Explaining myths about Atheism

[Onasi]

As the title of the thread suggests, this is just a series of the most common misconceptions about atheism being explained away. If this has already been the topic of a previous thread please just leave a link in a comment.

On of the largest misconceptions of theists is that Atheism is a religion. Atheism is not a religion. There is no community of atheists. There is no dogma, holy texts, prophets, ect to atheism.

The second misconception that I often hear is that Atheists believe that there is no God(s). Atheism is not a belief. It's a lack of belief. I am an atheists therefore I lack a belief in God(s). I don't believe that there are no gods.

Another one is that Atheists are Satanists. Personally I believe this stems from the idea that any heretic of a religion is from the devil. This is not the case. There are many faiths that don't require a belief in a God(s). This misconception may also stem from the fact that Anton LaVey, the founder of the Church of Satan, was an atheist. As stated on page 62 of his book The Satanic Bible "Satanists do not accept Satan as an anthropomorphic being...he merely represents a force of nature." This essential means that Satanists (AKA Laveyan Satanists) are mostly atheists who use the terms Satan and God to address forces in nature that they believe aren't explainable.

In other words, they are atheists that use Satan as a mascot not as a deity to be worshiped. When a Laveyan Satanists says "Hail Satan" he is referring to himself.

Another misconception is that Atheists do have a religion and that's Evolution. Evolution isn't a belief system. It's a scientific theory that is believed by theists and atheists alike. The Catholic church as well as other religious institutions have even stated that evolution is accepted as part of God's plan. Many leading evolutionary biologists are actually theists and many are Christians. There is nothing "Atheistic" about Evolution.

The last major misconception, that I have come across, is the idea that Atheists all believe the same thing. This of course is false. The only thing that an atheists shares with all other atheists is the lack in a belief in god(s). Atheists follow various political and philosophical ideologies. Some even believe in ghosts and reincarnation. Atheists aren't the same in the same way Christians/Muslims/Jews/ect aren't all the same. I'm sure you can think of a member of your faith either living or dead that have completely different opinions then you do. The only thing you share in common is your faith.

 

[Monkey]

The second misconception that I often hear is that Atheists believe that there is no God(s). Atheism is not a belief. It's a lack of belief. I am an atheists therefore I lack a belief in God(s). I don't believe that there are no gods.

Either you are arguing language semantics here or you are just wrong. Some atheists can hopefully expand on this.

On of the largest misconceptions of theists is that Atheism is a religion. Atheism is not a religion. There is no community of atheists. There is no dogma, holy texts, prophets, ect to atheism.

There are organized groups of atheists out there that are just as bad as religious extremists. In fact, groups of religious and nonreligious leaders frequently call out militant atheism as they do militant religious organizations.

As for the rest of what you said (prophets, holy book, etc), I don't think that is a common misconception at all. I'd be very interested though in where you've heard people think atheism was actually a faith in itself.

 

[Nyangoro]

On of the largest misconceptions of theists is that Atheism is a religion. Atheism is not a religion. There is no community of atheists. There is no dogma, holy texts, prophets, ect to atheism.

Though atheism itself may not specifically be a religion (at least not as it is commonly thought of), it does fill the "religious" part of a person's belief system/mentality/etc. That's why you hear people refer to it as a religion.

The second misconception that I often hear is that Atheists believe that there is no God(s). Atheism is not a belief. It's a lack of belief. I am an atheists therefore I lack a belief in God(s). I don't believe that there are no gods.

This sounds like needless semantics to me. Lacking a belief in God is tantamount to believing that there is no God.

The last major misconception, that I have come across, is the idea that Atheists all believe the same thing. This of course is false. The only thing that an atheists shares with all other atheists is the lack in a belief in god(s).

And that's the part that all atheists have in common. That's why people say all atheists believe the same thing. It's not really a misconception unless the person speaking tries to broaden out to other parts of a person's mentality.

 

[Orion]

Just throwing some quick things out there that will probably come about as an answer or response to things that will come up later. Don't really have time right now, and it's still early-thread.

Not-playing chess cannot be a hobby.
Not-knitting cannot be a past-time.
Non-belief cannot be a religion.

By having most of their bias, prejudice and dogma removed, it becomes easy for an atheist to become very accepting and open-minded. I don't mean to say open-mindedness doesn't exist in theists - far from it. What I mean is that without any pre-existing framework for one to favour or dislike certain things, they tend to be much more readily accepting of them, rather than possibly having some teaching to overcome to accept it. I tend to always phrase this really badly, my apologies.

Also, "You've got to believe in something." This is crap, really. I believe in plenty of things, I just don't believe in something that I think can't be proven to exist. Lots of theists believe in lots of things aside from what's in their religion, so why is it necessary that the religious belief itself be necessary for a person?

