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Did I hear Nomura right?



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Box_ghost

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I know. It's this fact I hate. I just can't wait for KH3 so this saga can end Hopefully we can avoid such characters and get better OC's. I've completely given up on this saga.

Terra and Aqua are alright. Ven is tolerable if there's no KH gayshit like there's been. Aqua's a beast with that damn ghost drive. But they jus need to let oxas and Xion stay yht ehell gone. Yeah, save them, whatever. But after that, there needs not to be an appearance, nor reference from them.
 

Shadow_

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Or they could pull a fast one on us, let them be gone for a little while and then bring them back.
 

Tatsu

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It just means that like always Sora is going to receive zero character development and it's going to be how he inspires someone persevere through darkness. Nomura has turned him into a Jesus type figure where it's mainly about his message he sends rather than what he thinks and feels. :rolleyes:

I had high hopes for this series after CoM but ever since then this series has plummeted. The supposed main character is stagnent and everyone who serves no true purpose in the series is getting developent. It's a complete utter mess. Get KH3 out of the way now. If anything this series needs to be rebooted like DMC so we can get a more humanized Sora (just like how Capcom is going to do with Dante)and some stories that are ACTUALLY told through his pov. At this point, Sora has become the most mysterious figure in KH imo. I don't know what this guy thinks anymore. We don't even know if he's pulling a Loki and faking his attitude. We don't know who he hates, who he loves, or what he feels. A complete enigma now and we will never get answers at this rate.

Just finish this series and reboot it with newly designed and more humanized Sora. Hell, give him red hair or black hair in the reboot.
 
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Taochan

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It just means that like always Sora is going to receive zero character development and it's going to be how he inspires someone persevere through darkness. Nomura has turned him into a Jesus type figure where it's mainly about his message he sends rather than what he thinks and feels. :rolleyes:
Sora had wonderful development throughout KH1 and COM. Sure, he got rebooted for KH2 but DDD will more than likely serve as a way to redevelop him. He wasn't even there in Days and in BBS he was a child. Then we have Coded, which in fact did give him great development as Data Sora.
I think the game is very much about how he feels. The fact he goes off to save people he doesn't know, just because they helped him to become who he is, says a lot about his personality and how he thinks.

I had high hopes for this series after CoM but ever since then this series has plummeted. The supposed main character is stagnent and everyone who serves no true purpose in the series is getting developent. It's a complete utter mess. Get KH3 out of the way now. If anything this series needs to be rebooted like DMC so we can get a more humanized Sora (just like how Capcom is going to do with Dante)and some stories that are ACTUALLY told through his pov. At this point, Sora has become the most mysterious figure in KH imo. I don't know what this guy thinks anymore. We don't even know if he's pulling a Loki and faking his attitude. We don't know who he hates, who he loves, or what he feels. A complete enigma now and we will never get answers at this rate.
So, who are these characters with development that are useless? Are you referring to TAV? Oh you mean characters that are relevant to the future games story line and also were relevant to KH2. Or do you mean Riku? Oh the other boy who is meant to save the world? Maybe you mean RAX? Or maybe Namine, maybe Kairi? Calling any of them unimportant is a foot in mouth situation. Everyone played their role in this series and are pointed to in Coded as being something to the future of this series.

Yeah, Sora is totally faking his sincere attitude. He in actuality doesn't give a shit about anyone and just constantly puts his life on the line for the thrill of the battle. How do you not know Sora? Granted his character development isn't fleshed out like Riku's, it's still there. And I frankly think we all know Sora very well. Rewatch the cutscenes; everything you need to know Sora is right there. He loves Riku and Kairi, Donald and Goofy. He deeply cared for Namine, and he has a bond to the others.

Just finish this series and reboot it with newly designed and more humanized Sora. Hell, give him red hair or black hair in the reboot.
Because that is what will help the series.
 

blueheart

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I hope we get to play more as Riku, I wished we got to play as him in KH1 since he was probably my favorite person in KH1.

