Brainstorm: Sora, Roxas, and Ven

[*Twilight*]

There's a lot of speculation about the relationship between these three, so I want to brainstorm in this thread and see if we can all reach a logical conclusion/theory. Then when we get more info we can see if the theory still stands. I'll start with our first major clue, some info, and key questions. You all can read my thought process if you want too lol.

Nomura: You will be able to separate Ven from Roxas with ease, I will hint though by connecting the story between Roxas and Sora, you will understand who Ven is.

Sora: heartless (until fusion)
Roxas: nobody (until fusion)
Ven: keyblade wielder from ten years in the past who happens to look and sound like Sora's nobody (until fusion?? jk)

Key Questions:
What's so special about Sora's and Roxas' relationship?
How can Roxas use a keyblade? H4X!!!
Why would Sora's body and soul look like a keyblade wielder from ten years in the past (when Sora was four)?

--------------
My thoughts:

So, we all know the story between Sora and Roxas: Sora's stabs himself, becomes a heartless, gets reverted back to his original looks, and creates the nobody we now know as the BHK err... Roxas. Their relationship doesn't seem any different than any other heartless+ nobody, except for the fact that Roxas can wield a keyblade. For that reason alone I think it's a key point to focus on.

I can only think of two reasons for why Roxas can wield not just one, but two keyblades. 1. Sora's heart is strong enough to allow his nobody to have keyblades. 2. Roxas has a strong power of heart while somehow still being a nobody. Either way, it makes no sense to me. So this is where I think Ven comes in. Ven looks exactly like Roxas, who is basically Sora's body and soul. Sora's body and soul looks like a keyblade wielder from ten years ago...not only that, but somehow because of Ven, Sora's nobody can wield a keyblade.

What I'm thinking is that Sora's heart is inside Ven's body and soul. What makes Roxas and Ven separate is the fact that Ven has (or had) his own heart, while Roxas doesn't have one. Putting Sora's heart in Ven's body pretty much just made him a more powerful Sora? It can kind of explain why Roxas can wield a keyblade. That leaves more questions though! What happened to Ven's heart? Is that the "erasing" he meant? What happened to Sora's original nobody/body and soul? Ugh...hopefully someone else will come up with something more concrete.

 

[saixrulz]

What I'm thinking is that Sora's heart is inside Ven's body and soul.

I think it is the reverse. That when ven was about to be "erased" he gave part of his heart or soul to sora so that there could still be keyblade wilders after they were gone. And then since ven gave part of his heart/soul to sora when sora became a heartless vens traits were passed on to roxas.

 

[shadow15]

I don't think that it's Soras heart inside Vens body and soul I think that it is Vens heart inside Soras body and soul along with Soras heart. Remember Nomura had said that Roxas is nothing more than Soras nobody he can't be Vens body at all now that he has said so. But clearly there's pretty much the connections for you. Soras original body and soul is there in Roxas, The only thing that came up of Ven in the process was his looks and sort of like a new body because Sora could meet Roxas live during the story their bodies might have been left there, well at least their dead bodies or they just fade away or something but I don't think that it's the end we see of Terra,Aqua and Ven in KH3. It explains how they were able to weild the keyblade but what I don't understand is how Xemnas knows so much already, you see he even speaks of Sora being too young to weild the keyblade but apparently the only reason they had gotten the keyblade was that they were at the right place at the right time I guess.

Roxas could temporarily weild the Kingdom Key and he could weild the keyblade i'm sure it's because of him coming into being and Soras heart had touched the light after being a heartless and his body became whole again simple as that. Remember Ven was the one who picked up Way to The Dawn in which case Riku and Sora can weild both the kingdom key and Way to The Dawn and i'm not sure but Oblivion and Oathkeeper seem to be keyblades of the inbetween realm right? Just for that path like Way to The Dawn.
It was because of his connection with Soras heart that he could weild the keyblade.

 

[dualblade]

Here's what i think. From what we see from the new bbs trailer, Ven seemed to be on the verge of losing something..most probably his heart. Maybe his body could no longer hold it or something or maybe Ven was physically weaker than terra and could not protect his heart from being taken from him. Maybe his heart could be used for something like sealing or summoning kingdom hearts, that kinda explains why Master Xehanort from bbs wanted it. Ven, despaired that his heart could be used for something bad told terra to 'erase him' so that xehanort would not get Ven's heart. Terra, instead of destroying his friend's heart probably put it into Sora. that's why he went to destiny island and was watching over Sora and Riku. Here i think he tried to use riku as the host as Riku seemed stronger but somehow the heart went to sora instead. This might have something to do with Sora's own powers like how he was able to keep Kairi's heart in his body in KH1 and to Sora's slight resemblence to Ven. When sora stabbed himself, Ven's heart was also one of the hearts that was released. Roxas was created from Sora's soul but obtained Ven's heart. That's why Roxas seemed to have a heart and could wield two keyblades. One because he had Ven's heart and the other because he was Sora's, a keyblade wielder's nobody.
That's my theory anyway, sorry for the absurd length!

