base of operations. What Roxas is doing in Deep Dive isn't part of the Org.'s master plan; he is simply clearing out invading Heartless.

Point 3: Why can't Roxas massacre the Heartless whenever he wants?

The main reason for this is because Organization XIII could not summon Heartless back when Roxas was a member. But that will be explained in the next point.

It was mentioned that Sora was able to fill up Kingdom Hearts in a short amount of time. How was this possible? You see, Sora was able to fill power Kingdom Hearts because the Heartless hunt him relentlessly. As mentioned in the previous game, the Heartless have great fear of the keyblade and seek to destroy its users. With so many Heartless coming at him constantly, it was easy to kill a lot of them.

Ok, soooo.....Roxas has the keyblade, right? Why don't Heartless track him down? Well, the reason behind this can be traced to a cutscene from the beginning of KH1. Sora is sitting in a hotel room with Leon and Yuffie, and notices his keyblade sitting across the room. Yuffie explained to Sora that they had to get the keyblade away from him to shake off the Heartless. Whenever the keyblade is in contact with Sora, the Heartless can sense Sora's heart.

And there you have it. The Heartless DON'T hunt down Roxas because he DOESN'T have a heart.

Final Point: Why can't Organization XIII summon Heartless for Roxas to kill?

This one is probably the easiest to explain. Xemnas DID NOT have control over the Heartless back when Roxas was still a member of the Organization.

To quote Xemnas himself, "...the Heartless ally with whoever is strongest."

Organization XIII did not gain control over the Heartless until the cutscene after the 1,000 Heartless Battle, when they proved that they were stronger than Maleficent. Afterwards, the Heartless realized that their leader was weak, and allied with the Org. By the end of the game, Maleficent and Pete had so little control over the Heartless that they had to resort to fighting them in The World That Never Was.

.........

Whew....I hope that explains things well enough. Anyone have any questions, comments, or disagreements?

 

[violent_anger]

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT. If you're not gonna read my post, then you won't know what I'm saying, man violent_anger, I hate having to deal with you. You always act this way! Listen up, you can't just say they are fake, Roxas shows emotions, The Keyblade comes back to Roxas when he throws it away, Roxas said he hart belongs to himself! Pfft. Why should I even respond to you if you don't take the time to respond to me

did you ever play the game? im going to assume that you did. if you searched through that "brain" you would recall xaldin summoning his spears. as for the kingdom key, just as was said before, that was due to the computer program

 

[HeartofTwilight]

I'm not going to quote darkstar and take up space, but the point made was an exellent one. Good job of explaining why, whether or not the keyblades are real, Xemnas couldn't use Roxas like he could use Sora.

About Marluxia, getting Soras keyblade would be the best form of ruinning there plan.

About the Keyblades, just beacuse his keyblades may not have been two of the true keyblades (dark, light, in-betwen) whose to say it doen't have the power to unlock hearts so that they gather in Kingdom hearts. Nothing at all is to say they don't? I think that makes a lot of sense.

 

[wtholyf]

Violent anger don't be so arrogant, as we see for Roxas, the keyblade returns to him even when he throws it down. It returns on its own accord. The keybldes werent computer programs afte rhe left Diz's world

 

[violent_anger]

he never left dizs world, he was in it the whole time, the only time he wasnt in it was in deep dive, where he used strike raid. unless you can refer to a certain cutscene where that happened