Braig and Xigbar might be two different persons?



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Xehanort-X-blade

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hello guys ok so we know in secret movie re:coded we see braig since his nobody and heartless were destroyed he returned to being human again but the secret movie takes before DDD so how come braig is xigbar again? i have 3 theory's about it look

1)its possible that braig and xigbar are two different characters its like sora and roxas sora became heartless but he manage to return to being human so we don't know about braig story so it might be true maybe that's why we see him as xigbar again in KHDDD cause braig and xigbar not the same BTW both braig and xigbar know MX they both share same goal so i think no need for him to become nobody again

2) maybe we see him as xigbar cause it's sora dream and since sora never meet braig he only know xigbar maybe that's why he sees him as xigbar since he know xigbar and he never met braig

3)or maybe he just returned being nobody after the re:coded secret ending but who turn him into a nobody again was it MX again?

P.S. hope this wasn't confusing:(

 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Young Master Xehanort is a time traveler and is pulling characters out of their respective points in time, like Ansem Seeker of Darkness (Xehanort's Heartless) and Xemnas (Xehanort's Nobody) who otherwise could not exist anymore.

It's very likely that's the situation for Braig/Xigbar as well.

Time travel is going to be a big component for the Organization members.
 

Zebedy

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Pretty sure they are both the same character. Xigbar, as seen in the end of DDD, is technically Braig -- a recompleted person. He just goes by Xigbar because he still identifies with the Organization's purpose. As for the difference in models, I wouldn't look too much into it. They were likely just lazy and didn't want to spend the time to make a completely new model that looked like Xigbar in Braig's clothes or whatever (they cut a lot of corners like this in the series. This wouldn't be the first time).
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Pretty sure they are both the same character. Xigbar, as seen in the end of DDD, is technically Braig -- a recompleted person. He just goes by Xigbar because he still identifies with the Organization's purpose. As for the difference in models, I wouldn't look too much into it. They were likely just lazy and didn't want to spend the time to make a completely new model that looked like Xigbar in Braig's clothes or whatever (they cut a lot of corners like this in the series. This wouldn't be the first time).
would you care to point out where they have cut corners in the past? The only one I know is when they used Saix's model for YX in BBS, but it didn't matter one bit cause he was just in an org robe.

They definitely didn't get lazy, there's a reason Xigbar and Braig appeared differently.
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

would you care to point out where they have cut corners in the past? The only one I know is when they used Saix's model for YX in BBS, but it didn't matter one bit cause he was just in an org robe.
-Saix's model for YMX in BBS
-The Dark Margin in Blank Points is the same assets as the one in the KH2 Ending despite being on the other side of the sea (i.e. Aqua/DiZ are on the Dark Realm side, Sora/Riku are on the Between Realm side)
-Ventus, Terra and Aqua's models in BBS flashbacks are the same models used throughout the game despite all flashbacks happening four years before the events of the game.
-All of the New Organization XIII in KH3D use the same repeating model, despite being completely individual characters
-While obviously more up for debate, as some might argue it suggests a deeper meaning which isn't textually hinted at, the fact that Isa and Lea wake up in Org coats instead of new RG outfits, could be further proof of unwillingness to make new models at the time/for this game.

Those are just some off the top of my head. I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting at the moment.

They definitely didn't get lazy, there's a reason Xigbar and Braig appeared differently.
I really disagree, since by all accounts, Xigbar at the end of KH3D is the exact same person in the 2.5 ending. Aside from reusing his Braig model in one two minute cutscene, there is nothing to suggest otherwise.
 