 

[Onasi]

Though atheism itself may not specifically be a religion (at least not as it is commonly thought of), it does fill the "religious" part of a person's belief system/mentality/etc. That's why you hear people refer to it as a religion.



This sounds like needless semantics to me. Lacking a belief in God is tantamount to believing that there is no God.



And that's the part that all atheists have in common. That's why people say all atheists believe the same thing. It's not really a misconception unless the person speaking tries to broaden out to other parts of a person's mentality.

Not necessarily, you can be a member of a religion and still be an atheist. You would be viewed as a member of that religion and they would follow it's ideology.

No, if you believe in something you have faith in an assertion. If you lack a belief in something you have an absence of faith. So no. Believing there is no God(s) is saying you are confident in the idea that there is no God. Lacking a belief in God means you have no reason to believe God(s) exist. They are different.

 

[Nyangoro]

By having most of their bias, prejudice and dogma removed, it becomes easy for an atheist to become very accepting and open-minded. I don't mean to say open-mindedness doesn't exist in theists - far from it. What I mean is that without any pre-existing framework for one to favour or dislike certain things, they tend to be much more readily accepting of them, rather than possibly having some teaching to overcome to accept it. I tend to always phrase this really badly, my apologies.

I understand the point you are trying to make. As you said, both theists and atheists are capable of being accepting and open-minded about various things. However, atheists do have a pre-existing framework. That framework is the fact they do not believe in the concept of a superior, divine deity (be it a being, a force, etc.). A theist will always have the assumption that there is such a thing in the back of their mind. Likewise, an atheist will have the assumption that there is no such a thing.

Also, "You've got to believe in something." This is crap, really. I believe in plenty of things, I just don't believe in something that I think can't be proven to exist. Lots of theists believe in lots of things aside from what's in their religion, so why is it necessary that the religious belief itself be necessary for a person?

For me, when I say religion as a part of a person's mentality, I am referring to their perception/concept of a supernatural deity. Not believing in such a concept fills that part of the mindset. Reason being that it does affect how things are viewed, whether a person actively tries to think about it or not. Religion is a part of a person's belief system, and effects their thoughts or actions regarding various issues.

Not necessarily, you can be a member of a religion and still be an atheist. You would be viewed as a member of that religion and they would follow it's ideology.

See my above comment to Orion's post regarding what I am referring to when it comes to religion. I mean, sure, there are members of a religion who do not actually share that religion's views. However, that just means that the person's religious views were different than said person was professing.

No, if you believe in something you have faith in an assertion. If you lack a belief in something you have an absence of faith. So no. Believing there is no God(s) is saying you are confident in the idea that there is no God. Lacking a belief in God means you have no reason to believe God(s) exist. They are different.

And if you have no reason to believe that God exists, then you must be, to some degree, confident that there is no God. If such a confidence is not there, then you are referring to agnosticism.

 

[Orion]

I understand the point you are trying to make. As you said, both theists and atheists are capable of being accepting and open-minded about various things. However, atheists do have a pre-existing framework. That framework is the fact they do not believe in the concept of a superior, divine deity (be it a being, a force, etc.). A theist will always have the assumption that there is such a thing in the back of their mind. Likewise, an atheist will have the assumption that there is no such a thing.

But then this could also come down to the 'type' of atheistic non-belief. Does someone believe because they personally have not seen evidence for it? Does this person not want to believe because of what things people have done in the name of that religion, or what it teaches? Or do they not believe in it because science has not shown such a thing to exist?
You could say some people are atheist 'just because', but there are others who are atheist because of science never showing a deity to be. A 'science-based' atheist would be willing (though at first definitely skeptical) to accept a deity or religion if science showed them to exist/be true. Sort of like you have someone who is directly atheist, or you have someone who is an atheist as a result of something else. Atheism and... scientism? I'm not totally sure, but I know we don't primarily label or define a sick person based on their symptoms, but upon the illness they are suffering from.
Damn this thing is hard to nail down.

 

[The Conquerer]

The second misconception that I often hear is that Atheists believe that there is no God(s). Atheism is not a belief. It's a lack of belief. I am an atheists therefore I lack a belief in God(s). I don't believe that there are no gods.

That's sounding more like agnosticism; the knowledge or concept of God exists behind human comprehension.