 

[Nightmare]

hers some advicce dualblade and shadow15, never make your theory or whatever a block of words. make them paraghaphy... nobody likes reading those long blocks of words....

and *Twilight*, Ven does NOT have Sora's heart... if its about a heart, then Sora has Ven's heart, which could be why the Keyblade choose him and not Riku at the hallow bastion place... in kh1

 

[darksephiroth00]

I think it is the reverse. That when ven was about to be "erased" he gave part of his heart or soul to sora so that there could still be keyblade wilders after they were gone. And then since ven gave part of his heart/soul to sora when sora became a heartless vens traits were passed on to roxas.

It's been a while since I've been on this website. First off, You're correct (based on theory alone). I too think that Ven gave his power to Sora before he was erased, But Sora couldn't wield his power until he was about 12yrs old. I also took a deep thought into something that was said on this forum two years back. My hypothesis is that Roxas is a reincarnation of Ven. Think about it. Sora inherit Ven keyblading skills. When Sora opened his own heart, he woke up Roxas. Roxas is a splitting image of Ven. Forget theory of Body and Soul. There is no such thing. It is worse than the guy that came up with the name BHK. Sora is almost like Naruto in some way (except for how he got the nine tail fox). Sora inherited Ven's Soul before his death, and has the to use two keyblades (which was seen in KH2).

Let me add that I didn't read what everyone wrote. The forum still shows the first message rather than the last. So if you already said what I said, than I am not alone.

 

[Mahagna]

Hmm.... So, the Keyblade is a weapon of the heart so Ven must've had a strong heart. Going with the theory that Sora somehow acquired the keyblade when Ven was "erased" that means Sora is able to use the keyblade now. Now, Hollow Bastion KH1, Sora stabs himself and becomes a heartless. Somehow, Kairi uses her mystical Princess powers and Sora returns to normal. Also, Roxas is created. (I can't help but think this may be the opening scene in 358/2 days and it shows Roxas being born XD) So, as Sora can use the Keyblade, thanks to Ven's heart, can Roxas also use this ability? Apprarently so.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Sora - wields keyblade (dual also), when in Wisdom form Sora wields the keyblade backhand-ish (except when shooting) a trait of Ven?, became a heartless for a short time
Roxas - wields keyblade (dual also), was born as a nobody
Ven - weilds keyblade backhand- style (dual?)

So, maybe, if you understand the link between Sora and Roxas you will understand who Ven is,
random shot in the dark but... does this mean Ven is like Roxas and is a keyblade weilding Nobody? But this asks another question, who's Nobody? Or maybe even Ven is the one with the heart and he has a nobody?

 

[dualblade]

First of all kingdoom 911 sorry that my message is an eyesore, i didn't really pay much attention to the arrangment cause i just had to let my theory out of my head and typed on without thinking.

But still, if people wanna read sthg, they will and if they find it too troublesome they wont, so chill.

Next, like u said Mahagna, the keyblade is a weapon of heart. Ven had a strong heart, thus his keyblade but from what we see in the trailers, he is physically weaker and master Xehanort wants something with his heart. (scene were terra is supporting an injured ven and questions Xehanort, "what have u done with his heart).

So i guess bbs will revolve mostly around ven's heart, terra's attemp to save his friend and finally to ven's connection with Sora/Roxas.

I wonder where Aqua fits into the story?

 

[Essence of Elegy]

Sora: heartless (until fusion)

he wasn't really a Heartless, unless you're talking about his brief experiences as a Shadow. When he regained his form, he was just incomplete, that's all.

If Sora's hearts was inside Ven, wouldn't Sora have become a Heartless?

Here's a thought. Remember that scene with Terra watching Sora and Riku spar? Perhaps that scene is some time after Ven was "erased". When Ven was erased, somehow Sora was created (here everything is unclear). Terra must've been very protective over his friend, explaining why he was watching over Riku and Sora in the first place.

I wonder where Aqua fits into the story?

There isn't enough information to speculate about it but I'd say that Aqua was the one who "erased" Ven.

 

[KCDjedi]

I still say that any connection between Sora and Ven that in any way gives Sora any part of Ven it will severely detract from Sora's originality and character. Think of it this way, if Sora had Ven's heart he'd have no choice but be the way that he is (strong of heart, character, will, etc.), while each of his merits he should have earned on his own.

It's like building up a superhero only to find out he was implanted with courage and heroism, making these things not his own.

 

[Essence of Elegy]

I still say that any connection between Sora and Ven that in any way gives Sora any part of Ven it will severely detract from Sora's originality and character. Think of it this way, if Sora had Ven's heart he'd have no choice but be the way that he is (strong of heart, character, will, etc.), while each of his merits he should have earned on his own.

