Film ► Frozen II - November 2019

[Nazo]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

It's not the existence of gay characters that is the issue here. The question is what is the intent behind putting them in. Companies will jump on trends and bandwagons all the time for some press and to boost their view in the public eye. So the question is, when it comes to creating gay characters, are they being added out of a genuine interest in representing and supporting the LGBT community, or is it a business move where the company doing it could care less what topic of controversy they're dealing with but they side with it purely out of self-interest? Is it pro-gay or pro-opportunity? That's what I have a problem with. Exploiting controversy for personal gain.

Now, that being said, Disney has a great track record of being supportive of the LGBT community. So, I'm certain that Disney would do it as a means of support and proper representation, in which case, I wouldn't have an issue with it.

Also, I'm sorry if I've upset any of you. I genuinely apologize if so :frown:

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

It's not the existence of gay characters that is the issue here. The question is what is the intent behind putting them in. Companies will jump on trends and bandwagons all the time for some press and to boost their view in the public eye. So the question is, when it comes to creating gay characters, are they being added out of a genuine interest in representing and supporting the LGBT community, or is it a business move where the company doing it could care less what topic of controversy they're dealing with but they side with it purely out of self-interest? Is it pro-gay or pro-opportunity? That's what I have a problem with. Exploiting controversy for personal gain.

Honestly, does it matter? The companies are free to have ulterior motives for their actions. Companies will always find ways to make money and if that means making the entertainment industry more diverse because it is what people want, then why should we be upset about that?

The people behind writing and creating the characters, stories, and worlds for films and television will have more than enough sincerity to make up for the money-grubbing intentions of the companies they work for. It would be nice to believe companies would also do it because it is the right thing to do, but they will still be profiting from it so in the end does it really matter?

If the intent is genuine, then it will be.

Now, that being said, Disney has a great track record of being supportive of the LGBT community. So, I'm certain that Disney would do it as a means of support and proper representation, in which case, I wouldn't have an issue with it.

=D

Also, I'm sorry if I've upset any of you. I genuinely apologize if so :frown:

You had very good points so don't think anybody is genuinely upset at you. It is more that the more the worry that arguments essentially begin to boil down to companies "pandering" but if they don't start now, when will things change?

How long do people have to wait for it to be a genuine shift?

 

[BlackOsprey]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Honestly, I don't really care who Disney pairs Elsa with as long as it isn't her sister and the relationship isn't shoehorned. (Yeah, straight relationships can be incredibly forced too. Look at... yep, just about any other action movie.)

 

[Elysium]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

My only issue is that this went from "Please don't give Elsa a love interest in the sequel" to "Give Elsa a love interest in the sequel" really quickly.

Yeah, I think the only thing problematic here is not the fact that her love interest could be female, but the fact that she'd be given a love interest at all. One of the things the film was celebrated for was the fact that it had a powerful female character who wasn't evil and who wasn't married by the end of the film. Even Anna's arc with Hans was a critique of the love-at-first-sight trope that animated films (especially Disney) adhere to 9 times out of 10.

 

[Chuman]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Well they sure put me asleep

heyo.

i want to frame this post up on my wall

also @tartarus it depends on the plot of the film. if it was about elsa finding someone like herself and they fell in love and happened to be lesbians, the movie would be as progressive, if not more, than the original.

i agree that making characters one way or another for no reason is dumb, but facts are facts; making a character in disney gay would not be pointless. it would be an unprecedented move and shake up the industry which we could really use.

 

[VoidGear.]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Can you even make a character gay "for a reason"?
It's not like humans in real life "become" gay "for a reason". It just happens. And that's just exactly how it should be treated in the media as well.

 

[Chuman]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Can you even make a character gay "for a reason"?
It's not like humans in real life "become" gay "for a reason". It just happens. And that's just exactly how it should be treated in the media as well.

the only case i can think of is once upon a time. mulan was clearly fauning over aurora and they backpedaled, then recently they force a relationship with two characters who barely knew each other.

i don't care; they forced a dozen straight relationships before it, but that was one that would have been great aaaaaand they fucked it over. i think they just didn't want to make their disney princesses gay, because god forbid young girls think its okay to love whoever they want to.

 

[VoidGear.]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

the only case i can think of is once upon a time. mulan was clearly fauning over aurora and they backpedaled, then recently they force a relationship with two characters who barely knew each other.

i don't care; they forced a dozen straight relationships before it, but that was one that would have been great aaaaaand they diddlyed it over. i think they just didn't want to make their disney princesses gay, because god forbid young girls think its okay to love whoever they want to.