This was really one of the few things that annoyed me in KH1. I know he's not the main character, but they could have given a little more insight on what he was thinking at the time, and some more information on what he was doing. We still don't fully know what he did throughout the series, besides CoM and from Sora's point of view. But maybe it's because I'm just dense on people's emotions and line of thinking, especially in KH1.
 

Tatsu

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Sora had wonderful development throughout KH1 and COM. Sure, he got rebooted for KH2 but DDD will more than likely serve as a way to redevelop him. He wasn't even there in Days and in BBS he was a child. Then we have Coded, which in fact did give him great development as Data Sora.

Really? Really? Where was this development. It wasn't in the game that's for sure. And in Days, it was once again about him being symbol (not character) inspiring the good in people. And Coded doesn't count. THAT wasn't Sora. It was a Data Sora! What happens with Data Sora doesn't affect Sora at all. There comes one of the insignificant characters that received development when it could've went to making Sora into being human instead of a walking talking enigma.

I think the game is very much about how he feels. The fact he goes off to save people he doesn't know, just because they helped him to become who he is, says a lot about his personality and how he thinks.

Does he miss being a normal boy? Does he really enjoy putting his life after everybody else? Does enjoy having to constantly save the day? Does he miss his family and friends on DI? Did Riku's betrayal anger him? Does he go off saving people because he wants or because he has no choice? If he were given the opportunity to having the keyblade or not having it, which would he choose? Does he hate Xehanort? Was Organization XIII really frustating him or was it just because he was sick of all the fighting and mind games? Does he love? Does he feel love? Does he hate?

Those are just sample of questions that have yet to be answered. Questions and answers that could drive a story and humanize this enigmatic symbol known as Sora (not a character anymore. he's plain simple symbol right now).

So, who are these characters with development that are useless? Are you referring to TAV? Oh you mean characters that are relevant to the future games story line and also were relevant to KH2. Or do you mean Riku? Oh the other boy who is meant to save the world? Maybe you mean RAX? Or maybe Namine, maybe Kairi? Calling any of them unimportant is a foot in mouth situation. Everyone played their role in this series and are pointed to in Coded as being something to the future of this series.

For one, Data Sora. He isn't the real Sora and we probably won't see him again. So why give him so much development time that could've been used to humanize the actual Sora. As of now, the real Sora is more robot than Data Sora. Good job, Nomura.

Another one is Roxas. While he was important, do we really need a whole game based on him going gaga over another insignificant character Xion. Do they play a role in future installments? Apparently not, TAV do but not them. Namine...don't get me started on miss plot device.

Yeah, Sora is totally faking his sincere attitude. He in actuality doesn't give a shit about anyone and just constantly puts his life on the line for the thrill of the battle. How do you not know Sora? Granted his character development isn't fleshed out like Riku's, it's still there. And I frankly think we all know Sora very well. Rewatch the cutscenes; everything you need to know Sora is right there. He loves Riku and Kairi, Donald and Goofy. He deeply cared for Namine, and he has a bond to the others.

Because that is what will help the series.

Is he faking it? There's nothing stating that he is or isn't faking it. That's the big problem here. For all we know, he hates being a hero and wants to be normal. For all we know, the only reason he's smiling is because he's putting his misery on hold so everyone else can be cheery. We don't know. That's the problem here. I think Sora, I think a blank. Like I said, he is as much a mystery as Loki. Don't know if he's sincere or not.
 