 

[Nyangoro]

But then this could also come down to the 'type' of atheistic non-belief. Does someone believe because they personally have not seen evidence for it? Does this person not want to believe because of what things people have done in the name of that religion, or what it teaches? Or do they not believe in it because science has not shown such a thing to exist?
You could say some people are atheist 'just because', but there are others who are atheist because of science never showing a deity to be. A 'science-based' atheist would be willing (though at first definitely skeptical) to accept a deity or religion if science showed them to exist/be true. Sort of like you have someone who is directly atheist, or you have someone who is an atheist as a result of something else. Atheism and... scientism? I'm not totally sure, but I know we don't primarily label or define a sick person based on their symptoms, but upon the illness they are suffering from.

Remember, I'm only referring to the religious part of a person's mentality as their current thoughts on the concept of a deity. The terms theism and atheism are both incredibly broad. Just as there are differing circumstances and specifics for varying atheists, there are differing circumstances and specifics for various theists. The only difference is that, on the theistic side, we define the certain established specifics (such as Christianity, Islam, Pantheism, the various cultural mythologies, etc.). As an atheist can have once been a theist, so can a theist have once been an atheist. Each person has various reasons for what fills each part of their worldview, and those can change things (not all Christians believe the exact same thing either, for example), but the broad, overall idea tends to be consistent.

Damn this thing is hard to nail down.

Yeah, I guess that's what happens when discussing more abstract concepts. Especially when such concepts don't even have all of their terminology defined (or at least not consistently), but I think that makes it all the more interesting

 

[Professor Ven]

Easy Button - if you're finding religion a bunch of old socks, this is your new hat to wear for now. Utilize your thinking freedom wisely, mah boyee.

Atheism is for those humans who act more or less human than their religious counterparts, they're going against the norm and substituting it with a [hopefully] enlightening type of experience. Generally the intelligent atheist is one who learns and understand religion(s), as opposed to most likely the mass majority trying to be hip and cool or something.


I personally despise most hypocritical Christians, though the religion is okay at best. Doesn't mean I have to be an ass about it unless I am being specific on a topic at hand or something.

Also, to younger kiddies - don't go Atheist to be hip and cool or whatever BS (Sami awe that one chick will totally date me if I'm atheist) Think about it beforehand. Think about what you want to believe in, and why. Then the why of that why, and so on.


Just hate bandwagoners.

 

[Onasi]

There are organized groups of atheists out there that are just as bad as religious extremists. In fact, groups of religious and nonreligious leaders frequently call out militant atheism as they do militant religious organizations.

As for the rest of what you said (prophets, holy book, etc), I don't think that is a common misconception at all. I'd be very interested though in where you've heard people think atheism was actually a faith in itself.

Just as bad as religious extremists? I don't see mobs of people trying to kill theists in the streets. Atheists don't cut peoples heads off for not being an atheist. Atheists don't start wars over disagreements in religion. Atheists don't train paramilitary groups to attack non atheist nations and people. When was the last time an atheist made a car bomb and set it off in a crowded marketplace? Sorry if i'm sounding like a dick but you honestly can't compare a few pissed off Atheists and a few select cases to centuries of Christian and Muslim terrorists killing civilians in mass, blowing up buildings, and starting wars.

Often creationists who argue against Evolution say that Atheism is a religion who's creation myth is evolution and refer to people like Richard Dawkins, Stephen Hawking, and other atheist scientists as "Prophets"

 

[Solar]

Just as bad as religious extremists? I don't see mobs of people trying to kill theists in the streets. Atheists don't cut peoples heads off for not being an atheist. Atheists don't start wars over disagreements in religion. Atheists don't train paramilitary groups to attack non atheist nations and people. When was the last time an atheist made a car bomb and set it off in a crowded marketplace? Sorry if i'm sounding like a dick but you honestly can't compare a few pissed off Atheists and a few select cases to centuries of Christian and Muslim terrorists killing civilians in mass, blowing up buildings, and starting wars.

Except the biggest mass-murderers in history have been extremist atheists and there is the odd modern day atheist terrorist as well (I'm thinking of that bomber in the US

 

[Luap]

I'd like to know where this "myth" mentioned that religious folk think Atheists have their own scriptures... I never knew anyone who believed that. If someone does, they are a tard, because that makes absolutely no sense.

I personally despise most hypocritical Christians, though the religion is okay at best.

Funny thing about Christianity is that as a Christian that we must accept the fact that we are hypocrites, in the sense that we can never achieve Godliness in this life, even though we must try. But, that's being a hypocritical human, not a hypocritical Christian.

A hypocritical Christian is a person who thinks they are above another (let they be Christian, Atheist, Islamic, Morman, etc.) because they are Christian.

Not directly related to this subject, but, I'm starting to consider myself an Agnostic Christian. I believe that, if any religion is true, it must be Christianity, but not necessarily that Christianity must be true...