Yeah I mean, you're right. You can force a relationship without making it plausible just in order to have (or even: not have) gay characters. What I mean is just that it's said that people actually try to make up "reasons" why a character is gay instead of just letting them love whoever they love.

 

[Audo]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

while this post is more specifically about male/male relationships in media, it hits a lot of things that get me whenever these sorts of conversations come up and can be applied here, and is something to consider:

“romance is just an easy shorthand for intimacy and trust.” please. please send these easy shorthand gay relationships my way. what universe do you live in that gay people can hook up easily on-screen and the audience reaction is “what a cop-out, they’re just doing it to avoid developing their friendship.”

listen. heterosexual romance is often an easy shorthand for intimacy and trust. this works because there’s an expectation – both on part of the filmmaker and the presumed audience – that heterosexual romance is normal and part of the background radiation of everyday life. and any time someone makes a movie where the male and female leads hook up, without much build-up or development of their relationship, they then strengthen that expectation in a self-perpetuating feedback loop
.
gay romance does not have the same cultural history. the default assumption is that same-sex leads will not hook up unless they live in the gay/lesbian genre. platonic male friendship is, in fact, the easy way out.

it’s absolutely homophobic to say a gay romantic relationship would somehow lessen a bond of friendship. and i mean this in the kindest of ways, because it may not be the same degree of homophobia that leads to gay people being physically attacked, or laws being written to actively restrict people’s rights for the fact of being gay. it’s a low-grade, pervasive homophobia that results when the speaker doesn’t conceptualize gay people as a part of a normal, everyday milieu. that a character being gay has to be narratively justified in some way (as if gay people around the world don’t have to justify their right to exist every single day!); that a gay relationship is somehow “pandering” and “inorganic”, because the normal, natural – straight – audience could never really relate to a gay relationship.

look. we are all shaped by cultural expectations. it doesn’t make someone a bad person if their mental conception of “an intense relationship between two guys” defaults to “friendship” instead of “romance”. but responding to any challenges to that paradigm by extolling the virtues of same-sex friendship and ignoring the long history of gay relationships in media being censored and sanitized and othered? yeah. that’s homophobic.

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[Chuman]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

its funny when two girls are seen kissing and holding hands the media calls thwm gal pals. and by funny i mean diddlyed up.

 

[redcrown]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

I would be more surprised if Elsa ended up with a guy, and I don't even like this movie that much.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Disney: No Princess for Queen Elsa #CharmingPrinceForElsa | CitizenGO

Wow this is getting so reactionary it is depressing.

 

[Audo]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Disney: No Princess for Queen Elsa #CharmingPrinceForElsa | CitizenGO

Wow this is getting so reactionary it is depressing.

gross.

it has 50k sigs.

they list GLAAD as a hate-group against Christians lol

 

[BlackOsprey]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Disney: No Princess for Queen Elsa #CharmingPrinceForElsa | CitizenGO

Wow this is getting so reactionary it is depressing.

And here I was, thinking that the thing that made Frozen different and unique was how it SUBVERTED that "marry Prince Charming = ultimate life goal" garbage. I grew up watching disney films like Cinderella, but I've got more ambitious dreams than finding a hot guy. But hell, what do I know.

 

[Elysium]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

they list GLAAD as a hate-group against Christians lol

Of course they do. Disgusting.

 

[Chuman]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

yo i was about to flame the living fuck out of this guy but he removed his twitter and facebook. i see why, the rest of his petitions are equally vile and evil.

 

[redcrown]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

That entire webpage makes me want to throw up. It's been awhile since I've seen such stupidity.

 

[Ulti]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Christ guys. Just let Elsa be her Single Lady self. She don't need no relationship to be a stable queen. I'd rather see more mainstream say it is entirely okay to be single.

 

[VoidGear.]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Disney: No Princess for Queen Elsa #CharmingPrinceForElsa | CitizenGO

Wow this is getting so reactionary it is depressing.

Oh come on now.
What is this shit and why.

 

[redcrown]

Re: Frozen - Sequel REALLY coming so you never have to "let it go"

Tried to google this and got no results, so maybe I'm just a dumbass and oblivious to the answer, but here's my question:

Why is being homosexual supposedly "against family values"? Since when are they opposite? Just because they can't procreate together? If that's the case, then are people who are against homosexual marriage/romance also against adoption or couples with no children?