Heartless and Xemnas theory



REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS

yamibakura

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2014
Messages
167
Location
Shadow Realm
When a persons heart is consumed by darkness he becomes a heartless.But we r shown that heartless already existed in the realm of darkness.How were they created considering that noone lives to lise his heart?Is it possible that heartlesses are mainfestations of darkness and each time some1 in the RoL loses his heart a portal opens so that the heartless can move from one realm to another?
But how did ansem SOD get created then?Could he be in the REALM of darkness b4 and when xehanort lose his heart come from there?And then again ,was he really a heartless?In the xehanorts reports he never said anything about turning into one.He just discarded his body leaving him a wandering heart but he didnt techically become a heartless.He abandoned his physical apperance to travel through time.
And i strongly believe that a nobody does not neccessary require that his original persona loses his heart.If his body vanished maybe the soul and mind that inhabited it acted on their own just because it was xehanort and he is crazy and never quits.Or maybe is it posssible that xehanort xehanorted himself.First he seperated a piece from his heart and let it inside his body and then he casts away the body and trancends to and existence of only the heart.The body holds terras heart and eraqus but also a portion of the already dominant xehanort allowing it to live and breathe.That means xemnas was never a nobody but he was from the beggining a new xehanort.
And this is possible considering that xehanort can indeed manipulate pieces of his heart.
 

Gram

Banned
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
15,616
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • Master of Monologues
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5 ReMIX
  • Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance
  • Keyblade Master
Keep in mind that even if Ansem's nature as a heartless is uncertain it is still a fact that he under went that heartless process that formed him into what he was.
The experiment that changed all the apprentices, even Xehanort, was indeed one to form heartless. That much is certain.

It's the after affect that's odd as stated by Ansem himself:
Ansem Report 12 said:
I have transcended to an existence of only the heart. I should have come back as a Heartless, but there is no sign of such a transformation.

My body has surely perished. However, I am different from the other Heartless, keeping the memories of before, and I have not taken on the form of a Heartless. It is clear that there are still many things to be studied.

In order to cross over to the dark side, which is not this world, you must go beyond the door of Kingdom Hearts, the place connected to the world's heart.

The innermost part connected to the world's heart, the place connecting to the world of darkness. (I will record the details in another report...)

There are still so many unknown worlds.

The present world.
The world of darkness.
The world of light.

And,
The world in-between.

Where does the true paradise lie, I wonder?
Ansem didn't expect to come back as he did showing even he doesn't quite understand. In the end though what formed Ansem was the "experiment" depicted in the opening of DDD, Ansem the "heartless" was born that day as was Xemnas.

The DDD glossary states clearly how nobodies are formed as well:

Nobodies

If a strong-hearted person loses or is robbed of that heart, their body and spirit can live on as a Nobody.

Nobodies have no hearts, by they retain their human memories, which served as a reservoir from which to draw human emotion.

Unlike Heartless, Nobodies are hierarchical and choose to be subject to the Organization's leadership.
It mentions "loses" or "robbed". Granted this doesn't say it's always a heartless it's just that the only known cases we have of nobodies are from heartless formations.

The exact mechanics aren't known though but given they are said to be born from "lost" or "stolen" hearts implies nobodies themselves only form when the heart is lost unintentionally.
Or rather that a nobody is born when that hearts will to carry on forms the nobody as it leaves the body.

Xehanort on the other hand clearly and willingly became what he did. Key point being "Xehanort" was willing. Terra and Eraqus on the other hand may have not been willing.

Regardless of the unknowns though Xemnas is definitely a nobody, he was born as nobodies are born. (from a discard body+soul)
However that doesn't mean he was born truly lacking a heart. It's a theory I've seen from time to time and honestly I think your right when you mention Xehanort leaving a part of his heart behind to ensure he maintains control of the newly formed Xemnas.

It's like Roxas' case. Roxas was born as Sora's nobody, this goes without question, however Ventus' heart was also sleeping within him the entire time.
Xemnas could very well be similar to Roxas with a part of Xehanort's heart sleeping within him and guiding his actions.

Back on Ansem though he is honestly an unknown. Everyone from Nomura to several in-game characters call him a heartless but he behaves nothing like one and Young Xehanort himself refers to Ansem as "Xehanort reduced to just a heart".