Taochan

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Really? Really? Where was this development. It wasn't in the game that's for sure. And in Days, it was once again about him being symbol (not character) inspiring the good in people. And Coded doesn't count. THAT wasn't Sora. It was a Data Sora! What happens with Data Sora doesn't affect Sora at all. There comes one of the insignificant characters that received development when it could've went to making Sora into being human instead of a walking talking enigma.
Sora’s development was in the games. :/ Go back and play them. Sora grows from an inexperienced boy to one who saves worlds. He grows from a prejudiced individual (regarding the Organization) to one who realizes that their lack of hearts doesn’t make them expendable. Sora continues to remain loyal to his friends no matter what. He chose to continue travelling the universe to find Riku when he could have gone home with Kairi. That shows his character immensely. Even when Sora learns that Namine has lied to him, he continues to want to save her and be her friend… because that’s who he his.
Data Sora isn’t Sora, that’s agreeable. Sora isn’t a walking enigma in personality. :/

Does he miss being a normal boy? Does he really enjoy putting his life after everybody else? Does enjoy having to constantly save the day? Does he miss his family and friends on DI? Did Riku's betrayal anger him? Does he go off saving people because he wants or because he has no choice? If he were given the opportunity to having the keyblade or not having it, which would he choose? Does he hate Xehanort? Was Organization XIII really frustating him or was it just because he was sick of all the fighting and mind games? Does he love? Does he feel love? Does he hate?
Sora wanted to go see other worlds. That’s why they were making a raft in KH1; Riku and Sora wanted to explore. Sora might miss being ‘regular’ or at least he might miss not fighting but he obviously enjoys meeting new friends and seeing new places.
Nomura said family isn’t important in KH for one. And secondly, a whole year of Sora’s absence has been erased from his mind. So to him, he hadn’t been away from his family for too long.
Riku’s betrayal never seemed to anger Sora, it saddened him. That’s why upon reuniting, Sora cries. Sora cried for all of the mixed up feelings he’s had for Riku and on the beach in the RoD they reconcile.
Sora is the type of person to always defend the world, because that’s what’s right.
I imagine Sora might hate Xehanort. And with the Organization, it’s obvious how much disdain Sora had for them. He may not hate them, but before Axel sacrifices himself for Sora, Sora definitely doesn’t like any of the Org members and thinks of them as well… heartless, as lesser beings.
Does he love? Did you miss his whole journey to find Riku and save Kairi? Did you miss how he grows close to Donald and Goofy? He obviously loves, though if there is any romantic love is completely unclear (and it will undoubtedly stay that way, as to appease all fans).

Those are just sample of questions that have yet to be answered. Questions and answers that could drive a story and humanize this enigmatic symbol known as Sora (not a character anymore. he's plain simple symbol right now).
Sora’s still very much a character but I agree that he’s also very much a symbol.

For one, Data Sora. He isn't the real Sora and we probably won't see him again. So why give him so much development time that could've been used to humanize the actual Sora. As of now, the real Sora is more robot than Data Sora. Good job, Nomura.
How is Sora a robot? Wtf? Did you not play any of the games? Where he states his jealousy of Riku, how he cares for his friends, when he cries, when he kneels before the Organization? Sora is no where close to a robot.

Another one is Roxas. While he was important, do we really need a whole game based on him going gaga over another insignificant character Xion. Do they play a role in future installments? Apparently not, TAV do but not them. Namine...don't get me started on miss plot device.
No, we didn’t really need Days. Nomura gave us Days because the fans asked for it and Nintendo wanted a KH game on the DS. You don’t know that they don’t play a role in future installments. Coded shows that they need saving, which either means that they’ll gain their own forms or that they’ll just be put at peace.

Is he faking it? There's nothing stating that he is or isn't faking it. That's the big problem here. For all we know, he hates being a hero and wants to be normal. For all we know, the only reason he's smiling is because he's putting his misery on hold so everyone else can be cheery. We don't know. That's the problem here. I think Sora, I think a blank. Like I said, he is as much a mystery as Loki. Don't know if he's sincere or not.
Is he faking it? You’re the only person I’ve ever heard have this problem. Why can’t someone just genuinely be a good person? We’ve seen Sora struggle with betrayal on several occasions and it hurts him but he perseveres. He’s a person who puts other people before him. You’re making him out to be more mysterious than he really is.
 