Just as bad as religious extremists? I don't see mobs of people trying to kill theists in the streets. Atheists don't cut peoples heads off for not being an atheist. Atheists don't start wars over disagreements in religion. Atheists don't train paramilitary groups to attack non atheist nations and people. When was the last time an atheist made a car bomb and set it off in a crowded marketplace? Sorry if i'm sounding like a dick but you honestly can't compare a few pissed off Atheists and a few select cases to centuries of Christian and Muslim terrorists killing civilians in mass, blowing up buildings, and starting wars.

Those people are false preachers/blasphemers to each of their religions respectively, because neither the Bible or Qu'ran teach to kill nonbelievers.

 

[Pirates]

Doesnt mean it is due to atheism though.
I also doubt that that is true, Crusades and such.

All modern crimes are committed by those who dont believe in Zeus. Does it matter?
Nope.

 

[Orion]

Except the biggest mass-murderers in history have been extremist atheists and there is the odd modern day atheist terrorist as well (I'm thinking of that bomber in the US

However, it is definitely possible for a murder to be attributed to a religion - religions have things that they are inherently and morally (typically leading to violently) opposed to. The only thing atheism comes close to (but still indirectly and not inherently) advocating is following the scientific method and accepting its conclusions, but it's not about conversion, dominating, cleansing or anything else - there is no atheist agenda for its members to get violent and angry about. Whereas for religions there are things in the scriptures that people can and will get violent about, even without straying from what the religion advocates.

I also want to understand another thing - from you and others:
Those that feel atheism in some way causes murders or horrors - do you feel it is directly atheism that is causing it, or that them not following a religion is making them supposedly more susceptible to the idea of murder?

 

[Onasi]

Except the biggest mass-murderers in history have been extremist atheists and there is the odd modern day atheist terrorist as well (I'm thinking of that bomber in the US

The Biggest Mass Murderers in history didn't kill in the name of Atheism.
Hitler- theist
King Leopold II- theist
Tsar Nicholas II- theist
Enver Pasha- theist
Tojo Hideki- theist
Saddam Hussein- theist
Joseph Stalin- atheist killed people for power not atheism
Mao- atheistic Taoist killed for power during a civil war
Pol Pot- atheist killed to form a perfect society
Vladimir Lenin- Atheist didn't kill for atheism


The major Atheist dictators in history never killed in mass for atheism but their own personal ideology of mixed political and philosophical beliefs. Theistic dictators have been racking up death counts since the bronze age. Lets not forget something called the Inquisition. Oh and there is that whole Muslim fundamentalist thing that involves blowing up buildings. Or those Christian Fundamentalists that kill abortion doctors and picket the funerals of soldiers. Or the Hindus killing Muslims in India for the crime of having another religion. Or the countless women and homosexuals oppressed by Muslim Theocracies.

 

[▽]

Though i do share the view with the professor that atheism seems to be the popular thing today (of course not for every atheist), i oppose the notion that the intelligent atheist knows almost exclusively about religion and spirituality. I myself do not have the intent to study holy books thoroughly. Instead, i study physics, the mechanisms behind nature itself. Does that make me unintelligent? I have become an atheist through inquiry that started at a young age. And that was a few years before internet was iplemented by the masses.

I can see how some might think that atheism starts to seem a religion. With forums and meetings held by atheists. I am quite sceptical of how some people almost blindly follow dawkins, hitchens, harris etc.. I agree with those people to a certain degree, but i'm sure there are points i disagree on.

 

[Deleted member 36435]

Except the biggest mass-murderers in history have been extremist atheists and there is the odd modern day atheist terrorist as well (I'm thinking of that bomber in the US

Holy bonk if you are referring to Hitler I'm going to scream.

but if you are referring to stalin that's okay

but there are many more than just Hitler and Stalin as outlined by Mr. Onasi

 

[Oberon]

Myths of atheism. What a nice oxymoron. =)

Atheism as a concept is not hard to grasp. It's just the lack of faith or lack of a belief in a creator. That hardly ever applies to the things an atheist might do (whether that be crime or otherwise). And it isn't as if people are killing in the name of atheism or anything.

 

[Onasi]

but there are many more than just Hitler and Stalin as outlined by Mr. Onasi

Pol pot is the only dictator that you can really make the argument that he killed for atheism and even in that it was his own philosophical views on what he think the people of Cambodia should believe and act like. Stalin didn't kill people for Atheism. He killed people he viewed as threats to his power in the Soviet union and did multiple purges where he killed high ranking military, politicians, ect. Just him being an atheist means nothing. He didn't kill in the name of it. If we are going to count Stalin as mass murder who killed in the name of atheism we should count any murderer who just happened to believe in god as killing in the name of their faith.