Davidsawr

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

-Saix's model for YMX in BBS
-The Dark Margin in Blank Points is the same assets as the one in the KH2 Ending despite being on the other side of the sea (i.e. Aqua/DiZ are on the Dark Realm side, Sora/Riku are on the Between Realm side)
-Ventus, Terra and Aqua's models in BBS flashbacks are the same models used throughout the game despite all flashbacks happening four years before the events of the game.
-All of the New Organization XIII in KH3D use the same repeating model, despite being completely individual characters
-While obviously more up for debate, as some might argue it suggests a deeper meaning which isn't textually hinted at, the fact that Isa and Lea wake up in Org coats instead of new RG outfits, could be further proof of unwillingness to make new models at the time/for this game.

Those are just some off the top of my head. I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting at the moment.


I really disagree, since by all accounts, Xigbar at the end of KH3D is the exact same person in the 2.5 ending. Aside from reusing his Braig model in one two minute cutscene, there is nothing to suggest otherwise.
Most of those dont affect the gameplay quality at all so does it really matter?
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

-Saix's model for YMX in BBS
-The Dark Margin in Blank Points is the same assets as the one in the KH2 Ending despite being on the other side of the sea (i.e. Aqua/DiZ are on the Dark Realm side, Sora/Riku are on the Between Realm side)
-Ventus, Terra and Aqua's models in BBS flashbacks are the same models used throughout the game despite all flashbacks happening four years before the events of the game.
-All of the New Organization XIII in KH3D use the same repeating model, despite being completely individual characters
-While obviously more up for debate, as some might argue it suggests a deeper meaning which isn't textually hinted at, the fact that Isa and Lea wake up in Org coats instead of new RG outfits, could be further proof of unwillingness to make new models at the time/for this game.

Those are just some off the top of my head. I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting at the moment.


I really disagree, since by all accounts, Xigbar at the end of KH3D is the exact same person in the 2.5 ending. Aside from reusing his Braig model in one two minute cutscene, there is nothing to suggest otherwise.
They did, however, put an aged Ienzo in that lab suit. I don't know. The credits say Xigbar, but he IS Braig reformed. BUT if Xehanort can pull all versions of himself through time then maybe it's possible to have both Xigbar and Braig, and indeed it'd be a good way to even out the numbers.
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Most of those dont affect the gameplay quality at all so does it really matter?
Um, none of this discussion is about gameplay, it's about story. So I'm not sure why that is relevant at all to what we're talking about?

They did, however, put an aged Ienzo in that lab suit. I don't know. The credits say Xigbar, but he IS Braig reformed. BUT if Xehanort can pull all versions of himself through time then maybe it's possible to have both Xigbar and Braig, and indeed it'd be a good way to even out the numbers.
Well the aged Ienzo and his new model is likely because that's what Ienzo will look like for the rest of the series. On the flipside, Xigbar is likely to remain in the Org coat and have that appearance for the rest of his appearances, hence why they wouldn't bother making a new model just for the 2.5 ending.

And again, aside from this one reusing of his model, there is nothing else to suggest that Braig in 2.5 isn't Xigbar in KH3D.
 

Xehanort-X-blade

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

braig and xigbar possible that they two different person's cause sora returned back to his human form even after roxas was born so basically somebodies can exist even after they become nobodies but not sure how sora did it and turn back human again
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

braig and xigbar possible that they two different person's cause sora returned back to his human form even after roxas was born so basically somebodies can exist even after they become nobodies but not sure how sora did it and turn back human again
It just begs the question, why Roxas and Xion had to return to Sora? If Sora was human, why did they have to 'go back?' Maybe, he wasn't human and just some form of Heartless, but then again that theory might fall flat on it's face. Isn't it stated in the game that Heartless can't wield the Keyblade and that Keyblade is their mortal enemy? So, how a Heartless bearing one probably wouldn't make sense, I digress.
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Memory. Sora's memory was being drained and then spread out between Roxas and Xion. To wake up he needed them back.
Yeah. They literally say he can't wake up without his memories of Kairi.
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

It just begs the question, why Roxas and Xion had to return to Sora? If Sora was human, why did they have to 'go back?'
As Gram pointed out, it's the memory issue.
Had Naminé not messed up Sora's memories in CoM and thus "unhinged" them so that Xion could unwillingly absorb them through Roxas, none of the "going back/returning to Sora" would have been necessary at all.