Tatsu

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The sad thing is, everything you just said are nothing but assumptions. Not facts or evidence. Everything that you and I say are just theories. Until we get some scenes Sora stating this stuff like him being jealous of Riku or sad about the betrayal, nothing is official. Again, right now Sora is a enigma. The only fact we know about him is that he wanted to find Riku and Kairi. But that's about it.
 

Taochan

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Nothing I said was a theory.

Play the games.
 

Tatsu

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I did play the games and I know about the personalities of every character except....Sora. Sora is the biggest question mark of all. The substance is there somewhere it is very, VERY hidden. You know what KH is like, the Tim Burton Batman series. You know how it was more about the villains and side characters and their development than Batman himself. Instead of the movies being Batman movies, it was all about the villains and side characters and Batman just being a walking emo enigma with zero development. It wasn't until the reboot Batman Begins did we finally learn about the man behind the mask. The question is: bwhen is Sora going to get his Batman Begins?

May not happen unless the series is rebooted.
 

Sephiroth0812

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The sad thing is, everything you just said are nothing but assumptions. Not facts or evidence. Everything that you and I say are just theories. Until we get some scenes Sora stating this stuff like him being jealous of Riku or sad about the betrayal, nothing is official. Again, right now Sora is a enigma. The only fact we know about him is that he wanted to find Riku and Kairi. But that's about it.

I actually faceplamed at this...do you need everything spelt out in voice and/or delivered on a silver platter? One has eyes to look and then there's something called subtlety.
None of the things Taocha said about Sora are just theories, they are noticeable if one pays close attention.
Sora got quite a bunch of insight on how he "ticks" in KH 1, CoM and the story-relevant worlds in KH 2, which was sadly a whole whack discredited by his poor portrayal in "Filler"-worlds.

As for Roxas, Xion and Naminé, what gives you the right to say they are "insignificant"? Are you Nomura's ghost writer or what?
Blank Points and Re:Coded pretty much layed out that they are in fact still important to the series, as are TAV.
This isn't just a Sora-alone show...just because an important role is not yet obvious it doesn't mean there isn't one...this saga has still three games to go and don't forget the next saga.
 

Tatsu

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How is it I know everything about Roxas, Xion, Riku, Terra, Aqua, Namine, Ventus, and even Axel yet when I think Sora I'm left scratching my head. Perhaps because he has received zero character development and is just a giant symbolic monolith. Sora=Loki and Burton Batman in terms of character development. He just a giant blank. No wonder Xehanort has no clue how to break this guy, he is one big question mark. I'm the gamer and I still don't know what's ticking in that brain of Sora's.

Also just because he puts a smile on his face doesn't mean it's sincere. I can smile too in a group setting, doesn't mean I'm happy. No one will ever know unless they put me on the spot. Same could be for this enigma. We'll never know because it's a question that will never get answered because Nomura doesn't want to tackle the issue. What is behind the blue eyes of our protoganist? It's a story I'm waiting for and so far, I haven't gotten it. And sadly we won't get it. Because of this, Sora is without a doubt the worst developed main character in the history of gaming. A giant symbol and a big enigma.

As for Namine, her only purpose was to be reset button so Sora could stay stagnent as a character because even Nomura himself has no clue on where to take the character. At this point, best thing to do is end it with KH3 and reboot it in two years. Maybe a new KH with newly designed Sora and a storyline that reveals his character and emotions. Like I said, Sora needs his Batman Begins. If Capcom can do it with Dante, Square can do it with this guy.
 

Taochan

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You may be the only person who has no concept of who Sora is. This game series isn't about spelling everything out for you; read facial expressions, tones of voice, and watch for his tears. That's a way to find out who Sora is. Listen to what he says; dig a little deeper.
 

siegleeagle

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How is it I know everything about Roxas, Xion, Riku, Terra, Aqua, Namine, Ventus, and even Axel yet when I think Sora I'm left scratching my head. Perhaps because he has received zero character development and is just a giant symbolic monolith. Sora=Loki and Burton Batman in terms of character development. He just a giant blank. No wonder Xehanort has no clue how to break this guy, he is one big question mark. I'm the gamer and I still don't know what's ticking in that brain of Sora's.

