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Do you remember when Akuroku was a thing?



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Elysium

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I read that chapter you recommended last night. I really liked it. I'll probably read the whole fic at another time since it's SoRiku and the writing was strong (not the case with all fanfiction). What was the part when Roxas is sitting in front of the bonfire referring to? Did Riku commit suicide or was it another character?
 

Clue.Less

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I read that chapter you recommended last night. I really liked it. I'll probably read the whole fic at another time since it's SoRiku and the writing was strong (not the case with all fanfiction). What was the part when Roxas is sitting in front of the bonfire referring to? Did Riku commit suicide or was it another character?
I'm so glad you like it! I re-read it again yesterday, as well as the chapters after that one, and they really are something... Started over from chapter 1 today and the beginning is not as strong, but it really picks up after a while.

It's the day Kurt Cobain died.
 
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Noivern

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Oh boy, I was really afraid when I saw that thread title, but ended up with a really good discussion that did not creep me out.

I'm not going to go over why I don't like AkuRoku. I never did back when I was a kid and later a teen (like someone else pointed out, the huge height difference always made Axel seem so much older to me. and then we got all the other details) nor am I going to reply to anyone in particular as to why I think it's a creep ship nowadays. Focus on the nowadays part, as I don't think it's fair to judge people who were into the pairing back when we only had CoM and KH2 and the only hint about Axel's actual age was his height, specially when we look at KH2 Riku's growspurt.

I'm just going to say that if your pairing needs a whole bunch of headcanons to function (changing all the core aspects that define a character like their age and background) as a non problematic pairing, then you should probably accept if people are grossed out by it.

That is not to say I think everything is heavily problematic nor that all relationships are "good". I do like a good build up, some good angst. I think a lot can be written in a relationship with toxic aspects that are dealt with throughout their time together without the pairing itself being "bad".

I'm just glad this ship is pretty much dead nowadays in mainstream fandom and I don't have to feel unconfortable and avoid certain areas of KH-centered places to avoid it nowadays.
 

Hedginka

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The Kingdom Hearts canon is so phenomenally fragile that it’s easy to insert your own head canons or ignore lore additions you don’t like if you really want to. I think every KH fan has at least one piece of canon that they happily ignore and if they don’t, I’m impressed. Heck, a lot of people feel the story should have ended years ago. I have thoughts and concepts here and there that are contradicted by pieces of canon that I don’t like. So if someone wants to ignore every indication of Axel’s age over the last decade, I say more power to them.
 

*TwilightNight*

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Grooming is when you isolate or lie to a child or build a relationship with a child specifically with the intention to abuse them. That doesn't happen with Axel. Axel was working with Roxas as part of his job for the Organization. He didn't intentionally seek Roxas out or deliberately manipulate him to like himself (Axel) more. Anyone shipping the relationship back in KH2 days would have considered it a workplace relationship that developed over time by happenstance. Axel didn't even have a heart to begin with to have feelings towards Roxas before they'd met.

Actually, I imagine the fact that Roxas is the impetus for Axel re-growing his heart is the reason the pairing was shipped so widely back when KH2 was released; Roxas ended up making Axel feel again and Axel didn't know that was possible. That would necessitate the ship be a slowburn, not love at first sight.

Axel really isn't that innocent on that behalf either. Your perspective works in the regular canon, but with AkuRoku being shipped as a romantic relationship, this means that gaining feelings for Roxas and vice-versa would have happened during work hours and the year they had spent together on the clock tower. Which is grooming in my opinion as it is during Roxas' formative months. He's dependent on Axel for answers about activities, life, friendships, and love. This is an extrene imbalance of power. Unintentional at first, but AkuRoku has to be done with interest of romantic and sexual inclinations [eventually]. Otherwise it's not a ship. Even going by KHII standards, Roxas is half his size, is underaged, and Axel himself is portrayed as needy/clingy, perhaps due to Roxas making him "feel".

Honestly, I didn't need 358/2 Days to find it uncomfortable. It simply cemented it.

I'm not going to give people shit for shipping it, but it's not for me personally.

It isn’t about grooming in regards to these particular relationships with age discrepancies. I know they aren’t being groomed and that there isn’t a power discrepancy there. It’s strictly about the age gap and when the basis of their interactions began. Even though it was a brief meeting, Aqua would have perceived Riku as a child for 10 years until she saw him as a young teenager then finally properly met him as an older teen. Even though she’s known him longer as a teen, that doesn’t negate the fact that she knew him as a child while she was nearly an adult and considered him a child for a very long period of time.

Can't say much on that because it's complex, and I can't deem it unreasonable. I do think there's a difference between being attracted to the older version of him and not be attracted to the younger. And that's if Aqua has thought about Riku for years in the Realm of Darkness. I do believe her memory had to be jogged a bit to connect Kairi as that little girl she met once.
 

Elysium

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Axel really isn't that innocent on that behalf either.
I'm not sure what this means. I didn't say Axel was an innocent character in general, only that his behavior in canon was innocent of this grooming descriptor. Developing feelings for someone a year after you've first met them and interacted with them (which would have to be the case considering Axel doesn't even have a heart at the beginning of Days) doesn't = grooming. Maybe you're thinking of a different word, I dunno. I agree Roxas is much younger than him and there is a power imbalance, but not that Axel grooms him. The only reason I responded to this word (here and once before, previously, in another thread) is because it's a loaded word that's often thrown at gay relationships in media or, in this case, fandom.

Moreover, as I've also said before in another thread, if we're going to over-infantilize Roxas and act like he's a 1-year-old in order to dramatize, then we have to treat all the Org. members as if they're 10 years old or younger--which means everyone's underage. And then even something like Sora / Roxas or Riku / Roxas is disturbing, because it's a 2-year-old with a 15-year-old.
 
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