We're not sure what Ansem is but we do know he underwent the process of the heartless were a heart was lost and a nobody was formed due to strength of said heart.
I'd say the best bet to answer your question lies in Ansem's make-up. Terra, Eraqus, and MX all played a part in Ansem's formation meaning he had three hearts of influence rather than the traditional one.
It's possible Xehanort's presence managed to maintain itself as Terra and Eraqus' was lost in the transformation. It was Terra's body and heart after all, MX was just riding piggyback, so it's likely the heart that was "lost" was Terra rather than all three.

Regardless of the case I do think Ansem achieved a type of heartless form. There was something dark inside that robe he was wearing after all.
Ansem is like Namine. He's referred to as a specific species but has none of it's characteristics but the process that birthed him.
 
Last edited:

yamibakura

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2014
Messages
167
Location
Shadow Realm
i agree with waht u say but in ansems and namines case everything is different.How did xehanrot know that he would survive this process in first place?How was he sure that he wouldnt became merely a shadow?
Thats because ansem could be a different species.Xehanort said that he abandoned his body not his heart meaning that the heart remained untouched through this process.And considering the fact that he maintained his selfhood there is no way he was a common heartless as he was a heart himslef.Also Scar was a similar case as he talked through the battle and looke identical to b4.
Moreover namine is an example of an exception She was not a born like other nobodies so why call her one?She didnt even have kairis body neither soras and coexisted with her.U cant call her a nobody in the traditional sense.
Another question is if ansem after possessing riku was a heartless at all?He had a truly human body so why was he a heartless?He was an actual reincarnation considering that in KH1 journal pages it is not said that ansem turned into a heartless but that he abandoned his physical presence.
 

Gram

Banned
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
15,616
  • You've Got A Friend In Me
  • Master of Monologues
  • Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5 ReMIX
  • Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance
  • Keyblade Master
i agree with waht u say but in ansems and namines case everything is different.How did xehanrot know that he would survive this process in first place?How was he sure that he wouldnt became merely a shadow?
It's like your didn't read my post at all. D=

I posted a part of Ansems reports from KH1 were he says clearly that he "should've" came back a heartless. The fact that he said should shows he wasn't expecting what happened. He fully thought he'd return as some mindless heartless however he didn't.


Thats because ansem could be a different species.Xehanort said that he abandoned his body not his heart meaning that the heart remained untouched through this process.And considering the fact that he maintained his selfhood there is no way he was a common heartless as he was a heart himslef.Also Scar was a similar case as he talked through the battle and looke identical to b4.
You don't seem to understand the heartless. No one "abandons" the heart, you can't do such a thing as the heart is the person. What causes a heartless is a heart consumed by darkness.

No ones once told you Ansem was a "common" heartless just that he expected he'd become one but didn't. All that was said is he could be some new sub species type of heartless.

Moreover namine is an example of an exception She was not a born like other nobodies so why call her one?She didnt even have kairis body neither soras and coexisted with her.U cant call her a nobody in the traditional sense.
You've completely missed the point of my entire post. Why Namine and by extension Ansem are referred to as heartless and nobody is because they were born the same way such beings are.
Ansem willing underwent the heartless process and to his surprise came back as something more than that.
Namine was born through the heartless/nobody process as well. As Kairi's heart left Sora's, i.e. a heart leaving a body, Namine was made. Namine was made from a heart leaving a body.
It was also in that same moment that Roxas was born as a nobody that Namine was born as well further showing she was born from the nobody process but is something either new or a sub species.

That's the whole schtik about Ansem and Namine. They behave nothing like a nobody or heartless should but they was born through the processes that make them. This means they could very well be something new or at the same time a sub species of the two.

Another question is if ansem after possessing riku was a heartless at all?He had a truly human body so why was he a heartless?He was an actual reincarnation considering that in KH1 journal pages it is not said that ansem turned into a heartless but that he abandoned his physical presence.
No. Riku never became a heartless. Ansem kicked him out of his body but Riku's heart was never consumed by the darkness. Riku's body was confirmed to be stolen by Ansem by both himself and Nomura and then he later got his body back after Ansem was defeated in KH1.
The only time you see Riku outside his body is a added scene from KH1 final mix. In which he seems to project a human form.

Check again bro. It's not in the KH1 journal but everyone from Nomura, Yen Sid to even Riku calls Ansem a heartless. The very reason we refer to him as a "heartless" is because of those people.
However just like Namine is called a "nobody", it could just be them giving an over simplified term to a being not fully understood.

Ansem being called a heartless and Namine being called a nobody is mostly just because they was born through them processes. What they are exactly and truly isn't known, even Ansem himself wasn't sure what he had become.
 
Last edited:
Top