Also just because he puts a smile on his face doesn't mean it's sincere. I can smile too in a group setting, doesn't mean I'm happy. No one will ever know unless they put me on the spot. Same could be for this enigma. We'll never know because it's a question that will never get answered because Nomura doesn't want to tackle the issue. What is behind the blue eyes of our protoganist? It's a story I'm waiting for and so far, I haven't gotten it. And sadly we won't get it. Because of this, Sora is without a doubt the worst developed main character in the history of gaming. A giant symbol and a big enigma.

As for Namine, her only purpose was to be reset button so Sora could stay stagnent as a character because even Nomura himself has no clue on where to take the character. At this point, best thing to do is end it with KH3 and reboot it in two years. Maybe a new KH with newly designed Sora and a storyline that reveals his character and emotions. Like I said, Sora needs his Batman Begins. If Capcom can do it with Dante, Square can do it with this guy.
Um I think I know who Sora is better than you apparently do. He is who he has been shown to be. The kind,caring boy who is selfless and tries to be there for someone even if they are a stranger. I think he feels extremely developed on who he is as a person and he feels real to me.
 

blueheart

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I actually faceplamed at this...do you need everything spelt out in voice and/or delivered on a silver platter? One has eyes to look and then there's something called subtlety..

I actually have a big problem with this myself. I'm the kind of person that needs everything explained to me in detail before I get it, as in why people or someone might act or react in a certain way, or what they're feeling, or why they say certain things. Esecially in KH1, I had a problem with this. Mainly because most of the time everyone had a doll face, and the dialouge was rare or had more than one meaning. I can see where Tatsu is coming from. Even though I don't wholly agree with him on some points, he also has a few good ones.
 
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siegleeagle

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I actually have a big problem with this myself. I'm the kind of person that needs everything explained to me in detail before I get it, as in why people or someone might act or react in a certain way, or what they're feeling, or why they say certain things. Esecially in KH1, I had a problem with this. Mainly because most of the time everyone had a doll face, and the dialouge was rare or had more than one meaning. I can see where Tatsu is coming from. Even though I don't wholly agree with him on some points, he also has a few good ones.

True but then comes in the problem of people who dont like everything spelled out for them like me. The developers then have to decide who to cater to and in the end someone is still unhappy.
 

Taochan

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I'm pretty sure the developers felt that they weren't making Sora into some huge enigma for most people as well.
 

Sephiroth0812

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I'm pretty sure the developers felt that they weren't making Sora into some huge enigma for most people as well.

One can never satisfy everyone, that's true in every area and every field, yet regarding Sora I found also that most people do understand quite well how Sora "ticks", what his motivations are and that he does have his doubts and inner conflicts.

Some people just want him to change so badly because they apparantly can't stand a more upbeat, friendly hero...although one had to wonder then...as i.e. Zidane from FF IX was also such a type of hero, or Tidus in X.

Still, I can relate to those who say that KH 2 somewhat butchered Sora's portrayal, as in most of the Disney "Filler"-worlds Sora's actions and behaviour didn't always match up.
 

Tatsu

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Problem with Sora is, there's no subtelty either. Whenever there's a scene he has a blank face. And honestly in a series where every character is getting their history spelled out to the viewer, I don't think it's wise to have a character that gets developed through subtelty and expressions. Just have it spelled like everyone else, otherwise do the same to every other character.

A scene I do want to see and hasn't been done is the scene where Sora and Riku kind of talk about Riku's betrayal in KH1 and how Sora feels about it. I just feel that there's no closure to that at all. Nomura's going off on everything including what size shoe Xion and Roxas wears that he forgot about some more interesting and pressing issues.
 
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