Naminé even outright states it in Days:
Days said:
Riku: What happened?

Naminé: Some of Sora's memories are missing.

Riku: How can that be?

Naminé: They're escaping through Sora's Nobody into a third person-- and now they're starting to become a part of her.

Riku: You can't get the memories back out.

Naminé: If they're still separate...then yes, I think so.
(She looks at the sketchbook on the table of the picture of Axel, Roxas, and Xion)

Naminé: But if they join with her memories, things get a lot more complicated. I would need to untangle her memory before I could finish Sora's... What was supposed to take months might take years. DiZ would be furious.

Riku: So what's the solution?

Naminé: If I try to just jump in and rearrange her memory...then I risk Sora waking up to find out that nobody remembers him anymore. I can't do that to him. It's too late either way. His awakening will have to be delayed. I never imagined Sora's Nobody and the other one would fight so hard to be their own people. Unfortunately, the only real solution...is for them both to go away.

Naminé: Did you know her face was blank at first? Only now can you see someone. That proves some of Sora's memories are inside her. Some inside her, some inside Sora...others inside Sora's Nobody... I can't sort it out anymore. All I can do is pick up the pieces once what has to be done, is done.
So if one wants to be nitpicky, one could say that Roxas and Xion losing their existences is Naminé's fault because she messed up Sora's memories, which of course is a gross oversimplification of the whole issue.
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Pretty sure they are both the same character. Xigbar, as seen in the end of DDD, is technically Braig -- a recompleted person. He just goes by Xigbar because he still identifies with the Organization's purpose. As for the difference in models, I wouldn't look too much into it. They were likely just lazy and didn't want to spend the time to make a completely new model that looked like Xigbar in Braig's clothes or whatever (they cut a lot of corners like this in the series. This wouldn't be the first time).
That's really just speculation on your part, according to the Memorial Ultimania the person in the secret movie is definitely Braig and according to DDD's journal the person in TWTNW is Xigbar.

-The Dark Margin in Blank Points is the same assets as the one in the KH2 Ending despite being on the other side of the sea (i.e. Aqua/DiZ are on the Dark Realm side, Sora/Riku are on the Between Realm
Both games use the same assets because it's the same place, there is no evidence to suggest otherwise.
 

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

^ Plus the claim that it's being lazy is well....lacking. If they was gonna be lazy they'd have used the same model for both games. Not use two different models for both. You'd see Xigbar in both or Braig but you didn't.

On top of the things listed by ShardofTruth it seems it's hinting at more. It, of course, could just be Nomura trolling but the fact that there is no confirmations anywhere to say in either direction is important.
Saying it's not possible just cause you say so is hardly substantial.
 
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The_Echo

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

I really disagree, since by all accounts, Xigbar at the end of KH3D is the exact same person in the 2.5 ending. Aside from reusing his Braig model in one two minute cutscene, there is nothing to suggest otherwise.
I'm sorry, what?

Why are you so positive that they're the exact same being? Why is Braig being in the Destiny scene not evidence that they're separate? Where in DDD does it ever even once imply that Xigbar is the recompleted Braig?

I simply just don't see how you've come to this conclusion.
Both games use the same assets because it's the same place, there is no evidence to suggest otherwise.
Well, actually, it's been confirmed that Sora and Riku are on the edge of the Realm Between, while Aqua and Ansem are (obviously) on the edge of the Realm of Darkness. It's part III in Director's Secret Report XIII

Though, why these regions can't look the same is beyond me.
 