It's like building up a superhero only to find out he was implanted with courage and heroism, making these things not his own.

Ven didn't seem at all like Sora. He looked more like the sad, searching type. Which makes him much like Roxas.

This is all judging from the leaked trailer of course.

 

[pgerv12]

I highly think Ven gave Sora the power to use the keyblade before he "disappears" and in turn giving him a part of his soul. But another thing is Namine was born also of Sora's soul making him have a powerful soul as it is that is why Sora's special. Now Roxas can dual weild keyblades because of having the power of light (oathkeeper) and darkness (oblivion). Am i right, Nobodies can use darkness and light

 

[DarkSoldier85]

It still doesn't explain why Ven looks like Sora (i.e. facial features) as well as Roxas. If a piece of Ven's heart were in Sora and Sora became a heartless, the Nobody would look like Ven with minor physical changes.

Here's a thought. Remember that scene with Terra watching Sora and Riku spar? Perhaps that scene is some time after Ven was "erased". When Ven was erased, somehow Sora was created (here everything is unclear). Terra must've been very protective over his friend, explaining why he was watching over Riku and Sora in the first place.

When you fight Terra in KH2FM, he says something like "You aren't the one I chose..."
I think he was watching over Riku, the one he expected to be the next Keyblade wielder.

 

[Essence of Elegy]

I highly think Ven gave Sora the power to use the keyblade before he "disappears" and in turn giving him a part of his soul. But another thing is Namine was born also of Sora's soul making him have a powerful soul as it is that is why Sora's special. Now Roxas can dual weild keyblades because of having the power of light (oathkeeper) and darkness (oblivion). Am i right, Nobodies can use darkness and light

Oathkeeper and Oblivion represent Sora's friends. Oathkeeper for Kairi and Oblivion for Riku. Sora's friends were a part of his heart, but I don't know why Roxas could wield those particullar Keyblades when he only had Sora's body and soul and not his heart.

 

[KeybaldeFan1]

Jeeze.....Roxas can use the keyblade because sora can.Powerful nobodies get their origonal Powers.As for why Roxas can weild 2, the same reason. Sora does have the power to wield 2 keyblades, it's just those special cloths bring out that power.

 

[Essence of Elegy]

Powerful nobodies get their origonal Powers.

If that was true, then that would mean Xehanort had the power to wield nothingness, which is wrong. Xehanort had no powers, he simply seeked the darkness and thus he lost his heart.

 

[gotegenks]

Jeeze.....Roxas can use the keyblade because sora can.Powerful nobodies get their origonal Powers.As for why Roxas can weild 2, the same reason. Sora does have the power to wield 2 keyblades, it's just those special cloths bring out that power.

i agree with you, i think roxas wielding keyblades is not so much a mystery anymore, people make it a big deal because theres a new character whom roxas looks like.

 

[Dexel]

When you fight Terra in KH2FM, he says something like "You aren't the one I chose..."
I think he was watching over Riku, the one he expected to be the next Keyblade wielder.

Now, I'm not going to dive into this theory myself and give my opinion, but just to clarify this to you, DS, that enemy was called Lingering Sentiment.

Whether or not it's actually Terra isn't known, but don't just jump to conclusions that it was Terra because they look the same.

If it isn't Terra, then, well, there's no proof that it speaks for Terra.

 

[*Twilight*]

and *Twilight*, Ven does NOT have Sora's heart... if its about a heart, then Sora has Ven's heart, which could be why the Keyblade choose him and not Riku at the hallow bastion place... in kh1

Prove me wrong.

he wasn't really a Heartless, unless you're talking about his brief experiences as a Shadow. When he regained his form, he was just incomplete, that's all.

If Sora's hearts was inside Ven, wouldn't Sora have become a Heartless?

When he regained his form, his nobody was already born. Isn't he still a heartless then?


Well at least it seems we all agree on one thing: Ven gave something to Sora, or a part of himself resides in Sora. Whether it's his heart, body, soul, mind, etc.
Ven's heart somehow being in Sora is pretty popular, but I don't get why that would make Sora's nobody look like Ven. That would have to mean that Ven's heart went into Roxas when he was born. But that would make him a full being; pretty much just Ven in someone else's body. And Roxas is supposed to be a nobody.

 

[gotegenks]

Prove me wrong.



When he regained his form, his nobody was already born. Isn't he still a heartless then?


Well at least it seems we all agree on one thing: Ven gave something to Sora, or a part of himself resides in Sora. Whether it's his heart, body, soul, mind, etc.
Ven's heart somehow being in Sora is pretty popular, but I don't get why that would make Sora's nobody look like Ven. That would have to mean that Ven's heart went into Roxas when he was born. But that would make him a full being; pretty much just Ven in someone else's body. And Roxas is supposed to be a nobody.

maybe roxas isn't a nobody? (puts on flameproof sweatervest)

FLAME AWAY! >