ShardofTruth

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Well, actually, it's been confirmed that Sora and Riku are on the edge of the Realm Between, while Aqua and Ansem are (obviously) on the edge of the Realm of Darkness. It's part III in Director's Secret Report XIII

Though, why these regions can't look the same is beyond me.
It's the same place though. The Realm of Darkness doesn't contain worlds like the Realm of Light does (at least not as far as we know), the place (the Dark Margin) were all these characters were stranded is the tip of an unknown world from the Realm Between that is reaching into the Realm of Darkness, into the dark ocean to be exact. Both realms are overlapping here (something that is also displayed in the Memorial Ultimania) and that is all the Nomura said in the Director's Secret Report, nothing about a separation by the ocean.

This is the last discussion about this topic we had here.
 

ShardofTruth

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

Well this is already wrong because we see Castle of Dreams in the RoD at the end of Zero Point.
That's a completely different thing. Castle of Dreams is a world from the Realm of Light and if you played Kingdom Hearts and Dream Drop Distance you know what happens once a world's heart is consumed by darkness.
What I was talking about are worlds that naturally exist in the Realm of Darkness.
 

Zebedy

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Re: braig and xigbar might be two different persons?

That's really just speculation on your part, according to the Memorial Ultimania the person in the secret movie is definitely Braig and according to DDD's journal the person in TWTNW is Xigbar.
This is speculation on everyone's part, but aside form reusing a model, there isn't anything to suggest otherwise as far as I'm concerned. It's clear that Braig was recompleted along with everyone else, and then proceeds to go about setting parts of their plan in motion (in 2.5 ending it's taking Isa to be a vessel, and then in KH3D it's obviously the rest of the plan with Sora). Are we really suggesting that just because they reused the Braig model without modifying it (as in, giving him Xigbar's long hair) that it is concrete proof that both Xigbar and Braig are existing at the same time, as separate people? Nothing in the text suggests this to be the case, as the only other examples of a Somebody and a Nobody existing at the same time are in the cases of Special Nobodies which Xigbar is not. Assuming that Braig and Xigbar are separate people, existing at the same time, and are both vessels, why not reveal that in KH3D? Why keep "Braig"'s identity a secret in the ending scene? It doesn't make much sense, and the much simpler answer is that Braig and Xigbar are the same person, and the "Xigbar" seen at the end of KH3D is the recompleted Braig.

^ Plus the claim that it's being lazy is well....lacking. If they was gonna be lazy they'd have used the same model for both games. Not use two different models for both. You'd see Xigbar in both or Braig but you didn't.
The laziness in question comes from having to make a NEW model. It's the same reason that they didn't bother making young versions of TAV even though they should have. It just wasn't worth the amount of work in their eyes. They already have both Xigbar and Braig models already made, so, using both Braig or both Xigbar isn't any more or less time saving than using the Braig model for the wake up scene and the Xigbar model for the other scenes.

I'm sorry, what?

Why are you so positive that they're the exact same being? Why is Braig being in the Destiny scene not evidence that they're separate? Where in DDD does it ever even once imply that Xigbar is the recompleted Braig?
Why wouldn't he be? You think that all of the RG apprentices were recompleted but Xigbar? The whole Lea/Ienzo scene was about how Braig and Isa were recompleted, but they weren't there. So the question was not "Is Braig recompleted" it was "What happened to Braig and Isa" which is then answered by the ending of KH3D, and further fleshed out in the 2.5 ending.

— Xigbar and Saix appeared as members of Organisation XIII. Did they return as humans like Lea and the others?
Nomura: The conditions of becoming a human have been met, so you’d think they had returned, wouldn’t you? For them to have been with Xehanort and the others, perhaps they were collected after they had become humans and before Lea and the others woke up.

Like I don't know why we're really arguing this point. Xigbar in KH3D is clearly the recompleted Braig. The only thing making people think otherwise is just because they didn't update Braig's model to resemble Xigbar more closely for a 2 minute cutscene.

Though, why these regions can't look the same is beyond me.
Looking similar would make sense, looking literally exactly the same less so. At the very least you'd think the Aqua side would be mirrored or something.
 
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